Talk to me about workflow & file management please!

DuncTheGeek

DuncTheGeek

Messages
43
Name
Duncan
Edit My Images
Yes
Hey all

Just looking for some opinions & guidance before I paint myself into a corner & cause extra work for myself...

I've got LR although only tickled around the edges so far but looking to spend a bit more time on togging so better to get things in order now. (I will be spending time going through some LR tutorials too and it may well be the answer is in there - but I'm always a fan of asking real people just how they're doing things!)

I'm an old school DOS Dinosaur so my inclination is to always manually shuffle files around in separate folders for each event/trip/shoot whatever it may be. But I'm thinking I may be a bit out of date thanks to LR's cataloguing abilities and there may well be a better way or doing stuff. (Space & backup isn't an issue, I'm all over that side of things from my day job).

So can anyone give a walkthrough of how they treat files from arriving home with a memory card through to printing please? Do you dump them in a temporary folder? Throw them into a year/month folder or all into the huge LR bucket and rely on tagging to sort them from within LR? File them somewhere else after LR?

Thanks folks!
 
DuncTheGeek said:
Hey all

Just looking for some opinions & guidance before I paint myself into a corner & cause extra work for myself...

I've got LR although only tickled around the edges so far but looking to spend a bit more time on togging so better to get things in order now. (I will be spending time going through some LR tutorials too and it may well be the answer is in there - but I'm always a fan of asking real people just how they're doing things!)

I'm an old school DOS Dinosaur so my inclination is to always manually shuffle files around in separate folders for each event/trip/shoot whatever it may be. But I'm thinking I may be a bit out of date thanks to LR's cataloguing abilities and there may well be a better way or doing stuff. (Space & backup isn't an issue, I'm all over that side of things from my day job).

So can anyone give a walkthrough of how they treat files from arriving home with a memory card through to printing please? Do you dump them in a temporary folder? Throw them into a year/month folder or all into the huge LR bucket and rely on tagging to sort them from within LR? File them somewhere else after LR?

Thanks folks!
Click to expand...
The way I do it is like this:

I import into Lightroom by shooting date (which I believe is the default setting for Lr) so anything which was shot today would go into a folder with todays date. I do not rename anything.
I then keyword all the images. Generic keywords can be added to all of the images at the import stage, other keywords can be added to groups of images after they have been imported.
Once the images have been imported I will then review them. Rejects are flagged with an X, and images that I like are flagged with a P. Once reviewed I will select all the rejected images and delete them from the hard drive. I will then process all of the P flagged images.

I also use “Smart Collections” so that any image that meets the Smart Collection criteria is automatically added to that collection. The same image can be included in several different Smart Collections.
 
LR user here.

DO download files from the card or camera to your computer, manually placing them into folders that you assign meaningful, traceable names. Then import into LR etc, keywording.

DON'T manually move images once imported into lightroom, but instead use lightroom to move images so that it can keep a track of where they are stored.

DO check the files have imported OK.

DON'T manually delete the files from the memory card (because this can cause corruption) and instead format the card in camera each time ONLY after you know the files are on the computer and OK.


I put image files into folders by date, sometimes also assigning a name to the folder(s) (like Canada 2022, Helen portrait etc) where that may be helpful. LR reats the images like they are in a bucket as you say, but if you ever neem to manually extract then having a semi-rational filing system is essential.
 
Another LR user here. I use LR to do the import into folders by date, which is exactly the same as doing that manually except it allows you to easily deselect the rubbish rather than having to delete them later. I then keyword (tag) them and sometimes add them to relevant collections if they are for specific projects.
 
sirch said:
Another LR user here. I use LR to do the import into folders by date, which is exactly the same as doing that manually except it allows you to easily deselect the rubbish rather than having to delete them later. I then keyword (tag) them and sometimes add them to relevant collections if they are for specific projects.
Click to expand...
Ditto, except I am way behind with keywording.

There are various ways to keyword. I suggest you research to find out what suits you before you start. Changing later is not easy.
 
sirch said:
allows you to easily deselect the rubbish rather than having to delete them later.
Click to expand...

FWIW I go through and bin the blurred etc pictures after import, deleting them from disc at that stage - there has to be a time when you screen the images, and it makes no difference where in the workflow that is, pre or post import. However I keep images that I'm not 'sure' about because sometimes they can actually be the ones I prefer later.
 
I import from the SD card to Lightroom, copying the files into YYYY/YYYY/MM/DD folders. Lightroom also simultaneously applies my standard processing and metadata and puts a copy of all files to my NAS.

I rarely use the folder structure when it comes to finding files, but it doesn't hurt to use it, as it is all automatic.
 
The secret to finding images at a later time is key words. The more the merrier. Light room makes that very easy.
How the files are named is unimportant. Where the image files are stored is very important. To move them later breaks their links. However for security, back ups should be kept elsewhere, and preferably in more than one place.

Lightroom makes filing and finding very easy. How you back up is less important than being Sure to do it.
I back up a copy of the entire file once a month. And retain three months of back ups.
 
I use LR and import backing up at the same time. Then go through the images and mark for delete those not needed. At sports I am probably shooting ten frames a second so get many unwanted shots so just keep the wanted. Other obvious errors such as poor focussing or part of subject out the frame are also deleted. For the remaining images, I apply a score using the stars. 5** could be a competition success (I have only a few of these) 4** are potential competition entries and 3* not good enough for a competition but I wish to keep for now. I do not bother to mark lower than this as they would all be deleted anyway. All of these images are colour coded Blue (unprocessed Raw files). I then apply Keywords but the images are automatically stored by date. There is no need to place in subject or location folders as I can easily find images by keywords. When images have been processed the Raw file is changed to Red and completed edited files (usually TIFF are set to Green). Typically for a set subject competition, I might need a girl wearing red captured within the last 2 years. Very easy to set a search criteria in LR and search Keyword (People, Red), Date (to match), colour code(Green) score 4* or higher. This is searched against all of my 30,000 plus final images and takes less that 1/4 second to display all matches.

Dave
 
Dave Canon said:
I use LR and import backing up at the same time. Then go through the images and mark for delete those not needed. At sports I am probably shooting ten frames a second so get many unwanted shots so just keep the wanted. Other obvious errors such as poor focussing or part of subject out the frame are also deleted. For the remaining images, I apply a score using the stars. 5** could be a competition success (I have only a few of these) 4** are potential competition entries and 3* not good enough for a competition but I wish to keep for now. I do not bother to mark lower than this as they would all be deleted anyway. All of these images are colour coded Blue (unprocessed Raw files). I then apply Keywords but the images are automatically stored by date. There is no need to place in subject or location folders as I can easily find images by keywords. When images have been processed the Raw file is changed to Red and completed edited files (usually TIFF are set to Green). Typically for a set subject competition, I might need a girl wearing red captured within the last 2 years. Very easy to set a search criteria in LR and search Keyword (People, Red), Date (to match), colour code(Green) score 4* or higher. This is searched against all of my 30,000 plus final images and takes less that 1/4 second to display all matches.

Dave
Click to expand...

That is an interesting set of criteria.
However I have never thought of grading images in terms of competitive value. Nor would I ever delete them on that account.
I do like your idea of distinguishing them by colour as to file type. However I keep very few raw files but save processed files almost always as Tiff's.
 
Terrywoodenpic said:
That is an interesting set of criteria.
However I have never thought of grading images in terms of competitive value. Nor would I ever delete them on that account.
I do like your idea of distinguishing them by colour as to file type. However I keep very few raw files but save processed files almost always as Tiff's.
Click to expand...
Being in a club entering competitions, club, national and international has been a major drive for my photography. However, I still capture images to please myself and have been slowing down in competition entries in recent years but still find it useful to rate my images as I will normally always process 4* and above but not bother to process 3*. In recent times COVID has resulted in far less photography shoots so I have gone back over a few of my 3* images and found a few that would work particularly when processed with new software. When I initially upload the images to LR I automatically copy the Raw files to a temporary area on my NAS and keep them for 3 to 6 months so if I delete a Raw file and change my mind I do have an opportunity to recover. All of my 3* and above Raw files I keep for ever on my NAS which is no problem and I also keep all of my processed files also mainly TIFF. If I need a JPEG version for the web or projection, I create as needed using LR export and only store temporarily. There is little point in my storing JPEG files as different sizes are needed for different purposes. Many of those images which I delete are not just about competitive value but images which have no value by any criteria for me.

Dave
 
Dave Canon said:
Being in a club entering competitions, club, national and international has been a major drive for my photography. However, I still capture images to please myself and have been slowing down in competition entries in recent years but still find it useful to rate my images as I will normally always process 4* and above but not bother to process 3*. In recent times COVID has resulted in far less photography shoots so I have gone back over a few of my 3* images and found a few that would work particularly when processed with new software. When I initially upload the images to LR I automatically copy the Raw files to a temporary area on my NAS and keep them for 3 to 6 months so if I delete a Raw file and change my mind I do have an opportunity to recover. All of my 3* and above Raw files I keep for ever on my NAS which is no problem and I also keep all of my processed files also mainly TIFF. If I need a JPEG version for the web or projection, I create as needed using LR export and only store temporarily. There is little point in my storing JPEG files as different sizes are needed for different purposes. Many of those images which I delete are not just about competitive value but images which have no value by any criteria for me.

Dave
Click to expand...

Photography has always been too important to me to consider it a competitive pastime. I suppose as a long time professional I was in competition with others in one sense at least. But the concept of being able to give a score to them passes me by completely. An image might have exceptional value for one purpose and none at all for another. Value almost always relates to purpose, it is very rarely intrinsic.
A photograph can be technically diabolical, but be the only record of something of the utmost importance. The significance of such an image is rarely known at the time, it may be many years before its importance is recognised. The time to make such decisions is rarely "Now".

However it seems that Competition images rarely have significant long term value. and only extremely rarely survive the life or interest of the author.
Very much the same fate awaits the vast majority of Professional images, The few, of both groups that do have a second life are usually family related, or are of significant local or national events.
 
Terrywoodenpic said:
But the concept of being able to give a score to them passes me by completely. An image might have exceptional value for one purpose and none at all for another.
Click to expand...
I did not say I was giving the image a score but merely a decision a. to keep the image 3* b. to Process it 4* and to identify the few images which I think stand out 5*. Are you saying that you cannot understand that concept. I will be going to Castle Coombe (motor racing) on Monday and will probably return with 500 or so frames. Given the nature of racing a burst of ten frames are likely to produce many similar shots so why bother to process them all. With motor cycling I was looking to catch frames with spacing (i.e. bikes not overlapping each other) these situations are only momentary. It is possible to catch them with a single shot as I had to do in years past but, it is easier to take advantage of the technology. While I do not want crashes to occur, they are inevitable. Unless one catches the sequence, you cannot be sure to get the ideal frame. How do you decide which images to process or do you keep them all and process all of them?

Dave
 
Dave Canon said:
I did not say I was giving the image a score but merely a decision a. to keep the image 3* b. to Process it 4* and to identify the few images which I think stand out 5*. Are you saying that you cannot understand that concept. I will be going to Castle Coombe (motor racing) on Monday and will probably return with 500 or so frames. Given the nature of racing a burst of ten frames are likely to produce many similar shots so why bother to process them all. With motor cycling I was looking to catch frames with spacing (i.e. bikes not overlapping each other) these situations are only momentary. It is possible to catch them with a single shot as I had to do in years past but, it is easier to take advantage of the technology. While I do not want crashes to occur, they are inevitable. Unless one catches the sequence, you cannot be sure to get the ideal frame. How do you decide which images to process or do you keep them all and process all of them?

Dave
Click to expand...

The absolute no hopers I eliminate at once. The rest I process to Tiff's. (Shots in the same burst get the same processing.)
From those, I select as many as necessary and give them final adjustments in Photoshop (except for sharpening)

Final sharpening is done prior to export. At each stage some images may be dumped as inferior to others, but not necessarily. I have no problem with keeping two or more nearly identical images. I see no reason to make such a final choice before possible export.

Sometimes the choice is between two images one of which is technically better while the other is slightly more visually attractive.
I might choose one version for a large print but the other for online use, where technical shortcomings will be less likely to be critical, or noticed at all.
 
I use lightroom, too, and I wish I was as disciplined and consistent as some seem to be, I'm waaaay behind with processing stuff. I do just import into date folders, but I do something which helps me with my lack of application: I am set to automatically back the jpgs to Google Drive at full size. I then use Google photo albums, auto tagging and AI search, which makes it super easy to find stuff with minimal effort. Whenever I need to look for something, I find it in Google, note the date and go straight to it in LR. I then copy the entire folder structure locally onto a second drive.
 
I also use star ratings, but without the competition:
5* - portfolio worthy images
4* - images I really like
3* - not great images, but ones I want to keep
2* - need to go through Photoshop
1* - need to check before deleting

I also use colours to identify where images have been used:
Red - exclusive
Yellow - sold a print
Blue - shared online

I then combine the above with smart filters to highlight any images that aren't great or haven't been used in a year since they were taken, so they can be reviewed and removed from Lightroom.
 
This is really interestingh and helpful. I'm still trtying to get to a workflow and usage of LR that works well for me, so I like the way the use of colour coding has been described, as well as the point about saving as TIFFs and only using JPGs for certain exports. I do use the star ratings and kewords to good effect, though the best star ratings I've felt able to allocate my shots have been a few 3*s, never better than that yet. But I'm working on it.
 
I copy all the raw files onto an ext ssd, into whatever folder system I use on there so I know I always have them straight out of the camera.

then I import to LRCC deleting from LR the crap ones( which is the majority)taking a note of the file number to delete from the ext ssd later.

the rest I work on till im happy then export to my photos app on the iMac.

I then delete all the photos from lightroom as I don't use it for catologueing.

works for me so I thought I would post it.
 
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