Given a parking ticket for being one minute late

[Sponge]

Agreed.

Maybe you could ask to see the documentation proving all time pieces used by the Warden are calibrated and synchronised? Like speed cameras have to be? As you don't think you were late back, i.e. it was 1600, not 1601.

Even if it gets you nowhere, make them work for their money! The cost of the admin involved in responding to your challenge will eat into their fine. It probably won't, but that's how my mind works ;-)

 

[Ruffy]

Challenge it if it is only 1 min, I had the same issue some time back, 1901hrs by there watch 1857hrs by mine and I won !!!

It's impossible for everyone's watch to read the same, this will help you out so long as your not saying its 10 mins out lol

 

[simon44]

I think it's absolute crapola he got a ticket for just 1 minute over. It says more about the ticket issuer than anything else. I would spit nails if that happened to me.

 

[Carlo]

i've appealed a couple of parking tickets in the past.
Once i'd mistakenly put a pay and display ticket back to front in my rush to pick the kids up, and the other time i got a ticket for parking outside my own house!! (dropped kerb)
Both times i was successful.
I'm positive i remember reading something about 2-3 minutes 'grace' period in all the documentation, so it's well worth checking up with whichever local authority it was (you will be able to find the details on the web).
Just because you get a ticket doesn't always mean you should have been given one (if that makes sense) most people will pay up without questioning it, and this is what they 're banking on.

 

[Alastair]

Surely the five minute grace period is 15:55-16:00?

However, if the difference is only one minute it's always worth an appeal with a request to see the precision and accuracey specification and the calibration records for the clock in the ticket issuing device. There was a poice force that was caught out some time ago because the speed-gun calibrations had been allowed to lapse (or they'd changed the operational frequency of calibrations without changing their documented management system specification).

However, if you did say to the warden that you were only a minute late.. you have already acknowledged to the authority that you agree you were late and that you were aware of the restriction.

 

[George Dorn]

It's worth challenging the ticket. Most authorities allow a period of 'grace', seven minutes in my Borough for example.

 

[tezmed]

i'd contest it on the grounds that the ticket would have taken longer than the minute to have been issued and then photographed and still only be 1 minute into the prohibition.....

be aware though that they are like vultures....

i once stopped in a bay to read the sign as the sign was facing the other way for a total of 20 secs as upon reading it said you had to pay by phone (which i didnt have on me at the time) so i drove off to find somewhere else... a camera took a pic of me getting out and issued me with a fine as they had 2 photos of me in the same location timed 20 secs apart.... i appealed and explained and still had to pay the 80 friggin quid...

 

[unclened]

Everyday I see motorists pleading to be left off with an offence.

Like the next person if I have done no wrong then I will stand my ground but let's be honest if we park up, speed a couple of mph over etc etc , we know that we are breaking the rules and as such it is up to us to take the responsiblity for that regardless of how little outside of the rules it falls.

The rules are in place for a reason....If we choose to break them then how do we have a right to contest the punishment??

Just pay it and ensure you give yourself more time to return to your vehicle next time if you don't wish to chance receiving similar again!

what if the council or local authority isn't following the rules, are the general public allowed to fine them?

1000's of cases where the council has tried to enforce parking tickets that didn't comply with the letter of the law. Sadly parking enforcement is one of the biggest swindles around, conducted both by public and private entities.

 

[unclened]

I think i will just go ahead and pay the fine and learn from the mistake. Not happy about it but i guess if i have no chance if i appeal it then it is not worth the hassle.

head over to Fightback Forums and have one the members take a look at a scanned copy of the parking ticket. Don't pay till you've had some advice on whether this defendable.

 

[boyfalldown]

what if the council or local authority isn't following the rules, are the general public allowed to fine them?

1000's of cases where the council has tried to enforce parking tickets that didn't comply with the letter of the law. Sadly parking enforcement is one of the biggest swindles around, conducted both by public and private entities.

Yep, 3 of the 3 tickets I was issued last year were overturned at appeal. Atleast two were really clear cut and down to the warden being a bit dim. What a waste of time

 

[unclened]

Yep, 3 of the 3 tickets I was issued last year were overturned at appeal. Atleast two were really clear cut and down to the warden being a bit dim. What a waste of time

My old man has a habit of picking up parking tickets, I guess he enjoys paying for my son's schooling, albeit indirectly.

I had a ticket overturned where he had parked on a double red.. Turned out the ticket wasn't compliant because it fettered his right of appeal.

 

[boyfalldown]

My old man has a habit of picking up parking tickets, I guess he enjoys paying for my son's schooling, albeit indirectly.

I had a ticket overturned where he had parked on a double red.. Turned out the ticket wasn't compliant because it fettered his right of appeal.

my three - 1 was because I'd left the pay and display ticket from the swimming pool on the dashboard, when I went home. Overturned because apparently the warden couldn't read the residents permit on the windscreen.

1 because the warden didn't understand the changes to the parking rules round me on rugby match days (they change all the zones/parking permit rules round me on match days due to the proximity of the stadium)

and the last one due to the warden being unable to read the instructions on a mixed use (residents/pay) parking meter

funnily every one was within 50 yds of home & a waste of time

 

[jonbeeza]

When I used to live in a small town in Lancashire, I used to go out of my way to to spot the wardens. I would then say hello and good morning, and then have a little chat with them and smile. My mates would always drive past them and swear and threaten to punch their faces in etc.

I would say to my mates, you must be mad you have to keep them on side. I did park in some funny places at times. On warden always threatened to give me a ticket the next time, but she never did.

people who have power, need to be kept on side

 

[ziggy©]

I would appeal that, appeal anything as the parking attendant can not issue a ticket within 1 minute the process takes longer than that to do. comming from a person I know (I stopped callign him a mate when he got the job, he even booked his uncle) who is one.

That's interesting

 

[Little John]

I just asked the guy I know and even he said it is very harsh to issue a ticket within a minute and who ever did it must have already entered all or at least some of the details before the time expired. He works the Bolton area who are notorious and even they "give" a 5 minutes grace period.

 

[DUNKS]

Hi. I had a little incident this year which turned out OK.
Every summer the city square in Notts is turned into "seaside" with a few tons of sand and paddling pools.
My wife, and myself with our daughter in law and grandaughter went for a play and parked in a 2 hour only no return bay paid our dues and went for a paddle.
A while later we realized that we were going to be in trouble with the time, I tore back the half mile or so to the car leaving the gang to pack up and follow.
Meter maid was hovering as I approached my car with seconds to spare.
I explained the situation to meter maid and she said OK as long as your lot are back in ten minutes and you are telling the truth it will be OK.
She did wait to see if I had been telling porkies and they arrived within the alotted time.
Meter maid wandered off to book some other poor soul.

 

[ziggy©]

I had a look at the evidence at the Barnet.gov.uk site and it is showing that the picture was taken at 16:03. I remember when i came out i told him i was only one minute late. I saw him place the ticket on the windscreen and take the picture. Is it really possible that it would have taken two minutes from the time the ticket was printed to him taking the picture? I am sure his camera and ticket machine are not synchronized.

Also, the time and date shown in the picture of the car looks a bit too sharp on the edges. I would have expected the edges on the date and time to be soft as the rest of the image but it does not blend with the rest of the image (Maximise the image to see it clearly). I dont have a P&S so i am not sure if this is how the date and time usually comes out. The date and time looks a bit out of place in this picture or am i just seeing what i want to see

 

[Little John]

The time stamping can be anything they probably use a camera that stamps bright yellow for ease of identification/reading and as it doenst have anything to do with the lens then sharpness wont really be effected.

Have you stuck an appeal in yet? you need to do it asap to get the increase frozen

 

[unclened]

And have you sought help on pepipoo forums? They'll tell exactly where you stand.

 

[tiler65]

the exif says 16:03:22.

I would challenge this penalty notice.

 

[ziggy©]

And have you sought help on pepipoo forums? They'll tell exactly where you stand.

Yes i posted there a week earlier. I am in the process of appealing the ticket. Just trying to work out on what grounds i should appeal it.

 

[Lynton]

the exif says 16:03:22.

I would challenge this penalty notice.

based on what?

time on screen shows 16.03
EXIF shows 16.03

16.01 print the ticket, (could be 16.01.59) print it out, hand write the bits and bobs, seal it up in a bag, put under windscreen and take a photo possible 83 secs later.

Given the pic was taken at 16.03.22 and you were nowhere in sight, I would say.... man up and take the fine. It does appear you were late back.

Another day you'd have got away with it...

 

[unclened]

based on what?

time on screen shows 16.03
EXIF shows 16.03

16.01 print the ticket, (could be 16.01.59) print it out, hand write the bits and bobs, seal it up in a bag, put under windscreen and take a photo possible 83 secs later.

Given the pic was taken at 16.03.22 and you were nowhere in sight, I would say.... man up and take the fine. It does appear you were late back.

Another day you'd have got away with it...

Not until all legitimate options for appeal have been exhausted

 

[Lynton]

ok.. but i am struggling to see the legitimate options now.....

 

[boyfalldown]

ok.. but i am struggling to see the legitimate options now.....

heres one for you..................Barnet council say 3 minutes casual observation time for that contravention code. One minutes observation (especially at the start of the period) isn't long enough.

 

[admirable]

http://www.barnet.gov.uk/faq-parking-appeals-q3

 

[boyfalldown]

http://www.barnet.gov.uk/faq-parking-appeals-q3

Grace period and observation period are different. There's also a doc on there that lists observation periods. Digging out a link is tricky on my phone, will find later

 

[ziggy©]

based on what?

time on screen shows 16.03
EXIF shows 16.03

16.01 print the ticket, (could be 16.01.59) print it out, hand write the bits and bobs, seal it up in a bag, put under windscreen and take a photo possible 83 secs later.

Given the pic was taken at 16.03.22 and you were nowhere in sight, I would say.... man up and take the fine. It does appear you were late back.

Another day you'd have got away with it...

No that is not correct. When i came out of the shop it was 16:01. The ticket was not even on my car at the time. I was there when he printed it and placed it on the car. I was trying to reason with him hence the slight delay from when he placed the ticket on my windscreen and when he took the picture.

The London CEO's handbook states:

b) Time restrictions/paid parking
Where a time restriction applies, CEOs should not issue a PCN
less than two minutes before a restriction starts or less than
two minutes after the restriction has expired. For example, if
a restriction starts (or paid-for time expires) at 8.00am then
a PCN should only be issued if the vehicle is in contravention
after 8.02am. Similarly, if a restriction ends at 6.00pm then
no PCNs should be issued after 5.58pm. It should be stressed
that a vehicle in such a situation does not have the right to
be in place for two minutes – this is not a grace period.

The Civil Enforcement Handbook can be downloaded from here http://www.londoncouncils.gov.uk/policylobbying/transport/parkinginlondon/ceohandbook.htm

The only thing i am not sure of is does the CEO handbook override what they say on their website.

 

[big soft moose]

Thing is though a ticket issued at 16.03 is more than 2 minuites after the ticket expired so trying to appeal on those grounds will just get you laughed out of the room - you'll also note that it specifically says that it isnt a grace period

Like lynton said, man up and pay the thing - if you are quick you'll get the 14 day 50% discount.

(your tactical error was wasting time arguing - if you'd come out at 16.01 and got in ther car and driven off before he issued the ticket chances are you'd have got away with it)

 

[ziggy©]

Thing is though a ticket issued at 16.03 is more than 2 minuites after the ticket expired so trying to appeal on those grounds will just get you laughed out of the room - you'll also note that it specifically says that it isnt a grace period

The ticket was issued at 16:01 not 16:03. See the image on the previous page.

(your tactical error was wasting time arguing - if you'd come out at 16.01 and got in ther car and driven off before he issued the ticket chances are you'd have got away with it)

Yes i agree. I should have just got in the car and not even wait for him to print out the ticket :bang:

 

[big soft moose]

The ticket was issued at 16:01 not 16:03. See the image on the previous page.

the ticket notes that the offence occured by it being on the ground at 16.01 (note the point about the 2 minuites not being a grace period) , but the picture demonstrates that it was still on the ground at 16.03 (and probably later than that as in the picture the car is still unocupied - chances are you didnt actually drive away until 16.04 or later )

so I'd still say you are on a loser with that line of argument.

Personally i'd just take it as a harsh lesson of the realities of parking in london and pay the £55 before the 14 day limit - a fruitless apeal risks going considerably beyond that timescale and costing more in the long run)

 

[realspeed]

When I worked for BT the vehicles used to be classified as crown vehicles and as such could park basically anywhere. All that changed with privatisation. So we got loads of parking tickets as the jobs often required parking outside premises which we handed to BT to pay for. Well we decided to get exeption tickets from the council traffic wardens office, so there was a huge queue waiting for exemption tickets it was taking all morning to have them issued. Vans and lorries blocked the road as well, must have been 50+vans/lorries.
The traffic wardens soon backed down and give instructions to the wardens to leave us alone as they didn't want the same proceedure to go through every day.



Realspeed