So it really is time to ditch Adobe

IMatch looks good - except it only operates on Windows.
You could give Photo Supreme a look https://www.idimager.com/, or Neofinder http://www.cdfinder.de/ and PhotoMechanic have their database version in limited beta (you need have a license for Photo Mechanic to be part of the beta).

I'm using Neofinder, and although its a bit rough around the edges, its very fast and very powerful. I have a catalogue for Raws, and a catalogue that combines all my separate Capture One sessions into one big catalogue. Developer is very responsive and its low cost, in fact if you only want to catalogue a single volume, the trial last forever. It doesn't have the bells and whistles of Media Pro (Which I've use since before MS bought it) but Neofinder is a solid and powerful cataloguing and search tool..

But I'm also a long time Photo Mechanic user, so am trialling the beta "plus" version with the cataloguing. Its a bit of a different concept to other DAMs as it has obviously come from an "add cataloguing to PM" approach, rather than build a DAM from scratch. And its suffering from being a beta, but I suspect its one to watch.
 
You could give Photo Supreme a look https://www.idimager.com/, or Neofinder http://www.cdfinder.de/ and PhotoMechanic have their database version in limited beta (you need have a license for Photo Mechanic to be part of the beta).
I've used both iMatch and Photo Supreme (from when it used to be called IDimager). iMatch was a very cumbersome program, although it's now been completely re-written, but I got on better with IDimager (Photo Supreme) but I stopped using a dedicated DAM when I started using Lightroom. Now I no longer use LR it may be time to look at a dedicated DAM again.
I'm using Neofinder, and although its a bit rough around the edges, its very fast and very powerful. I have a catalogue for Raws, and a catalogue that combines all my separate Capture One sessions into one big catalogue. Developer is very responsive and its low cost, in fact if you only want to catalogue a single volume, the trial last forever. It doesn't have the bells and whistles of Media Pro (Which I've use since before MS bought it) but Neofinder is a solid and powerful cataloguing and search tool..

But I'm also a long time Photo Mechanic user, so am trialling the beta "plus" version with the cataloguing. Its a bit of a different concept to other DAMs as it has obviously come from an "add cataloguing to PM" approach, rather than build a DAM from scratch. And its suffering from being a beta, but I suspect its one to watch.
We all know what happens when things are "tacked on" to an existing program - they finish up like Photoshop, which probably has the worst UI of any commercial software.
 
We all know what happens when things are "tacked on" to an existing program - they finish up like Photoshop, which probably has the worst UI of any commercial software.

Well people already complain about the PM GUI: I find it OK. However, I maybe misled you on my comment about PM.

I simply meant that rather than designing a new version of PM, they have kept PM pretty much as it was and added a catalogue menu item. This is great for existing PM users, as there is little new to learn, but will seem odd to anyone who has used other DAMs. PM+ sill works very much as PM does, just replaced what used to be a rather unreliable search tool, with a new cataloguing tool.

If I wasn't now finding Neofinder so good, I would be very excited about the PM+. As it is, I'm less sure about what I should do, as the standard version of PM, plus Neofinder does everything I really need, and I suspect it will be some time before PM+ is as robust as Neofinder is for cataloging.
 
People are getting creative.
https://mobile.BANNED/Everblue_Comic/status/1124453210297520128
 

Attachments

  • D5rZjoHVUAAJzui.jpeg
    D5rZjoHVUAAJzui.jpeg
    71.3 KB · Views: 20
Last edited:
This thread really highlights the wider problem. There is Adobe and then there are all the others and it's knowing which way to jump, choosing Adobe is easy, it will be around for a long time and there is loads of support and help.
 
I find there is masses of online info, videos and help for the popular alternatives too. Especially for those that have been around a long time.
And we never know when the next Adobe price hike or limitation is coming.
 
Last edited:
Prices for just about every product inevitably rise. I would never jump ship just on a financial whim.
 
There's a point beyond which price increases become price gouging, especially when attached to a subscription model that means you have to keep paying even if you don't need the updates.
 
Prices for just about every product inevitably rise. I would never jump ship just on a financial whim.
Quite so.
There are plenty of programs that can do a better job than Adobe.
 
This thread really highlights the wider problem. There is Adobe and then there are all the others and it's knowing which way to jump, choosing Adobe is easy, it will be around for a long time and there is loads of support and help.

And this is also quite correct, and even if there isn't so much support Adobe software often just simply works better than the others.

People are getting creative.
View: https://mobile.BANNED/Everblue_Comic/status/1124453210297520128

There's quite a few key packages missing from that graphic.
 
Gizmodo not beating about the bush here:

https://gizmodo.com/adobe-is-screwing-with-its-cheapest-software-plan-in-th-1834505711

'Adobe Is Screwing With Its Cheapest Software Plan In the Scummiest Way'

'The $9.99/month option can also be purchased as a 12-month plan for $119.88, which can be further locked down for an additional three years. But by hiding that option on the website, it means that new Creative Cloud subscribers who aren’t familiar with the current pricing structure will simply assume the $20.99/month option is the cheapest way to get Photoshop, and that’s a scummy way to take advantage of them.'
 
So, if you buy a subscription from Amazon (et al) does that get applied at the end of your current subscription? Mine is due to renew at the end of June once the 2 free months has expired.
Yes. You can have up to 36 months paid up at any one time.
 
Adobe UK has stated that the £9.99 Photo Plan is still available and will continue to stay at the same rate for customers.


Like they said lightroom would continue to be available as a one-off purchase?

Having seen what happened with Lightroom there can be little ndoubt about what will happen to the subscription models in the future.

Honestly I believe Adobe's behaviour is quite disgusting.
 
Last edited:
Honestly I believe Adobe's behaviour is quite disgusting.

The pressure will be on Adobe for sources of revenue growth. They have had the shift to subscription and the associated uplift. Presumably that has (or is expected to) level off. That means the likely next phase will involve pressure to uplift the yield from customers by changing the subscription model and rates..
 
Like they said lightroom would continue to be available as a one-off purchase?

But they didn't say it would be available forever and anyway LR6 is still available to buy from several outlets. All computer programs have a finite lifespan and personally I would rather they put their development time (and budget) into making the latest version better than trying to add features or functionality to an ageing version.

Having seen what happened with Lightroom there can be little ndoubt about what will happen to the subscription models in the future.

Agreed, but what doesn't go up in price these days? I very much doubt that they will implement a 100% price hike in one jump but carrying our random testing on a live web site is a bit weird though.

Honestly I believe Adobe's behaviour is quite disgusting.

Really? TBH, I don't see they have done anything that thousands of other businesses around the world don't do day in day out.
 
@Bristolian,

We'll have to agree to differ on that. It really isn't worth arguing about.

I wasn't trying to be argumentative (I'm not even sure I can spell it correctly :)) - just wanting to add some business perspective to the discussion.

No offence meant and I hope none taken :)
 
The pressure will be on Adobe for sources of revenue growth. They have had the shift to subscription and the associated uplift. Presumably that has (or is expected to) level off. That means the likely next phase will involve pressure to uplift the yield from customers by changing the subscription model and rates..


Adobe's revenue for the last financial year (2018 - 9) was $9.03 billion, and increase of 24% on the previous year.
 
I’d sooner deal with a company that had a history of economic growth than one losing money and risking going out of business. Least, that’s what I used to practice when buying IT for a major organisation. But it’s a free country, with no perfect products; people can buy and use what they want. :)
 
Really? TBH, I don't see they have done anything that thousands of other businesses around the world don't do day in day out.

If you walked into Tescos and bought a loaf of bread you'd probably be p****d off if the cashier charged you £1 more than the woman in front of you and the bloke behind because they got the exact same bread as you but got it off a hidden shelf at the back that you didn't spot.

This may be an acceptable way to behave in some circles. We can all make our own minds up how we feel about companies who do this.
 
If you walked into Tescos and bought a loaf of bread you'd probably be p****d off if the cashier charged you £1 more than the woman in front of you and the bloke behind because they got the exact same bread as you but got it off a hidden shelf at the back that you didn't spot.

This may be an acceptable way to behave in some circles. We can all make our own minds up how we feel about companies who do this.


Dynamic pricing in supermarkets is on the way...

Imagine pricing based on what they THINK your salary is.
 
If you walked into Tescos and bought a loaf of bread you'd probably be p****d off if the cashier charged you £1 more than the woman in front of you and the bloke behind because they got the exact same bread as you but got it off a hidden shelf at the back that you didn't spot.

This may be an acceptable way to behave in some circles. We can all make our own minds up how we feel about companies who do this.

I'm sorry but it is clear that what has been happening with prices on the Adobe website is some form of testing - they have said so. Has anyone actually attempted to purchase at the higher quoted price and the transaction went through at that price? Just like Tesco, I can always decide not to accept their pricing and go elsewhere or ask the manager to explain the difference.

In any case, my comment that you quoted wasn't specifically concerning the price hike but in response to what I thought Jerry meant as their general attitude towards their customers.
 
Reading this thread and others of a similar ilk here and elsewhere I am a little surprised that people appear to think that companies like Adobe are here for the benefit of their customers ... they're not.

Every company is in business to make money for their owners and/or shareholders. If they're not then they won't be around for long.

In business terms, whether the turnover is $9 billion or $90 billion is immaterial - it's profits that grow the business not turnover. Would Adobe be considered a success if their outgoings were $91 billion? For sure their investors wouldn't and bear in mind your pension fund may well be one of those investors.
 
Reading this thread and others of a similar ilk here and elsewhere I am a little surprised that people appear to think that companies like Adobe are here for the benefit of their customers ... they're not.

Every company is in business to make money for their owners and/or shareholders. If they're not then they won't be around for long.

In business terms, whether the turnover is $9 billion or $90 billion is immaterial - it's profits that grow the business not turnover. Would Adobe be considered a success if their outgoings were $91 billion? For sure their investors wouldn't and bear in mind your pension fund may well be one of those investors.
I tried making this point a few posts ago ... Minolta, amongst others, was a great camera company poorly managed and failed to make a profit. It went bust. It was regretted by the photographic community.
 
Jerry meant as their general attitude towards their customers.

You were right in assuming that I meant that Adobe treat their customers like ****. Yes, we have the choice of signing up to their new business model or going elsewhere but many of us have spent years refining our processing techniques and to start again using new software will be a struggle. And they know that. The phrase 'short and curlies' has been used before and I will use it again.

And I do know a bit about business, as it happens, as I have been in business myself for many years - not quite on the Adobe scale, however!
 
Reading this thread and others of a similar ilk here and elsewhere I am a little surprised that people appear to think that companies like Adobe are here for the benefit of their customers ... they're not.

Every company is in business to make money for their owners and/or shareholders. If they're not then they won't be around for long.

In business terms, whether the turnover is $9 billion or $90 billion is immaterial - it's profits that grow the business not turnover. Would Adobe be considered a success if their outgoings were $91 billion? For sure their investors wouldn't and bear in mind your pension fund may well be one of those investors.

You could also argue that without customers then bye bye company.

I've been using Adobe products for years, I bought numerous old versions of LR and PS and now I am tied into their monthly plan. I'm looking for good alternatives, but nothing out there really matches LR in particular for ease of use, smooth workflow etc ... they do know this too. But, if people began to leave these plans en masse you bet your ass they would drop the prices again
 
Like they said lightroom would continue to be available as a one-off purchase?

Having seen what happened with Lightroom there can be little ndoubt about what will happen to the subscription models in the future.

Honestly I believe Adobe's behaviour is quite disgusting.
I believe the exact content of the Adobe statement said that stand-alone Lightroom would be available "indefinitely."

Note that "indefinitely means "an undefined period" and it does NOT mean for ever, for which I believe the word is "infinitely."
Clearly Adobe meant "until we say so" and they have now said so.
 
Oops… We have good news and bad news…   warren chrismas gmail com   Gmail.png

Received this intentionally misleading email from Skylum. Really not a way to endear me. :-/
 
And that means the pressure is on to keep a decent rate of growth or increase margins.
Is 24% a decent rate of growth and if not, what is?
 
I don't really use the management side of LR as I've always been happy with how I do that side of things manually (and that hasn't changed since becoming a wedding photographer).

So I'm literally just using LR to do what are relatively simple exposure/colour adjustments, spot removal etc and critically to apply my own presets. As far as I can tell, Affinity Photo will basically be sufficient for me if I can figure out how to recreate my presets. I took about two years perfecting them to this point so I really wouldn't want to have to do that again.
 
It seems a lot of people either use the processing side of lightroom or the asset management side.
I am one of those who do not use the processing side, but do use the Library system and the export system
I process with the raw processor in Photoshop to 16 bit tiff, and immediately continue with Pixel level editing as necessary.
I then move the finished files to "My Photographs" and import them from their into lightroom for keywording and other library grouping.

It is this second simple library function that I would need to find a replacement for if I move from adobe.
 
I believe the exact content of the Adobe statement said that stand-alone Lightroom would be available "indefinitely."

Note that "indefinitely means "an undefined period" and it does NOT mean for ever, for which I believe the word is "infinitely."
Clearly Adobe meant "until we say so" and they have now said so.


Yes, you're right. Indefinitely was the word they used. I'm sure very few people took the word to mean "for about the next 3 years", which is what actually happened. We can be absolutely sure that Adobe is about to increase the price of their packages by , oooh.....about 100% , I'd say.........

Fortunately I'm still on LR6.
 
@footman could you try making a new adobe account for the LR6 you're using on the different machine? i think this is what i did after i had done a trial that went to CC but then got a copy of standalone LR6.

@Bristolian standalone LR6 is very difficult/impossible to find - i failed to find somewhere to purchase it within the last few months. Currys listed it as in stock but then the order never processed and they said there was an issue and cancelled it, another online outlet had to back order it which was going to take 3 weeks and after 2 weeks got back in touch and said they couldnt get it any more. I then found somewhere on ebay who had a copy, that never arrived (i got a refund thankfully) and then I could find no other online retailer or store who had stock of the standalone version. I was only able to get it 2nd hand from a private person who didn't use theirs anymore which was just sheer luck - there appears to be on person selling it on ebay (not everyone's choice of a reputable outlet), it was sold out on amazon when i looked at the time, and its now over £200 and a site called Alza which I've never heard of. i thought when i finally decided to buy it that it was still readily available but it took me several months to eventually get it and i was kicking myself for procrastinating for so long. So it's no longer a reliable option/choice.
 
Last edited:
@dan_yell
That's interesting, would I have to use a different email address to set up another account? I think my problem is that I have a CC account already. If I didn't have that then I would be able to use my purchased copy of LR6.
 
Last edited:
Back
Top