Motorbike exhaust.

Dale.

Dale.

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Dale.
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Some of you will know, I recently bought a new motorbike, it's a 2003 CBR 600 F. It's a lovely bike, a dream to ride, much smoother than the Bandit, not that the Bandit was a bad bike. One thing though, the exhaust muffler is huge, it's like a bomb and it has to go. I want something smaller, a bit louder but not ear splitting, just something reasonable and sensible and definately, road legal.

A friend of mine suggested I cut the original down. It's welded on both ends as is the link pipe welded to the muffler. Not a big issue as I could rivet it but I do want to keep the original if I ever sell the bike, the new owner could have the option.

I've looked at mufflers, done some reading up on it and almost decided on this:-

https://www.pipewerx.co.uk/webshop/...werx-powder-black-round-street-legal-exhaust/



It would seem that fueling isn't affected by this can too, always a bonus as I don't want to get into that. The link pipe is also supplied and I would need this as the original is one piece.

Anybody had a Werx can on their bike or can recommend something else? Budget is around £200.

TIA.
 
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are you just doing the can?

Take a look at Lextek, not sure if they do one for your model, but the design looks a lot like the top end Akrapovic and yoshi pipes.

https://www.lextekproducts.com/EXHKIT761.php here, i cant say about sound as i dont have a cbr600 but a few of my mates have lextek and they sound nice, but maybe do some research on them first.
 
Sorry but why is there obsession with bikers and the need to make their bikes nosier? There is a reason bike manufacturers fit those exhausts. Consideration for others is one of those reasons.
 
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munch said:
Sorry but why is there obsession with bikers and the need to make their bikes nosier? There is a reason bike manufacturers fit those exhausts. Consideration for others is one of those reasons.
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A few reasons, one being it removes the restriction put in place by Europeans that stifles the bike, so cleaner throttle response, better/smoother power curve.
And two, which to most bikers is a bucket load more important, the noise makes us more noticeable when in and around traffic, like it or not most people hear a bike before they see it.

And also people just simply love the sound.
 
scott199 said:
A few reasons, one being it removes the restriction put in place by Europeans that stifles the bike, so cleaner throttle response, better/smoother power curve.
And two, which to most bikers is a bucket load more important, the noise makes us more noticeable when in and around traffic, like it or not most people hear a bike before they see it.

And also people just simply love the sound.
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Bobsyeruncle said:
Loud pipes save lives....
If you're not a biker, then I'd suggest this thread is not for you... :)
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I will answer the last point first, I have been a biker, spent several years attending bike meetings (still follow Road racing, BSB and WSB) so definitely not anti bike.

You both talk about nosier bikes getting you more noticeable, care to back that statement up with some actual facts?

It could just be that if the bike was actually travelling at the speed limit, the other road users would have enough time to see them.

Is "stifling" the bike really that much of an issue, Most bikes have more than enough power.

I also dislike none standard exhausts on cars.
 
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munch said:
I will answer the last point first, I have been a biker, spent several years attending bike meetings (still follow Road racing, BSB and WSB) so definitely not anti bike.

You both talk about nosier bikes getting you more noticeable, care to back that statement up with some actual facts?

It could just be that if the bike was actually travelling at the speed limit, the other road users would have enough time to see them.

Is "stifling" the bike really that much of an issue, Most bikes have more than enough power.

I also dislike none standard exhausts on cars.
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I'd say you haven't been a biker, you've been a motorcyclist.
If you'd been a biker you would understand :LOL:
Anyway, let's not derail the thread any further.
 
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Bobsyeruncle said:
I'd say you haven't been a biker, you've been a motorcyclist.
If you'd been a biker you would understand :LOL:
Anyway, let's not derail the thread any further.
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Why, is it because you can't answer my questions?
 
Bobsyeruncle said:
If you'd been a biker you would understand
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I agree with Munch's points about noise. Excessive noise is very upsetting to many people and when Dale says he wants something louder he could be interpreted as not caring about the people who will be upset by the noise. Perhaps he meant something quite different? I'm married to a now ex-biker and father to a couple of very active bikers so I'm not unsympathetic to the biker viewpoint.
 
Is there not a moot point in regard to the amount of noise to show "presence" and "noise for noises" sake!

We live within approx 30yards of a single carriageway A road with 40mph limit. Though not regularly, there are bikers that come along that road and we can hear them from approx 400yards away.......then what I surmise is a similar distance once they have passed at closest point. All during that bike passing so nearby the sound reverberates around the estate of houses.

Is that level of noise likely to be produced by a street legal exhaust???

And just because an exhaust is street legal does not mean that it is not anti social depending on the biker's riding technique and speed used in a residential zone.
 
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munch said:
You both talk about nosier bikes getting you more noticeable, care to back that statement up with some actual facts?

It could just be that if the bike was actually travelling at the speed limit, the other road users would have enough time to see them.

Is "stifling" the bike really that much of an issue, Most bikes have more than enough power.

I also dislike none standard exhausts on cars.
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I probably could trawl the internet and find some completely useless digits but I won’t, all I can offer is 25 years experience, ex dsa instructor, ex blue ribbon advanced rider (taught buy Leicester police riders) AIM and rospa advanced rider.

As for the speed thing, if the roads a nation speed limit but traffic is traveling at 40/50, we have the right to overtake when safe, as do cars and as a rule car drivers look in the rear view at the centre of the lane, very, very few use the wing mirrors, bikes generally ride left or right of centre to avoid debris left in the middle, better view round corners and many other reasons, the amount of times I’ve gone to overtake just for the car in front to try a late “dash” for a gap or decided to turn right last minute and have no clue I’m there, so experience of running standard and after market exhausts, with after market you can see drivers in front looking in the mirror at you or looking for you.

Have you ever had a bike overtake you and make you jump ?

filtering through traffic is another great example where ignorant drivers assume as it’s traffic nothing will come from behind, Ive had late lane changes, car doors opened on me and god knows how many other things, and let’s not even go down the “late lane change in roundabouts” car drivers for the most “glance” in mirrors and don’t “look” then move, exhausts are heard before you see us.

To give you an idea, how many times have you witnessed an emergency vehicle being held up and then blasting the siren to force traffic to move all because Johnny or Jenny no clue is sat in their little steel box, stereo on, absolutely oblivious to anything going on behind them, zero awareness of their surroundings.

Maybe ask why emergency vehicles need sirens ?
I’m not saying it’s the same thing but the basis of noise is the same, most car drivers “hear before they see”

As for restriction, technically no it’s not a pure power thing is a smoother power delivery, “most” of the crap the manufactures do to our bikes are because they have to, not want to for this country, imagine having an extreme jump in power half way through your throttle in a car, not all bikes but a lot of the sports bikes have this, so it’s not a speed thing, it’s makes the throttle the same throughout the range.

I must add, I do have “noisy” exhausts but every single one of them passes an MOT and is completely legal at all times, I do admit that some take it to far but for the most part riders are legal and checked.
As with everything some will take the Mickey
It may sound strange and over the top, but it truly helps us be “seen” but the above statement is what everyone thinks and hears, not all of us are hooligans, I try to be as quiet as possible in built up areas and respect the noise that can bounce around if buildings, making it louder.
 
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I am sorry but I really don't find that I often hear bikes before I see them. (Frequently hear them, when sat at home going down the local bypass though) If I am travelling at 55MPH then I am unlikely to hear a bike come up behind me. Even with an OTT exhaust. (living on the edge of the Yorkshire Dales and often use the roads to Devils Bridge and Hawes) I can assure you by the time I hear a motorbike they are already committed to any overtake etc.

Siren noise and exhaust noise are very different things.

I doubt I could use "sorry officer I never heard the bike coming" as an excuse. Nor could I ever see a biker saying "do you know what if only my exhaust had been louder this accident wouldn't have happened."

I too have done advanced courses, both an emergency services driving course and the IAM and do you know what listening specifically for bikes didn't form any part of the syllabus. We were taught to look out for bikes though. Did any of your courses specifically tell you to have a load exhaust?

Other problems with your assumption about exhaust noise are: What about those that are hard at hearing or play their music loud?
What about the motorcyclists that don't "modify" their exhausts are they responsible for their own accidents?
As you have already alluded too, noise in a built up area "bounces" so that creates more problems.

To me you are just using the noise as an excuse.
 
Noisier pipes in busy built up areas such as towns can certainly alert pedestrians and cyclists to the fact that the motorcyclist is there. Other vehicle drivers I'm not so sure, possibly though.
Legislation is being brought in to ensure that electric vehicles emit noise in towns etc to alert of their presence to avoid accidents with pedestrians and cyclists, therefore potentially saving lives.

Back to the OP's first post, he did say noisier, but definitely road legal, so he doesn't sound like a hooligan biker with straight through pipes.
 
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Bobsyeruncle said:
Noisier pipes in busy built up areas such as towns can certainly alert pedestrians and cyclists to the fact that the motorcyclist is there. Other vehicle drivers I'm not so sure, possibly though.
Legislation is being brought in to ensure that electric vehicles emit noise in towns etc to alert of their presence to avoid accidents with pedestrians and cyclists, therefore potentially saving lives.

Back to the OP's first post, he did say noisier, but definitely road legal, so he doesn't sound like a hooligan biker with straight through pipes.
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Again the difference is electric vehicles currently make no noise, so not really relevant. If More noise alerts people to vehicles presence why not all do it? (Especially bicycles, lets make it a legal requirement that all bicycles have to ring their bells constantly)

In answer to your earlier post, clearly I can't help the OP with his original question. I just question why he felt he needed a noisier exhaust. (This was a specific point)

The answers I have received do not convince me there is a need for them.

Not intending to derail the thread just asking a question, which so far the answers relating to noise I have difficulty accepting. Don't know enough about modern bikes to have an opinion about throttle response etc.
 
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munch said:
I just question why he felt he needed a noisier exhaust.
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Maybe he doesn't need one, but just wants one.
I don't need a new camera, but I want one.
Maybe cyclists should ring their bells more, particularly the ones that insist on riding on the pavement.

munch said:
Again the difference is electric vehicles currently make no noise, so not really relevant
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Why is it not relevant? Legislation will make them noisier, so they are safer.
 
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munch said:
electric vehicles currently make no noise
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Wrong. At under 20km/h, our Leaf whines (artificially) to alert pedestrians to its presence; above 20km/h the tyre noise etc is apparently enough. Still get phone zombies stepping out in front of us, as I do when on a bike with normal or loud pipes. Far fewer alert people step out in front of the bikes, especially the slightly louder one.
 
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I have a 2005 z750 with an aftermarket Beowulf titanium silencer.
it weighs about 10lbs less than the oem stock one and looks a lot nicer.
it is also a fair bit louder that the oem one.
my bike weights about 200kgs

I pay £80 a year VED for my bike whilst a diesel powered world heater can travel for FREE

so my answer to the OP @dale is go for it matey you have paid for the pleasure.

My wife rides a 2008 Honda CBF500 which is an older carb fuelled bike, i would like to install a nice loud exhaust on that to give here a bit more road presence and safety but i would need to adjust and probably rejet the carbs.
 
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munch said:
I am sorry but I really don't find that I often hear bikes before I see them. (Frequently hear them, when sat at home going down the local bypass though) If I am travelling at 55MPH then I am unlikely to hear a bike come up behind me. Even with an OTT exhaust. (living on the edge of the Yorkshire Dales and often use the roads to Devils Bridge and Hawes) I can assure you by the time I hear a motorbike they are already committed to any overtake etc.

Siren noise and exhaust noise are very different things.

I doubt I could use "sorry officer I never heard the bike coming" as an excuse. Nor could I ever see a biker saying "do you know what if only my exhaust had been louder this accident wouldn't have happened."

I too have done advanced courses, both an emergency services driving course and the IAM and do you know what listening specifically for bikes didn't form any part of the syllabus. We were taught to look out for bikes though. Did any of your courses specifically tell you to have a load exhaust?

Other problems with your assumption about exhaust noise are: What about those that are hard at hearing or play their music loud?
What about the motorcyclists that don't "modify" their exhausts are they responsible for their own accidents?
As you have already alluded too, noise in a built up area "bounces" so that creates more problems.

To me you are just using the noise as an excuse.
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I do feel you're taking all my explanations as a single point, the question was "why is there an obsession with bikers and the need to make their bikes nosier"

and I've tried to explain the reason why "most" motorcyclists feel it helps in general terms, you may be the best driver in the world and be fully aware of your surroundings at all times whilst driving, if that's the case, they don't help you "Notice" us, also at 55mph in a 60, your not the reason we have them, all my points are general and across the board, "most" bikers feel it gives them a slightly higher chance of being "seen".

"Siren noise and exhaust noise are very different things" yes they are and i didn't say its the same, i said noise is heard, so if you are (other road users) completely ignorant to the happening behind as the "majority" of drivers are, its another thing to assist in letting you know something is behind you, at 55/60 its not doing much as we are set at roughly the same speed, its when your doing 35, stuck in slow-moving traffic in a 60mph, your bored, frustrated, late, concentration is on what's ahead of you, whos causing this traffic, can i overtake somewhere.

"Sorry officer I never heard the bike coming" This point is just silly, off coarse thats very unlikely to happen, but you really have proven my point, how many times do you think "im sorry i just didn't see them" is the excuse when a car wipes out a bike ?? i couldn't honestly tell you the numbers but i would happily bet its well into the 60/70/80% range of reason's why a car hit a bike.

So it's not huge, but from a biker's point of view, if it gives us a 5% more chance of others noticing us, then it could possibly save a life.

NOW, please don't make this a statement, it's just how "most" bikers feel about it, we all know that plenty will just do it for the noise, power.

So it's not a "this exhaust will make me completely safe" its " maybe this just may help me be noticed"

everything I said is based on the general, law-abiding motorcyclist, who rides safely and within the law at all times (well most anyway) not the hooligans who fly around at warp speed everywhere and have no regard for others safety or peace and quiet
 
Gremlin said:
Doesn't help when you get riders admitting to break the speed limits at 4am in the morning
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The bloke who seemed quite proud to admit he regularly broke the speed limit is doing very little to endear motorcyclists to the rest of the population. I think most people understand that the roads are for getting from A to B and that if you want to mess around you should use suitable private facilities.
 
You will always get muppets with very lowd exhausts being antisocial at bad times of the day and night.

However I can certainly say with 100% conviction there are a lot more car drivers being antisocial with lowd exhausts and bad driving than there will ever be bikers.
 
Well, this one got interesting quickly. :LOL:


munch said:
Sorry but why is there obsession with bikers and the need to make their bikes nosier? There is a reason bike manufacturers fit those exhausts.
Click to expand...

With all due respect, I doubt you've heard my motorbike, it really is silly quiet (for a bike). My neighbour has a Volvo 2.5 estate and that is louder on tick over. As far as I know, it is a standard Volvo exhaust.

munch said:
Consideration for others is one of those reasons.
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Absolutely agree, which is why I said "a bit louder but not ear splitting " and "just something reasonable and sensible " and "definately, road legal".

Those criteria have to be met, I do respect the law and also how hard I worked (and how much I paid) to get my licence.

That said, I wouldn't mind it being a little louder but not hugely so, I'm not talking Harley (straight out of the showroom) loud. I had a 600 Bandit (with a standard exhaust) previously to the CBR and that sounded really nice, you could hear it coming but it wasn't a window rattler. I would like the CBR to sound about the same, maybe sound better than it currently does is a better way of putting it.

The main reason though is cosmetic, the original Honda exhaust is huge, it looks like a bomb. It seems a bit daft replacing a perfectly good exhaust for (mainly) cosmetic reasons but I just don't like it! Even before I rode the bike, I said to the salesman, "that can will have to go". If a new can smooths things out and lets the engine breathe a little better too, then that's a bonus. I'm not expecting any fueling issues after reading reviews and tech about the Werx exhausts.

The Werx cans seem good value for money. My main concern was the metioned fueling being affected but it doesn't seem to be an issue. It also comes supplied with the link pipe, which I will need, as the orignal Honda is all one piece from the collector box to the tip of the can. The Werx cans also have the street legal baffle to keep the noise level within limits, BS stamped and all that stuff.

I looked at the Lextek cans mentioned earlier, there is a dealer nearby. I had one on the Bandit, I actually found it quieter than the original Suzuki can that the Bandit had fitted from new. The Lextek cans are very good but they don't do a link pipe for my bike.:confused:

So Werx it is by the seems, I'll keep you all posted.
 
Dale. said:
I'm not talking Harley (straight out of the showroom)
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A lot of people don't realise that Harley's are quiet straight out the showroom. Pathetically so.
It takes good money to give them the distinctive sound. Different levels of modification are available at higher levels of cost.:)
 
Bobsyeruncle said:
A lot of people don't realise that Harley's are quiet straight out the showroom. Pathetically so.
It takes good money to give them the distinctive sound. Different levels of modification are available at higher levels of cost.:)
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I didn't know that, everday is a school day. :)
 
Dale. said:
Well, this one got interesting quickly. :LOL:




With all due respect, I doubt you've heard my motorbike, it really is silly quiet (for a bike). My neighbour has a Volvo 2.5 estate and that is louder on tick over. As far as I know, it is a standard Volvo exhaust.



Absolutely agree, which is why I said "a bit louder but not ear splitting " and "just something reasonable and sensible " and "definately, road legal".

Those criteria have to be met, I do respect the law and also how hard I worked (and how much I paid) to get my licence.

That said, I wouldn't mind it being a little louder but not hugely so, I'm not talking Harley (straight out of the showroom) loud. I had a 600 Bandit (with a standard exhaust) previously to the CBR and that sounded really nice, you could hear it coming but it wasn't a window rattler. I would like the CBR to sound about the same, maybe sound better than it currently does is a better way of putting it.

The main reason though is cosmetic, the original Honda exhaust is huge, it looks like a bomb. It seems a bit daft replacing a perfectly good exhaust for (mainly) cosmetic reasons but I just don't like it! Even before I rode the bike, I said to the salesman, "that can will have to go". If a new can smooths things out and lets the engine breathe a little better too, then that's a bonus. I'm not expecting any fueling issues after reading reviews and tech about the Werx exhausts.

The Werx cans seem good value for money. My main concern was the metioned fueling being affected but it doesn't seem to be an issue. It also comes supplied with the link pipe, which I will need, as the orignal Honda is all one piece from the collector box to the tip of the can. The Werx cans also have the street legal baffle to keep the noise level within limits, BS stamped and all that stuff.

I looked at the Lextek cans mentioned earlier, there is a dealer nearby. I had one on the Bandit, I actually found it quieter than the original Suzuki can that the Bandit had fitted from new. The Lextek cans are very good but they don't do a link pipe for my bike.:confused:

So Werx it is by the seems, I'll keep you all posted.
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Post a video :p
 
one thing you must do is sort out your keys with a soft pouch so the spare keys don't clatter around your headstock and scratch it up
 
Mr Bump said:
one thing you must do is sort out your keys with a soft pouch so the spare keys don't clatter around your headstock and scratch it up
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Totally, those are the spare set that I keep all 3 keys on, the ignition and 2 for the security. When the bike is on the road, it's just (the other) single key. (y)
 
munch said:
I am sorry but I really don't find that I often hear bikes before I see them.
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You've already stated you're a motorcyclist, therefore I would assume that like the rest of us, in your car you still think like you ride. I would suggest you use your mirrors more often than most, that's probably why you see them first. Many drivers don't.....
 
I wonder how deaf people cope with driving, must ask my neighbour !

I like listening to music while I drive, never had a problem with seeing any vehicle approach, even bicycles, perhaps they should have something fitted to emit noise ?

We all need to be aware of what is going on around us not rely on noisy exhausts etc, make us aware f others
 
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scott199 said:
That’s your old pipe I assume ? When’s the new one arriving ?

Maybe we should stray a “my bike sounds like this “ thread :exit:
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:LOL:


Yep, that’s the OEM .

New one not ordered yet, still recovering from a substantial vet’s bill. :runaway:
 
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