ORWO?

ChrisR

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For some strange reason I've taken a notion to shooting some ORWO film. I shot a roll or two of NP20 in 1970 while working in Bulgaria, and I've shown a couple of shots on here from time to time (Ithink the sausage seller and the London to Mexico rally car were on ORWO). Anyway, I heard that Lomography Potsdam 100 was actually an ORWO black and white film (UN54), so I bought a couple of rolls, plus some Silberra 54UN, to make up an order to Analogue Wonderland. Yesterday I loaded my first roll of the Potsdam (sitting on a rock on a fabulous beach looking out to Bass Rock, though that's not strictly relevant!). I was very surprised at the colour of the leader... bright blue! Never seen a black and white film like it...

Has anyone else tried this film?
 
I shot some ORWO colour print film back in the 90s because it was cheap. At one point I think ORWO needed special processing with their own chemistry (did they sell it process-paid in the UK?), but they might have switched to C41-compatible by then. Either way, I recall the colour balance being quite different to anything else, the sort of thing that just seemed odd at the time, but which the analogue hipsters would rave about today.
 
I remember buying some ORWO in blackpool many, many years ago. Remember that it required specialist processing. East German wasn;t it?
 
Yes, it was East German. I don't know where it's made now. This stuff is black and white, and ordinary chemistry I think (although I believe they suggest more diluted developers in some cases, eg Dilution E or H rather than B for HC 110).
 
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I've been shooting Orwo NP7 - a black & white film intended for cinema I think. The Latent Image in Shrewsbury have some Orwo colour in stock, so I've just bought some to try
 
Yes, it was East German. I don't know where it's made now. This stuff is black and white, and ordinary chemistry I think (although I believe they suggest more diluted developers in some cases, eg Dilution E or H rather than B for HC 110).
So I've finished the roll. Annoyingly, just shy of frame 36, after I'd climbed up to St Anthony's Chapel in Holyrood Park to take it against a dark stormcloud over the Firth of Forth!

Won't be developing until next week. MDC suggests Dilution E, which is 1+47, ie just over 5 [correction: 4.2] ml of concentrate to make 200 ml. I've always shied away from any HC 110 dilution that uses less than 6 ml per film, based on some web page somewhere... but I think @Asha devs his with 3 ml of concentrate. I suppose I could make 300 ml of solution and just overfill the Rondinax (normally it only goes half way up).

Whatcha reckon?
 
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So I've finished the roll. Annoyingly, just shy of frame 36, after I'd climbed up to St Anthony's Chapel in Holyrood Park to take it against a dark stormcloud over the Firth of Forth!

Won't be developing until next week. MDC suggests Dilution E, which is 1+47, ie just over 5 ml of concentrate to make 200 ml. I've always shied away from any HC 110 dilution that uses less than 6 ml per film, based on some web page somewhere... but I think @Asha devs his with 3 ml of concentrate. I suppose I could make 300 ml of solution and just overfill the Rondinax (normally it only goes half way up).

Whatcha reckon?
Yep habitually an eggspoon of hc110 (3ml approx ) to (approx) 93ml of water ....1:31 B solution.

Works might fine every time for four 5x4, two 5x7 or one 10x8 sheet of film in a Paterson orbital processor. ( constant agitation)
 
I remember buying some ORWO in blackpool many, many years ago. Remember that it required specialist processing. East German wasn;t it?

Sorry, lied about the Blackpool bit, that was a Perutz film. The Orwo I had was a single roll of process paid slide film 30 years ago, through an ad in PP or AP. Cheaper than KR64 - £3.50ish versus £5.25 (that's what it cost in George Henry Lee in Liverpool).
 
So I've finished the roll. Annoyingly, just shy of frame 36, after I'd climbed up to St Anthony's Chapel in Holyrood Park to take it against a dark stormcloud over the Firth of Forth!

Won't be developing until next week. MDC suggests Dilution E, which is 1+47, ie just over 5 [correction: 4.2] ml of concentrate to make 200 ml. I've always shied away from any HC 110 dilution that uses less than 6 ml per film, based on some web page somewhere... but I think @Asha devs his with 3 ml of concentrate. I suppose I could make 300 ml of solution and just overfill the Rondinax (normally it only goes half way up).
Yep habitually an eggspoon of hc110 (3ml approx ) to (approx) 93ml of water ....1:31 B solution.

Works might fine every time for four 5x4, two 5x7 or one 10x8 sheet of film in a Paterson orbital processor. ( constant agitation)
Devved it today, HC-110 dilution E, 4.2 ml in 200. Negs looked a little low in contrast even when wet. They've dried off now and are in the press (ie under the HCB tome), maybe they'll get scanned tomorrow. Perhaps next time I will use 6 ml in 300...
 
Devved it today, HC-110 dilution E, 4.2 ml in 200. Negs looked a little low in contrast even when wet. They've dried off now and are in the press (ie under the HCB tome), maybe they'll get scanned tomorrow. Perhaps next time I will use 6 ml in 300...

I’ve only ever used solution B Chris so can’t advise re the low contrast..... perhaps it’s due to the ratio of 1:47 offering a weaker strength solution as opposed to the actual amount of concentrate in that said ratio.
Is there a reason why you can’t try the stronger solution of 1:31 ( B)??
 
I’ve only ever used solution B Chris so can’t advise re the low contrast..... perhaps it’s due to the ratio of 1:47 offering a weaker strength solution as opposed to the actual amount of concentrate in that said ratio.
Is there a reason why you can’t try the stronger solution of 1:31 ( B)??
One user said they had "ruined" a roll by using Dilution A, and MDC recommends Dilution E, and doesn't mention B at all!
 
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One annoying thing: there are no frame numbers, nor any other information in the sprocket area! :( I'm pretty sure I've sleeved the various strips in different directions, which is going to make scanning a PITA. Something I hadn't thought of before...
 
I shot this roll of Potsdam 100 (believed to be ORWO UN54) at box speed; my Pentax MX is pretty reliable for metering. I used the SMC Pentax M 28/3.5 for most of the roll. It was developed in my Rondinax tank (continuous rotation) in HC 110 dilution E (1+47). This meant 4.2 ml of syrup in 200 ml of solution, as noted this was less than the minimum 6 ml of syrup per roll of film recommended by Michael Covington : "Be sure to use at least 6 mL of syrup per 135-36 or 120 roll of film, even if this requires you to put more than the usual amount of liquid in the tank". I was reassured by @Asha's results with 3 ml, but I'm now convinced that Asha is in fact a wizard, as the negatives look under-done to me (as Covington would suggest). Next time I will make 300 ml of solution, even though the tank only needs 200 ml; there'll be some leakage from the spindle, but that'll be OK.

Anyway, they scanned reasonably well, apart from a tendency to produce a lot of grain in lighter areas the moment I introduce a bit of sharpening or clarity in PP. I must admit, I quite liked the look.

a) This is a back stair visible from the new Physic Garden to Holyrood, that I rather like:

2105BPMXBW14Potsdam 100 by Chris R, on Flickr

b) The media tents set up outside the Scottish Parliament for the election:

2105BPMXBW15Potsdam 100 by Chris R, on Flickr

c) An ITV reporter being filmed for a "piece to camera" (I saw his report on the ITV News later than evening):

2105BPMXBW31Potsdam 100 by Chris R, on Flickr

d) The swan pond and St Anthony's Chapel in Holyrood Park, with some nice stormy weather:

2105BPMXBW36Potsdam 100 by Chris R, on Flickr

As I think I mentioned, I struggled up the hill (in inappropriate shoes) to get a shot with the chapel in the foreground, but there wasn't quite enough on the roll for the last frame!
 
I shot this roll of Potsdam 100 (believed to be ORWO UN54) at box speed; my Pentax MX is pretty reliable for metering. I used the SMC Pentax M 28/3.5 for most of the roll. It was developed in my Rondinax tank (continuous rotation) in HC 110 dilution E (1+47). This meant 4.2 ml of syrup in 200 ml of solution, as noted this was less than the minimum 6 ml of syrup per roll of film recommended by Michael Covington : "Be sure to use at least 6 mL of syrup per 135-36 or 120 roll of film, even if this requires you to put more than the usual amount of liquid in the tank". I was reassured by @Asha's results with 3 ml, but I'm now convinced that Asha is in fact a wizard, as the negatives look under-done to me (as Covington would suggest). Next time I will make 300 ml of solution, even though the tank only needs 200 ml; there'll be some leakage from the spindle, but that'll be OK.

Anyway, they scanned reasonably well, apart from a tendency to produce a lot of grain in lighter areas the moment I introduce a bit of sharpening or clarity in PP. I must admit, I quite liked the look.

a) This is a back stair visible from the new Physic Garden to Holyrood, that I rather like:

2105BPMXBW14Potsdam 100 by Chris R, on Flickr

b) The media tents set up outside the Scottish Parliament for the election:

2105BPMXBW15Potsdam 100 by Chris R, on Flickr

c) An ITV reporter being filmed for a "piece to camera" (I saw his report on the ITV News later than evening):

2105BPMXBW31Potsdam 100 by Chris R, on Flickr

d) The swan pond and St Anthony's Chapel in Holyrood Park, with some nice stormy weather:

2105BPMXBW36Potsdam 100 by Chris R, on Flickr

As I think I mentioned, I struggled up the hill (in inappropriate shoes) to get a shot with the chapel in the foreground, but there wasn't quite enough on the roll for the last frame!
They’re decent results Chris (y)
Other than some sharpening, did you have to make significant curves adjustments to increase contrast?
If not, then the solution you used looks to have worked just fine imo.

As for being a wizard, it seems that you have me figured out , much as I was trying to keep it a secret.
3ml concentrate is not false, however the additional ingredients of grenouilles and araignées do give my personal soup some umphh
:ROFLMAO:
 
They’re decent results Chris (y)
Other than some sharpening, did you have to make significant curves adjustments to increase contrast?
If not, then the solution you used looks to have worked just fine imo.

As for being a wizard, it seems that you have me figured out , much as I was trying to keep it a secret.
3ml concentrate is not false, however the additional ingredients of grenouilles and araignées do give my personal soup some umphh
:ROFLMAO:
EDIT: I liked them too, specially the first one of my daughter sitting by the sea that I decided not to post.

Rather than curves, I just did an Auto-levels adjustment in C1Pro, and then sometimes fiddled with the mid-tones a bit, which I guess amounts to the same thing as a curve (I can never remember how to use them, and different programs seem to have different controls, which is annoying... the curve in Vuescan is useless!).

Frogs and spiders should certainly help get the results you achieve, presumably after a bit of incantation, and maybe some widdershins dancing? ;)
 
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@ChrisR
Some additional reading if of interest.


Hereis the direct link to that offered in one of the responses on the forum.:

 
@ChrisR
Some additional reading if of interest.


Hereis the direct link to that offered in one of the responses on the forum.:


So reading through that article, you’re findings about using a minimal 6ml concentrate are indeed mentioned.
Now this has thrown me into a quandary as although my everyday standard of 3ml + 93ml water give me the results that I wish for, I am now wondering what 6mm + 186ml water will offer.
I may find that amount of solution far too much in the orbital...... only one way to find out.!
Looks like a couple of identical exposures are on the cards then, one souped with 3ml B solution and one souped with 6ml B solution.
Thank you for giving me yet another project Chris ! :bat::LOL:
 
I did shoot another roll of Potsdam 100, and this time I used 6.2 ml of HC-110 syrup in 300 ml of solution (1+47), overfilling the Rondinax by 50%. It's hard to tell, but I thought the results were a little better in terms of development...

2106CPMXBW02 Graffiti 1.jpg

2106CPMXBW06 Wisteria.jpg

2106CPMXBW23 Broken.jpg

2106CPMXBW34 Gravestones.jpg

All Pentax MX, SMC Pentax A 35/2, orange filter, Potsdam 100
 
I've now shot the roll of Silberra 54UN. Their advice, strangely, is HC-110 dilution B at 6:30. Everyone else seems to say dilution E at 6:00. I've asked on twitter, but any suggestions on here? It'll "cost" me the same in either case, as I'll be using 6.2 ml of syrup in the Rondinax...
 
I did shoot another roll of Potsdam 100, and this time I used 6.2 ml of HC-110 syrup in 300 ml of solution (1+47), overfilling the Rondinax by 50%. It's hard to tell, but I thought the results were a little better in terms of development...







View attachment 326066

All Pentax MX, SMC Pentax A 35/2, orange filter, Potsdam 100

The second batch seem to display less grain, judging from the cemetery shot which is the only one to have sky; the sky being the area that generally shows grain the most.
 
The second batch seem to display less grain, judging from the cemetery shot which is the only one to have sky; the sky being the area that generally shows grain the most.
Thanks Kevin.
I've now shot the roll of Silberra 54UN. Their advice, strangely, is HC-110 dilution B at 6:30. Everyone else seems to say dilution E at 6:00. I've asked on twitter, but any suggestions on here? It'll "cost" me the same in either case, as I'll be using 6.2 ml of syrup in the Rondinax...
I went for the same regime as the Potsdam: dilution E but 300 m rather than 200, and 6 minutes. Negatives looked fine.

1) Bindweed

2108APMXBW01 Bindweed.jpg

2) Owl on (from) a stump

2108APMXBW03 Owl.jpg

3) Four cottages

2108APMXBW21 Cottages.jpg

4) Arts Festival?

2108APMXBW32 Arts.jpg

All Pentax MX, Pentax M 28/3.5, Silberra 54UN (ORWO UN54), HC-110 E 6 minutes
 
Hi Chris, I remember the conversation on Twitter … did you come to a definitive conclusion?
Dave
I'm fairly confident Lomo Potsdam 100 is ORWO UN54, the only seed of doubt in my mind is the colour of the emulsion is different. But treating it as if it IS the ORWO works fine.

I think both the Potsdam and the Silberra were, um, quite nice. But I'm not convinced I'd buy more in preference to FP4+.

Oddly, having just decided to stick with FP4 for my summer black and white, I've now loaded one of my several rolls of original Acros 100, to see how it's bearing up. However, there's method in my madness, as it's possible I'll sell some of it and buy twice as many rolls of FP4. Or, from another thread, maybe half as many rolls of Tri-X!
 
Cheers Chris. Like you I’ve decided to settle on FP4+ as my Summer B&W film, just need the Summer now!
Oh, and welcome to TP F&C, Dave. Definitely the best bit. For other TP folk, I first "met" Dave on film twitter. He has some rather interesting cameras that I haven't seen mentioned much here, a couple of Horizon pano cameras and an extreme pano KMZ FT-2 (??).
 
For my last roll of Lomo Potsdam 100 I decided to push it one stop, it getting towards a murkier time of year. I didn't find much information around on pushing Potsdam 100, or even ORWO UN54, but, what the heck, give it a go (perhaps I should mention this is the first time I have ever deliberately pushed a film). So, I shot it at EI 200. I couldn't find any dev times for Potsdam at 200, but I did find a general piece of advice on the Massive Dev Chart, suggesting that for a one stop push in a standard developer I should multiply the dev times by 1.5. I think HC-110 E is a pretty standard developer, so that's what I did. MDC gives 6 minutes in Dilution E for Potsdam exposed at box, so my reference was 9 minutes, reduced by 15% as there was continuous rotation (more or less) in my Rondinax.

I was pretty happy with the results, here are 4...

a) I think these might be Alkanet leaves...

2110BPMXBW01 Leaves Potsdam 200.jpg

b) Bracken

2110BPMXBW03 bracken 1.jpg

c) Table outside the bookstore...

2110BPMXBW08 outside the bookshop.jpg

d) Autumnal bramble leaves...

2110BPMXBW29 autumn brambles.jpg

e) I should probably add this coastal view at Gullane, which has some sky for the grain-obsessed (not to mention some dust I missed, sorry)...

2110BPMXBW32 Gullane point 1.jpg

All taken with the Pentax MX and the SMC Pentax A 35/2 lens with an orange filter.

IMHO, on the basis of the one film, it seems to have coped with the small push very well.
 
Hadn't spotted that Nick, thanks. There's an interesting video somewhere in the article on UN54, including an interview with the ORWOUK rep, James, who mentioned his ORWOUK website where he sells ORWO films in 100 foot (or greater) lengths, There's a section with datasheets on ORWOUK as well. The datasheet for UN54 mentions (but the website does not include) ORWO Instruction 1182 for processing instructions; I found it with an internet search on the filmotech.de website. The Instruction recommends ORWO 17 or D96, 5-8 minutes at 21 C, or use Instruction 1183 if you want finer grain at the expense (IIRC) of some loss of sensitivity. No mention of HC-110!
 
I'm not sure what to make of this? New limited edition colour film. Good news if it is a new film, even if only limited edition. Apparently pre-orders open on 1 June.
ASA (ISO) 500 and "enhanced grains" will make it different to mainstream C41, and I guess there will always be a market for something a bit different. I wish them well, but don't think the enhanced grains is for me.
 
There's a lot of conflicting information around.

I've seen comments that it might be derived from Agfa XT320 cine film, processing in C41 rather than ECN2 accounting for the speed increase to 500 in a similar way that Kodak Vision 500D becomes Cinestill 800 but XT320 is apparently Tungsten balanced so if Orwo is daylight balanced it can't be.

Also, if Orwo have invested in a new film it seems strange that it is limited edition x on the other hand they say it is "proudly still produced in Bitterfeld-Wolfen on the original site" which from what I've read suggest they are using a lab coater rather than production scale equipment which may explain it.

Still, it's nice to hear of new film rather than film being discontinued - looking at you Fuji!
 
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