Qualifications for jobs?

[mastertrinity]

I'm just wondering how many people here have actually had to get a photography qualification (ND, HND, BA Hons) in order to get a photo job?

I'm purely standing at a compulsory POV, I really mean you needed it to get the job and not just do the course to learn a bit more.

reason I ask is I'm Currently doing an ND photography diploma and I haven't learned a thing, all of it can be learned from a book but instead they have to make a meal out of it plus you have to do textiles and graphics modules, I was thinking of leaving and either going onto my ND media studies diploma (I already passed the foundation diploma) and then try and then try and get into the industry.

so is there anyone out there who HAD to get the piece of paper claiming to be a photographer in order to get a photo job?

 

[gman]

You'd be better off doing a business type related course. My belief is that great photography comes from practice, experience and some natural flair. Obtain that then all you need to know is how to turn it into $$$ - hence the business type course.

Just my opinion though. Being more artistic rather than logical I believe you need to have some form of natural ability to be excellent at photography. Unlike say accounting, whereby you can simply learn how to do it all - although creative accounting is a whole new ball game hehe

 

[mastertrinity]

This is what I've always thought Graham.

Business is the biggest portion in photography yet it's much harder to learn and so it is beneficial to do a business type course rather than a photography one.

I was lucky enough to do GCSE business studies and got a C (well it was a B for coursework but I did crap on exam) and I feel like I might go on to do another business type course (accounting or something specialist) or alternatively carry on to Media level 3 ND next September which I found the foundation media diploma to be quite fun and exciting and I learned alot about audience, industry and copyright laws etc.

 

[Jayst84]

There are few jobs that will say you need a piece of paper. I believe some medical photography and scientific stuff requires it. If you apply to work in an established business some ask for it as well, just as a means of whittling down the hordes who apply (some studios, agencies, wedding companies, etc). But generally it's not a big deal.

I studied photography, didn't learn anything about taking pictures I didn't already know, but what any decent course will do is put you in touch with your peers (fellow students at similar stages to you in their 'careers'). And introduce you to people working in the industry (and possibly potential clients as well).

I have so many useful contacts in local photographers through doing my course, and I'd guess about 80% of clients in my first year out shooting came through contacts I met whilst studying.

EDIT: Any course worth it's fees should cover a fair bit of the business side of things as well.

 

[Moz]

I did a BA in photography and feel I wasted my time. I even stayed on for the top up year, partly because of pressure from parents to finish the full course but also because I found it difficult to actually find permanent work that actually paid, loads that offered experience though.Maybe I didnt look hard enough or market myself in the right ways.

Anyway I finished uni in July, was out of work for a few month bar a few freelance jobs, then heard of paid assisting work going somewhere near by to me at the start of October, assisted as a freelancer for the month and worked my bum off, there literally has been blood and sweat. Then last week, the big boss man offered me a full time position assisting and doing some photography work during busy times.

Only showed a portfolio at the initial interview which I wouldnt say you need to go on a course for as long as you are self motivated and know what you want and can create your own briefs to work to. I didnt mention I had done a course but put more emphasis on explaining my portfolio, plus he wasnt interested in if I had a piece of paper to say I can take a photo.

 

[Moz]

Oh and I have learned more technically and practically in the few weeks Ive been at this studio than I did during the entire time on the course.

The theory side I would go to a university for, just not the one ended up at. I feel like there is a big problem with the standard of teaching at this level, especially with the amount of money that you pay (I know its subsidised and grants ect are available) but Ive finished the education part of my life now and am so happy about that, I wouldnt ever want to go back into that type of education.

I hear this type of story from students who have done all types of courses all over the country.

 

[Jayst84]

Oh and I have learned more technically and practically in the few weeks Ive been at this studio than I did during the entire time on the course.

The theory side I would go to a university for, just not the one ended up at. I feel like there is a big problem with the standard of teaching at this level, especially with the amount of money that you pay (I know its subsidised and grants ect are available) but Ive finished the education part of my life now and am so happy about that, I wouldnt ever want to go back into that type of education.

I hear this type of story from students who have done all types of courses all over the country.

OT/
If you think higher ed is bad in the UK, you should've studied in Australia. :nuts:

 

[Daryl]

Others can say what they want. But after being in Photography for 22 years I have found you need Experience and the bit of paper.

I left college and got 2 years in Isle of Wight Archeology unit (Location and studio)
Then went to London and Worked Madame Tussuards studio. After that apply for jobs I was being told had experience but wheres the paper work. So I took a summer job as Holiday camp photographer and started a course City and Guilds 747 in Middleborough,
Half way through that got me a job for Sportsphoto agency. Shooting sports and film prems for National papers and magazines.

From there I moved South worked for a Studio and then the job I was after in Scenes of Crime with Thames Valley Police. After 7 years of that because they were not going digital I worked for some the largest school photography companies and the last 2 gone it alone.

So if you are going it alone then do business. If you want to work for larger companies and government photographic depts you both. Experience and the paper.

The employment journey in life is different for everyone.

It's for you to decide.


Really? 'Very few that want the paper?' that's rubbish every job I have gone for would like it. Why??? Because companies and studios want you to know the basis and have an understanding of photography.

I for one want the paper when we advertise. Do not have time to explain to togs the reasons and the where fors of why the camera does what it does.

Learn your self? Yes but it's the long way round to achieve what you want you can pick bad habbits from the start.

If you are goiing to do you own businness then do a biz course. And learn many other togs. Learn from their mistakes and learn what works for others and adapt it to what works for you.

Cock ups and mistakes are costly and time consuming in this business and some mistakes could cost you you future and reputation if you are not careful.


James makes a good point.

Choose your course carefully if you go that route. Too many courses are laid back and ARTY FARTY. They are waste of time. Hardly any one goes on to stay in photography. Work at your own pace and all that c r a p. Hippy teaching.

The course I did up North was based on running a all disaplins and all formats of photography.

you had to do 3 of each format 35mm/ medium/ 5x4 or 10x8 neg and trannie film. you had to choose 3 jobs from a huge list and do 3 off for each medium.

Architechture/Fashion/food/product/sport/commision/fine art/ etc. you had to price the job, work out the costings and prep the job. Shoot it. All under and this is the most important bit. Under a short time frame. They gave you deadlines to work under.

The real world will bite students in the butt if they get a job in the commercial world.

I have seen student f ar t about for 5 weeks doing one print for the portfolio. you have to produce a Rembrandt in an hour and produce 200 by the end of the day mate?

thats the difference.

Y

 

[mastertrinity]

yeah this course I'm doing is very arty farty and less technical etc. In my career I would be happy doing portraits and weddings etc and possibly a bit of commercial for businesses but I see that would mostly mean freelance.

I'm going to stay on the course for a few more months and then I'm going to go to a couple of open days and have a look at the business courses and if they are no good for me then I have my media to back up on.

The thing with me is that I'm going on 17 and want to do a course for a couple of years just until the economy gets a bit better and also I don't feel ready going all guns blazing freelance at such a young age. My course is boring and I've learned nothing plus I don't get along with most of the people in the class because most of them are arrogant nobs

 

[lauren_t]

I know what you mean, I'm doing the ND in Photography and finding it boring too! We've been doing apertures and ISO since the beginning of November and its getting a bit tedious. I've learnt how to process in the darkroom but thats about it.
We've had no lessons in the business side of things but my tutor has been exaggerating the 'its not what you know, its who you know' saying and its just so unhelpful lol but we have had graphic design lessons where the tutor has told us repeatedly to rely on photoshop to make our images look good.

 

[MartynK]

I'd recommend business studies, with the emphasis on sales and marketing, for anyone wanting to work for themselves. You can pay an accountant to look after that side of things, and he'll tell you what records to keep.

I imagine some photography jobs do require qualifications, but most employers - and just about all clients - will be more intersted in your work and experience.

 

[mastertrinity]

I know what you mean, I'm doing the ND in Photography and finding it boring too! We've been doing apertures and ISO since the beginning of November and its getting a bit tedious. I've learnt how to process in the darkroom but thats about it.
We've had no lessons in the business side of things but my tutor has been exaggerating the 'its not what you know, its who you know' saying and its just so unhelpful lol but we have had graphic design lessons where the tutor has told us repeatedly to rely on photoshop to make our images look good.

Ahh another sufferer of borditis


yeah were just about to start proper darkroom but we have been learning developing and while it's interesting the tutors just keep dragging it on. Graphics is the same as well they are always saying that we have photoshop to make the images look good so we don't get put under pressure but I think the tutors talk stupid lol, we also have a textiles manual printing module thing as well which bores the life out of me.

I think I should leave the course definitely because I'm not going to learn anything and plus I'd rather get a qualification in a vocational skill such as Business studies or my media diploma because it can help get me an actual job.

 

[Daryl]

Hahahaha, Well Lauren if you want to do Fashion in London It is who you know. 90% of the top work goes to 5% of the photographers. 10% of the rest of work is fought over by the others.

I did my stint in London and got in with a few of the 'London Geezer'. all total T**ts every last one. Egotistical Omnipitent ******s!!!!!! I can not be arsed with idiots.

One shoot there was Make up artists, Sylists assistants. Prop and set designers. They did all the work and set up the shot and Captain ego came in took 10 or 12 shots and went off to another room. Then came out did the same on the next set up.

He had the name and all the others did the work..... W**k*r!

 

[Tugster]

Hahahaha, Well Lauren if you want to do Fashion in London It is who you know. 90% of the top work goes to 5% of the photographers. 10% of the rest of work is fought over by the others.

I did my stint in London and got in with a few of the 'London Geezer'. all total T**ts every last one. Egotistical Omnipitent ******s!!!!!! I can not be arsed with idiots.

One shoot there was Make up artists, Sylists assistants. Prop and set designers. They did all the work and set up the shot and Captain ego came in took 10 or 12 shots and went off to another room. Then came out did the same on the next set up.

He had the name and all the others did the work..... W**k*r!

Say it how you see it Daryl

 

[gman]

I did my stint in London and got in with a few of the 'London Geezer'. all total T**ts every last one. Egotistical Omnipitent ******s!!!!!! I can not be arsed with idiots.

One shoot there was Make up artists, Sylists assistants. Prop and set designers. They did all the work and set up the shot and Captain ego came in took 10 or 12 shots and went off to another room. Then came out did the same on the next set up.

He had the name and all the others did the work..... W**k*r!

lol, this reminds me of America's Next Top Model! Who on earth are these people they find on the "judging" panel. That Nigel dude appears to be the only normal one. And what's with Tira Floodbanks, or Tiara or whatever she's called; when she says, "that's not a winning pose.....this is a winning pose" and all she does is the same bloody pose and simply slants her eyes!

Did over 7 years in Larrrrdan in the very colourful Soho district and it's definitely about who you know. A lot of "ya ya ya" and "oh darling ya" but there's also an obscene amount of money floating about....not to mention razor sharp steel business cards