Large group photo - Help!

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daharro

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David
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Hi all,

I'm looking for some advice... I've been asked to take a squadron photo at work which is a formal shot of about 150 people. I've got a D90 with a 16-85 and 50mm f1.8. Which one do you thinjk is going to be better? Do you think i'm going to be able to get everyone in (I'm thinking three or four rows) and it not look like everyone is too small, or should i be trying to take two or three photos and stitch them?

First time i've had to do this, and i really really dont want to F* it up! Any help gratefully recieved!

Dave
 
Hello David,

Using a 50mm lens on a cropped sensor camera (which I think the d90 is??) will be difficult, you might have to be in a different postcode to get 150 people in! :)

I'd stick with the 16-85mm and use it to frame effectively. You might try using a mid-range f-stop such as f9 to give some DOF and if possible use a tripod to get every ounce or sharpness out of the image.

Definitely shoot in raw so you can sharpen the image effectively and play with the white balance, exposure and any other post processing effects (keep it subtle for a formal pics I'd suggest).

Avoid stitching, there's so much individual detail in rows and columns of people it would be easy to make a photoshop slip and leave someone without a head or duplicate someone! Also you get perspective problems so it might end up looking like they're sitting in a fishtank!
 
Agreed with the above about stitching, i'd recommend using the 16-85 maybe around the 35mm end (if it's TOO wide) to avoid distortion.

But i'd try to get up high, and point the camera down it makes it much easier to get everyone in the shot
 
I think you'll end up at 16mm and even that on a crop might not be wide enough, it's quite a large group. If you get 30 peeps standing side by side that's still 5 rows deep.

If you can position yourself higher than the group, stairs or a balcony, that should make it easier to get them all in.
 
Ok thanks guys! is it also going to be worth using a flash to fill in? I dont know where they want to do it yet, I think the location might be a bit limited. I have got a tripod so thats not a problem!
 
If you use a flash you want to be sure it will reach everyone in the scene. Otherwise you might end up with it being brighter around the centre of the shot (may be subtle) with a noticeable drop-off.

Best wait for someone who's done very large group shots with flash for the final say on that though!
 
Don't go wide, you need a roughly normal perspective. 50/1.8 @ f11.

Get the front and back rows to take a pace outwards and dress em off sideways.

Shoot from something high, take a chair/stool/stepladder.
 
No flash! Do it in daylight with the sun behind you.

Oh, and the tall people at the back.
 
ok no flash! I'm really hoping they are over-estimating the number of people, i dont think i've ever seen 150 people in work let alone in the one squadron! Although they always come out of the woodwork!

Thanks for the help guys, i'll let you know how it goes!
 
150 no probs. If you don't have staging then you need 60 chairs and 5/6 gym benches and 8 tables. And if you are out side no less than 30mm wide angle or you will get distortion.
29 row front sitting chairs. then 30 2nd row standing. if you can get gym benches it's then 29 on bench then 4th row standing on chairs. 5th row on tables.

29
30
29
30
29

Front row is 'important 'people centre out.


Then you build the group tallest to shortest. Tell someone in the squadron and they will get the chaps in order.

Then build the group from the centre out.
so it's tallest first all in height order.

If you dont follow these simple rules it look like a pigs ear. Faces in spaces.

The eye should flow from the centre to the edges.

Need to know more then PM me.

You can use fill flash if the sun is behind you. A Metz CT45 will do the job.

Got a group of 1300 in April you can come and help.....
 
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What about shooting from a high angle? Might make an alternative interpretation but keep the formality.
 
Daryl said:
You can use fill flash if the sun is behind you. A Metz CT45 will do the job.
.
Click to expand...

Why would you use fill flash if the sun is behind you?

Don't under-estimate the job you're taking on with a group of that size. To give you some idea - this group is about twenty people wide in the front row...

4810500746_4b0bc107d0_o.jpg


I was backed up against a wall and just got the group in with the 17-40L on the 50D at 17mm. You're looking at another ten people wider and 5 rows so it's a pretty big group.

You've had some good advice about front row seated - second row standing, 3rd row standing on benches 4th row on tables etc and tallest at the back etc. If you're struggling you could get the front row sitting cross-legged on the ground, but as the front row will probably be higher ranks , that wont go down well. :D

Enlist some help in setting up the shot and take your time getting everyone arranged - it's not easy - make sure once you've finsihed that you can see everyones face before you take the shot.

Military types usually want to go for the formal straight ranks shot, in which case make sure well in advance of the day that there's be plenty of chairs, benches and tables etc handy - you don't want to be scratching around for them on the day.
 
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Shooting this kind of group is all about the people managment, as Daryl said.

yes, bash flash in there for a bit of on-axis fill (CT, just to lift the shadows under people's noses etc a tiny bit)

'Everyone make sure they can see the end of my camera with both of their eyes' is quite a useful phrase, can help in avoiding getting half a head from someone in a back row, though doing what Daryl has said should avoid that issue.


get an order form together so people can buy a print, get a pack of mounts from photomart and get them printed at dscolourlabs, great success for everyone :)
 
itsdavedotnet said:
yes, bash flash in there for a bit of on-axis fill (CT, just to lift the shadows under people's noses etc a tiny bit)

:)
Click to expand...

Well each to their own way of working, but I'd avoid having people looking into the sun and squinting like geeks, then adding flash into the mix. I'd associate shadows under noses with the sun overhead rather than behind the camera.

I'd much prefer a bright overcast day, or shoot in the shade using fill flash in either situation. On a really sunny day I'd avoid shooting with the sun behind me unless it was absolutely avoidable.
 
The Sun, even in light cloud should always be behind you. In the 10 to 2 position. some times with offical shots you are told it has always been here and can end up facing the sun. If you can you never face the sun. If you have no choice get the group to close their eyes and on the count of 3 open and look to your feet. They won't sqint as much.


A group this size should take about 15mins 4 or 5 shoots and done.
 
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a stitch is ok if you leave gaps...some school photos are done this way...but only with 3-4 in a shot then stitched at the edges where there is only white background

for 150 folks in 5 rows thats 30 per row... or multiple of such

try a theatre seeting arrangement in a church or venue with seating...

then take a walk

a super wide will distort so the 15...which is around 28mm in 35mm terms...is wide enough
and you will get a decent dof at f5.6

you can stagger seating so not to loose any faces and cushions for some rows to raise bums and standing at the back

i would settle on the english world cup team plan of

26 28 30 32 34...and no goalie
 
Cheers for all your advice guys, its first thing in the morning so i will let you know! Fingers crossed eh!
 
Good luck - just seen this. I was at a group event where I was lucky enough to be able to keep it more informal than you might be able to do to get a group shot of around 75 people. It was in an indoor, glass atrium lit facility with good light. I`d have been lost though if I had not scouted ahead and bribed a caretaker/ bouncer with a drink to persuade him to let me know where the screwdriver was kept to open a 2nd floor balcony french window always closed for health and safety reasons. Result - a big circle of people all looking up, reducing double chins and laughing at a few antics by me up high. It`s getting the height that will save you here or having at least 3 flashlights spread on stands to get even lighting if you use flash
 
If you can, definitely use 50mm at f/8. You could get people in at least 3 rows: front sitting, and 3rd row on some platform, while 4th could be all the really tall people. No people should be directly in front of the others, and do many exposures in case of blinking and face pulling. It happens all the time, particularly with kids.

Lighting is important. At least use a fill flash (that is Av or M mode, high speed sync and -1-2EV flash comp). Overcast day is perhaps the easiest to handle. If you are into it seriously you should think about 2 softboxes one from each side at angle aimed at the opposite side.
Direct sunlight is quite a good recipe for a disaster. Everyone will be squinting and swamped with shadows.
 
Well it went quite well! Plenty of time taken up by dressing people off in size order and faffing around trying to find the OC who forgot it was happening! I havent had a chance to look at the photos properly but it seems to be ok, they all look sharp enough. I think theres at least one person in each shot with eyes closed so might have to PS some eyes in subtly! Cheers for the advice, it definitely helped!
 
Glad it went well. I'm interested too to here how you got on, settings etc.
 
Squadron photo?
You do know you have RAF Service Photographers for this sort of thing, don't you?
DMOC at RAF Halton would happily supply someone...as would Media Ops at Strike Command...
 
Daryl said:
Hoping to Benson and Brize soon..... The RAF togs dont tend to be bothered or do it anymore............
Click to expand...

You do have to pay them - we don't do them for free either...lol

Squadron/Platoon/Company/Battalion Groups and Mess Photos are paid-jobs.
 
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