First paid job........Any tips??!

Slimbert

Slimbert

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Name
Damien
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Yes
Right........(takes a deep breath)........

.........I've got my first paid job coming up in a couple of weeks :banana: It's a 21st birthday party for a friend of a family member. I've got the job through word of mouth, sort of, after the girl whose party it is had seen some pictures I'd taken (which she liked) and asked if be interested in covering her 21st.

I've been very honest about the fact that I'm not a pro, and have explained I'm a jack of all trades and a long way off being a master of anything to do with photography! But, they are 100% happy to take the risk (however small or big that may be!), and we have agreed on a fee of £100 (towards my new lens fund!:D) with images being supplied on a disc with permission for them to post the photos on facebook, bebo etc and make prints for themselves and as gifts for other people.

She wants some "getting ready" shots, some formal shots of her with friends and family before the party and some general candid party/disco shots of people dancing drinking enoying themselves etc. Nothing too "arty" and nothing too "out there" which is fine by me, they just want better quality pictures than they could take with their own point and shoots!!

Now my questions are these:

1) Does the fee seem appropriate for a first job and for what is being asked of me? I'm happy with the fee, I'm just curious what other people think.

2) Disco/Party photography isn't something I've done a lot of, Andy (puddleduck) has VERY kindly offered to lend me a 50mm f1.7 which will help massively, but are there any "golden rules" or tips anyone can offer?

I really want to do a good job, and if they customer is happy with the results, it could lead to other work for the family, so ANY tips or advice will be hughly appreciated!:thumbs:
 
Do you have a flash?
If so, be sure to experiment (before the party) with 2nd curtain sync for dance floor shots.
I would also consider a wide angle lens, most of the time you will be up close and I doubt a 50mm will cut it.
 
I'd recommend trying to get in the venue before to get some idea of what settings you should be aiming for, if this isn't possible then try and head to a very dark bar/club and take some test shots, to get used to the challanges of shooting in low light.

a 50mm will be great for some shots but like Woodsie said, if it's in any way possible for you to get a wideangle lens, like a sigma 10-20mm, then this will make your job a bit easier ;)

Try and read up on walkthroughs/info about nightclub photograhpy, mainly about second curtain sync and different settings you use in very low lighting but still capturing the colours in the room :)
 
wombcorps said:
Try and read up on walkthroughs/info about nightclub photograhpy, mainly about second curtain sync and different settings you use in very low lighting but still capturing the colours in the room :)
Click to expand...

Are there any resources you could recommend?

This is an area that I would like to read up on :)
 
Woodsie said:
Do you have a flash?
If so, be sure to experiment (before the party) with 2nd curtain sync for dance floor shots.
I would also consider a wide angle lens, most of the time you will be up close and I doubt a 50mm will cut it.
Click to expand...

Yeah I have a Sony HLV-F36AM which I'm familiar with. Doesn't have the best range of the Sony flashes but I guess most things in low light are taken pretty close to the subject.

I have a Sony 18-70mm which I've been using a lot recently so again I'm familiar with it. It actually works pretty well with the flash as does my 35-70mm Minolta. I'm a little worried that the 50mm might be too long but I guess there is only one way to find out!

Thanks for taking the time to comment!:thumbs:
 
well I'm a club photographer but I learnt from people, rather than reading stuff. not to say the stuff isn't out there - I've had a quick look for a few links fi ya, I haven't found anything good yet. I found one site that had some do's and don'ts, but they were pretty crap tbh. But thats the thing with nightclubs - different lighting scenario in every club, so giving out exact settings isn't really too helpful.

a few tips from me though:

dont be tempted to immediatley bump up your ISO to max - try it on 800, then work your way down once you get a feel for the different settings. i sometimes move between ISO 200-800 depending on what I'm aiming for. sometimes I've had to use ISO 1600, but this was mainly down to me not thinking hard enough about my setings ;)

use second curtain sync on your flash - this lets in the light in the club before flashing on the subject

experiment with aperture and shutter speed - do you want movement (longer shutter speed) or crisp focus for portaits (shorter shutter)?

When you get into a venue, check out the lighting sequences, get an idea for colours etc and use this in your pics - for great dancefloor pics I place the subjects between me and some lighting to capture the colour and movement of a club dancefloor

I'd be happy to help ya in any way I can, if i think of anything else or find anything interesting online i'll link you up...

Good luck!
 
wombcorps said:
I'd recommend trying to get in the venue before to get some idea of what settings you should be aiming for, if this isn't possible then try and head to a very dark bar/club and take some test shots, to get used to the challanges of shooting in low light.

a 50mm will be great for some shots but like Woodsie said, if it's in any way possible for you to get a wideangle lens, like a sigma 10-20mm, then this will make your job a bit easier ;)

Try and read up on walkthroughs/info about nightclub photograhpy, mainly about second curtain sync and different settings you use in very low lighting but still capturing the colours in the room :)
Click to expand...

I'm familiar with the venue, I went to a wedding there last year. It's not as dark as some places I've been to and the the ceiling and walls are all white which all helps a bit.

Thanks for the tip on nightclub photography, it's not something I'd thought of!:bonk:
 
wombcorps said:
well I'm a club photographer but I learnt from people, rather than reading stuff. not to say the stuff isn't out there - I've had a quick look for a few links fi ya, I haven't found anything good yet. I found one site that had some do's and don'ts, but they were pretty crap tbh. But thats the thing with nightclubs - different lighting scenario in every club, so giving out exact settings isn't really too helpful.

a few tips from me though:

dont be tempted to immediatley bump up your ISO to max - try it on 800, then work your way down once you get a feel for the different settings. i sometimes move between ISO 200-800 depending on what I'm aiming for. sometimes I've had to use ISO 1600, but this was mainly down to me not thinking hard enough about my setings ;)

use second curtain sync on your flash - this lets in the light in the club before flashing on the subject

experiment with aperture and shutter speed - do you want movement (longer shutter speed) or crisp focus for portaits (shorter shutter)?

When you get into a venue, check out the lighting sequences, get an idea for colours etc and use this in your pics - for great dancefloor pics I place the subjects between me and some lighting to capture the colour and movement of a club dancefloor

I'd be happy to help ya in any way I can, if i think of anything else or find anything interesting online i'll link you up...

Good luck!
Click to expand...

Thank you for the advice. I think it is a case of just having play when I get the chance
:)
 
wombcorps said:
well I'm a club photographer but I learnt from people, rather than reading stuff. not to say the stuff isn't out there - I've had a quick look for a few links fi ya, I haven't found anything good yet. I found one site that had some do's and don'ts, but they were pretty crap tbh. But thats the thing with nightclubs - different lighting scenario in every club, so giving out exact settings isn't really too helpful.

a few tips from me though:

dont be tempted to immediatley bump up your ISO to max - try it on 800, then work your way down once you get a feel for the different settings. i sometimes move between ISO 200-800 depending on what I'm aiming for. sometimes I've had to use ISO 1600, but this was mainly down to me not thinking hard enough about my setings ;)

use second curtain sync on your flash - this lets in the light in the club before flashing on the subject

experiment with aperture and shutter speed - do you want movement (longer shutter speed) or crisp focus for portaits (shorter shutter)?

When you get into a venue, check out the lighting sequences, get an idea for colours etc and use this in your pics - for great dancefloor pics I place the subjects between me and some lighting to capture the colour and movement of a club dancefloor

I'd be happy to help ya in any way I can, if i think of anything else or find anything interesting online i'll link you up...

Good luck!
Click to expand...

Could you point me in the right direction for some sort of online tutorial or walkthrough? Not sure if my Sony has an option for second curtain flash will have to have a look.......

Thanks again!:thumbs:
 
Slimbert said:
Could you point me in the right direction for some sort of online tutorial or walkthrough? Not sure if my Sony has an option for second curtain flash will have to have a look.......
Click to expand...

Firstly, congrats on the job! As long as you're happy and they're happy, all is good, and it's nice to know they're willing to pay at all, too many people wanting something for nothing nowadays!

Might be a bit controversial, but I'd advise against 2nd curtain flash. It's always mentioned on here, and every single thread I've read has never put forward a decent argument for it. It has it's time and place, but is only really useful when the movement is predictable. There's an excellent link here that'll tell you how to do it, but unless you really know what you're doing, how you're going to move the camera, and how your subjects are going to move, you probably won't be happy with the results!

Before the exposure takes place, the pre-flash will fire, and unless you're going to explain to everyone at the party that you're using 2nd curtain (nothing like a photography lecture in the middle of a party to kill the mood :D), they'll all assume the photo has taken, move, and then when the actual flash fires, they won't be where they were in the first place!

Apart from that, usual stuff, large aperture, high-ish ISO to capture ambient light and give a sense of atmosphere etc. Have a play when you get there, see what works and what doesn't. If anyone asks, you're just 'carrying out checks on your camera'!

And good luck!
 
chris321 said:
Firstly, congrats on the job! As long as you're happy and they're happy, all is good, and it's nice to know they're willing to pay at all, too many people wanting something for nothing nowadays!

Might be a bit controversial, but I'd advise against 2nd curtain flash. It's always mentioned on here, and every single thread I've read has never put forward a decent argument for it. It has it's time and place, but is only really useful when the movement is predictable. There's an excellent link here that'll tell you how to do it, but unless you really know what you're doing, how you're going to move the camera, and how your subjects are going to move, you probably won't be happy with the results!

Before the exposure takes place, the pre-flash will fire, and unless you're going to explain to everyone at the party that you're using 2nd curtain (nothing like a photography lecture in the middle of a party to kill the mood :D), they'll all assume the photo has taken, move, and then when the actual flash fires, they won't be where they were in the first place!

Apart from that, usual stuff, large aperture, high-ish ISO to capture ambient light and give a sense of atmosphere etc. Have a play when you get there, see what works and what doesn't. If anyone asks, you're just 'carrying out checks on your camera'!

And good luck!
Click to expand...

All sounds like great advice! Thanks very much!!:thumbs:

I've got plenty of time to play around more with the flash beforehand which I'll be doing a lot of! I've just read that the second curtain flash is called "rear" on my alpha (if ive got it right) so I can have a play with that and see how it works.

ISO 400 works quite well on my alpha so I'll start there. 800 does start to show noise but I have some software to get rid of it that works quite well. Puddleduck is lending me a 50mm F1.7 prime so I'll have a wide aperture lens which is something I was worrying about! Next widest I have is f3.5:shake:

Thanks again for the advice!!:thumbs:
 
tbh thats a good point - i often use both 2nd curtain and normal flash, but am so used to switching between the two that i forgot to explain the differences

i cant really add to the above comment, except for seconding that 2nd curtain is good if movement is predictable, normal flash is great too, especially on a dancefloor if you want to catch a 'natural' shot of people dancing as the 2 flashes on 2nd curtain can spin some people out...both have their uses and experiment with both, you'll soon learn when which type of flash is appropriate. also just get to know your flash options - if you can turn it down in brightness, if it pivots or moves on top of the camera, if it has 2nd curtain option etc...

A quick google search found me some results - I'm not sure if I'm allowed to link to other forums, but search Nightclub photography tips or something similar in google and you'll find loads of info. some of it may be complete crap, but just note what sort of settings people are talking about, get out into a club and experiment - remember that every club is different and it is a constantly changing light source which can make learning (sometimes) slow moving and frustrating, but its so worth it when you get a good shot :)

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What sort of shutter speeds should I be aiming for in low light? I know this will vary a lot when taking everything else in to account but is it the usual "as quick as possible" or should they be slightly longer to get the deliberate movement effect?

Is 1 or 2 seconds with rear flash a sin, or should I be aiming a lot quicker around 1/200 and adjust the flash/iso etc to get the exposure about right?

Also is it better to over or under expose, or rarther which one should I try to avoid the most? I'll be shooting raw files so I can do some "rescuing" but I don't want to be relying on that too much!
 
you answered your own questions - if your looking for precision, then 1/200 would be OK, as would 1" if you wanted movement. then again, it all depends on the subjects, the lighting, your other settings, how steady your hand is....such a lot of parameters that it is impossible to suggest even a narrow band of settings.if you look online, you'll find settings ranging from ISO 1600, f2.8 at 0.4" to ISO 400, f4.6 at 1/200...both are valid in that no setting is right ;) sorry its a bit ambigous, if i could offer a good 'starter' set of settings I would, but i honestly can't narrow down the settings i use.

i tend to overexpose a bit, to make up for the difference on my camera screen and PC monitor. i also try to avoid editing too much and find that its often better to overexpose in a club and turn the brightness down/contrast etc, rathr than having to boost the light which can make the noise even worse. but i'm not exactly a master of editing and post processing, so maybe someone else more skilled in this feild could give you a better answer :)
 
wombcorps said:
you answered your own questions - if your looking for precision, then 1/200 would be OK, as would 1" if you wanted movement. then again, it all depends on the subjects, the lighting, your other settings, how steady your hand is....such a lot of parameters that it is impossible to suggest even a narrow band of settings.if you look online, you'll find settings ranging from ISO 1600, f2.8 at 0.4" to ISO 400, f4.6 at 1/200...both are valid in that no setting is right ;) sorry its a bit ambigous, if i could offer a good 'starter' set of settings I would, but i honestly can't narrow down the settings i use.

i tend to overexpose a bit, to make up for the difference on my camera screen and PC monitor. i also try to avoid editing too much and find that its often better to overexpose in a club and turn the brightness down/contrast etc, rathr than having to boost the light which can make the noise even worse. but i'm not exactly a master of editing and post processing, so maybe someone else more skilled in this feild could give you a better answer :)
Click to expand...

I suspected that would be the case! I think I'll just have to be trigger happy and try as many different things as I can throughout the night!

Thanks again everyone for the advice, it's been a real help to me in getting things in my head in to some sort of order. I now know a few things that I need to practice before the event mainly regarding the flash.

Cheers!:thumbs:
 
Wow... what kind of club were those shots taken in?? Not one I'd like to visit! blood everywhere!! ha ha
 
wombcorps said:
well I'm a club photographer but I learnt from people, rather than reading stuff. not to say the stuff isn't out there - I've had a quick look for a few links fi ya, I haven't found anything good yet. I found one site that had some do's and don'ts, but they were pretty crap tbh. But thats the thing with nightclubs - different lighting scenario in every club, so giving out exact settings isn't really too helpful.

a few tips from me though:

dont be tempted to immediatley bump up your ISO to max - try it on 800, then work your way down once you get a feel for the different settings. i sometimes move between ISO 200-800 depending on what I'm aiming for. sometimes I've had to use ISO 1600, but this was mainly down to me not thinking hard enough about my setings ;)

use second curtain sync on your flash - this lets in the light in the club before flashing on the subject

experiment with aperture and shutter speed - do you want movement (longer shutter speed) or crisp focus for portaits (shorter shutter)?

When you get into a venue, check out the lighting sequences, get an idea for colours etc and use this in your pics - for great dancefloor pics I place the subjects between me and some lighting to capture the colour and movement of a club dancefloor

I'd be happy to help ya in any way I can, if i think of anything else or find anything interesting online i'll link you up...

Good luck!
Click to expand...

One problem. The guy has a Sony :lol:

Just be careful with the ISO - make sure you get a good exposure and plenty of light if you're going up to ISO800 and I guarentee your shots will be noisy as hell.
 
My only advise would be:

1) Charge batteries, clean gear and prep and pack everything at least the night before.
2) Know where you're going and get there early so you are already comfortable before it's crouded
3) Make sure your client is happy and that they can ask you for any picture - if they're happy then they'll refer you ;)
4) Slow down ..... Your first gig you'll be wound like a spring shooting anything that moves. Take your time and let things develop in front of the camera.
5) Get details. Sometimes it's the little things that trigger memories.
6) Don't drink (booze) until after you're finished.
7) Enjoy it. It can be one of the best jobs in the world :thumbs:
8) Don't forget to get paid ;)
 
What he said ^^^^

Prepare properly then chill out

Work slowly and surely don't stress and rush

Look professional even if you're stressed and confused

Only supply what you're proud of (the art of mystique)

Get paid and get drunk :p
 
thread revival! 4 1/2 months.
 
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