So much hatred for new wedding photographers??

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POAH said:
pretty much in some cases yes

p.s I'm not saying I don't do it just in case you are going down that route, I pointing out with wedding photography its more often than not. you don't see it in other genres. hence my original comment on this thread ;)
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Yet you're the one doing it here. Go figure.

Of course, why would anyone get annoyed at being called an arrogant MoFu, or that they have their head in the arse.

:thinking:
 
Guys - lets ensure this stays on topic and also good humoured and of some constructive use - otherwise we may see a closed thread and some time off for some :)
 
Radiohead said:
Yet you're the one doing it here. Go figure.

Of course, why would anyone get annoyed at being called an arrogant MoFu, or that they have their head in the arse.

:thinking:
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note I said stereotypically - I'm not saying all are but thats the general feeling you get from this forum with wedding photographers. its the same with medics. I can't think of any other genre of photography that has so much old boys club mentality. I used to shoot a lot of automotive stuff for mags and I'd never give the kind of crap that a lot of people get on here for asking about weddings.


good example is this thread

http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=292805

no one gave the guy any abuse at all but if this had been about wedding photography people would have been down his throat in an instant
 
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POAH said:
tell that to the guy that gets the wrong testicle removed :LOL:
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But at least the guy who removed it had received training and was qualified, it wasn't done by a bloke who bought a scalpel for Christmas and thought he'd have a go.
And you can bet he'll have a decent size compensation.
 
Gotta agree with you POAH,

In comparison with other threads, the amount of technical knowledge and goodwill unleashed on non wedding threads is sometimes superb.
 
you don't need qualifications to do photography and I was only making a humerous post I was not suggesting its the same thing.

if people hire a photographer based on his previous work and he supplys images at the same or better quality then what compensation is there to get.

Wedding photography is no different to any other photographic service.

swanseamale47 said:
But at least the guy who removed it had received training and was qualified, it wasn't done by a bloke who bought a scalpel for Christmas and thought he'd have a go.
And you can bet he'll have a decent size compensation.
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This is perhaps bit of a ramble...

A guy at work can't afford a pro tog to do his wedding. I have been asked to do it, but I have rejected the chance because I feel my lack of experience and skill would end with bad results.Of course, if I felt I could do a job for him I would do it and do it cheaper than a PRO.

However, if I was on the otherside of the fence I could feel hostility to people like me offering to do it cheaper as I understand why it could devalue that particular trade - especially of whom can produce far better results in their sleep compared to myself.

However, we all have to start somewhere. Some traditional methods like though education and some though the hobby that they've got into.

Photography's business model will evolve as the years go by. DSLR's are allowing so many more people to get into this hobby and then maybe try and do it job wise or to get bit extra money. This trend will continue unless camera price and lenses rise by a few hundred at least. If DSLR's didn't exist then I would not get into photography. I respect what can be achieved with film, but using that just makes me want to shoot myself multiple times in the head. Even having forums like this are allowing people who are clueless at first to find it easier to get into photography.

My personal view is that I am doing this as a hobby and I love it - I love the challenge and I love the adventures you can have whilst looking for the right spot in a landscape area. If I can get somewhere with it then I will, and it's up to myself to produce good photography and to have a good business model. I think a lot of togs are going to have to think outside the box in the years to come with regards to their business model and the creativity of their photos.
 
What the pros are mostly worried about is the damage that an inexperienced amateur can do if they mess up sombodies special day.

I reckon 99.9% of pros wouldn't give a hoot about a wedding being ruined by an "amateur", and many of them if they knew would probably say the obvious.

I've seen some very ordinary pro wedding shoots, one of which was my nephews wedding pics, he paid what I thought was a small fortune and the results were no better than what a decent "amateur" could have done. I know wedding photography is sometimes not easy depending on the conditions, but the blown highlights in a lot of his pics was a disgrace IMHO.
 
There is no recognised qualification. It's an unregulated industry.

Plenty of membership bodies who'll take money off you and let you use their letters mind ;)
 
jpwild said:
it could devalue that particular tradeQUOTE]


It only becomes devalued when too many businesses start trading against each other and creating fierce price wars. Take the double glazing industry for example, that ruined itself. To put it into context, how many of the people posting here asking for help are seriously going to become any real competition?
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I would suggest you find a reputable pro who's willing to show you the ropes, preferably for free or offer to do all his fetching and carrying in return for on the job advice. Might be difficult finding someone though, as they may see you as competition no matter what some say.
 
Sigh.

I'm not threatened by anyone here in terms of competition.

Take AliB's approach as the template. Considered, professional and wanted to learn. Asked sensible questions, put in the time and did the hard yards. Now look where she is.

Contrast that with the endless 'Just booked my first wedding. What lens do I need? Should I use flash'.

Do it for free with both parties knowing the score and you can easily build a portfolio to the point where you start charging and covering your costs. No issue. Come in without being willing to do any research yourself and expect it handed to you on a plate, and take money from people with no experience at all, well if it goes tits-up that's entirely of your own making. Personally I don't know why anyone would expect to be treated with kid gloves in that example.
 
Davyboy said:
I reckon 99.9% of pros wouldn't give a hoot about a wedding being ruined by an "amateur", and many of them if they knew would probably say the obvious.
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I have to agree with that. But my opinion is that £200 professional photographers are a blessing. Who has £1500 to spend on a few photos that you probably only look at again in 20 years and think to yourself "why the hell did I marry him/her". Weddings cost about £15000 these days. Madness. Some members of the public want a few fairly decent shots. The chelsea lot will always be looking for something special. I am probably going to get cursed but most pro wedding photography is so dull. And what do wedding photographers do for the other 6 days?

Sorry, but wedding photographers annoy me.
 
Too many people owning a dslr, being made redundant, and having had some facebook comments on their photos that contain the word 'gawjus', spending said redundancy package on a couple of 5d2s or D700s, and a couple of workshops (each taught by people who have only been shooting for a couple of years...WTF) where they take photos of models who they can pose all day, and then BAM, passing off those photos from 'portfolio builder days' and the two weddings that they shot for their sister's hairdresser's 4th and 5th marriages as a portfolio, they are suddenly a 'professional wedding photographer'.

They have the equipment, yes, but in terms of the service, the attitude and the photos, they are by no means a professional...


Happily, certainly if this forum is anything to judge on, noone is actually interested in commercial photography, they'd rather deal with dribbling babies and bitchy brides than PR agencies and marketing departments, so my career is safe... :cool:
 
dance621 said:
I have to agree with that. But my opinion is that £200 professional photographers are a blessing. Who has £1500 to spend on a few photos that you probably only look at again in 20 years and think to yourself "why the hell did I marry him/her". Weddings cost about £15000 these days. Madness. Some members of the public want a few fairly decent shots. The chelsea lot will always be looking for something special. I am probably going to get cursed but most pro wedding photography is so dull. And what do wedding photographers do for the other 6 days?

Sorry, but wedding photographers annoy me.
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Ha! Way to introduce yourself to the forum! :eek:
 
dance621 said:
I have to agree with that. But my opinion is that £200 professional photographers are a blessing. Who has £1500 to spend on a few photos that you probably only look at again in 20 years and think to yourself "why the hell did I marry him/her". Weddings cost about £15000 these days. Madness. Some members of the public want a few fairly decent shots. The chelsea lot will always be looking for something special. I am probably going to get cursed but most pro wedding photography is so dull. And what do wedding photographers do for the other 6 days?

Sorry, but wedding photographers annoy me.
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thats OK, small minded bitter people who carry their prejudices in such a way as to balance the chip on their shoulders annoy me (y)
 
dance621 said:
I have to agree with that. But my opinion is that £200 professional photographers are a blessing. Who has £1500 to spend on a few photos that you probably only look at again in 20 years and think to yourself "why the hell did I marry him/her". Weddings cost about £15000 these days. Madness. Some members of the public want a few fairly decent shots. The chelsea lot will always be looking for something special. I am probably going to get cursed but most pro wedding photography is so dull. And what do wedding photographers do for the other 6 days?

Sorry, but wedding photographers annoy me.
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:LOL:

Yes, I only work the one day a week, the rest of time I either punch kittens or murder nuns.
 
boyfalldown said:
thats OK, small minded bitter people who carry their prejudices in such a way as to balance the chip on their shoulders annoy me (y)
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Thanks. Like your anemonefish pic by the way. I have a phd in the sustainable exploitation of amphiprion ocellaris (the false clown anemonefish). A couple similar but yours looks like amphiprion clarkii. Probably taken in the far east. Wide range. Mainly vegetarian, but can be opportunistic. Can be found in a number of anemones. In my experience usually heteractis magnifica or even stichodactyla mertensii. I find them one of the more aggressive of the anemonefishes (plural of fish is fishes if referring to different species).

There is a guy in the fish market in Padang Sumatra who sells them. Most are exported for aquarium trade. Each fish costs just under a pound. So you could buy 1500 for the same price as a pro wedding photographer.
 
Thank you -I have to admit to not knowing the Latin name but its a red sea clownfish taken off the brothers islands

They are fascinating fish in all the sub species but such a waste to see them in the markets

Interesting phd btw
 
Radiohead said:
Yes, I only work the one day a week, the rest of time I either punch kittens or murder nuns.
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I hate nuns.. horrible little things.. evil the lot of em... keep up the good work :) But lay off the kittens eh?
 
attractive but very aggressive and like many red sea species endemic to that relatively small area
 
swanseamale47 said:
If an amateur messes up a wedding (and yes it does happen) you have to remember the local press will say "Cardiff photographer ruins wedding" or similar, that tends to reflect on all the photographers in the area not only the offending tog.
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swanseamale47 said:
But at least the guy who removed it had received training and was qualified, it wasn't done by a bloke who bought a scalpel for Christmas and thought he'd have a go.
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Can see the local headline: "Swansea doctor gets the sac!";):LOL:
 
swanseamale47 said:
It's nothing to do with competition. What the pros are mostly worried about is the damage that an inexperienced amateur can do if they mess up sombodies special day.
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I dont get this thought.

there are plenty of professions in the world where people do the job on thecheap, and do it poorly. why is it only photographers that think this will happen?

amatuer mechanics fix cars all over the uk, do th ones that screw it up give the pros a bad name?
 
KIPAX said:
I hate nuns.. horrible little things.. evil the lot of em... keep up the good work :) But lay off the kittens eh?
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boyfalldown said:
attractive but very aggressive and like many red sea species endemic to that relatively small area
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POAH said:
I see your PhD is doing wonders for you :LOL:
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RJL2005 said:
Can see the local headline: "Swansea doctor gets the sac!";):LOL:
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Okay, I'm totally lost now! or has everyone been taken over by Aliens? :D what was the question again ..... :thinking:
 
There seems to be quite a few elitists on this forum, why all the negative remarks towards photographers who intend to start in the wedding game? I know there will be some who have the gear but haven't a clue what an f stop is, but there will also be some very adequate people out there who would do a good job with a little practice in whatever direction they choose to go in, whether it be weddings, commercial, sport etc etc. The one thing that I reckon would be very important is having the self belief in your own ability, if you can't trust yourself then you might as well forget it, until you can.
 
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