long exposures in daylight?

HoppyUK said:
It's 0.9, so only three stops, so no.

Let's say your exposure would be 1/250sec at f/8, ISO400, then three stops takes it down to 1/30sec. Ten stops would get you down to 4secs but by changing the f/number and ISO you should be able to increase that to 32secs easily enough, or reduce it back to 1/2sec or less by going the other way.

This is the only ten stop filter you can buy at the moment, and there is nothing darker (unless you want to play about with one of the stronger welding mask glasses on another thread). B+W ND110 £37 in 58mm:
http://www.warehouseexpress.com/buy-b-w-58mm-nd-110-3-0-sh-filter/p1013506
Click to expand...

this is comin through the post 2morrow (fingers crossed) any advice on 'an average settin' just so i know where to begin.
 
Claire said:
The spinning lens focusing thing - you simply have to focus and compose first, switch to manual focus to lock the focus in place, and THEN attach the filter.

Seeing as you cannot see a thing through a 10-stopper, you won't be able to compose, focus or meter.

Set camera on a tripod
Compose
Auto focus, then flick to manual focus to lock it
Take meter reading in Aperture Priority at desired f-stop
Add 10 stops to this reading
Screw on filter
Switch to Manual mode with the same f-stop, adding the 10 stops to the shutter speed (you'll most likely need Bulb setting)
Click!
Click to expand...


I'll try an follow this, but do u not mean switch to Auto-focus to Lock the focus so i dont spin it by accident?
 
jackbauer said:
I'll try an follow this, but do u not mean switch to Auto-focus to Lock the focus so i dont spin it by accident?
Click to expand...

No she means focus with it on Auto by pressing the shutter button half way and then switch it to manual so that it doesn't try and re-focus when you press the shutter to take the picture. You'll just have to make sure it doesn't move while you're attaching the filter.
 
jontucker said:
No she means focus with it on Auto by pressing the shutter button half way and then switch it to manual so that it doesn't try and re-focus when you press the shutter to take the picture. You'll just have to make sure it doesn't move while you're attaching the filter.
Click to expand...

i see, but will it not be easier just to swicth it to manual on the very last second...just before i hit the shutter button
 
btw, i really should appologise to the OP for stealin this thread lol
 
jackbauer said:
i see, but will it not be easier just to swicth it to manual on the very last second...just before i hit the shutter button
Click to expand...

No because the camera won't be able to focus through the filter because it will be too dark. That was the whole point of the method that Claire listed.

EDIT: It doesn't actually matter when you switch to manual as long as you do it before you press the shutter button again.
 
mrcrow said:
:clap:

wuthering heights...did the sheep eat your sandwiches... a real in your face sheep
Click to expand...

Thanks, yep that's the place, living near I have photographed it many times through the seasons and the sheep never miss a trick nicking butties out of peoples bags.
 
yey came though the post today! But on the rim of the lens it says "ND 3.0 10 BL 1000x", the bit that worries me is the ND 3.0. someone earlier i think said u need to start with a nd 4 but then someone else said thats not strong enough...or something along those lines. what i'm askin is...i'm sure i paid for a 10stop filter, have they sent me a lover value one instead?
 
10 stops is 1,000x reduction in exposure, and the filter has an optical density of 3.0.

They are all effectively the same thing.
 
Biko said:
This shot was taken with same ND filter you are looking at from WE, exposure f16 SS 30sec ISO 100 - and a fairly bright UK day.


nd.jpg
Click to expand...

wuthering heights again....no sheep here though

very good shot
 
Claire said:
The spinning lens focusing thing - you simply have to focus and compose first, switch to manual focus to lock the focus in place, and THEN attach the filter.

Seeing as you cannot see a thing through a 10-stopper, you won't be able to compose, focus or meter.

Set camera on a tripod
Compose
Auto focus, then flick to manual focus to lock it
Take meter reading in Aperture Priority at desired f-stop
Add 10 stops to this reading
Screw on filter
Switch to Manual mode with the same f-stop, adding the 10 stops to the shutter speed (you'll most likely need Bulb setting)
Click!
Click to expand...


Could you give some advice on step 4 and 5? I have a BW 10 stop and went out to try and get some landscape shots, I was fine with the manual focus stuff but all my shots were coming out very dark. I don't really know anything about metering. Is this the cause of that problem?
 
John.D said:
Could you give some advice on step 4 and 5? I have a BW 10 stop and went out to try and get some landscape shots, I was fine with the manual focus stuff but all my shots were coming out very dark. I don't really know anything about metering. Is this the cause of that problem?
Click to expand...

Sounds like an exposure problem.

Each 'stop' is either a halving or doubling of the exposure. In terms of lens aperture, f/2.8 is double the brightness of f/4, which is double f/5.6 and so on. In terms of ISO, 100 is half the sensitivity of ISO 200, which is half ISO 400 etc. Turning to shutter speeds, the relationship is fairly obvious - 1/125sec is half 1/60, with is half 1/30.

These are the three controls that you mix and match to get correct exposure and with a strong ND filter what you want is a very long shutter speed, so when you fit the filter you want to increase the shutter time by ten stops. So if your regular exposure time is 1/125sec, the ten stops longer will be 8 seconds (1/125, 1/60, 1/30, 1/15, 1/8, 1/4, 1/2, 1secs, 2secs, 4secs, 8secs).

If the image looks too light or dark, experiment using the halving/doubling principle until it's right.

Don't foget to cover the viewfinder with the eyepiece blind during the exposure to prevent streaking, and enable long exposure noise reduction in custom functions (remembering that the camera will lock up for the same amount of time as the shutter speed while LENR does its business).
 
Biko said:
This shot was taken with same ND filter you are looking at from WE, exposure f16 SS 30sec ISO 100 - and a fairly bright UK day.


nd.jpg
Click to expand...

has this picture been touched up? brightened? i'm takin picts in direct sunlight with not much clouds at 30seconds they still quite dark even at f11.
 
HoppyUK said:
Don't foget to cover the viewfinder with the eyepiece blind during the exposure to prevent streaking, and enable long exposure noise reduction in custom functions (remembering that the camera will lock up for the same amount of time as the shutter speed while LENR does its business).
Click to expand...

Does the Canon 450D have one of these? SOLVED (attached to the strap apparently...now where did i put that?!)
do u mean where we look through? can light enter through there, and affect the image?? SOLVED ( read the manual)

boy i must sound like a right noob lol

also when i metered it under aperture mode it said i need a shutter speed of 0"5, so does that mean to get a correctly exposed pict i would have to hold the shutter down for 8mins?
 
how did u get an extra 32 seconds?

i went from

0"5 to 1 - 2 - 4 - 8 - 15 - 30 - 60 - 120 - 240 - 480secs
 
jackbauer said:
how did u get an extra 32 seconds?

i went from

0"5 to 1 - 2 - 4 - 8 - 15 - 30 - 60 - 120 - 240 - 480secs
Click to expand...

because you should have gone

.5 - 1 - 2 - 4 - 8 - 16 - 32 - 64 - 128 - 256 - 512

not that it makes a grat deal of difference at that length of exposure!
 
Sniffing1987 said:
because you should have gone

.5 - 1 - 2 - 4 - 8 - 16 - 32 - 64 - 128 - 256 - 512

not that it makes a grat deal of difference at that length of exposure!
Click to expand...

ahh thought so, but my camera doesnt have a 16. so i thought the logical thing to do would be

1 2 4 8 15 30 60 120 240 480
 
jackbauer said:
...also when i metered it under aperture mode it said i need a shutter speed of 0"5, so does that mean to get a correctly exposed pict i would have to hold the shutter down for 8mins?
Click to expand...

You mean your metered exposure is 1/2sec without the filter? It must be pretty dark already. What f/number and ISO?

How long do you want the exposure to be to get the effect you want? 8 minutes (which sounds right) is usually only necessary for quite slow moving clouds?
 
it was just a test shot, and yeah it did get quite dark then, a big rain cloud went under the sun.

f11 / iso100

btw is there an easy way to do this count 10 steps backwards without being good at fractions? for the last 15mins been tryin to work out *** 1/10 is 10stop backwards.
 
jackbauer said:
has this picture been touched up? brightened? i'm takin picts in direct sunlight with not much clouds at 30seconds they still quite dark even at f11.
Click to expand...

No, only adjustment was colour correcting as filter is on warm side.
 
HoppyUK said:
Sounds like an exposure problem.

Each 'stop' is either a halving or doubling of the exposure. In terms of lens aperture, f/2.8 is double the brightness of f/4, which is double f/5.6 and so on. In terms of ISO, 100 is half the sensitivity of ISO 200, which is half ISO 400 etc. Turning to shutter speeds, the relationship is fairly obvious - 1/125sec is half 1/60, with is half 1/30.

These are the three controls that you mix and match to get correct exposure and with a strong ND filter what you want is a very long shutter speed, so when you fit the filter you want to increase the shutter time by ten stops. So if your regular exposure time is 1/125sec, the ten stops longer will be 8 seconds (1/125, 1/60, 1/30, 1/15, 1/8, 1/4, 1/2, 1secs, 2secs, 4secs, 8secs).

If the image looks too light or dark, experiment using the halving/doubling principle until it's right.

Don't foget to cover the viewfinder with the eyepiece blind during the exposure to prevent streaking, and enable long exposure noise reduction in custom functions (remembering that the camera will lock up for the same amount of time as the shutter speed while LENR does its business).
Click to expand...


Hi,
Well it was about 8:30pm so the light was getting on a bit, I used ISO 100, f/14, and the exposure was 273sec. It was 12mm on my Tokina 12-24. This is the result I got, bad shot I know but I was just experimenting -

http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/3156/letest1.jpg

http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/9413/letestex.jpg

I don't know if you can see it but I was trying to bring out the stonework in the lower portion of the shot, although this just wasn't brought out at all. Any attempts at increasing the exposure in Lightroom (second shot) makes no difference and the grain goes crazy (in Lightroom the noise gets very bad around the lower portion if I try and increase exposure). Maybe it needs to be an even longer exposure? Or perhaps increasing ISO to 200 or more. Thing is if I let the exposure run for even more to get the stonework to come out, the sky will become blown out!
 
Random thought from me (not used ND Filters so just guessing)....why would you use a 10-stop filter in the evening? Surely that will make things too dark? I'd assumed you would only use them in daylight...
 
John.D said:
Hi,
I don't know if you can see it but I was trying to bring out the stonework in the lower portion of the shot, although this just wasn't brought out at all. Any attempts at increasing the exposure in Lightroom (second shot) makes no difference and the grain goes crazy (in Lightroom the noise gets very bad around the lower portion if I try and increase exposure). Maybe it needs to be an even longer exposure? Or perhaps increasing ISO to 200 or more.
Click to expand...

You won't be able to bring it out in lightroom if it hasn't been caught in the first place, as you have suggested a longer exposure would or use a lower F stop (assuming you aren't on the lowest anyway). A higher ISO will increase the grain in the shot slightly so I would tend to do that as a last resort.
 
John.D said:
Hi,
Well it was about 8:30pm so the light was getting on a bit, I used ISO 100, f/14, and the exposure was 273sec. It was 12mm on my Tokina 12-24. This is the result I got, bad shot I know but I was just experimenting -

http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/3156/letest1.jpg

http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/9413/letestex.jpg

I don't know if you can see it but I was trying to bring out the stonework in the lower portion of the shot, although this just wasn't brought out at all. Any attempts at increasing the exposure in Lightroom (second shot) makes no difference and the grain goes crazy (in Lightroom the noise gets very bad around the lower portion if I try and increase exposure). Maybe it needs to be an even longer exposure? Or perhaps increasing ISO to 200 or more. Thing is if I let the exposure run for even more to get the stonework to come out, the sky will become blown out!
Click to expand...

You need to use a grad over the sky and increase the exposure. You have plenty of scope to do that without increasing the exposure time any longer, by lowering the f/number (you don't need f/14 for depth of field at 12mm) and raising the ISO.
 
I see. So perhaps something like f/8 would have been better?

And sdb, it had only just turned darker. It was quite bright a short while before. The only other ND filter I had was a Cokin ND8 which perhaps I should have used instead, but it's difficult on my wide angle as the holder can only hold one filter, and when I tried it the sky was really blown out after just 10 seconds, so I would have needed a grad to stop this, which I couldn't use as the slot was taken by the ND.
 
jerry12953 said:
To one or two of the posters on this thread....

Might I suggest you get to know the basics of using a camera at normal exposures before bringing in the extra complications of a 10 stop ND filter?

:shrug:
Click to expand...

I thought I did...
 
John.D said:
I thought I did...
Click to expand...

same ere! lol

but like i said before

"btw is there an easy way to do this count 10 steps backwards without being good at fractions? for the last 15mins been tryin to work out what 1/10 is 10stop backwards. "
 
if you have a standard calculator x2 ten times

if you have a scientific calculator... not done it in ages and I can't remember! I'll get the calculator out and have a look
 
oh thanks so if the meter said i'd need a shutter speed of 1/25 what would i type in?
 
jackbauer said:
oh thanks so if the meter said i'd need a shutter speed of 1/25 what would i type in?
Click to expand...

first divide 1 by 25 then multiply by 2 ten times (for a ten stop)

if it was an 8 stop you would divide by 25 then multiply by 2 eight times etc etc
 
Just a quick one to those of you that have used 10-stop filters....what is the best way of setting a custom WB for these shots? I shoot in raw so in effect should I even be worrying about setting a custom WB?
 
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