Law question

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Iain
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Hi guys, I hope I'm posting this in the right place.

I have a slight question about permissions for photographs, little bit long winded so please bear with me.....

On of my best mates is getting married in July. The guy she is marrying is cool but his bother is a bit of an idiot. I fell out with the brother a little while ago. He text me today abusing me about a story he'd heard involving me & his sister. He then proceeded to tell me I should pray I don't photograph him at the wedding as he is official denying permission.

Now, the wedding is being held in the grounds of a hotel. What I want to know is as this is a public place & I am not the official photographer, can i photograph him without fear? Do I have to get him to make a disclaimer that I have to sign agreeing not to photograph him? Is the text he sent evidence enough, as he seems to think it is?

Where do I stand on this? All help is greatly appreciated

Thanks
 
surely the harmony of the wedding is key, cant your friend have a word with her perspective husband to pull the brother in ?

as its a wedding in a public place dont see how permisson is needed as you state that you are not the official photographer, and the photos will be for own use to remember the day and maybe pass back favourite prints to her

think this is the brother problem and needs a talking too, also maybe a wide berth would be advised
 
Have a word with your mate first, see if she can defuse it. If he doesn't want his picture taken he should stay at home. Sorry I can't offer any legal help but I'm sure you will get plenty of advice and a few suggestions ;).
 
Well there are people who know more about this than me but my first thought is that if the wedding is taking place at a hotel, then it is NOT a public place.

I think a clear distinction needs to be made between something happening 'IN public' ie in public view and 'ON private land' The two are not the same.

If you take your clothes off in my front garden you are doing it 'in public' but you are 'on private land'.

As regards the specific nature of the situation you are outlining then perhaps the best thing to do to begin with would be to discuss the situation with your friend and her fiancé.

Just out of curiosity how big is he?
 
I know this probably isn't what you want to hear. But, for the sake of the Bride & Groom and a peacful wedding could the camera not stay at home? Or, is he just looking for an excuse to kick off? If so, spend the day taking photos of his sister being carefull not to include him in any :)
 
What a complete £$IO:mad:, you would think, for the sake of his brother on his special day, he could act as a grown up - I presume he is one :shrug:

Unortunately, there are those that can't.

I hope you get this resolved, I think the main thing is don't let it spoil your enjoyment of the day and esp. don't let it spoil it for the couple. (y)
 
He cannot officially deny permission. He is attending the wedding at his own choice, no one is forcing him to be there. It is common knowledge that weddings have wedding photographers to document the proceedings.

If he doesn't want to be photographed he has two options: Keep out of the way or don't attend.


Steve.
 
He cannot officially deny permission. He is attending the wedding at his own choice, no one is forcing him to be there. It is common knowledge that weddings have wedding photographers to document the proceedings.

If he doesn't want to be photographed he has two options: Keep out of the way or don't attend.


Steve.

:plus1: all the way. Does the groom know what a little douchebag his brother is being? If my brother had done that he'd have got a swift kicking...metaphorically speaking...NOT that I'm condoning violence of any sort. Sounds like he's just trying to get one over on you. I'd suggest talking to the B&G, making it clear what's going on and seeing if the groom can't get the bro to wind his neck in.
 
He cannot officially deny permission. He is attending the wedding at his own choice, no one is forcing him to be there. It is common knowledge that weddings have wedding photographers to document the proceedings.

If he doesn't want to be photographed he has two options: Keep out of the way or don't attend.


Steve.

he can decline to be photographed and actually telling the photographer means the photographer can't take the photo or he'd be breaching the peace.





tell the groom that his brother is being a ****
 
What Steve said ^. What on earth does this guy thinks he can do? He would never get this to a court of law - weddings and photography go together - fact of life. Go ahead, don't worry about a thing but for goodness sake don't taunt him or make him the target of any candids. Play it cool and dignified!

Alan
 
Just out of curiosity how big is he?
BIG!! Hes about 6ft 4 and weighs about 18st I think

could the camera not stay at home? Or, is he just looking for an excuse to kick off? If so, spend the day taking photos of his sister being carefull not to include him in any :)
My friend asked me if I would take some photos as she likes my style of photography plus I was going to put them in an album as a wedding present to them :) Plus to be honest, his sister isn't all that or my type, she and I just get on really well. My friends cousin who is a brides maid..... no she is a different story ;)

Right, so the general jist of the feedback is I can take photos without worrying about permission? If he has a problem with it I can tell him to go take a long walk off a short cliff? :D
 
Id' say talk to the B&G and see if they can talk to him. You don't want to take a picture of this meathead for him to then kick off and put a damper on the day. Out of interest, how old is this muppet supposed to be? Because he's acting like a 15 year old.
 
it just goes to show how much respect he shows to the prospective bride and groom.
I would have thought that at least on the special day he could put aside any animosity he has towards you. There is enough stress about arranging and getting married without unnecessary extra stress and worry caused by one person,.

If he listens stories put about by others then he needs to grow up. Any relationship you have,or any relationship his sister has, has got nothing to do with him, and he should get on with his own life.

I would go ahead and take the photos YOU-the BRIDE and the GROOM and any of the family want. it is not uncommon for siblings to get very jealous of something , in this case the marriage. Maybe a word to the parents if possible about your concerns may help.
I know from personal experience, my sister flatly refused to be in any official photos when I got married, but thats another story.

I concur with Steve Smith when he says " If he doesn't want to be photographed he has two options: Keep out of the way or don't attend."

Realspeed
 
he can decline to be photographed and actually telling the photographer means the photographer can't take the photo or he'd be breaching the peace.

I don't agree with that.

He is electing to place himself in a position where it is known that photographs are going to be taken. If he does not want to be included then he needs to keep out of the way.

Although it is not stated in writing on the invitation, it is common knowledge that weddings are photographed so his attendance would be construed as giving permission.

It's a bit like going to a swimming pool and moaning about getting wet.

In reality, his brother needs to tell him what an @rse he is being.


Steve.
 
Right, so the general jist of the feedback is I can take photos without worrying about permission? If he has a problem with it I can tell him to go take a long walk off a short cliff? :D

I think the most important advice given is to make the BG aware of his brothers threats and your friends wishes for you to take some pics.
 
Slight difference between Scots Law and English Law there chaps. In Scotland, yes there could potentially be a breach of the peace issue. In England, not a cat's chance!

Yes he IS on private property but I take it as read that, as a wedding venue, the owners have not got a problem with photography? They are the only ones who have the right to dictate terms and conditions of any photography on their property. So he has not got a leg to stand on and if he threatens you with any kind of violence, he's the one breaking the law so keep any texts.

Now, how to resolve the issue, I like the idea of broaching it with Parents, they are the ones likely to be able to control such a childish idiot so I'd go with that.

Good luck :)
 
The guy is obviously a complete twonk and would not have a leg to stand on if tried to take it legal.
As Steve says it is common knowledge that weddings are literally infested with cameras and if he doesn't realise that then he should crawl back under his stone.
What a to**er to risk embarrassing his family. Maybe he's just an attention seeker. I would make his brother aware of his childish behaviour and totally ignore him on the day. If he accidentally ends pu on one of your photos - tough!
 
Maybe telling him that you'll try to avoid having him in shot but you obviously can't offer any guarantee, however if he is in any of your photos you'll blur his face out. Also point out he's at a public gathering where photos are going to be taken, he attends at his own risk. Wayne
 
Many years ago when Lord Denning was Master of the Rolls (a high office of the appeal court) he resided over a case of a householder vs. a local cricket club. The householder was seeking compensation for damages caused by an errant cricket ball.
Lord Denning ruled that as the cricket club was in existence many years before the house was built then the householder would have to live with the fact that cricket balls would occasionally enter onto his premises and ruled against the householder's claims.

This case is similar. The groom's brother is planning to attend this wedding of his own free will. Photography has been a part of wedding ceremonies and receptions for almost as long as photography has existed. This is common knowledge and it is expected that he knows this. Therefore his attendance of the wedding can be seen as an acceptance of being photographed.


Steve.
 
If you have been asked to take photos by the B&G then go for it. Just remember, the bigger they are the harder they fall :)
 
I want to talk to the bride as she is my mate, but everytime this guy gets the hump about something to do with me, he runs to her and puts her in the middle and I don't want her to be in the middle yet again :(

I did tell him if he is that bothered then get a legal document that I have to sign agreeing not to photograph you. After that he stopped texting me.

As far as I know the hotel owners have no problems with photography as there will be an official photographer on the day. I wasn't going to make a point of photographing him apart from as part of the family group photos. I still have the text conversation saved on my phone, already thought of keeping hold of it just in case
 
How old is this guy Macca?
 
Chris, Im sure he is 24, but as we are no longer friends I have stopped counting lol
 
Guy's, you never know quite what is going through someones head. Don't judge everyone as being as sane as everyone else, he could be passive aggressive or have some other slight disturbance to normal human communication. That said, he should not be behaving like this towards his sister's wedding so a quiet word with the parents or a call to the bride to explain and see what can be sorted out quietly might be a better idea than anything too overt.
 
He is aggressive and has a short temper. But from what I've seen he is more hot air than anything else. I just wanted to make sure that he had no legal leg to stand on
 
Chris, Im sure he is 24, but as we are no longer friends I have stopped counting lol

Well I'm 24 and still threaten people so I can't say too much...like this morning when someone stole my coffee and donut :bat: HOW DARE THEY?!

I think the thing to take from this thread is that you need to talk to either the bride or groom, or possibly the parents. But do it quietly, the last thing you want is to make matters worse close to a big day like this by going in all guns blazing.
 
Is there another family member who could be asked to keep an eye on his behaviour and control him if he starts to be a problem?

It's not really a legal thing as I don't imagine he is going to take any legal action against you for photographing him but it does sound like he may become agressive if you do.

If, as you say, it's all hot air, he can still create a fuss and potentially ruin the couple's day. If someone can prevent this from happening by diffusing any potential situation before it occurs, it would be a major advantage.


Steve.
 
I say get a big telephoto and a whopping great flash then get right in his face with the camera. There's nothing like good fight to really make a wedding memorable. ;)

Legally, you have no concerns and I'm sure that whatever the case and personal stories here, todays bravado by text will totally evaporate come the actual day. :):)
 
I will try talking to BG and see what happens. I will let them know what he has said and how I won't make a point of photographing him

Thanks for all the help guys :D
 
How about this for a thought, give your camera already set up to someone else to take those photos of him. That way he can't accuse you of taking them. Crafty or what?;)
Don't forget if you use Sandisk, you can show him you have deleted any photos of him, but they can still be recovered on the rescue disk

Realspeed
 
TBH realspeed, I don't particularly want to photograph him anyway, hes not photogenic at all. I was just going to get him in the group shots and then if he appears in any backgrounds

Its the bridesmaid I'll be trying to take lots of photos of hahaha
 
Obviously if you're not the official photographer then you don't actually need to photograph him if you don't want to.

Whilst we can be quite macho about expressing our rights and legal standing, in reality it is easier to not let the situation arise.

More importantly, make sure you post those bridesmaid shots!


Steve.
 
Pay someone to give him a good hiding the night before :bat: can't do with rubberheads, they need injecting :wacky:
 
Pay someone to give him a good hiding the night before :bat: can't do with rubberheads, they need injecting :wacky:
Nice idea but I think they may notice if a guy the size of a small bungalow is missing :LOL:
 
What I say rhymes with duck him. Take whatever you want to, and if he moans tell him to have his lawyer call you in the morning with injunction papers. And in the meantime keep a sly eye on how much he is drinking and his mood and alter your response as necessary!

And post those bridesmaids pics!!!
 
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