Not in my back yard ... surely? *We have EVEN MORE cubs!*

gramps said:
They were facing in opposite directions, so I am sure that it is an issue with the camera knowing at what point to switch the I/R function off. With this and the 2nd unit, (actually 3rd as the first 'pink' one was returned), not functioning at all at night does make me think that there is a serious issue with quality control on these units.
I also had to send one of the H55 units back so my failure rate has been really high!
Click to expand...

I have just checked the settings for the 2nd unit, (which didn't record at all last night), and found that the Menu options for 'Video' & Video & Photos' was greyed out! This is not anything that I did and indeed I am unaware of any user option to do it so a bit puzzling ... I have done a full reset and both options are now showing correctly. I'll try it again tonight and see what happens.

Re: the 'pink' video, I'm going to try re-setting the IR Brightness to 'Normal' rather than on the highest setting and see if that makes any difference. I am loathe to send them back again if I can get them to work, as there doesn't seem to be any available options with anything like a similar spec. Bushnell have a similar spec option at around £300 but it has the LCD in the opening cover so must be harder to setup and nobody seems to have any stock anyway.

@Gremlin @sphexx
 
I haven’t tried the high IR setting. I’ll try it and see if I get anything odd.
 
gramps said:
I have just checked the settings for the 2nd unit, (which didn't record at all last night), and found that the Menu options for 'Video' & Video & Photos' was greyed out! This is not anything that I did and indeed I am unaware of any user option to do it so a bit puzzling ... I have done a full reset and both options are now showing correctly. I'll try it again tonight and see what happens.
Click to expand...

Have you set a target recording time ?
That is for photo only and will grey out the other 2 settings
 
Gremlin said:
Have you set a target recording time ?
That is for photo only and will grey out the other 2 settings
Click to expand...

I have set a targer recording time (20:00 - 06:00) but it is not for photo only, it works with video and has on all of the other units I have used (H55 & H70).
 
Okay so both cameras worked fine during the night, however there was no early morning activity around sunrise so I am unable to establish if reducing the IR brightness to 'normal' made any difference ... I will continue to observe.

Activity was less than normal last night but we still had visits from both adult Foxes, the Badger and one of the Fox cubs.

A bit of behavioural first...

1, Fox finds biscuit and stashes it for later.
2. Badger finds stashed biscuit and eats it.
3. Vixen shows her disgust!



One of the cubs visits.

 
Put mine on high IR last night. It was facing east so responded to rising sun I think (no obvious activity but lots of “reflections“ but no red cast FWIW. Not really the same sort of position as yours :(.
 
gramps said:
Re: the 'pink' video, I'm going to try re-setting the IR Brightness to 'Normal' rather than on the highest setting and see if that makes any difference. I am loathe to send them back again if I can get them to work, as there doesn't seem to be any available options with anything like a similar spec. Bushnell have a similar spec option at around £300 but it has the LCD in the opening cover so must be harder to setup and nobody seems to have any stock anyway.
Click to expand...

If I were going down the expensive trail cam route I think I'd look at something like the Browning Recon Force Edge (for video) and consider buying it from this company as they specialise in trail camera trapping surveys and are a 'not for profit' company too. https://shop.naturespy.org/ (perhaps send both your H70s back, get a refund and bite the bullet, as that Browning is under £200 and they estimate they'll be back in stock this week? https://shop.naturespy.org/product/browning-recon-force-edge-wildlife-camera-btc-7e/ ).

There's some useful info about trail cams on their website and you can check out their YouTube channel for 'real world' sample footage from various trail cams, from both them and some of their customers. Hope this is useful. (y)
 
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Mr Badger said:
If I were going down the expensive trail cam route I think I'd look at something like the Browning Recon Force Edge (for video) and consider buying it from this company as they specialise in trail camera trapping surveys and are a 'not for profit' company too. https://shop.naturespy.org/ (perhaps send both your H70s back, get a refund and bite the bullet, as that Browning is under £200 and they estimate they'll be back in stock this week? https://shop.naturespy.org/product/browning-recon-force-edge-wildlife-camera-btc-7e/ ).

There's some useful info about trail cams on their website and you can check out their YouTube channel for 'real world' sample footage from various trail cams, from both them and some of their customers. Hope this is useful. (y)
Click to expand...

It does look interesting, the only drawback that I see is the 20sec night limit ... it says continues if it sees movement but I wonder how effective that it. I have been using 2 min record time on my H70's and it has been much better with uninterrupted footage.

However, last night capped it for me ... there was obviously a lot of activity from the missing food that I placed out but one of the cameras took one clip and then the 2nd clip showed corrupt and nothing further. Meanwhile the 2nd H70 didn't record anything at all, seems it reset again of its own accord and consequently ignored the time settings, I had meticulously checked everything and formatted each card before the cameras were placed out last night, so I know they were properly.
It's very disappointing as when they work they are good but as they are so unreliable, they are both on their way back to Amazon.
 
gramps said:
It does look interesting, the only drawback that I see is the 20sec night limit ... it says continues if it sees movement but I wonder how effective that it. I have been using 2 min record time on my H70's and it has been much better with uninterrupted footage.

However, last night capped it for me ... there was obviously a lot of activity from the missing food that I placed out but one of the cameras took one clip and then the 2nd clip showed corrupt and nothing further. Meanwhile the 2nd H70 didn't record anything at all, seems it reset again of its own accord and consequently ignored the time settings, I had meticulously checked everything and formatted each card before the cameras were placed out last night, so I know they were properly.
It's very disappointing as when they work they are good but as they are so unreliable, they are both on their way back to Amazon.
Click to expand...
That's disappointing for you... are you going to go back to the original ones you had?.
I get the odd corrupt image on mine too...but now I no longer format 'in camera', I delete the images off the card on my pc, and just insert them back in. It has certainly extended my battery life. Think I am back to 3+ weeks with my cameras set 24/7.
 
Solo man said:
That's disappointing for you... are you going to go back to the original ones you had?.
I get the odd corrupt image on mine too...but now I no longer format 'in camera', I delete the images off the card on my pc, and just insert them back in. It has certainly extended my battery life. Think I am back to 3+ weeks with my cameras set 24/7.
Click to expand...

I've taken the advice of @Mr Badger and ordered the Browning (at least then I've got someone I can blame! :LOL: ).
A lot more expensive but it looks reliable from the reviews of both it and the whole Browning series so I'm hopeful, though I probably won't be buying two!
 
gramps said:
It does look interesting, the only drawback that I see is the 20sec night limit ... it says continues if it sees movement but I wonder how effective that it. I have been using 2 min record time on my H70's and it has been much better with uninterrupted footage.

However, last night capped it for me ... there was obviously a lot of activity from the missing food that I placed out but one of the cameras took one clip and then the 2nd clip showed corrupt and nothing further. Meanwhile the 2nd H70 didn't record anything at all, seems it reset again of its own accord and consequently ignored the time settings, I had meticulously checked everything and formatted each card before the cameras were placed out last night, so I know they were properly.
It's very disappointing as when they work they are good but as they are so unreliable, they are both on their way back to Amazon.
Click to expand...

Sorry to hear about your faulty cameras, sounds like a bad batch, or quality control has gone to pot? Either way, you can't keep on buying and returning on the off chance you finally get one that works!

As for that Browning, according to the spec it records video for a max of 20 seconds (apparently a downside of producing such good quality video) but is ready to trigger and record again 1 second later. 5 seconds between recordings is the best the Apeman H55 can do.

Perhaps give Nature Spy a call and ask what the 2020 version of this camera is like, as that might have extended recording? Or they might be able to suggest a suitable trail cam for your purpose. It's probably like 'normal' cameras though, there's never one single camera that will do everything you want, at a price you can justify! Hope this is useful.

Edit: Written before I'd seen the post above.
 
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gramps said:
I've taken the advice of @Mr Badger and ordered the Browning (at least then I've got someone I can blame! :LOL: ).
A lot more expensive but it looks reliable from the reviews of both it and the whole Browning series so I'm hopeful, though I probably won't be buying two!
Click to expand...
Hey, don't blame me, it was only a suggestion! ;) I hope it works well for you. It will be interesting to see how the video quality compares, but bear reliability in mind too... the video from the H70 might have looked OK, but if it's not triggering, going pink or playing up and losing its setting, then it doesn't matter how good the video potentially is, as it's not up to the job! Do bear in mind Nature Spy's advice about batteries (including the minimum recommended power of rechargeables), as you want your new cam to run right. Best of luck and keep us posted. (y)
 
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Mr Badger said:
Hey, don't blame me, it was only a suggestion! ;) I hope it works well for you. It will be interesting to see how the video quality compares, but bear reliability in mind too... the video from the H70 might have looked OK, but if it's not triggering, going pink or playing up and losing its setting, then it doesn't matter how good the video potentially is, as it's not up to the job! Do bear in mind Nature Spy's advice about batteries (including the minimum recommended power of rechargeables), as you want your new cam to run right. Best of luck and keep us posted. (y)
Click to expand...

Yes it's no good if you can't rely on iy working and. for me, the Apeman H70 cameras are not reliable.
All of my rechargeables are shown to be 2500mAh (well the Ikea ones are 2450mAh) but I don't leave them in more then 3 days so I would hope they would all be fine (3 x sets Ikea, Eneloop & Powerowl).
2 year UK warranty is probably a good idea too. :)
Due tomorrow so won't have to wait too long to test it out. :)
 
gramps said:
Yes it's no good if you can't rely on iy working and. for me, the Apeman H70 cameras are not reliable.
All of my rechargeables are shown to be 2500mAh (well the Ikea ones are 2450mAh) but I don't leave them in more then 3 days so I would hope they would all be fine (3 x sets Ikea, Eneloop & Powerowl).
2 year UK warranty is probably a good idea too. :)
Due tomorrow so won't have to wait too long to test it out. :)
Click to expand...
I'd think about biting the bullet and getting a set of the single-use Energiser Lithium batteries for it to start with, at least with those you can rule out any power deficiency, then perhaps try it with rechargables after you know it works OK? It seems a powerful bit of kit and NS strongly recommend Lithium batteries for it too. I usually test each battery with a volt meter before putting a new set in the trail cam too, as the occasional duff cell isn't totally unknown, so testing can save a lot of time and disappointment.
 
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Mr Badger said:
I'd think about biting the bullet and getting a set of the single-use Energiser Lithium batteries for it to start with, at least with those you can rule out any power deficiency, then perhaps try it with rechargables after you know it works OK? It seems a powerful bit of kit and NS strongly recommend Lithium batteries for it too. I usually test each battery with a volt meter before putting a new set in the trail cam too, as the occasional duff cell isn't totally unknown, so testing can save a lot of time and disappointment.
Click to expand...
Yes I've got a pack of Energisers so I'll use them first and good point about using a meter, I'll get it back out of retirement!

[Edit: Just checked voltage from all batteries taken out of the H70's this morning and they are all at 1.3+ volts].
 
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For interest - the University of Glasgow has conducted research which indicates that urban foxes are starting to differ from their rural counterparts in the same way that wild dogs and cats might have done during their domestication process. There's a piece on the BBC News site under Scotland/Glasgow & West (currently in the 'latest updates' section).
 
Jannyfox said:
For interest - the University of Glasgow has conducted research which indicates that urban foxes are starting to differ from their rural counterparts in the same way that wild dogs and cats might have done during their domestication process. There's a piece on the BBC News site under Scotland/Glasgow & West (currently in the 'latest updates' section).
Click to expand...

Very interesting, the video certainly matched my recent experiences with the visiting dog Fox (hope the lady washed her blanket knowing what they like to rub their snouts in!)
Ours has showed interest in getting in the back door twice, once when the wife was nearby! :runaway:
 
gramps said:
Very interesting, the video certainly matched my recent experiences with the visiting dog Fox (hope the lady washed her blanket knowing what they like to rub their snouts in!)
Ours has showed interest in getting in the back door twice, once when the wife was nearby! :runaway:
Click to expand...
They’ll come in, as I’m sure you know. A friend of mine witnessed a fox come into her houseband run off with a leather handbag, and she had 4 dogs at the time (South London) :).
 
Solo man said:
That's disappointing for you... are you going to go back to the original ones you had?.
I get the odd corrupt image on mine too...but now I no longer format 'in camera', I delete the images off the card on my pc, and just insert them back in. It has certainly extended my battery life. Think I am back to 3+ weeks with my cameras set 24/7.
Click to expand...
Maybe not relevant to this but years ago I found an SD card reporting as ”full” when I was just deleting them via the computer (Mac) though it seemed to be empty. When I formatted it in camera It returned to being “empty”. I know “deleting” doesn’t really delete anything, just flag them as deleted so I guessed some language problem between Mac & camera. There may have been hidden files (didn’t check) of source.
 
Well the 'Browning Recon Force Edge' arrived just before lunch so been through the setup and now just waiting for an angle ballhead that I ordered to arrive and then I can set it up in the garden to see how it performs! :)
 
gramps said:
Well the 'Browning Recon Force Edge' arrived just before lunch so been through the setup and now just waiting for an angle ballhead that I ordered to arrive and then I can set it up in the garden to see how it performs! :)
Click to expand...
Glad it got there safely, how does it seem to compare build-quality wise to the H55?
 
Mr Badger said:
Glad it got there safely, how does it seem to compare build-quality wise to the H55?
Click to expand...
It's considerably more substantial in build than the H55 or H70 but very slightly smaller.
I like that the batteries are removed from the bottom (batteries are in a tray) so there is never the need to remove the camera to replace them and the front facing LCD screen was a must for me so that I can see what the camera is going to be monitoring.
in 'Ultra' mode it runs at 60fps but I'm not sure if that is the same at night, we shall see.
 
Fingers crossed for you but, judging from the examples of vids from it on YouTube, I think you'll be OK. It would be the trail cam I'd get (or the 'special ops' no glow version - a hard choice for me - range v stealth!) if I didn't have to leave my trail cams in different locations out in the wild unattended for a week or so at a time. As I said before, having something stolen that's cost between £35 and £60 would be annoying, but £170+ would be bloody painful! :facepalm:
 
Mr Badger said:
Fingers crossed for you but, judging from the examples of vids from it on YouTube, I think you'll be OK. It would be the trail cam I'd get (or the 'special ops' no glow version - a hard choice for me - range v stealth!) if I didn't have to leave my trail cams in different locations out in the wild unattended for a week or so at a time. As I said before, having something stolen that's cost between £35 and £60 would be annoying, but £170+ would be bloody painful! :facepalm:
Click to expand...

I'm with you, I wouldn't leave a glow version unattended in the wild, for my garden I think it will be ideal.
The H70 had low-glow and the animals clearly saw it but having said that they seemed to be aware of the no-glow version too and neither spooked them. Hoping there will be plenty of activity tonight so it gets a good test. :)
 
I'm looking forward to seeing the results, I think I'm nearly as excited as you are! :) I think this should be a good comparison between cheap and mostly cheerful (with the H55 anyway!) and high end prosumer. You should get to test the weatherproofing too if the forecast is the same as it is here! (y)
 
Mr Badger said:
I'm looking forward to seeing the results, I think I'm nearly as excited as you are! :) I think this should be a good comparison between cheap and mostly cheerful (with the H55 anyway!) and high end prosumer. You should get to test the weatherproofing too if the forecast is the same as it is here! (y)
Click to expand...

Typical, just went out to set the camera up to record between 8pm & 5am and the Fox comes into the back garden and spent 10 minutes socializing! I didn't take my phone or camera out with me as I was carrying the camera and food, so another eyes only experience :)
 
gramps said:
Typical, just went out to set the camera up to record between 8pm & 5am and the Fox comes into the back garden and spent 10 minutes socializing! I didn't take my phone or camera out with me as I was carrying the camera and food, so another eyes only experience :)
Click to expand...
Wildlife does seem to have a wicked sense of humour at times! :giggle:
 
Well the results are in!
I confess to being a little nervous that I might regret buying the Browning, that the video would be much poorer, or that something else might prove to be a deal-breaker but after last night's results I can rest at ease.
The video quality is good, the coverage is good and the I/R is both effective and unobtrusive.
The only slight downside is that night video clips are limited to 30 secs maximum, however the settings allow for a next detection to occur after just under 1 second so very little is missed.
The unit is far more robust and on first testing I can say that I have no regrets.

Samples?
Oh of course :)

Hedgehog.



Fox cub practicing its hunting skills.

 
I'm glad you like it... I can come out of hiding now! :giggle: To me the video quality looks better than the H70, certainly movement seems much better rendered at that 60fps setting, with no bluring of trotting legs, etc. The field of view appears wider, which is good, and it's nice to have proper sound recording rather than the muffled recording you get from the H55 and H70 due to their microphone openings being inside the weatherproof casing.

As ever, it seems you get what you pay for, but the law of diminishing returns applies after a certain level. Hopefully it will be a reliable as the build quality suggests. You'll have to try it with a bit of daytime footage now to see what that's like, so perhaps set it to come on at around 5pm today in case foxy is early again. (y)
 
Mr Badger said:
I'm glad you like it... I can come out of hiding now! :giggle: To me the video quality looks better than the H70, certainly movement seems much better rendered at that 60fps setting, with no bluring of trotting legs, etc. The field of view appears wider, which is good, and it's nice to have proper sound recording rather than the muffled recording you get from the H55 and H70 due to their microphone openings being inside the weatherproof casing.

As ever, it seems you get what you pay for, but the law of diminishing returns applies after a certain level. Hopefully it will be a reliable as the build quality suggests. You'll have to try it with a bit of daytime footage now to see what that's like, so perhaps set it to come on at around 5pm today in case foxy is early again. (y)
Click to expand...

I had forgotten all about audio!
Yes that is really clear, actual 'dawn chorus', H70 can't touch that quality.
I can hear a click when the video starts up, as did the Vixen evidently from her looking straight at the camera when the 2nd clip started, didn't bother the dog Fox though.
I bought one of these from amazon to enable easy fixing and ballhead versatility: UTEBIT Ballhead Clamp
 
gramps said:
Mr Fox came back at teatime and was happy to spend a bit of time socializing.
@Stuart Philpott First train your Fox to relax! :LOL:



Hate iPhone video but there you are, all I had with me.
Click to expand...
Half of me thinks what charming video, the other half thinks do be careful, as it's a wild animal and a very efficient predator, so you never know for sure that it won't turn on you (particularly if it gets the wrong signals or something suddenly scares it); and also, if it learns to lose its inherent fear of humans, not everyone might be as prepared and calm as you are at it's (unexpected) approach, or, indeed, choose to be as kind and respectful to it as you are. Either way, it might not be a good outcome for human or fox.

gramps said:
@Mr Badger
Daytime video of the Browning ain't bad either :)


Click to expand...
Very impressive, I can see why Nature Spy rate it now. (y)
 
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Mr Badger said:
Half of me thinks what charming video, the other half thinks do be careful, as it's a wild animal and a very efficient predator, so you never know for sure that it won't turn on you (particularly if it gets the wrong signals or something suddenly scares it); and also, if it learns to lose its inherent fear of humans, not everyone might be as prepared and calm as you are at it's (unexpected) approach, or, indeed, choose to be as kind and respectful to it as you are. Either way, it might not be a good outcome for human or fox.
Click to expand...

It's a valid point and on my part there will never be anything more than the chance to spend a little time quietly in its presence.
My first ever contact with him several weeks ago was when he took me by surprise and walked up to me while I was setting out some food in the feeding tray that I had hanging from the tree at that time. It was clear that he was already completely at home with humans.
There have been a couple of occasions when I have made a sudden move, (over-balanced on bending down for example) and his first response is always to retreat.
The last time we stood outside to do the evening NHS clap he came out from the garden of a house on the main road, walked past the people standing at the front of that house and crossed the main road toward us ... all whilst people were clapping and banging kitchen utensils!
Our garden is clearly on an 'ancestral' route for Foxes as we have seen them walking through the garden over a number of years, even setting up home in our greenhouse one year but I have never paid so much attention as recently, with the new 'lockdown' conditions forcing me to spend more time at home and looking for wildlife observation opportunities.
The only time I have ever enjoyed such close proximity to a fox was at the British Wildlife Centre and that was sitting with others inside the Fox enclosure on a photography workshop they arranged.
 
The Browning certainly is living up to all hopes!
The video quality is excellent and I must say that the movement detection and reactivation after the 30 sec cut-ff at night is superb.
The Badger visited again last night and I have combined 13 x 30 sec clips, without any transition editing, and the transitions are for the most part almost instant, just a couple of 'jumps' in movement ... I am very pleased.
Audio is good too, in the following clip you can hear the Badger chewing when he is nearest the camera, the only 'negative' is the audible 'click' when the camera activates. I have emailed Naturespy to get their comments on this, it isn't a deal breaker just an annoyance.
I tried high illumination last night (long range) ... I suspected that it would 'flood' the area with light but not so, no white out at all and a pretty even coverage throughout.

Here is the 13 clip footage for you to judge...

 
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Nice set of videos with your new camera... definitely less jerky compared to your other ones.

Foxes can be very bold... but even so, I'd prefer to keep them at a distance.
 
gramps said:
Mr Fox came back at teatime and was happy to spend a bit of time socializing.
@Stuart Philpott First train your Fox to relax! :LOL:



Hate iPhone video but there you are, all I had with me.
Click to expand...


I wish buddy I wish ,trouble is if I do that make 'em relax to humans then I've probably hung a death sentence around their collective necks. Around here they need to associate humans as a huge threat Roger, simply becuase they are. .Our situations are just so different buddy, I'm a soft sod at times,huh:LOL: I won't even give them other grub.,they just get the bird food left overs.
I feel like i'm walking a tightrope with 'em at the mo mate,but I figure if I try to do what I think is right for them ,then that's the best I can do,it's def not the best for me, But hey. no complaints We are really lucky to have this happening

I'm still getting all the visits and still smiling like a cheshire at what I'm seeing ,want some images/ footage now though ...an I phone is better than nowt huh:D


I'm going to back track later through your thread mate,just came here via the alert. Thank you for the heads up. I've not really been here these last days burning the candle a bit sadly

Ahh cool, Roger you have a new camera grats mate :cool:

All the luck , I've really enjoyed this thread Roger good fun and a goodly bit to learn as well about trail cams. Ha I still pinch myself,she is here. i'm convinced now she is the same vixen from the bone yard I mentioned. There's a wonderful irony to me lying in a field for hours and the fox that is meant to be there is feeding at home in front of my front door:LOL: I know lots about nature me:banghead:

take care mate

stu
 
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