Nikon manuals are an absolute mess

Slaphead

Slaphead

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Andy
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So, I've been using the SU800 and SB-R200s basically in idiot mode since I bought them, and now want to get a bit more creative with them, take more control, and perhaps get the SB600 into the equation. Naively I thought that 10 minutes with the manual would provide me with the required knowledge to achieve this.

Mistake. It took me an hour of backwards and forwards through the damn thing just to put the whole picture together. What's worse is that a lot of it seems to be repetition with a twist at the end, meaning you waste time going through the same material again only to be presented with a slightly alternative way of doing something.

Not to mention that the manual is a combined SU800/SB-R200/R1C1 manual which means it jumps arbitrarily between these different sections. Just as you think you're getting somewhere - bang - the chapter ends and it starts wittering about something else. I mean how many chapters need to be dedicated to just the SB-R200 when it only has 4 controls which an illiterate monkey could operate - the SU800 is where the action is.

Are Canon manuals just as bad?

Anyway rant over - I got the info I needed in the end, but why did it have to be such hard work for a device which, on the face of it, is not particularly user friendly, but doesn't exactly require a degree in rocket science to operate.
 
Slaphead said:
Are Canon manuals just as bad?
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Yes! The problem is - for the English translations they go to a Mexican sardine fisherman who did night school Japanese. :D

Seriously, they're pretty crappy from any manufacturer. Flash is one of the most tricky things to get your head around or to explain anyway, but the problem with camera manuals is that as well as trying to explain the functioning of their particular doodad, they also feel obligated to touch on some basic photographic principles as well for those who are coming in with very limited knowledge, so the result is usually a pretty sad miss mash with the manual attempting to be a guide to the use of the particular item and a photographic crash course. They usually fail dismally. :gag:
 
Slaphead said:
So, I've been using the SU800 and SB-R200s basically in idiot mode since I bought them, and now want to get a bit more creative with them, take more control, and perhaps get the SB600 into the equation. Naively I thought that 10 minutes with the manual would provide me with the required knowledge to achieve this.

Mistake. It took me an hour of backwards and forwards through the damn thing just to put the whole picture together. What's worse is that a lot of it seems to be repetition with a twist at the end, meaning you waste time going through the same material again only to be presented with a slightly alternative way of doing something.

Not to mention that the manual is a combined SU800/SB-R200/R1C1 manual which means it jumps arbitrarily between these different sections. Just as you think you're getting somewhere - bang - the chapter ends and it starts wittering about something else. I mean how many chapters need to be dedicated to just the SB-R200 when it only has 4 controls which an illiterate monkey could operate - the SU800 is where the action is.
Click to expand...

I had the same problem with the SB600 manual

I found Ken's info a lot easier to follow LINK
 
Ffoeg said:
<snip>...they tell you how to do sometihng and assume that you already know why you'd want to do it in the first place.
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That's so true... What really annoys me is the way Nikon use 2-bit b&w images in their manuals to illustrate the principles behind (for example) some creative lighting technique or another using one of their flash units...

That's where sites like YouTube come into their own - where you can actually see how it's done and the effects you can achieve before trying it all out for yourself. I probably learned more about 'Commander' mode in a 5 minute video on YouTube than I did from reading the manual...
 
At least I'm not the only one who finds this then. Part of my job means that I have to go through highly technical manuals in German quickly to get the relevant info, and quite frankly that's normally a lot less hassle than this English manual was despite me not being mother tongue German.

Ffoeg said:
Agreed that they are bad, which is why I bought this..http://www.amazon.co.uk/Nikon-Creat...2415/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1317285241&sr=8-1 Problem solved :)

But I find most most manuals the same, in that they tell you how to do sometihng and assume that you already know why you'd want to do it in the first place.
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Thanks for that. Even though I think I've got CLS sussed out now I've ordered it as it looks like it could be a very interesting read anyway.
 
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Ffoeg said:
But I find most most manuals the same, in that they tell you how to do sometihng and assume that you already know why you'd want to do it in the first place.
Click to expand...

Canon manuals used to be different. I've got several from my film bodies from the late 60s FT through to a mid-80s T90 and they all explain how to change the aperture and shutter speeds, but why, with illustrations of depth of field, motion blur, panning, etc.

It's like a mini tutorial in the basics of photography, even in the manual for the A-1, which was a very serious and advanced camera of its time.

Some time around when autofocus arrived, it changed a bit and they started assuming you knew what you wanted to do.
 
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Slaphead said:
Thanks for that. Even though I think I've got CLS sussed out now I've ordered it as it looks like it could be a very interesting read anyway.
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Well bloody hell - I ordered it from Amazon UK yesterday on express and got it today - normal for you guys in England I guess, but certainly not where I am.

Looks to be a very comprehensive read. Thanks again for the tip Martyn - Edit sorry I credited the wrong person with the book info. It was in fact Ffoeg - so thanks Ffoeg
 
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Slaphead said:
Well bloody hell - I ordered it from Amazon UK yesterday on express and got it today - normal for you guys in England I guess, but certainly not where I am.

Looks to be a very comprehensive read. Thanks again for the tip Martyn.
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Many items I order (direct) from Amazon come from Amazon Switzerland (and thus sometimes take a day longer than expected). So perhaps you were lucky and managed to match up one of the products dispatched locally for you.
 
Musicman said:
Canon manuals used to be different. I've got several from my film bodies from the late 60s FT through to a mid-80s T90 and they all explain how to change the aperture and shutter speeds, but why, with illustrations of depth of field, motion blur, panning, etc.

It's like a mini tutorial in the basics of photography, even in the manual for the A-1, which was a very serious and advanced camera of its time.

Some time around when autofocus arrived, it changed a bit and they started assuming you knew what you wanted to do.
Click to expand...

I got a free 70's Nikon camera with a lens I bought (well it was advertised as free lens with the camera but it wasn't the camera I was after :lol: ) and the manual that came with that was pretty similar to what you describe.

Full colour and full of useful information and tips!
 
agree, cryptic and generally hiding the most useful stuff in a pile of dross.. how about a sheet in the front with the most useful stuff for a "real" photographer condensed on it
 
Ffoeg said:
But I find most most manuals the same, in that they tell you how to do sometihng and assume that you already know why you'd want to do it in the first place.
Click to expand...
That's so true. My personal bugbear is Microsoft Excel. There's some really advanced statistical stuff buried away in the built-in functions, but the help section says things like: "To discombobulate a thingymajig, select Thingymajig ... Discombobulate from the menu." Well, duh. No mention of what types of thingymajig you can actually discombobulate, or what happens if you try to discombobulate the wrong type of thingymajig, or what effect all those optional parameters on the discombobulation function actually do. But if you know all about discombobulation and thingymajigs, then it will at least tell you which buttons to click.
 
CT said:
Yes! The problem is - for the English translations they go to a Mexican sardine fisherman who did night school Japanese. :D

Seriously, they're pretty crappy from any manufacturer. Flash is one of the most tricky things to get your head around or to explain anyway, but the problem with camera manuals is that as well as trying to explain the functioning of their particular doodad, they also feel obligated to touch on some basic photographic principles as well for those who are coming in with very limited knowledge, so the result is usually a pretty sad miss mash with the manual attempting to be a guide to the use of the particular item and a photographic crash course. They usually fail dismally. :gag:
Click to expand...

I'm sorry but I just can't let this blatent lie go unremarked!... it's wasn't night school Japanese... it was evening classes, please get the facts right. ;)
 
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