Lightening the Load (D800)

chrism_scotland

chrism_scotland

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Chris
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Hi folks,

I thought I'd ask this here as there seems to be a lot of people pondering the merits of mirrorless.

Basically I currently have a D800 and a nice set of lenses (Tamron 24-70 f2.8, Nikon 24mm f2.8D, Nikon 20mm f1.8G and the Nikon 70-200 f4 VR) and I do love use the camera but more and more I'm finding that I'm having less time for dedicated shooting time and I find that the kit is just too bulky to take with me everyday.

I also like to travel, having spent a week in February in Prague I took the D800, 24-70, 20mm and a 35mm f1.8 ED with the intention of "travelling light" and frankly it was just a pain, the camera felt huge, the kit very heavy, it probably didn't help that the weather for photography wasn't great (very grey/smoggy) but it did reiterate my feelings from my trip to Munich in December when I took just the D800 and the 16-35 f4 VR and again felt like I was weighed down somewhat (did get some great shots though!)

I have been looking at downsizing, partly because I think there are other options out there now to a full size full frame DSLR, namely the Sony A7x range and I've been following the A7/A7r and A7ii with a keen eye over the last 12 months or so, I wouldn't rule out other mirrorless systems (The Olympus EM1 looks great too) but I have become accustomed to the performance and low light ability of a full frame sensor having had 2x D600's and now the D800.

I've also considered the option of swapping out the D800 for the slightly smaller D750, and only take the primes on holiday in the summer (20/24 & 35 & 50/85) but that doesn't really get away massively from the size of the D800.

I'm not precious around the 36mp (having looked back at my 24mp shots of the D600 I can't see a huge difference) and I don't do anything thats particularly challenging AF wise (no sports, maybe a bit of aviation but only civilian airliners at the airport) and actually manual focus for a lot of what I do seems to be better (low light/night tripod stuff). I mainly shoot landscapes, architecture and citys and when I'm travelling and I can't see that theres an awful lot my D800 can do in this regard that a good and small mirrorless setup wouldn't.

A bit of an essay I know but I'd appreciate anyone's thoughts! particularly if anyone has already done the same or is thinking the same!
 
I wouldn't get rid of your DSLR i did that with same thoughts its to big and bulky couldn't be bothered carrying it so i sold it all got loads M43 gear and missed my DSLR :rolleyes:
I've now got my DSLR starting gradually getting lenses back and i wouldn't do same again so i now have a 5D3 and a Fujifilm X100S picked up for £458 as a Fuji refurb which i really like and tempted to take just that on my next holiday !

I'm still tempted with the idea to get back into CSC but either the EM5 Mark II or Fuji X-T1 which i have owned previously and really liked yet very reluctantly sold to get funds for 5D3..
I personally never seem to get along with the Sony series and ive had a few recently i had a A6000 and put that up for sale within 2 weeks (not had any A7 series) i just prefer the M43 and Fuji X series, M43 has loads lenses to choose from and is most compact to carry, Fuji X series has the edge on photos i thought yet the cameras and lenses are a bigger than M43 gear so im undecided which id go with :eek:
 
I have a Fuji system as well as a Nikon FF one and tend to take the Fuji out because it significantly lighter and smaller. The core of the Fuji system is an X-T1 and an 18-135 lens while the Nikon system is based around a D750 with a 24-120. Other lenses get taken depending on what I think I'll need. Did consider dropping the Nikon stuff completely but there are still quite a few things that it does better than the Fujis.
 
I use an x100s for a smaller and lighter option. As a travel/light option it's wonderful. I wouldn't sell my d800 for it, there are times when they are the best option. But if photography isn't my only reason to be somewhere the x100s comes with me
 
daugirdas said:
swapping camera systems to generally cheaper options won't likely improve your photography or reduce frustration. Experience and training will.
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The OP doesn't appear to be after 'improving' his photography as such, just reducing the weight so he can actually carry a good camera more often and shoot more (which is an improvement over NOT taking photos in my book lol)

Unless you are into selling BIG prints I suspect few people 'need' the resolution of a D800, so if 24mp you've found to be enough then dropping to 16mp for mirrorless you'll find makes Sod all difference

I have no doubts that the current better mirrorless can produce images of equal quality to a good DSLR in all but extreme cases (esp silly high ISO) - so if I were you I'd ask myself this question...

Do I need high ISO a lot, and so much so I can't just use some NR software such as Lightroom???

If yes - a D750 and a 24mm and 85mm will easily do and reduce your weight issue a fair bit (needs a bit of cropping but hey you have plenty of pixels - remember not long ago 6mp was considered more than enough for A3 prints - I know, I sold them happily)

If no - then I'd switch to mirrorless in an instant and carry a FAB camera with me far more often :)​

No matter how awesome the camera is if its not with you went you see a shot its worthless

Dave

PS - I'm toying with switching to mirrorless too, some of my pals and some highly respected togs I know use the Fuji system
 
Didn't you buy a A7 before Christmas, If so why did you get rid? If it was for IQ or size/handling then you wouldn't think M4/3 would be better. I like Fuji myself and only sold my XT1 due to the delay of the super tele.

The X100S / T seem a good alternative for travelling or if you can afford it the Sony RX1 as you like using primes.
 
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DG Phototraining said:
PS - I'm toying with switching to mirrorless too, some of my pals and some highly respected togs I know use the Fuji system
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As an aside I really considered this last yeasr. Even shooting a couple of weddings last year using XT-1s instead of d800. With regret, I decided not to change. Although the image quality was there I found they're were occasions when I came up against the kit limits, which I never do with Nikon.
 
Having just changed from a Canon 5d mk3 to A7R, I'd say there are definitely pros and cons to take on board. Bear in mind I use it mainly for landscapes.

Pros include IQ and DR, small size and weight. I like the EVF/LCD interface but some prefer the OVF of the SLR. I like the spread of AF points right across the frame and the what you see is what you get view and the histogram display. MF is easy with magnified view etc and thus you have the option of nearly any lens using an adapter.

Cons include less capable AF though I'm my case and probably yours doesn't sound like a big deal.
A7R definitely needs best practice to bring out its best i.e. tripod and release cable and high quality lenses.
Battery life is definitely much worse but the battery size means just pick up some spares so no problem.
My biggest concern is probably the obviously less robust build and weather sealing on the A7R.

Overall though for me it's a big win with less weight and size plus improved image quality. Thus I'm more likely to take the camera with me and use it. My landscape kit consists of A7R, 16-35mm, 55mm and a Contax G 90mm .
 
If you want to cut down there's only two sensible answers - don't take as much DSLR gear with you (preferably body and one prime), or buy a top end compact camera with a decent zoom.

Going the mirrorless route only ends up with a bag full of gear again. :D
 
Best of luck with whatever you decide to do mate.
I've been pondering the same of late. My landscape photography is taking me further and further from sea level and I have started to really enjoy hiking. The problem is, once you start getting into hiking up high you need to start carrying a lot of safety equipment, waterproofs, spare clothes, food and drink, ice axes, poles, maps, torches, the list goes on, so my lowepro backpack has had to make way for a decent rucksack which means my 5D3 and 16-35 F4 IS L lens is packed up safely in the bottom of it.

Suddenly, taking an image that isn't a deal breaker is now a ballache of unpacking and messing around to get it all out and of course my non photographer hiking buddies get a bit frustrated.... Because of this I have found myself coming home with less and less images and making a conscious decision to ignore shots I would ordinarily have taken the time to try and make the best of.

I also like to make trip reports on a hiking forum I use and again, I have no "bread and butter" images for this as I can't be bothered stripping the rucksack out just to take a picture illustrating "we parked here" or "lunchtime"

So I've been scouring reviews for a month or so looking for a pocket sized camera that can still produce decent results... I still take my SLR but want to be able to leave it packed away until a serious opportunity arises. I think I have found my solution. The Canon G7X. I've been out at weekend and taken a few test shots side by side with my 5D3 and I am more than shocked at its capabilities. If anyone's interested, I will pop them up.
 
I have a D610 and bought an Oly EM10 to have a dabble with M4/3, I've not picked up the Nikon since. The difference in image quality and high ISO isn't as much as you'd think and the lack of weight is truly liberating and also having high quality fast primes with IS is fantastic and easily makes up for the difference in ISO performance!

My recent trip to Marrakech sealed the deal with me and I'm going to pick up an EM1 as a more 'serious' camera - if I get on with it then the D610 will go.

Marrakech shots here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/72341657@N02/
 
I'll give my usual plug for the Sony RX10 as the ideal travel camera - 20MP 1" sensor, 24-200mm f2.8 equivalent zoom from Zeiss, decent EVF. I've hardly used my D7100 since getting mine.
 
Personally I think it's nice to have a small light camera to complement a dSLR - just been to Mexico where I took my d300s, and a Canon Powershot S110 which I ended up using more as it was lighter. I could have taken my girlfriends d3200 which is actually a very nice entry level camera, and very light. I would also consider, for future trips, a Canon GX7 or Sony RX100.
 
This is why I think canon should be on to a winner with the m series (although original didn't sell as well until the price drop by argos).

For those with a Canon Dslr it means you can use the m when you don't want to take all your kit around with you. If you get the m adaptor it also means you can use all of your DSLR lenses with it
 
Chris, you'll already know the main advantages and disadvantages of each type, as I se them...

DSLR advantages over A7 series - OVF (an advantage for some,) may have faster focus, may have better tracking, faster frame rate, more native lenses, longer battery life.

Minus points - big and bulky, potential focus issues / MA hassle.

A7 series advantages - EVF (an advantage for some,) in view histogram, peaking, zebras etc..., more compact, potentially more hassle free AF.

Minus points - Focus tracking may not be the best, possibly a lower frame rate, limited native lens choice (but some very good lenses are available and more coming.)

Personally I'm much happier with my A7 and MFT than with my previous 5D setup and I'll not go back to a conventional DSLR. DSLR's are just too big and bulky and too attention grabbing and I like the WYSIWYG and in view histogram offered by CSC's and I get a much higher first time keeper rate with these cameras as the chimping and retaking of shots I used to do with my DSLR's in more difficult to meter situations is very mostly gone. I also like being able to use old manual lenses with ease. If for some reason the A7 series dropped off the face of the earth I'd rather go to MFT or Sony APS-C CSC rather than APS-C or FF DSLR.

Good luck choosing.
 
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I went through the 'advanced compact' phase. It wasn't for me. Same reasons as OP, I wanted to lighten the load when travelling and just out and about. But I kept coming back to my D800 plus a prime ... I just ... prefer the feel/ergonomics of it, and the output was always better than any of the compacts, no matter how snazzy they were. I don't mind having a dslr + prime on me, it's not heavy or cumbersome if you're going to carry a bag anyway.

I sold on every compact I bought after a couple of months. Had the X-10, the RX100 and the X100s. But over time I have also sold on most of my lenses. I now have just 2, a 35mm and a 150mm. And I feel much freer about my shooting. I was trying to take everything everywhere when I had 5-6 lenses, and getting flustered. It was turning me off heading out just to shoot, for pleasure. I'm slowly getting back into it now, I know there's no fuss, I just grab the cam, and go. The only thing I miss is my 85mm 1.8, I was hesitant about selling that one, but I know I will buy one again ... I just needed funds at the time tbh. Great thing about a prime like that, is it won't break the bank, especially if you buy used.
 
Different things for different people. When I went to Rome/Athens I never found the camera to be heavy or cumbersome. One D800 with a 24-70F2.8 attached. Goes in a sling bag with some grads, a cpl. charger and spare battery. Doddle.

You'll take a bath lightening the load and then spend more to "downgrade" to a technically inferior system. Doesn't make sense to me.
 
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I moved from a Nikon DSLR system, no real regrets to be honest. :)
 
ST4 said:
Different things for different people. When I went to Rome/Athens I never found the camera to be heavy or cumbersome. One D800 with a 24-70F2.8 attached. Goes in a sling bag with some grads, a cpl. charger and spare battery. Doddle.

You'll take a bath lightening the load and then spend more to "downgrade" to a technically inferior system. Doesn't make sense to me.
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Hmmm. I made a profit when I sold all my Canon gear and bought more fully into CSC's. I ended up with fewer AF lenses but more lenses overall and I'm happy.

The "technically inferior" argument is subjective as DSLR's only hold a clear lead in maybe one or two areas and only then when you are looking at the very very best DSLR's whilst the same can be said for CSC's and they clearly have an advantage in some technical areas.

On balance the scales tilt very favourably for CSC's for me but some could see an advantage for DSLR's if their needs and style differ significantly from mine. So IMVHO it's a case of 6 and two 3's maybe.
 
All I know is I paid a LOT of bills after selling on gear, that I really didn't 'need'. And still had sufficient gear to do most types of shoot.

I never minded carrying about a bag of gear though either, had the D800 plus various lenses on me in NYC, Turkey and Spain. Not a problem.
 
Cagey75 said:
I never minded carrying about a bag of gear though either, had the D800 plus various lenses on me in NYC, Turkey and Spain. Not a problem.
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its horses for courses though. i much prefer a lighter, unobtrusive system to carry all day
 
Yeah, as i said earlier, more compact cameras weren't for me. I've tried both ways.
 
I did exactly this, sold up, bought a Fuji X-T1, never really got on with it and am now quite happy with a D750 with primes. The F 1.8g primes are all light and excellent quality.

I always felt the XT-1 was too small and fiddly for my hands, the focus was not as quick or accurate, ISO performance was poor over 1600 and after the novelty of the new system wore off I was realised I made a mistake.

I would stick with the Nikon, but perhaps go for the smaller and lighter D750, its great!
 
Thanks for the comments guys, its good to hear a wide range of different viewpoints and its given me a lot to think about! I also do take note if the comments from folk who have switched to a Mirrorless and then realised they didn't get on with it, I don't think I'm willing to fully ditch the kit, when size isn't critical the D800 & 24-70 is still the weapon of choice.

I will ponder Andrew's comments about the D750, a lighter body and more discipline about what I carry when I'm on my travels (light primes) could be an easier and ultimately cheaper solution than trying to buy a body and extra lenses!
 
I decided to make a topic based on my recent experiences looking for a compact.

Here.
 
I've had a 5D2 since 2010. No complaints about it really for what I use it for - landscape/coastal, general walkabout, kids portraits/days out etc - aside from the size & the weight. The past 12 months I've been shooting lots of old manual lenses on it & without using live view focus can be missed at times. That reason & the size/weight thing is the reason I've today ordered an A7 [& C/Y > Sony adapter] to 'try' :) I say try because I have a good month or so before I need to sell something to help pay for the Sony [old 450D kit, 17-40L & ND110, ND8, Lee filters, few manual lenses] & I can keep the 5D2 for a while too. I'll pick up an EF>Sony adapter & if I find I don't miss using the 5D2 & the 28/1.8 50/1.4 & 135L are usable on the A7 I may sell the 5D2 & the A7 & pick up an A7ii. Of course if I don't get on with the A7 I can hopefully sell it on without a loss :)

^^^ That's the plans anyway ;)
 
theres currently a7 series, sigma dp series and leica if you want same quality, more or less
 
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