IR Film Photography

Kev M

Kev M

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I've decided to give myself a set of goals for this summer to try some difference techniques one of which is IR photography which raises a couple of questions.

Obviously I need IR film, any recommendations?

Do you have to use a special filter with the IR film?

Is metering for use with IR film the same as normal? If I have to use a filter will it work if I place it over my light meter to take an incident/reflective reading?

Someone mentioned at camera club last night that you had to process them in metal tanks. Is that true?

They also said that they had to be loaded in total darkness, no problem I've got a changing bag. But if you're loading the film onto the take up spool (120) how do you know when you've wound it on to the right point before closing the back?

Can IR negs be printed on normal B&W papers in normal chemistry or do they need a special paper & chems? Can they be developed in normal chems?

That'll do for a starter I reckon,
Cheers,
Kev
 
For recommendations, I like Rollei's IR 400, it's sensitive to 820nm, so quite a lot further into IR land than Ilford's SFX200, easy to process (standard b&w chemicals), and reasonably priced (~£6.50/36exp 35mm roll).
You don't have to use a special filter with IR film, but it's a waste of money if you don't as it'll just behave like regular b&w film, so really a filter is a must, something like a Hoya R72 which cuts all visible light.
This is the first I've heard of requiring metal tanks, and I've processed quite happily in a plastic patterson tank.

As for loading in darkness, this was the case with Kodak's HIE, and is also true with Efke's Infrared Aura film as they lack anti halation layers, which allows light to travel the length of the film. It won't hurt to load in subdued light though.

For printing, this is an area I'm out of my depth, as it's something I've not done (other than a contact print or two from my pinhole camera years back), but as you end up with a regular negative, I don't see any reason why printing would be different.

In terms of metering, I generally meter for ISO400 (either TTL without filter in place, or incident), then add 5 stops to compensate for the IR filter. You may find it easier to rate the film ISO 12 and use whatever reading your meter gives. It doesn't hurt to bracket a stop or two either way too.
 
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Nothing to add to Dfhaii's post other than to confirm it.
I did shoot a roll of Rollei IR400 last year, I did use an R72 filter, I did meter at iso 12, and it did give quite a strong effect.
It was a practice roll, it wasn't thoughtfully shot and thus I should shoot some more this summer...:)
 
my experience is very much the same, the Rollei IR 400 is a good option, nice effect and I just treat it like any other film except I'm a bit more careful when loading and obviously use the filter. I've got some 5x4 to use this year if we get some nice bright days.

It actually compliments normal landscape togging quite well as it give good results in the middle of the day, when most other landscape togging is a bit rubbish.
 
I used to shoot a lot of this in the early 90's mainly used Kodak but I am sure Konica used to do something useful too, always processed in plastic tanks with no problems. Alas it is all too easy now with PS.
 
Picked up a couple of rolls of Ilford SFX200 at Focus yesterday as it was going cheap. Then went to the Intro2020 stand to ask about Hoya IR filters and got told they were £80. Wasn't counting on that when I bought the film.


Having said that the woman on the Ilford stand said I could just use a deep red filter so I'll see what colour square filters I've got. does anyone know if this will work or have a 67mm IR filter they want to get rid of at a reasonable price.
 
Someone posted a link to the Lee filter on WHE for about £15 a few days ago, sounds a bargain to me (y)
 
Ilford SFX is Red sensitive so adding a deep red filter will have some effect but not as much as the proper IR filters.

Just had a quick Google and Cokin do IR filter (89B I think) for less then £30 depending on where they come from.
 
only problem with Cokin filters is the possibility of light-leaks. I bought a screw-in 720nm filter from the bay of fleas for around £15 (72mm version) - was from this crew... - bit cheaper in 67mm (y)

Have to admit, I've only used it on the dijical, my main film camera had IR sensors for frame counting etc, so doesn't like IR film. I'll get around to trying it on the old yashica at some point, probably after I've got a better feel for how it works on the digi. first :shrug:
 
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raathistle said:
Someone posted a link to the Lee filter on WHE for about £15 a few days ago, sounds a bargain to me (y)
Click to expand...

I got all excited for a minute but a quick bit of research makes them sound a little bit unsuitable. I think I'd be better off spending a little more and getting the right filter first time round.

Knikki said:
Ilford SFX is Red sensitive so adding a deep red filter will have some effect but not as much as the proper IR filters.

Just had a quick Google and Cokin do IR filter (89B I think) for less then £30 depending on where they come from.
Click to expand...

Yeah, they were a bit light on that information yesterday, said it was an IR film. Never mind, it'll do for a start and if I'm buying a proper filter I might as well get some proper IR film too.

TheBigYin said:
only problem with Cokin filters is the possibility of light-leaks. I bought a screw-in 720nm filter from the bay of fleas for around £15 (72mm version) - was from this crew... - bit cheaper in 67mm (y)

Have to admit, I've only used it on the dijical, my main film camera had IR sensors for frame counting etc, so doesn't like IR film. I'll get around to trying it on the old yashica at some point, probably after I've got a better feel for how it works on the digi. first :shrug:
Click to expand...

Cheers for the link, does the quality seem okay?
 
Kev M said:
Yeah, they were a bit light on that information yesterday, said it was an IR film. Never mind, it'll do for a start and if I'm buying a proper filter I might as well get some proper IR film too.
Click to expand...


Stuff like Ilford SFX, Konica 750 (no longer made) I also suspect the Rollei film are what they call 'Red Sensitive' basically means that they are all aorund the 700-750nm wave length meaning that if you looked at a light/colour chart (or what ever they are called) you will see that they are up in the beginnings of infra red spectrum.

The old Kodak H1E(?) was up in the 1475nm range and was a proper infrared film, which need special handling, like total darkness to dev it, steel tanks etc.

If you do get hold of a R72 filter then when you meter (assuming your using the Bronica and hand held meter) then set the meter to ISO 12 and away you go. Should dev in all makes of developer, have done it myself (yonks ago) using ID-11 or Rodinal.

Oh another thing check out Amazon they seem to have a range of screw in IR filter with a wider variety of prices.

Have fun :)
 
Kev M said:
Cheers for the link, does the quality seem okay?
Click to expand...

Seems pretty good to me, only gave it a try a couple of times, and hadn't got the most solid of tripods back then, but it did some interesting stuff...



If you click through to Flickr theres a bigger version.
 
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I think it has to be a deep red filter, because SFX isn't IR film, its pseudo IR.
:)
 
I shot a test roll of Efke ir820 at the weekend. I metered for 100ASA then added 5 stop and 6 stops. I used a Cokin P007 filter blue-tac'd to a clear filter ;) Developed in Illfosol 3 for 8.5 mins. Seems that you should pre-wash the EfKe film, not sure why! Also used water for stop bath, fixed normally. Negs seem OK, the +6 stops shots seem better exposed. Will be in the darkroom tonight to see how they have come out!
 
Here's the result!

4426213303_2fb6c1d949_o.jpg


This is a scan from a print but i had to do further work to it in Photoshop. Very difficult neg to get a good conventional print as the shadow details are pretty thin and the highlight details are very heavy. Will be back in the darkroom again next week to try to get a better print that I don't have to edit in Photoshop. Very excited and please with my first efforts with IR film, especially considering all the horror stories I have read concerining Efke ir820 Aura.
 
Nice focus! If that's a bad one the good one should be awesome!
 
+1 really like this shot although If im honest, the highlight along the edge of the cliff is a bit distracting?..

Bry
 
Remember that you must use the IR focus mark (usually a little red mark near the normal focus mark) on your lens - don't use autofocus if you have it.

Metering usually won't work as the deep red confuses the meter - meter with the filter off at normal ISO (200 for SFX 400 for Efke 820 I think unless you want to push it) when focused normally and note the aperture. Then put the filter on and add on 4 to 6 stops if its an R72 filter or 89B depending on the film used. SFX200 recommends 4 stops and Efke 820 recommends 5 but lots of people say to use 6. This makes any IR film pretty slow usually between 6 and 12 ISO so use a tripod. Focus it to the IR focus mark and then.....

Take the Picture!

If your lens doesn't have an IR focus mark then either:

  1. Its a lens that doesn't need any change in focus - most do some don't
  2. It doesn't have one so you will have to guess or use a different lens


Hope this helps
 
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Hi Samuel thanks for the tips.

I've just checked one of the Bronica lenses I have handy and it has the IR focussing mark so I assume the rest will too.

Spring seems a bit late this year, roll on green leaves and sunshine.
 
Kev, I've just got a HiTech IR filter from teamwork for about £30 all in, had a quick play on my 5d and is looks fine. 30second exposure with no light leaks (con't go longer as no expensive canon shutter release thingy).

Bit of a pain it come today and not yesterday, was a lovely bright sunny day here yesterday, today is a bit poo!
 
I am planning to try this IR photography and a little clarification would be great.
I have not used film in 20 years.

I have a Zorki 4K With a Jupiter 8 lens. I also have the hoya r72 and the stepping rings to fit.

I noticed here that you Meter for iso 12 does this vary for different film, light etc? or could I take this as a safe benchmark.

In focusing there was mention of the IR focus spot does anybody have any idea as to where this is on the Jupiter 8
 
Metering for Iso 12 would be for a 400iso film, such as Rollei IR400 as mentioned in early posts. This gives +6 stops worth of adjustment. Ilford SFX200 would be ISO 6 by same process.

If there is a IR focus spot on the jupiter-8 it will be on the ring where the normal focus indicator and depth of field markings are scribed. There's no guarantee that there will be a marking - it's a FSU lens, after all - they sometimes missed elements of the lens out if the Vodka ration was good that day :LOL: If there's no IR marker, then i'd try not to shoot with the lens wde open, and hope that DOF covers any variations.
 
There is a colour IR option available but it is tres expensive, cut down from some sheet arial film by "a guy" and sold by silverprint HERE. £18 a pop though so not worth it unless you really love it
 
Unfortunately that's not going to be available much longer, Kodak has just discontinued the bulk stock aerial film the guy was cutting it down from.
On his website he says that what has has on hand is all that's left.
The effect is certainly worth it though IMO, the examples the guy has on his Flikr are really effective.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/infrared_film/

A real shame really as I have always wanted to shoot some but have not been able to as I don't have a 120 camera. You don't even need an IR filter, just a yellow or orange filter will give the colour IR image.

About ISO 6 - 12 is what's usually used for B&W IR film. For SFX 200 with an R72 set your meter to 12 and for Efke/Adox IR820 add on 5 - 6 stops to the listed speed as I can't quite remember what it is. Remember though that your meter won't be able to meter through a deep red filter. Look at my previous post.

I looked on a Jupiter 8 picture and couldn't see an IR mark. That means that its likely you won't be able to use it or more unlikely it needs no correction, I'll have a deeper look for you.

A cheaper place to get Ilford SFX 200 is 7 day shop, its about half the price than at at Silverprint. Not sure about the Efke IR820 though.

I personally would use SFX though as IR820 is true IR film, it needs to be loaded and unloaded in complete darkness, used as quickly as possible once loaded and stored in a freezer plus you should get it processed as quick as possible. It does have a very good effect though.
SFX however is 'pesudo IR', it does the same thing but with an extended red sensivity to give the effect and as so does not need any of the above precautions.

Another thing about IR photography to be careful of is the IR frame counter in some cameras - especially all Canon EOS SLRs, the Xpan 1, a lot of Minolta cameras after the mid 80's and anything else that uses an IR frame counter. This will fog the negatives otherwise, some are o.k and just do it on the sprocket holes, others extend into the image itself

Hope this helps:)
 
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Not so sure... have you tried a (say) 800nm filter on a colour film? Maybe even 700nm?
 
I've checked the data sheets of most kodak films and all them have spectral sensitivity that falls short of 720nm, so IR filters would be of no use.
 
Well, maybe try 650 then? OK, long exposure but you'll never know...
 
If you look on Silverprint with that colour IR film on the datasheet from the guy it actually says to not use even a red filter and certainly not an IR filter as all you will get is a dark red image.

It is a shame that its finally going though, as I said, I've always wanted to try some. Blame digital imaging, Kodak and the US Forestry Service signed a 10 year deal a few years ago to supply it to the Forestry Service for IR aerial photography. Now that digital IR imaging has "advanced further than anticipated in the last few years", the deal has been called off.

BTW Ambermile, theres not a film in the world thats colour (apart from that stuff) and will go to 720nm, even 650nm is really pushing it, the Kodak Portra 400VC is slightly sensitive at 700nm so you might get away with it but the exposure would be verrrrrry long and just red.
 
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When I do IR with the digital camera and an IR filter it's red too, just needs a tweak on the balance is all. Yes, I know CCD's are red sensitive but they have filters to close down that end - and yet still enough gets through to make the images I posted earlier.
 
That rollei infrared film is cheaper from ag-photographic. Some serious bargains here though:

link

link

The second seller has got some decent auctions as well...
 
Still haven't got around to buying a filter. When buying a filter do you have to match the Nm of the filter to the film? The cheaper ones seem to be about 700Nm and the more expensive 8-900Nm. This all means very little to me apart from numbers. I've got some SFX and some Konica 720 to start with but if I get into it and buy some proper IR film will I find a filter with a 700Nm rating not up to the job with proper IR film?
 
I think an IR Filter is an IR filter no matter what the film is you use like the Hoya R72 or the Wraten equivalant which is such a dark red you can't really see through it.

Best see if you can get hold of data files for the films your intested in which should tell you what the best filter is to use.

Or if you wait abit I will post an old image taken using Konica 750 film and a R72 filter when I get home. :D
 
I used to use a Kodak 25 red with SFX and a Lee 87 which is 750nm with either Kodak HIE or Konica infra-red. Couldn't see a thing with the 87 though!!
Definately tripod only
C
 
SFX and Konica 750 only have spectral sensitivity up to about 740-750nm. To get the infrared effect you want to use a filter above the range of the visible light spectrum (~700nm) and below the highest sensitivity value of the film (~750nm in your case). So, if you're getting one of the cheap filters on evilbay the one to go for is the 720nm filter.

Efke and Rollei IR films have spectral sensivity up to 820nm, Kodak HIE 900nm. A filter with a cutoff value of 720nm with give good results with all of them. Basically don't bother getting any of the infrared filters with higher cutoff values unless you intend to use the for digital infrared photography.
 
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