Sharing Lightroom catalogue, two devices

gad-westy · 10 Jul 2017

This is maybe slightly complicated but I'll try to keep it simple.

I have an imac and a macbook. Both have lightroom installed but all of my photos and catalogue are on imac only Currently have lightroom catalogue and previews on internal SSD and actual image files on an HDD drive. Works quite well, nice and quick.

I'd like to be able to use the same catalogue and images on the laptop with minimal faff so looking at different methods for sharing images and have narrowed it down to two. Just interested in feedback from those that have tried similar.

1. Catalogue file in dropbox folder so that it syncs automatically on each machine but sits on the local SSD of each machine so nice and fast once synced. Images files on an external 2TB USB 3.0 HDD.

2. Buy a dual 2.5" enclosure and put a small SSD and large HDD in there. Catalogue on SSD and images on HDD. Not even sure if these exist but I assume they do.

Any thoughts?

Chappers · 10 Jul 2017

If you are going to use an external drive anyway, I'd put the catalogue and images on that. Dropbox would only work if you have internet connectivity, and depending on the service could be slow. Depending on the size of your catalogue I wouldn't get to hung up on a SSD, for that. Simply put the Library files on the same HDD as the images.

gad-westy · 10 Jul 2017

Chappers said:
If you are going to use an external drive anyway, I'd put the catalogue and images on that. Dropbox would only work if you have internet connectivity, and depending on the service could be slow. Depending on the size of your catalogue I wouldn't get to hung up on a SSD, for that. Simply put the Library files on the same HDD as the images.

Thanks. I used to have LR on an internal HDD and the difference in general speed after moving it to an SSD seemed huge. I'm not sure I'd fancy going back again but open minded. That would obviously be a simple solution if there is no speed penalty.

neil_g · 10 Jul 2017

Definitely not Dropbox. Lr cats aren't designed to be shared and easily corrupt. Dropbox has too much potential to cause corruption through syncing.

Generally the acceptable workaround is export and import of catalogues on each machine. Store the catalogue on an external drive, a nice fast one as Lr benefits from that, and take regular backups just in case you get a drive disconnect.

gad-westy · 10 Jul 2017

neil_g said:
Definitely not Dropbox. Lr cats aren't designed to be shared and easily corrupt. Dropbox has too much potential to cause corruption through syncing.

Generally the acceptable workaround is export and import of catalogues on each machine. Store the catalogue on an external drive, a nice fast one as Lr benefits from that, and take regular backups just in case you get a drive disconnect.

Maybe I need a rethink. I had assumed that as long as I always made sure that dropbox was synced before using the other machine, there should be no issue as you're always working from the local drive. I assume the corruption you refer to would come from the syncing operation itself?

The trouble with an external drive is that anything big enough is going to be an HDD operating over usb3.0. My concern is that it will just be a huge slow down vs. what I'm used to. To get a faster external drive would mean SSD and that is going to be mega money for a drive big enough. That's why I wondered about using a hybrid drive with both SSD and HDD.

andy1868 · 10 Jul 2017

Are you just editing on the laptop or do you need to export from there too?

If you just want to edit on the laptop while on the go, you don't need the original images with you. On the iMac, import the photos into Lightroom, on import build 1:1 and smart previews. Once this is done, all you need is the Catalog to edit, so in theory you could have this on an external SSD if needs be, without needing the giant drive with the originals on too. Export is available from the smart previews but obviously not at the same size etc, should be fine for online use though I would think

For what it's worth, I have never tried the above, however it has given me the drive to try it for myself as editing on my laptop away from the PC would be handy now and then! I do use 1:1 and smart previews, then unplug the external drive to improve speed on the PC so don't see why it wouldn't work the way you want it to

gad-westy · 10 Jul 2017

andy1868 said:
Are you just editing on the laptop or do you need to export from there too?

If you just want to edit on the laptop while on the go, you don't need the original images with you. On the iMac, import the photos into Lightroom, on import build 1:1 and smart previews. Once this is done, all you need is the Catalog to edit, so in theory you could have this on an external SSD if needs be, without needing the giant drive with the originals on too. Export is available from the smart previews but obviously not at the same size etc, should be fine for online use though I would think

For what it's worth, I have never tried the above, however it has given me the drive to try it for myself as editing on my laptop away from the PC would be handy now and then! I do use 1:1 and smart previews, then unplug the external drive to improve speed on the PC so don't see why it wouldn't work the way you want it to

Perhaps should have made that a little clearer at the start. My ideal aim is to be able to sit with either laptop or desktop and use lightroom in exactly the same way with the same library no matter where I am. This could be at home if other half is using other computer or maybe because I want to sit in front of TV or it could be when I'm away. That's the ideal. If it can't be done in a satisfactory manner, then I guess your's doesn't sound like such a bad compromise.

andy1868 · 10 Jul 2017

Ahhhh okay, yes I re-read your original post after I posted and saw the "minimal faff" part and thought this may not be for you :LOL:

Dual caddies exist looking online so what you want may be easily possible, you'd just need to make sure the caddy addresses the 2 drives separately, ie 2 different drive letters and not in a RAID configuration

neil_g · 10 Jul 2017

gad-westy said:
Maybe I need a rethink. I had assumed that as long as I always made sure that dropbox was synced before using the other machine, there should be no issue as you're always working from the local drive. I assume the corruption you refer to would come from the syncing operation itself?

if any process, such as dropbox, attempted to access the cat while it was in use then you run the risk of corruption. i guess you could physically make sure dropbox was totally disabled (kill and services and processes) before using lightroom and turning it back on later but its a faff.

as i say the only guaranteed workaround and the one that is accepted by adobe techs is the cat import/export method.

at the end of the day, LR was never designed to share its catalogue. its a limitation but thats why its cheap, adding record locking and multi user support would significantly increase the cost of the software.

gad-westy · 11 Jul 2017

neil_g said:
if any process, such as dropbox, attempted to access the cat while it was in use then you run the risk of corruption. i guess you could physically make sure dropbox was totally disabled (kill and services and processes) before using lightroom and turning it back on later but its a faff.

as i say the only guaranteed workaround and the one that is accepted by adobe techs is the cat import/export method.

at the end of the day, LR was never designed to share its catalogue. its a limitation but thats why its cheap, adding record locking and multi user support would significantly increase the cost of the software.

Cheers Neil. Plenty to ponder.

My gut feeling is to wait a little while before investing in anything. If a 2tb Thunderbolt external SSD had been available for an affordable amount, then I guess this conversation would be null and void. So maybe I need to wait until prices drop a little.

neil_g · 12 Jul 2017

gad-westy said:
Cheers Neil. Plenty to ponder.

My gut feeling is to wait a little while before investing in anything. If a 2tb Thunderbolt external SSD had been available for an affordable amount, then I guess this conversation would be null and void. So maybe I need to wait until prices drop a little.

If you want access to your entire library then yes it can be a bit of an issue.

You could run an archive cat, and a smaller current edits cat. A bit more complicated maybe but could get away with a smaller drive.

Nawty · 12 Jul 2017

I tried, for a while, to have the catalog sync across using iCloud Drive but ultimately resorted back to exporting catalogues from my Macbook to my iMac as it was just too slow and buggy. The iMac is the 'master system' which has everything on it, including backup drives etc and the Macbook is used for editing on the move so after a trip I just export everything as a catalogue, transfer via Airdrop (which is very quick nowadays, even for a 40gb catalogue) and importing into LR on the iMac.

mal robb · 13 Jul 2017

I had this dilemma as well and put photos and catalogue on an external drive. It worked but not ideal and now I just use my desktop for editing. I think Adobe are really missing a trick here as a lot of photographers have more than one device on which they want to view and edit photographs. It would be great if you could put your catalogue and photos on something like OneDrive and be able to use Lightroom on any device you choose.

neil_g · 13 Jul 2017

mal robb said:
I had this dilemma as well and put photos and catalogue on an external drive. It worked but not ideal and now I just use my desktop for editing. I think Adobe are really missing a trick here as a lot of photographers have more than one device on which they want to view and edit photographs. It would be great if you could put your catalogue and photos on something like OneDrive and be able to use Lightroom on any device you choose.

like i said earlier, if they did then LR would cost a hell of a lot more. its a small price to pay to have such a versatile, cheap editing and cataloguing program.

gad-westy · 14 Jul 2017

Nawty said:
I tried, for a while, to have the catalog sync across using iCloud Drive but ultimately resorted back to exporting catalogues from my Macbook to my iMac as it was just too slow and buggy. The iMac is the 'master system' which has everything on it, including backup drives etc and the Macbook is used for editing on the move so after a trip I just export everything as a catalogue, transfer via Airdrop (which is very quick nowadays, even for a 40gb catalogue) and importing into LR on the iMac.

I think this is what I'll end up doing. Unfortunately, I've managed to spill lemonade on the macbook so it's all a bit moot and until that is repaired/replaced

mal robb · 14 Jul 2017

neil_g said:
like i said earlier, if they did then LR would cost a hell of a lot more. its a small price to pay to have such a versatile, cheap editing and cataloguing program.

Not meaning to be contentious but why would it cost more? Surely record locking would not be required because it is just one user seeking to access the data, it is just the device that is changing. I sense that it is perhaps more to do with latency as accessing large RAW files from the cloud, would likely be a frustrating experience in terms of user experience.

neil_g · 14 Jul 2017

mal robb said:
Not meaning to be contentious but why would it cost more? Surely record locking would not be required because it is just one user seeking to access the data, it is just the device that is changing. I sense that it is perhaps more to do with latency as accessing large RAW files from the cloud, would likely be a frustrating experience in terms of user experience.

The point is the cat really isn't very resilient, to make it more robust and/or potentially allow some form of official sharing between devices would require a fairly hefty recode. And if they did eventually offer multi user support naturally they'd charge more too as photography studios would love it.

gad-westy · 15 Jul 2017

neil_g said:
The point is the cat really isn't very resilient, to make it more robust and/or potentially allow some form of official sharing between devices would require a fairly hefty recode. And if they did eventually offer multi user support naturally they'd charge more too as photography studios would love it.

Will be interesting to see if there is a shift towards this. It just seems to be the way everything is going. I'm not sure how it would work on a practical level because the sheer amount of data but would be good to see a dedicated LR cloud catalogue service to replace the dropbox issue above.

Nawty · 15 Jul 2017

Isn't this exactly what LR mobile is designed for - iPad pro, raw editing etc...

I keep seriously considering ditching my 12" Macbook and iMac and just getting a MBP and dock as I just don't use the iMac and managing data across two devices is a PITA.

In truth the 12" Macbook is almost enough and I love the form factor, if I didn't enjoy the occasional game then I would just get a 2017 version and have done with it (which I might do anyway).

gilbouk · 15 Jul 2017

Nawty said:
Isn't this exactly what LR mobile is designed for - iPad pro, raw editing etc...

I keep seriously considering ditching my 12" Macbook and iMac and just getting a MBP and dock as I just don't use the iMac and managing data across two devices is a PITA.

In truth the 12" Macbook is almost enough and I love the form factor, if I didn't enjoy the occasional game then I would just get a 2017 version and have done with it (which I might do anyway).

Totally agree with you Nawty, I'm going down that avenue myself, as trying to manage pictures on 2 devices is a PITA. Particularly if you just want to start where you left off from. I tried the syncing via Lightroom Mobile Sync which I just don't understand, and it's slow particularly if you have a slow upload speed and a large number of files to work through. One powerful and portable device for all is where I'm going.

Nawty · 15 Jul 2017

Gil Bev said:
Totally agree with you Nawty, I'm going down that avenue myself, as trying to manage pictures on 2 devices is a PITA. Particularly if you just want to start where you left off from. I tried the syncing via Lightroom Mobile Sync which I just don't understand, and it's slow particularly if you have a slow upload speed and a large number of files to work through. One powerful and portable device for all is where I'm going.

What device are you thinking? I honestly find my 2015 12" Macbook almost enough for my editing needs (LR isn't particularly resource intensive).

gilbouk · 15 Jul 2017

Nawty said:
What device are you thinking? I honestly find my 2015 12" Macbook almost enough for my editing needs (LR isn't particularly resource intensive).

I picked up a 2015 MacBook Pro 13" quite cheaply and have been using it ever since with little use of my desktop anymore. Have actually posted by desktop up for sale in the Classified section

mal robb · 15 Jul 2017

The problem with one powerful and portable device is hard drive size. 512GB machines are now becoming more common but you tend to pay a premium for these sort of sizes of SSD and large (RAW) photo collections soon fill up your device.. It sounds like they are just making iterations to LR and not a wholesale architectural redesign, which I think Adobe should be looking at as technology has moved on.

gilbouk · 15 Jul 2017

mal robb said:
The problem with one powerful and portable device is hard drive size. 512GB machines are now becoming more common but you tend to pay a premium for these sort of sizes of SSD and large (RAW) photo collections soon fill up your device.. It sounds like they are just making iterations to LR and not a wholesale architectural redesign, which I think Adobe should be looking at as technology has moved on.

I know it's a bad thing to do, but I don't keep my RAWs after I've PPd. At least not for long.