Medium format recommendations?

FishyFish

FishyFish

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I'm mulling the idea of getting a better MF camera this year. I currently have a Lubitel 166 U, which is ok, but I'm finding the focussing screen to be difficult to use (even with the magnifying lens) and consequently tend to avoid shooting stuff that can't be captured at the infinity setting.

I want something that's easy to focus, has good image quality, and I'm probably looking at a budget of up to £200 (although something less would be a bonus). Any recommendations on a suitable camera (it doesn't have to be a TLR)?

Thanks.
 
If you wanted to stick with a TLR, you won't go wrong with any of the Yashicas and won't have any problems getting one below £200 (or £100 for anything other than a 124G). I've had a Yashica Mat, 124G and now have a 635 and they all handle well and are easy to focus with nice bright screens. The lenses are also very sharp.

If you wanted something other than a TLR, my favourite MF system is the Mamiya M645 (I've owned 3!). I've had a couple of 645J's and one 645 1000, they're basically the same body but 1/1000th shutter speed on the 1000 (funnily enough) and more limited features on the J. Unless you want interchangeable backs, the M645 system is great, relatively light in MF terms and the lenses are excellent. The standard 80/2.8 handles well and delivers excellent results and the 35/3.5 is an awesome landscape/architecture lens if you like wide angles. Again, should be pretty easy to find an M645J with 80/2.8 and WLF for under £200.
 
Rolleicord Vb and Minolta Autocord. Both are very well built (but watch the focus knob on the Minolta) and should be within budget. My First MF camera was a Rolleicord and I still use it a lot despite having other much fancier options. It's very light, reliable and produces lovely photographs.

Or for a little more money, how about stepping up to a freshly serviced Rolleiflex T for £275?

http://mwclassic.com/product/rollei...3-5-tessar-in-synchro-compur-shutter-er-case/
 
I forgot to put some links in!

My M645J album on Flickr here

My Yashica 635 album here

Just to add, I used to carry my M645J around Chester zoo on days out with the family with a Black Rapid style sling strap and it never got in the way.
 
Minolta Autocord, nice sharp lens, well built, and doesn't have the problem that many other TLRs have, whereby if the camera is left with a part-used film in then the next shot but one has a kink in the film due to being bent round a sharp corner... the Autocord has a straight film line, IIUC.
 
I've had some good results from my Yashica 635s. They are fairly straightforward to use and easy enough to focus (if you use the magnifier) and have a reasonably bright focusing screen. Most of them have the Yashikor lens which gives good, sharp results, particularly around the f8 to f16 range, and some nice slightly swirly looking bokeh when wider open. Coming from a Lubitel I'd think you'd like the 635. Also, they don't have the complicated internals that go with the winding handle and self-cocking shutter mechanism that the Yashica Mat range has, which can be prone to go wrong as the years take their toll. Plus, if you get a 635 with the conversion kit you can also shoot 35mm film. :)

The later 635s (around the last year of production) came with a Yashinon lens (like the Yashicamat 124) and have a slight edge on the Yashikor for sharpness, but these are comparatively rare and only come up for sale occasionally (with the seller often not realising what they've got! :naughty: ) . However, when stopped down you'd probably be hard pushed to tell the difference between that and a Yashikor, which isn't a bad lens at all really.

Prices seem to have firmed up a bit lately, and there doesn't seem to be as many 635s appearing on eBay, so expect to pay around £100 (or perhaps a little more) for an excellent++ to mint- one (as usual, there are a few tatty examples about so avoid those and wait for a nice one to turn up!). If you are interested let me know and I can give you a few tips on what to look out for (good and bad) when buying. For instance, never operate the self timer unless the flash sync lever is set to the X position, as it jams the shutter mechanism permanently!
 
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FishyFish said:
I'm mulling the idea of getting a better MF camera this year. I currently have a Lubitel 166 U, which is ok, but I'm finding the focussing screen to be difficult to use (even with the magnifying lens) and consequently tend to avoid shooting stuff that can't be captured at the infinity setting.

I want something that's easy to focus, has good image quality, and I'm probably looking at a budget of up to £200 (although something less would be a bonus). Any recommendations on a suitable camera (it doesn't have to be a TLR)?

Thanks.
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In terms of TLRs, I currently own a Lubitel 166U, Holga 120GTLR, Minolta Autocord, and Rolleiflex 2.8E, and have previously owned a Yashica Mat 124, Rolleiflex Automat, and a different Rolleiflex 2.8E They all are capable of good results when used within their capabilities.

I wouldn't worry so much about brand name, but I would try to find the camera in the best condition that best matches your needs. TLRs provide the best cost/performance ratio possible in film cameras, I would argue.

In terms of SLRs, the Bronica SQ series also offers great value for money and lots of versatility as well, but these will cost a little more than your lower end TLRs (between £180–£320 usually).

Ultimately, it's pretty personal though.
 
I really love my Bronica SQ-A - I got lucky and picked mine up for about £240, if I remember correctly. Interchangeable lenses, a gloriously huge waist-level finder and square photos!
 
Now come on people, we mustn't tempt one of our flock to spend any more money on old cameras, must we?! :whistle: Oh, just listen to those sirens softly calling your name...

Don't look, don't look! :runaway:




Too late! :D
 
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Does the SQ-A have a straight film path so you can leave a roll in without getting the kink? I think finding a 6x6 with a better film path is on my to do list.
 
srichards said:
Does the SQ-A have a straight film path so you can leave a roll in without getting the kink? I think finding a 6x6 with a better film path is on my to do list.
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I think the backs have a 90 degree turn like A12 Hasselblad ones. You'll be wanting a Pentax 67, or Mamiya 6/7 :D
 
If you want to incorporate a physical workout at the same time as capturing wonderful photographs, pick up an RZ67 ( or RB)

There's nothing else out there in MF that can compare ...............................Weight wise! :D:D:D
 
srichards said:
Does the SQ-A have a straight film path so you can leave a roll in without getting the kink? I think finding a 6x6 with a better film path is on my to do list.
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...or maybe a Mamiya C330. Think they have a straight film path, but I may be wrong.
 
srichards said:
Does the SQ-A have a straight film path so you can leave a roll in without getting the kink? I think finding a 6x6 with a better film path is on my to do list.
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Are you having trouble with film paths? With what cameras?

I think I have seen an issue with this maybe once or twice over the past 550 rolls that I've shot and many of my cameras that I own or have owned feature curved film paths (e.g., Bronica, Hasselblad, Rolleiflex, etc.).


FujiLove said:
One of the best MF bargains is the Bronica ETRS. I've seen nice looking full kits (body, lens, back, finder & grip) sell on eBay recently for well under £200.

This one sold today for £226 with two lenses and a spare back!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Zenza-Bronica-ETRS-Film-Camera-Body-75mm-amp-150mm-Lenses-2-Backs-/371861393418?hash=item5694aa900a:g:6ucAAOSw5cNYmveD
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For most users nowadays, I would argue that the ETR series isn't as good a buy as the SQ series as the ETR cameras almost require the use of a prism and handgrip, which adds both weight and cost. SQ series offers a great balance of size, handling, cost, and performance that I think most camera systems in medium format will struggle to match.
 
I think I did on the automat as some frames were odd looking and I hadn't shot the roll in one go. I'll have to check them again as it could have been my piddle poor focussing.

I'll put another roll through again and see if it does the same or it was just a one off.
 
skysh4rk said:
ETR cameras almost require the use of a prism and handgrip, which adds both weight and cost
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That's what I like as I can use it as a large SLR and a hot shoe for flash...but if you like sq shots it's not much use as cropping to sq would be smaller.
 
srichards said:
I think I did on the automat as some frames were odd looking and I hadn't shot the roll in one go. I'll have to check them again as it could have been my piddle poor focussing.

I'll put another roll through again and see if it does the same or it was just a one off.
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Well, it is possible.

If I'm really worried about the possibility of kinked film, I either stop down (i.e., for greater depth of focus) on the second frame (which would be the shot affected by the kink) after the camera has been sitting for a while or just take an extra shot (i.e., depth of focus bracketing). Both of those options are easier and cheaper than buying another camera. If it were really a huge issue though, Hasselblad, Rolleiflex and the like would have done a lot more to address the issue over the many years they produced cameras.

Note that I specifically mean depth of focus here, which is distinct from depth of field.
 
excalibur2 said:
That's what I like as I can use it as a large SLR and a hot shoe for flash...but if you like sq shots it's not much use as cropping to sq would be smaller.
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In addition to its trimmer WLF-only form, you can use the SQ cameras in SLR style too as that system also offers hand grip and prism. SQ affords more flexibility than the ETR and is quite similarly priced these days.
 
skysh4rk said:
In addition to its trimmer WLF-only form, you can use the SQ cameras in SLR style too as that system also offers hand grip and prism. SQ affords more flexibility than the ETR and is quite similarly priced these days.
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Well yes but it adds to the weight and cost (as mentioned) and in many cases you would crop a sq to about 6 X 4.5 which I would guess is why they bought out 6X4.5 in the first place...and you get 3 more frames for your money.
 
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excalibur2 said:
Well yes but it adds to the weight and cost (as mentioned) and in many cases you would crop a sq to about 6 X 4.5 which I would guess is why they bought out 6X4.5 in the first place.
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We have discussed this at length before. While I feel that the SQ series makes much more sense and is a better purchase for most folks today, this is not a universal truth and encourage anyone to use whatever camera suits them best.
 
skysh4rk said:
We have discussed this at length before. While I feel that the SQ series makes much more sense and is a better purchase for most folks today, this is not a universal truth and encourage anyone to use whatever camera suits them best.
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...but the OP is looking for advice and suggestions then he can make up his mind.
 
excalibur2 said:
...but the OP is looking for advice and suggestions then he can make up his mind.
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Well, if the OP were looking for more specific advice regarding these cameras, I'm happy to answer any questions, but I've already provided advice above. There are many options based on what has been specified (i.e., easy to focus and has good image quality), so it will be hard to narrow this down any further without more information.
 
skysh4rk said:
the ETR cameras almost require the use of a prism and handgrip
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Why ??

I have both of those accessories, however, personally I find it more preferable to use the ETRS with WLF and without the grip.

Tbh the bulk and weight probably ( I haven't bothered to weigh it!) isn't an awful lot more than a TLR such as the 124G and has the advantage of interchangeable film backs and lenses
 
Asha said:
Why ??

I have both of those accessories, however, personally I find it more preferable to use the ETRS with WLF and without the grip.

Tbh the bulk and weight probably ( I haven't bothered to weigh it!) isn't an awful lot more than a TLR such as the 124G and has the advantage of interchangeable film backs and lenses
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How do you shoot verticals?
 
skysh4rk said:
How do you shoot verticals?
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Vertically! :D

With the ETRS, I generally don't, preferring to use an SLR for that composition>

However it is not difficult to hold the ETRS at eye level on its side to obtain a portrait orientated frame if needs be,.

Certainly no more awkward or clumbersome than obtaining the composure through the prism with grip attached
 
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Asha said:
Vertically! :D

With the ETRS, I generally don't, preferring to use an SLR for that composition>

However it is not difficult to hold the ETRS at eye level on its side to obtain a portrait orientated frame if needs be,.

Certainly no more awkward or clumbersome than obtaining the composure through the prism with grip attached
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Can you shoot verticals without a grip? Yes.

Is it easy to do so? Not especially. I myself have used several cameras this way and I would say that it is quite awkward, in fact. Most people aren't really going to want to use the camera in the manner that you describe, as your viewfinder image would be upside down, and most folks will ultimately opt for the prism and grip.

Asha said:
With the ETRS, I generally don't, preferring to use an SLR for that composition>
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The ETRS is an SLR though?
 
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skysh4rk said:
your viewfinder image would be upside down
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I forgot to mention that I stand on my head so as to resolve this technical issue :D

I guess that shooting other outfits which show images that are back to front and / or upside down, ^^that^^ issue doesn't pose me a big problem, but then I don't come under the heading of "most people";)
 
Asha said:
and has the advantage of interchangeable film backs and lenses
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...and you forgeot re Etrs and similar:- interchangeable focussing screens and bellows, extention tubes, for close up work...I would think close up work on a TLR is more difficult :eek:
 
On the other hand, FishyFish could always stay with the Lubitel and enjoy the essence of film photography for the 'free spirit' it has become, instead of having to become a spectator on a game of medium format camera 'Top Trumps'? :whistle:
 
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Mr Badger said:
On the other hand, FishyFish could always stay with the Lubitel and enjoy the essence of film photography for the 'free spirit' it has become, instead of having to become a spectator on a game of medium format camera 'Top Trumps'? :whistle:
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I'd buy that deck.
 
Now there would have to be some rules... only pre 2nd World War genuine Kodak made 'box type' Brownies would be allowed, which unless owned already must not have been bought for more than £10. Home servicing would be allowed (lens cleaning, shutter & film transport lubrication and light-leak mending only), but no modifications or additions to original spec would be allowed (as that would have to be covered by a separate 'Pimp my Brownie' section!). So what do you think?


And yes, I'm joking! :D
 
I'm still thinking about my pack of Medium Format Top Trumps. Cost, Portability, Adaptability and Reliability sections should be okay, but it's going to be a hell of an argument for the 'Image Quality' score.
 
FujiLove said:
I'm still thinking about my pack of Medium Format Top Trumps. Cost, Portability, Adaptability and Reliability sections should be okay, but it's going to be a hell of an argument for the 'Image Quality' score.
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Not to mention shots per roll and 'turbo' 220 film handling capability! :LOL:
 
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