I need help from people with calibrated and high gamut monitors.

D

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Recently Calibrated my display. My laptop is a Dell XPS 9570 4K


With Lightroom, I have never had an issue with exporting, neither have I with Photoshop. but recently noticed that my screen was showing a bit pink so I thought I would calibrate it with the i1 X-Rite Profiler calibrator.

Since I have calibrated the screen the screen looks slightly green but I assumed that was due to being used to seeing the other calibration. Anyway, my files look fine in Lightroom and Photoshop both working in the ProPhoto RGB colour space, but sadly when I export from Lightroom in Jpeg the images appear way oversaturated. I also export in SRGB.

I tried uploading one to my google drive and on there it looks like it would in Lightroom which gave me hope but if I view it on my phone its way oversaturated again.
Looking online I see this is normal for high gamut screens and the images need to be viewed with software that is colour managed, but that doesn't explain why it looks normal in my google drive on my laptop but it doesn't when viewing it on my phone.

Plus if this is the case, it doesn't make any sense as I have calibrated my display but now everyone has to view my work on colour managed software and viewing them on phones is a no go now?

Hope someone can help, so far I see it's better to revert to an uncalibrated display.

Annotation 2020-02-24 205745.jpeg
 
And that's why we don't calibrate :) revert back to a normal screen that you are happy with and check it against an iPad/phone
 
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Connor Moore said:
People are saying it's much better to calibrate and I paid £150 for my calibrator
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I see professionals use calibrated screens and their work looks the same on everything so there must be a way
 
Connor Moore said:
I see professionals use calibrated screens and their work looks the same on everything so there must be a way
Click to expand...

Thats simply not possible (outside the monitors in their control and even that is not always possible), monitors are different per model and manafacturer, TV's, tables, phones, all different, then people change the settings again making the number of combinations of what people are looking infinite, you CANNOT calibrate a monitor and have everybody else's display look the same, Well, that's my experience anyway (around 2 million colour sensitive published images)
 
Surely you are calibrating your monitor in the hope you can replicate the result in print.
Never going to make it so every one can view your image and see it the way you do.
 
tijuana taxi said:
Surely you are calibrating your monitor in the hope you can replicate the result in print.
Never going to make it so every one can view your image and see it the way you do.
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I'm not too bothered in slight colour shifts but I don't know why after exporting in SRGB that the file appears different even on the same computer with the same calibrated screen. This is because of a none colour managed software, but that makes no sense because it's converted to SRGB so it should show the same. And why before I calibrated my display the images looked the same after export?
 
It's likely to be caused by how your browser handles the colour space you exported the file in. I'm using Firefox on PC and the RHS image looks a *little* more saturated and a bit greener to me. On the phone the difference seems a little stronger.

For web work, only export in sRGB - it's the only universal colourspace right now.
 
ancient_mariner said:
It's likely to be caused by how your browser handles the colour space you exported the file in. I'm using Firefox on PC and the RHS image looks a *little* more saturated and a bit greener to me. On the phone the difference seems a little stronger.

For web work, only export in sRGB - it's the only universal colourspace right now.
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I do export in SRGB but the images look different even on the same display
 
If your monitor is calibrated and the image does not look correct when exported on the same laptop, could it be due to some additional settings in LR on export?

Also not 100% if you would get correct results when using a laptop screen as you may see different results based on how you are viewing the screen (angle).
 
sep9001 said:
If your monitor is calibrated and the image does not look correct when exported on the same laptop, could it be due to some additional settings in LR on export?

Also not 100% if you would get correct results when using a laptop screen as you may see different results based on how you are viewing the screen (angle).
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I have been through all the settings in lightroom, tried multiple things. And it's not a viewing angle issue, I assure you of that
 
Sorry in that case cannot think of anything else, hopefully some one more knowledgeable will be able to help.
 
What program are you using to view your photos on screen?
I know from experience that the different photo viewers on a pc alter the way photos look.
 
Studio488commercial said:
https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4251432
“If you use any other software than PremierColor then remember to remove PremierColor, or disable it by disabling its service and disabling its start-up entry (which is what I've done). Otherwise it will screw up iProfiler or whatever calibration/profiling.”

Loads of stuff on the web about how rubbish dell are with this :)
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Okay so Dell got rid of premiere color due to this problem, such a bad software but I was aware of this. Now dell uses Intel Graphics Centre or something along them lines. The Intel graphics centre is quite useful and my calibrator doesn't affect saturation and intel software does. The dell XPS is way oversaturated out the box
 
Connor Moore said:
I do export in SRGB but the images look different even on the same display
Click to expand...


Not sure If I have got the total wrong end of the stick here but PRO photo will not be showing all its colours on any monitor, most top spec monitors are capable of producing the colour gamut of RGB to around 98-99% of it, SRGB is obviously a much smaller colour space again.
Converting a Pro Photo image with a super wide gamut (Of which some wont even display on your monitor) right down to SRGB will result in a significant squeeze of colours into a smaller gamut, therefore altering what you see.
Sorry if I have misunderstood your question, but as I read it this jumps out at me.
The colour gamut diagram below should make it more understandable

sRGB-vs-Adobe-RGB-vs-ProPhoto-RGB-573x650.png
 
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Daniel_Wretham said:
Not sure If I have got the total wrong end of the stick here but PRO photo will not be showing all its colours on any monitor, most top spec monitors are capable of producing the colour gamut of RGB to around 98-99% of it, SRGB is obviously a much smaller colour space again.
Converting a Pro Photo image with a super wide gamut (Of which some wont even display on your monitor) right down to SRGB will result in a significant squeeze of colours into a smaller gamut, therefore altering what you see.
Sorry if I have misunderstood your question, but as I read it this jumps out at me.
The colour gamut diagram below should make it more understandable

View attachment 269800
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I'm aware that prophoto shows more than any screen can see but this doesn't affect my images when my screen isn't calibrated? I have reverted back to before I calibrated and everything seems fine but obviously I don't have a calibrated screen now.

From my understanding that wide gamut screens are pointless unless you're shooting for magazines or print. Which I didn't know about, I'm primarily a web shooter and only shoot for web. But I do shoot weddings and offer prints also for family shoots so I like to use the widest range I can at all times then just convert afterwards. I just don't understand why I have this problem when I calibrate my screen but don't when it's not. I feel like there is a setting in Windows colour management that I'm missing.

When I calibrate I set the profile to be windows default and everything but there must be something else
 
It's not the Windows Photo Viewer issue with calibrated monitors is it (or something similar)?

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4105226

Have you tried viewing the images in more than one application?

I haven't had much success in calibrating laptop monitors personally - my Dell Ultrasharp is OK, but tried with a couple of laptop panels and always ended up with a green or magenta colour cast.
 
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Connor Moore said:
I'm aware that prophoto shows more than any screen can see but this doesn't affect my images when my screen isn't calibrated? I have reverted back to before I calibrated and everything seems fine but obviously I don't have a calibrated screen now.

From my understanding that wide gamut screens are pointless unless you're shooting for magazines or print. Which I didn't know about, I'm primarily a web shooter and only shoot for web. But I do shoot weddings and offer prints also for family shoots so I like to use the widest range I can at all times then just convert afterwards. I just don't understand why I have this problem when I calibrate my screen but don't when it's not. I feel like there is a setting in Windows colour management that I'm missing.

When I calibrate I set the profile to be windows default and everything but there must be something else
Click to expand...

I understand you now with the ok when not calibrated, not when calibrated thing.

To a degree the above answer still stands, I would reccomend doing your post proccessing in Adobe RGB, and then exporting in SRGB for web which should show minimal difference. I found Pro Photo was way too different from SRGB.
This however wouldnt explain the difference in the calibrated an non calibated view :/
When you say you calibrate it to windows default ? that wouldnt be a nuetral calibration ? its a profile unique to that, it will have difference in contrast and saturation & possibly warmer or cooler. your X1 calibrator should be creating a whole new neutral colour profile of which you save and use, again sorry if this isnt what you meant
 
I get very similar colors from both images... I highly doubt I have selected the exact same pixels so some difference is to be expected. But the right image does look slightly more saturated/redder to me.

What I did find is that the image(s) do not have the color space embedded. What that means is that some programs will assume/use sRGB, while others will just use the system/monitor profile.
I also suspect that you created a less than optimal monitor profile... there are several options (D65, gamma 2.2, black point, etc) that will affect the calibrated profile. I.e. just because you used a calibrator doesn't mean the resulting profile is right/good.

Screen Shot 2020-02-25 at 9.50.37 AM.jpg
 
Daniel_Wretham said:
I understand you now with the ok when not calibrated, not when calibrated thing.

To a degree the above answer still stands, I would reccomend doing your post proccessing in Adobe RGB, and then exporting in SRGB for web which should show minimal difference. I found Pro Photo was way too different from SRGB.
This however wouldnt explain the difference in the calibrated an non calibated view :/
When you say you calibrate it to windows default ? that wouldnt be a nuetral calibration ? its a profile unique to that, it will have difference in contrast and saturation & possibly warmer or cooler. your X1 calibrator should be creating a whole new neutral colour profile of which you save and use, again sorry if this isnt what you meant
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So I noticed my screen was showing quite pinkish so I got a xrite calibrator. The profile before calibration was a factory one called EI bunch of code then RGB or something
 
Daniel_Wretham said:
I understand you now with the ok when not calibrated, not when calibrated thing.

To a degree the above answer still stands, I would reccomend doing your post proccessing in Adobe RGB, and then exporting in SRGB for web which should show minimal difference. I found Pro Photo was way too different from SRGB.
This however wouldnt explain the difference in the calibrated an non calibated view :/
When you say you calibrate it to windows default ? that wouldnt be a nuetral calibration ? its a profile unique to that, it will have difference in contrast and saturation & possibly warmer or cooler. your X1 calibrator should be creating a whole new neutral colour profile of which you save and use, again sorry if this isnt what you meant
Click to expand...

Also you can work in Adobe RGB in lightroom and if I put Photoshop to Adobe RGB then it will mess the profile up when imported to Photoshop from lightroom
 
Son_of_Thor said:
It's not the Windows Photo Viewer issue with calibrated monitors is it (or something similar)?

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4105226

Have you tried viewing the images in more than one application?

I haven't had much success in calibrating laptop monitors personally - my Dell Ultrasharp is OK, but tried with a couple of laptop panels and always ended up with a green or magenta colour cast.
Click to expand...

I find Windows Photo Viewer ok, well at least better than the default one that comes with Win10.
The newer one just called "Photos" gave my Olympus raw files what looked like the Aurora in skies.
Very nice, but not that natural during the day on the south coast.

I calibrate using a SpyderPro 5 and DisplayCal software, print reliably from Lightroom on a Canon Pro 10 so that does for me.
Think you need a rather expensive laptop to get good colour rendition, best I have seen is from my daughters which is 100 Adobe RGB
 
sk66 said:
I get very similar colors from both images... I highly doubt I have selected the exact same pixels so some difference is to be expected. But the right image does look slightly more saturated/redder to me.

What I did find is that the image(s) do not have the color space embedded. What that means is that some programs will assume/use sRGB, while others will just use the system/monitor profile.
I also suspect that you created a less than optimal monitor profile... there are several options (D65, gamma 2.2, black point, etc) that will affect the calibrated profile. I.e. just because you used a calibrator doesn't mean the resulting profile is right/good.

View attachment 269802
Click to expand...
How do I embed the colour space into the image. I thought lightroom done that when exporting in SRGB.

And I calibrated from D65 and 2.2 gamma
 
the first step to calibration is to set the monitor to factory defaults. this will give yo a clean start. the pink coloring could be due to a lose or damaged cable. i have also noticed and i dont know why . different types of connector calibrate slightly differently. eg srgb dvi hdmi
 
steve_lyt said:
the first step to calibration is to set the monitor to factory defaults. this will give yo a clean start. the pink coloring could be due to a lose or damaged cable. i have also noticed and i dont know why . different types of connector calibrate slightly differently. eg srgb dvi hdmi
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I set it all to factory settings before calibrating and the pink tone isn't a loose cable as the pink tone goes away after calibrating.
 
Connor Moore said:
I do export in SRGB but the images look different even on the same display
Click to expand...

My experience with lightroom is that if I use a different colourspace for any stage of editing an image, when I export even though I tell LR to use sRGB, the other colourspace carries over in the the image. I discovered this when sending pictures for printing - images that were supposed to be sRGB and included that information in the exif data were actually exported using the other colour space, and they failed to print correctly.
 
ancient_mariner said:
My experience with lightroom is that if I use a different colourspace for any stage of editing an image, when I export even though I tell LR to use sRGB, the other colourspace carries over in the the image. I discovered this when sending pictures for printing - images that were supposed to be sRGB and included that information in the exif data were actually exported using the other colour space, and they failed to print correctly.
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That's an interesting observation - I've had a few issues with sending images off for printing and not quite getting back what I was expecting. Some of it is user error, but there may be something more to it. I'll start a new thread on that topic though at some point so as not to derail this thread any more...
 
Connor Moore said:
How do I embed the colour space into the image. I thought lightroom done that when exporting in SRGB.

And I calibrated from D65 and 2.2 gamma
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Lightroom does embed the color space (PS can be more difficult)... there's a fair chance that the tag was stripped when uploaded here (the exif only says RGB w/ no alpha).

First thing I would do is recalibrate the monitor in a darkened environment; to make sure there is no ambient light coloration/brightness causing an issue.

The wide gamut saturation issue is due to stretching the smaller color space to the wide gamut space... does your phone have an OLED wide gamut screen? Most phone apps are not color managed AFAIK. I.e. the issue may be your phone.

Using a calibrated screen does not require others to use color managed software... i.e. if you export the images in sRGB correctly than any program that assumes sRGB (non-color managed) or reads/applies the tag (color managed) will display the image correctly.
The only other possibility is that you created a bad profile, or installed it incorrectly (or the wrong one?).
 
Connor Moore said:
Also you can work in Adobe RGB in lightroom and if I put Photoshop to Adobe RGB then it will mess the profile up when imported to Photoshop from lightroom
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Lightroom ALWAYS works in ProPhoto, you cannot change it.
Don't confuse the working colour space with the display colour space.
 
Brian G said:
Lightroom ALWAYS works in ProPhoto, you cannot change it.
Don't confuse the working colour space with the display colour space.
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Yeah I meant to say can't not can sorry. I know lightroom only works in pro photo
 
sk66 said:
Lightroom does embed the color space (PS can be more difficult)... there's a fair chance that the tag was stripped when uploaded here (the exif only says RGB w/ no alpha).

First thing I would do is recalibrate the monitor in a darkened environment; to make sure there is no ambient light coloration/brightness causing an issue.

The wide gamut saturation issue is due to stretching the smaller color space to the wide gamut space... does your phone have an OLED wide gamut screen? Most phone apps are not color managed AFAIK. I.e. the issue may be your phone.

Using a calibrated screen does not require others to use color managed software... i.e. if you export the images in sRGB correctly than any program that assumes sRGB (non-color managed) or reads/applies the tag (color managed) will display the image correctly.
The only other possibility is that you created a bad profile, or installed it incorrectly (or the wrong one?).
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None of this makes sense to me. I calibrated my monitor in a pitch black room and done all the right things for calibration that I'm aware of.

But people keep going on about colour managed softwares. This is really annoying as if thats the case then I don't want a calibrated screen that just seems stupid to me. So if it's not calibrated people see what I edit and how I intended it. But if I calibrate my display, it looks perfect to me but different to everyone else. This makes no sense to me.

If I don't calibrate I don't have an issue apart from a slight pinkish tone on the laptop screen. I ended up going into manual controls for colour and brightness and I changed the hue my like 1% and pulled the reds down slightly and now it looks perfect and my files look relatively the same on everything.

I'm still angry as I paid £150 for a calibrator and £2000 for a laptop that shows 100% of the RGB and Adobe RGB colour spectrum but it's going to waste and not being used.
 
Its not a waste if you want to print accurately, usually the reason people calibrate and set profiles
 
Connor Moore said:
So if it's not calibrated people see what I edit and how I intended it
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Nope, everyone is looking at something slightly, sometimes massively different, you have ZERO control over what people see.

tijuana taxi said:
Its not a waste if you want to print accurately, usually the reason people calibrate and set profiles
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^ This

I have had so many conversations/arguments about this subject, usually with people who have read the book but in reality have never walked the walk.
 
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Studio488commercial said:
Nope, everyone is looking at something slightly, sometimes massively different, you have ZERO control over what people see.
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Yeah I know it would be different because every screen is different but what I mean is when I export then open the jpeg its way more saturated than it is in lightroom but when my scree. Isn't calibrated, I don't get this problem. So this is a colour profile problem and not a screen problem
 
I'll calibrate purely for print purposes, but a work around if the shift is consistent, would be adjust saturation down slightly before exporting for web!

Even with my screen calibrated, and printer paper profiled, which deals with most things, but to deal even then there a slight difference to what I see on the Screen and I need to tell the printer to increase Brightness otherwise my prints come out darker than what I'm viewing on my screen. And on odd occasions I have to alter contrast/sharpening to get the print I do want.
 
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