M4/3 Advice

S

Ste_S

Messages
584
Edit My Images
No
Is there any noticeable difference in image quality between the various 16MP sensor M4/3 camera's ?

I have a Panny G3 which I love, but have wondered about getting a slightly more modern body. The Panny G7 and GX7 are in my price range, as is the Olympus OM-D E-M5 I, E-M10 I and E-M10 II.

Thoughts ?
 
•


If of MS is spoken, then only the resolution is considered.
The greater the megasencel count…
  1. one can enlarge the print relatively more and /or
  2. one can crop in so much more then with a lesser count.
All the other qualities are not in the equation.
 
Not really much difference in the 16mp m4/3. The EM1 suffered hot pixels and noise on long exposures (although they added some software to correct this) but other than this you're not going to see a discernible difference between dynamic range, noise etc etc between the models. The new 20mp ones are fractionally better in terms of noise and DR, but not by much.

That being said if you go on scores (which is not always the best thing to do) then there is more of a difference between the G3 and the Olympus models, and possibly the newer Panny. Olympus OMD cameras at least are pretty much all the same (barring the 20mp EM1-II)

https://www.dxomark.com/Cameras/Com...-versus-Panasonic-Lumix-DMC-G3___1046_901_701
 
Last edited:
I had the Panasonic GH2 in the past (which is only marginally older than the G3) and also the Olympus E-M5 MkI. I now have amongst others the Olympus E-M10II and the E-M1 MkI. For photography the E-M10 MkII is a worthwhile upgrade compared to the GH2 and the E-M5 MkI IMO, especially at slightly higher ISO's. With the budget for an E-M10 MkII you can probably also afford a used E-M1 MkI, which would be even more of an upgrade in terms of focusing speed, focusing accuracy, fps, buffer capacity and reasonable (but not great) CAF performance.
 
I have a Panasonic G80, I had an Oly em5 also for a while. I would say the G80 image quality is a bit better, it seems 'cleaner' [because they removed the AA filter perhaps?] and I prefer the contrast/tones it puts out, but the old em5 was actually slightly better in low light. Olympus seem to be ahead on that front. I just preferred the overall look I got from the Pany and I prefer the ergonomics and menu system. Those are merely personal preferences, but they can make a big difference. Some would argue that ergonomics are more important then image output, especially if you're shooting RAW whichever you opt for. Don't get too hung up on noise either, with M43, it'll be there, no matter the make or model. It is the only major weakness of M43 IMHO

I would say go for a G80 if you like the Panasonic cameras, you will notice big improvements such as much better evf and LCD, faster focusing, an improved menu system, touch screen and 5-axis stabilization, 4K video [if you 're into that] and better 1080p, decent battery life, wi-fi/remote via your phone, I find it very hard to find cons about this camera apart from I wish it was a tad cleaner up to 1600 ISO - I rarely feel the need to go above that.
 
Used to have a G3 now have an em-5ii and G80.

I've noticed a difference, but that could also have been the significant improvement in my photography skills!
 
Do you shoot raw or jpeg, if jpeg you may get better results with the more modern jpeg engine in later cameras.
 
The G3 is an older generation sensor. All the newer cameras you mentioned are similar, and a significant improvement in terms of noise levels and dynamic range. The biggest differences between them are in the ergonomics, where the G7 is a clear winner IMHO. It also has Panasonic's DFD focusing, and should therefore be better with moving subjects. The G7 would be an easy choice for me.
 
gcogger said:
The G3 is an older generation sensor. All the newer cameras you mentioned are similar, and a significant improvement in terms of noise levels and dynamic range. The biggest differences between them are in the ergonomics, where the G7 is a clear winner IMHO. It also has Panasonic's DFD focusing, and should therefore be better with moving subjects. The G7 would be an easy choice for me.
Click to expand...

Just be careful with the G7. I had real trouble with shutter shock using the 14-140mm lens with my G7. Ended up replacing it with the G80 which is a better camera in every way (though more expensive).
 
dclutter said:
Just be careful with the G7. I had real trouble with shutter shock using the 14-140mm lens with my G7. Ended up replacing it with the G80 which is a better camera in every way (though more expensive).
Click to expand...

Yup. I had the same trouble with the G7 and GX7 and the killer is that knowing what lens may be affected by shutter shock isn't easy. For example I wouldn't have guessed that my Minolta 50mm f1.2 would be affected but it was. Used with lenses that aren't affected by shutter shock or when used with the electronic shutter (which can bring it's own issue) these camera are very nice.
 
dclutter said:
Just be careful with the G7. I had real trouble with shutter shock using the 14-140mm lens with my G7. Ended up replacing it with the G80 which is a better camera in every way (though more expensive).
Click to expand...

woof woof said:
Yup. I had the same trouble with the G7 and GX7 and the killer is that knowing what lens may be affected by shutter shock isn't easy. For example I wouldn't have guessed that my Minolta 50mm f1.2 would be affected but it was. Used with lenses that aren't affected by shutter shock or when used with the electronic shutter (which can bring it's own issue) these camera are very nice.
Click to expand...
Did you guys try the Olympus cameras the OP was mentioning? I never had shutter shock with my G7 (and I'm not someone who claims it doesn't exist, as I've seen it on other gear). I agree the G80 is a better camera, but it wasn't one of the options listed, so may be out of the OP's price range.
 
Do Panny cameras not have the anti shock mode like Olympus?
 
snerkler said:
Do Panny cameras not have the anti shock mode like Olympus?
Click to expand...

They have an electronic shutter but than can give rolling shutter which never bothered me and you can also get banding under artificial light which did bother me. I think an electronic first curtain shutter (I think that's what it's called) can reduce shutter shock but I read somewhere that the Panny's don't have it due to a hardware limitation... might be true...

Shutter shock only affects specific camera and lens combinations and in a specific shutter speed range. If you can avoid those you'll have no issues but avoiding the shutter speed range is definitely an issue. Ditto if you use an affected body and lens combination and use the electronic shutter in anything but flickering artificial lighting or when rolling shutter could bother you. My GX7 only definitely showed shutter shock with two lenses, the tiny and lovely 14-42mm Mega OIS and my old Minolta Rokkor 50mm f1.2. All of my other lenses seemed fine and with an Oly 17, 25 or 45mm f1.8 or Panny 12-35mm f2.8 the GX7 was a gorgeous thing.
 
Last edited:
gcogger said:
Did you guys try the Olympus cameras the OP was mentioning? I never had shutter shock with my G7 (and I'm not someone who claims it doesn't exist, as I've seen it on other gear). I agree the G80 is a better camera, but it wasn't one of the options listed, so may be out of the OP's price range.
Click to expand...
I only have an em5ii. It is a brilliant camera and the never had shutter shock issues (though I usually stick to EFCS/antishock shutter).

Unfortunately the em5ii and G80 fall in a similar price range (though I'd almost pick the G80 over it).

A friend has an em5 original and I don't think the difference was huge. The em5ii does have better IBIS. Not sure about EFCS on the em5.
 
woof woof said:
They have an electronic shutter but than can give rolling shutter which never bothered me and you can also get banding under artificial light which did bother me. I think an electronic first curtain shutter (I think that's what it's called) can reduce shutter shock but I read somewhere that the Panny's don't have it due to a hardware limitation... might be true...

Shutter shock only affects specific camera and lens combinations and in a specific shutter speed range. If you can avoid those you'll have no issues but avoiding the shutter speed range is definitely an issue. Ditto if you use an affected body and lens combination and use the electronic shutter in anything but flickering artificial lighting or when rolling shutter could bother you. My GX7 only definitely showed shutter shock with two lenses, the tiny and lovely 14-42mm Mega OIS and my old Minolta Rokkor 50mm f1.2. All of my other lenses seemed fine and with an Oly 17, 25 or 45mm f1.8 or Panny 12-35mm f2.8 the GX7 was a gorgeous thing.
Click to expand...
I steer away from full electronic shutter for the reason you mentioned plus the jello effect (y)

dclutter said:
I only have an em5ii. It is a brilliant camera and the never had shutter shock issues (though I usually stick to EFCS/antishock shutter).

Unfortunately the em5ii and G80 fall in a similar price range (though I'd almost pick the G80 over it).

A friend has an em5 original and I don't think the difference was huge. The em5ii does have better IBIS. Not sure about EFCS on the em5.
Click to expand...
My first EM5-II had horrendous shutter shock, sent it back and second one was fine. I now do use anti-shock mode anyway, but never had shutter shock on the second EM5-II or any other Olly with full mechanical shutter anyway, I just use anti shock just in case. Besides, I can't see any drawbacks to using electronic first curtain.
 
E-M10 II is probably best bang-for-buck body Olympus have ever made..... can't see past mine.
 
The G80 doesn't have any shutter-shock settings, it is apparently completely absent by default. Not sure why Olympus need to have an option to disable it?
 
Cagey75 said:
The G80 doesn't have any shutter-shock settings, it is apparently completely absent by default. Not sure why Olympus need to have an option to disable it?
Click to expand...
The G80 has a super super quiet/gentle shutter (specially designed because of the shock issues I think). It hardly makes a click. The oly shutter is very satisfying ;-)
 
GX80 sensor without AA filter is just as good if not better than the 20 mp sensor and had a great shutter. Great size and currently £50 cash back. In day to day use no real difference between most of the sensors these days .
 
dclutter said:
The G80 has a super super quiet/gentle shutter (specially designed because of the shock issues I think). It hardly makes a click. The oly shutter is very satisfying ;-)
Click to expand...

These new cameras with the new shutter are IMO excellent. I have a GX80 and it's a superb camera with a lovely shutter and you can set it to automatically switch between the mechanical and the electronic shutter. From what I've read these new shutters fix the shutter shock issue.
 
I had a G3 and have recently upgraded to a GX7 (via a few others on the way!) and the difference is massive. ISO is usable on the GX7 but would be unthinkable on the G3 (if it even had it, I can't remember) :).
 
Last edited:
Forkbeard said:
I had a G3 and have recently upgraded to a GX7 (via a few others on the way!) and the difference is massive. ISO is usable on the GX7 but would be unthinkable on the G3 (if it even had it, I can't remember).
Click to expand...

Yup. I would and do use every ISO up to and including 25,600. Remember film? :D
 
woof woof said:
Yup. I would and do use every ISO up to and including 25,600. Remember film? :D
Click to expand...

Ha, I've recently had a spell going back to film and forgot how spoilt we are with digital and how much is taken for granted when it comes to image capture. I set the auto iso limit to 6400 on the gx7 and don't worry about it now. Before my foray into film I would have been pixel peeping the crap out of it.
 
Last edited:
dclutter said:
The G80 has a super super quiet/gentle shutter (specially designed because of the shock issues I think). It hardly makes a click. The oly shutter is very satisfying ;-)
Click to expand...

I've had both, I had an em5 up until recently. I much prefer the G80 shutter, I found the em5 one way too 'springy' and noisey. I often set the G80 to ES so it's almost completely silent, feels kind of nice and satisfying, especially when you mostly use the EVF, no loud 'spring' sound from pressing the shutter.
 
Cagey75 said:
I've had both, I had an em5 up until recently. I much prefer the G80 shutter, I found the em5 one way too 'springy' and noisey. I often set the G80 to ES so it's almost completely silent, feels kind of nice and satisfying, especially when you mostly use the EVF, no loud 'spring' sound from pressing the shutter.
Click to expand...
Oh definitely, the G80 shutter is pretty magical, but for some inexplicable reason I like the sound of the shutter on my em5ii.
 
dclutter said:
Oh definitely, the G80 shutter is pretty magical, but for some inexplicable reason I like the sound of the shutter on my em5ii.
Click to expand...


The em5II probably has a better shutter than the mk1, I've not used it. I love my G80 though, such an easy camera to use and the results are more than good enough for me
 
Thanks for all the replies folks. Read the advice here and also managed to try some of the contenders out - Panny G7 and GX80, Olympus E-M10 II and for the sake of completion Sony A6000 and a Fuji X-E1.

and the winner was.... the GX80. Was a close call between the GX80 and the E-M10 II, but just preferred the feel of the GX80 in the hand. The G7 was a tad too large. The Sony A6000 surprisingly felt plasticy in comparison to the the GX80, and it's lens line up (and cost) holds it back. The Fuji X-E1 was nice, but I'd miss at least some articulation on the screen, and its another camera with an expensive lens line up.
 
I hope you'll be happy with your choice :D

I think the GX80 is a bargain at the price they are for sale for.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top