Step Up In Quality Advice Please

paulcamcas

paulcamcas

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Paul
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I currently do what I do with a single Elinchrom One strobe but excellent little unit that it is, it isn't up to what I'm putting it through. Yesterday it was 1,800 cycles at about ⅓ power in about 3 hours and although colour temp was very consistent, output just wasn't. I'm thinking about upgrading to an Elinchrom Pro HD 500 or Broncolour Siros 400 or Profoto D1 250. Elinchrom would allow me to stick with the current trigger but I do like the way Profoto modifiers attach and suspect that the quality is better.

Does anyone have any thoughts on these or alternatives? I'm happy to spend less money as long as I'm still going to get build quality and output consistency.

Any advice is much appreciated.
 
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•


I've been a Profoto user for years now
and I can only recommend… plus it has
the retrofit concept.

If you can, try to go for the D1 1000… I got
three of them and they are indestructible.
 
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My experience is with elinchrom for 1000 - 2000 shots from 9-5. I've had similar issues with BXri heads but the RX heads have been flawless over the years. Unfortunately, they don't disclose in the stats the suitable workloads heads are for. I spoke with elinchroms UK distributer - the flash centre - and they advised which heads would be suitable for my workload. Probably worthwhile giving them a call to find out which model - if any - would be suitable or if profoto would be better. I'd look for an official profoto distributer and check which models would be suitable for your needs also - just to be on the safe side.
 
Those are all very capable units, but I can't comment on durability.

I'd be very happy with any of them though the one with the most complete spec, in terms of power, range, colour consistency and fast durations at high power levels is the Elinchrom Pro HD, 1000Ws for preference. They do go off with a notably louder pop though, might be a concern.
 
Thank you Kodiak Qc, Deadlock and Richard. I spotted a refurb Elinchrom Pro HD 1000 on Wex for a very good price (less than half that of a Profoto D1 1000) so I'm going to give it a try. As Richard says the spec is very attractive and not having to buy a new trigger is a bonus. The louder pop may be annoying but I'm hoping that at the very low power setting I'll mostly be using it won't be too bad.
 
paulcamcas said:
Thank you Kodiak Qc, Deadlock and Richard. I spotted a refurb Elinchrom Pro HD 1000 on Wex for a very good price (less than half that of a Profoto D1 1000) so I'm going to give it a try. As Richard says the spec is very attractive and not having to buy a new trigger is a bonus. The louder pop may be annoying but I'm hoping that at the very low power setting I'll mostly be using it won't be too bad.
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(y) Be interested to know how you get on :) You may notice it's a little heavier than you're used to!

Also, the Pro HD heads have multiple capacitors, which is how they maintain high consistency throughout the power range, and fast durations at certain settings. At your stated output though, I'm guessing the larger capacitors won't ever get charged at all so it might be an idea to give them a few full power blasts every now and then to keep them conditioned.
 
Good luck with it Paul.
Please let me know how you get on with it over the coming months as I have been debating on whether or not to buy these heads myself for the same reasons/issues.

Richard, why do you feel the Pro HD 1000 over the 500 would be beneficial when 500W would be sufficient?
 
HoppyUK said:
(y) Be interested to know how you get on :) You may notice it's a little heavier than you're used to!

Also, the Pro HD heads have multiple capacitors, which is how they maintain high consistency throughout the power range, and fast durations at certain settings. At your stated output though, I'm guessing the larger capacitors won't ever get charged at all so it might be an idea to give them a few full power blasts every now and then to keep them conditioned.
Click to expand...

Will let you know how it performs. I certainly wouldn't have known about the multi capacitors or the need to keep them conditioned so thanks for the heads up.
 
Deadlock said:
Good luck with it Paul.
Please let me know how you get on with it over the coming months as I have been debating on whether or not to buy these heads myself for the same reasons/issues.

Richard, why do you feel the Pro HD 1000 over the 500 would be beneficial when 500W would be sufficient?
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I'm really suggesting the HD Pro as it's on the OP's list and looking at total performance it obviously has twice the power of the 500 version, but with no penalty at low outputs, ie no colour shift, or inconsistent brightness that sometimes happens at low outputs with powerful heads. That's why I'd get one, even though I'd rarely need 1000Ws.

But given the OP's stated application, it's certainly overkill. Assuming he could get reassurance on the consistency and durability front with very heavy use (I always check for that, and never had a problem with Elinchroms, but I don't do 1500 flashes on the trot) then the BRX250 is the obvious choice from Elinchrom, and a very nice unit it is too. Get two for belt and braces on the reliability front, though that won't help with flash-to-flash consistency. When you open that book though, there's lots of choice from a variety of brands. I'd still go for the BRX250, because it's a good and affordable unit with slightly faster flash durations than average at that power, but there are a lot of options at less money. Lencarta for example, or at the other end of the cost scale, Profoto is always tempting :)

Just thinking about this again, for a lower powered head that is guaranteed to deliver every time, Profoto D1 250 is probably the safest bet. They're not the most popular rental choice for nothing. Great spec, high quality build, excellent performance.
 
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All makes sense to me Richard. I only went for the The Pro HD1000 as it was the one reduced on Wex. At £110 less than the 500 it made sense even though I don't need 1000w. BUT... I've been worrying ever since that I should have gone for the Profoto. It'll be £1,023 for the head and trigger vs £620 for the Elinchrom. That's a big difference but I think I'm going to call Wex and change the order.
 
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Okay, switched the order to the Profoto D1 250. It would have been nice to try the fancy stuff on the Elinchrom but I don't actually need any of it. I'll let you know how the Profoto works out.
 
paulcamcas said:
Okay, switched the order to the Profoto D1 250. It would have been nice to try the fancy stuff on the Elinchrom but I don't actually need any of it. I'll let you know how the Profoto works out.
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Don't do that!

Only joking :) Profoto's Air remote control system is really nice, too (y)
 
I just went for the simplest remote - just a trigger. I'm never far from the head so don't need the fancy remote.
 
paulcamcas said:
I just went for the simplest remote - just a trigger. I'm never far from the head so don't need the fancy remote.
Click to expand...

If it does what you need, and it clearly does, then simple is good.
 
Richard, I don't know about the BRX heads but the BXRi heads fall into the same category and they cannot flawlessly cope with 1000-2000 shot days like the old RX units can. Thats why I've been looking at todays RX equivalent in the HD Pro line.

Paul, if it were me, I probably would have gone from the elinchrom as I'm already fairly heavily invested in them. And at that price... even if it wasn't for you you probably could have sold it on again without losing much, likely far less than the cost of a hire, and gone for the profoto then.

It will be good to hear how you get on over the coming year or so, in terms of reliability and servicing of the profoto unit.
 
On strike against the Elinchrom for me is that I had to return one of the RX Ones for repair and after three weeks it came back with exactly the same fault. TFC were stand up and just swapped it for a new one but it did niggle a bit.
 
paulcamcas said:
On strike against the Elinchrom for me is that I had to return one of the RX Ones for repair and after three weeks it came back with exactly the same fault. TFC were stand up and just swapped it for a new one but it did niggle a bit.
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I'm not defending TFC but it's worth remembering due to the nature of the product and the way repair shops work it's almost unavoidable that they're going to let you down at some point but on the bright side every company I've dealt with has gone above and beyond (even if it takes them a few tries).
 
simonbarker said:
I'm not defending TFC but it's worth remembering due to the nature of the product and the way repair shops work it's almost unavoidable that they're going to let you down at some point but on the bright side every company I've dealt with has gone above and beyond (even if it takes them a few tries).
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TFC were excellent throughout, it was whoever the unit went to for repair that messed up.
 
Call me Mr Decisive! I've now got the Profoto and Elinchrom heads on the way. I'm going to try the Elinchrom first - if it does the job for me, I'll stick with it and return the Profoto unused. If not I'll sell it on and try the Profoto.
 
Both heads have arrived but the Profoto is unopened as yet while I try the Elinchrom. It's early days but the HD Pro is looking good to me. After a few hundred frames I've seen perfect output and white balance consistency. Recycle time is amazing - at my sort of output, I can't press the shutter fast enough to beat it. On continuous low (about three frames per second) the HD Pro is easily keeping up. I'll be putting it to work on Saturday and I'm hoping it passes the test so the Profoto can go back without even coming out of the box.
 
paulcamcas said:
Both heads have arrived but the Profoto is unopened as yet while I try the Elinchrom. It's early days but the HD Pro is looking good to me. After a few hundred frames I've seen perfect output and white balance consistency. Recycle time is amazing - at my sort of output, I can't press the shutter fast enough to beat it. On continuous low (about three frames per second) the HD Pro is easily keeping up. I'll be putting it to work on Saturday and I'm hoping it passes the test so the Profoto can go back without even coming out of the box.
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(y)

Is the Profoto box actually sealed...?:D
 
paulcamcas said:
Both heads have arrived but the Profoto is unopened as yet while I try the Elinchrom. It's early days but the HD Pro is looking good to me. After a few hundred frames I've seen perfect output and white balance consistency. Recycle time is amazing - at my sort of output, I can't press the shutter fast enough to beat it. On continuous low (about three frames per second) the HD Pro is easily keeping up. I'll be putting it to work on Saturday and I'm hoping it passes the test so the Profoto can go back without even coming out of the box.
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I'm not in the least surprised, Elinchrom pro heads are excellent and I'm always at a loss to understand why some people compare them unfavourably to Profoto. And, many years ago before I got involved with Lencarta, I used the Elinchrom Chic 1200 power packs, plus some older models, and all of those were excellent too.
 
Good to know Gary. Out of interest, is there a Lencarta equivalent to the ELC HD Pro 1000?
 
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paulcamcas said:
Good to know Gary. Out of interest, is there are Lencarta equivalent to the ELC HD Pro 1000?
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The ELC HD Pro 1000 is unique in terms of power, consistency of colour over a wide range of outputs, and fast flash durations for a voltage-regulated head. It's basically a multi-capacitor floor-standing pack and head in a monolight design.

What do you think of the flash sound at full power? Okay?
 
paulcamcas said:
It is a real "pop" and could get annoying if I ever have to llluminate Shopshire :)
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Reminds me of Crocodile Dundee...
That's not a pop, my old 6000 pack had a real pop:)
I used to use the 6000, together with up to 6 of their 2400's, when shooting in factories
 
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1,800 flashes today. Zero variation in output or colour balance. No failures to fire. Using at about 1/5 power so the pop was quiet and recycle instant. Lovely not to worry about shooting too fast. Very pleased indeed. The ELC HD Pro is definitely a keeper. Wex are picking up the Profoto on Monday :)
 
Garry Edwards said:
I'm not in the least surprised, Elinchrom pro heads are excellent and I'm always at a loss to understand why some people compare them unfavourably to Profoto. And, many years ago before I got involved with Lencarta, I used the Elinchrom Chic 1200 power packs, plus some older models, and all of those were excellent too.
Click to expand...

It's because they are/were hideously out of date, the Style monoblocks only recently got replaced by the ELC's so it wasn't that long ago you were paying a lot extra just to get radio control added (and so forth) but their pack and head systems in the studio appear to have been abandoned at a business level. I can understand why they've made some of these decisions but it was a pretty good incentive not to touch them if you had the choice.

Things are definitely improving with their new products but go back about one to two years ago or so and besides cost I'm not seeing many reasons to choose Elinchrom over Profoto if we're talking about monoblocks/pack and head systems in a studio environment.
 
Just a quick update - after 20k shots or so, the ELC PRO 1000 has been impeccable. Very consistent colour, no dark frames. Definitely a cracking bit of kit - I'm more than a bit pleased with the purchase.
 
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