Beginner Teach me about speedlights

GTG

GTG

Suspended / Banned
Messages
1,660
Edit My Images
Yes
Got fed up of endless buying and selling bodies, its foolish and got me nowhere.

I have a tripod and monopod already but what I never got into was using speedlights.

I bought a Chinese one years back but never used it.

Now I want to get into it so thought I would ask here so I don't make mistakes buying stuff I don't need.

I only want to buy one for a Nikon because the one I already own is a Canon so no point getting another Canon model.

So what are the good options, is it better to get a Nikon brand one or Chinese ?

Also any general advice about their use and benefits etc would be handy.

When to use them, how much extra light they give you, use outdoors / indoors etc.

I tried to read a guide but a little baffled to be honest
 
I found "strobist.blogspot.com" a really inspiring read, especially the lighting 101 series.
 
Hi, Two options (1) Godox (2) Yongnuo.
Not as well made as Canon/Nikon but for a starter (and Only my Opinion) Cannot be beaten.
HSS, TTL, Manual all available under one roof with them just make sure you get the all in model/s and not just manual although to learn about light or a camera come to that MANUAL is the way to go.
Lots of advice on Youtube videos on ALL models.
Russ
 
If you want to dramatically raise the standard of your photography, and get your toe in the door of a whole new level of creative picture making (as opposed to just picture 'taking') then 'light' is the answer. It's a huge subject, you'll always be learning, but it's endlessly rewarding too.

A speedlight or two is a great way to start. Suggest Godox, as they make very good guns that are also part of a big and fully compatible product range to grow into.

Try this book Speedliter's Handbook by Syl Arena. It's Canon-centric, but just change the model numbers and it applies to all brands https://www.amazon.co.uk/Speedliter...UTF8&qid=1499357060&sr=8-1&keywords=syl+arena Great book for learning and it covers everything you can do with flashguns, which is a huge amount :D

Then just get stuck in ;)
 
sk66 said:
I'd be inclined to go with the Godox/Neweer/etc V860 for the lithium battery packs... Soooo much nicer than dealing with AA's.
Click to expand...

Somewhat off topic - but I only use AAs and despite doing shoots of several hours I've rarely had to replace my batteries, and never needed a flash recycle time faster than they manage anyway as my portrait shoots are not machine-gunning with flash; so what exactly are the benefits of Lithium batteries, or is it really for machine-gunners who take many hundreds of flashed shots per shoot? :)

Ta for replied

Dave
 
Even if you never have to change batteries while shooting, and you couldn't benefit from faster recycle times there are other advantages IMO.
For me, a big one is maintenance compared to NiCd/NiMH. They don't suffer from the same memory effect and they don't self discharge nearly as much/quickly. And I find that keeping track of/managing two battery blocks a lot more simple than the 16+ AA batteries they replace. Even if one is at 1/2, and neither has been charged in 2 weeks, I'm still good to go...
 
I already have tons of rechargeable high capacity AA`s and several fast chargers.

I actually have some that are called "stay charged" that don't self discharge the same speed as standard AA`s
 
DG Phototraining said:
Somewhat off topic - but I only use AAs and despite doing shoots of several hours I've rarely had to replace my batteries, and never needed a flash recycle time faster than they manage anyway as my portrait shoots are not machine-gunning with flash; so what exactly are the benefits of Lithium batteries, or is it really for machine-gunners who take many hundreds of flashed shots per shoot? :)

Ta for replied

Dave
Click to expand...

For me, the main advantage of Godox's single lithium battery is charging convenience. I often use three or four guns for interiors or location portraits and that's 16 bluddy AAs to charge, even though they often only need a top-up. It's just a PITA

Faster recycle is another very welcome advantage with lithiums, especially using HSS mode when the gun is almost always pretty much flat out and taking a few seconds. You can fit AA-size lithiums in a lot of flashguns but they're not recommended - they can get unbelievably hot. Canon says don't.

GTG said:
I already have tons of rechargeable high capacity AA`s and several fast chargers.

I actually have some that are called "stay charged" that don't self discharge the same speed as standard AA`s
Click to expand...

They're the ones - Ni-MH rechargeable. Eneloop is the leading brand, really good (y) They recycle the flash pretty quick, right to the end, and last well. Disposable alkalines are useless. Ditto re-chargable NiCads, old tech now.
 
GTG said:
I already have tons of rechargeable high capacity AA`s and several fast chargers.

I actually have some that are called "stay charged" that don't self discharge the same speed as standard AA`s
Click to expand...
I've got at least 24 Eneloop Pro's for 3 speedlights... but if I were buying new I wouldn't choose an AA flash just because I have them. In fact, I'm contemplating selling all of my Nikon speedlights and getting a single Godox V860 (the speedlights have mostly been replaced by AD200's and aren't getting used).

I used to be of the opinion that if you were only buying one speedlight it should be a fully compatible/capable OEM model... but things have changed a lot in the last few years.

Edit: BTW "fast chargers" are not the best choice for batteries...
 
Last edited:
sk66 said:
I've got at least 24 Eneloop Pro's for 3 speedlights... but if I were buying new I wouldn't choose an AA flash just because I have them. In fact, I'm contemplating selling all of my Nikon speedlights and getting a single Godox V860 (the speedlights have mostly been replaced by AD200's and aren't getting used).

I used to be of the opinion that if you were only buying one speedlight it should be a fully compatible/capable OEM model... but things have changed a lot in the last few years.

Edit: BTW "fast chargers" are not the best choice for batteries...
Click to expand...

Are the Godox V860 very good ? I was looking at the Yongnuo 465ex I think for about £60 new from hong kong
 
The main advantage to the Godox (besides lithium battery packs) is that it's compatible with the entire range of Godox lighting/remotes, and for getting the light off camera. If you are only going to ever get 1 speedlight and only for use on-camera, then a Yongnuo probably makes more sense. But I would be hesitant to get the 465... I think the 568 is better specced/featured.

But, TBH I haven't used *any* off brand speedlights... all of mine are/have always been Nikons. But the lights I use the most any more are Godox.
 
Last edited:
GTG said:
Are the Godox V860 very good ? I was looking at the Yongnuo 465ex I think for about £60 new from hong kong
Click to expand...
565?

The Godox has many advantages. If I was starting tomorrow, I'd get a complete Godox system.
 
GTG said:
Are the Godox V860 very good ? I was looking at the Yongnuo 465ex I think for about £60 new from hong kong
Click to expand...
Yes the V860II is a great flash. I have the cheaper TT685 that is almost the same flash but with AA's. It has the same output but othervise only have the price s advantage. Another great thing is if you are with a group (at a model/portrait shoot) all having a godox or two from the last generation you all suddenly have a lot of lights at your disposal no matter if youre shooting nikon canon or sony.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
And the teaching part
Lesson 1. The hotshoe on your camera is for a trigger not the speedlight. ;)
 
Last edited by a moderator:
soeren said:
And the teaching part
Lesson 1. The hotshoe on your camera is for a trigger not the speedlight. ;)
Click to expand...

I know what you're saying, but the important thing is not where the flashgun is, but where the light is coming from.

Eg when bouncing, the flash is often on-camera because that's a good and very convenient position, but the light is coming from the walls/ceiling.
 
HoppyUK said:
I know what you're saying, but the important thing is not where the flashgun is, but where the light is coming from.

Eg when bouncing, the flash is often on-camera because that's a good and very convenient position, but the light is coming from the walls/ceiling.
Click to expand...
Yes that is absolutely correct and offcource there are situations where you cant do anything else than use direct on camera flash. But youll also often find yourself i places where bounce is not possible or practical + bounce can cost you a lot of power forcing higher iso etc so the better solution is ocf. :)
 
Last edited by a moderator:
soeren said:
Yes that is absolutely correct and offcource there are situations where you cant do anything else than use direct on camera flash. But youll also often find yourself i places where bounce is not possible or practical + bounce can cost you a lot of power forcing higher iso etc so the better solution is ocf. :)
Click to expand...
And if going with OCF, then there are "better" solutions than speedlights...
IMO, speedlights are primarily for "run and gun" work these days. Anymore, they're not really even a cheaper solution when you consider that it requires 3-4 to equal an AD200, or 6-8 to equal an AD360. And those are both much better suited to working with modifiers...
 
With "" being the important twist in "better". Yes you can go with more powerfull strobe type flash but e.g. the AD360 is a heavy, bulky thing that yells " hey dont leave me here naked" for a modifier adding even more weigthht. And there are tons of stuff you can do with speedlights so they are not always, not even close, bested by other options.
 
soeren said:
And there are tons of stuff you can do with speedlights so they are not always, not even close, bested by other options.
Click to expand...
We'll have to agree to disagree...
The only thing I see a speedlight being better for with OCF is to hide in places where other options would be too large... and w/ the AD200 introduction, that's not very often.
 
sk66 said:
We'll have to agree to disagree...
The only thing I see a speedlight being better for with OCF is to hide in places where other options would be too large... and w/ the AD200 introduction, that's not very often.
Click to expand...

The thing about speedlights is they're very small and light, fast and convenient, can be used on-camera or off-camera, with a zoom/tilt/rotate head. There are lots of situations where I find all those things very useful and I would not want to be without them.

Despite appearances, the AD200 is not a speedlight. And it's not a proper monolight strobe either - it's kind of like a monolight but with a few bits missing, such as a proper modifier mount and modelling lamp. In a way, it falls between two stools, but the AD200's great strength of course is that it can be used something like a speedlight, or you can add a few items and it becomes a fully fledged studio/location strobe. Which is all pretty amazing.

I've been using an AD200, AD360 and AD600 for the last few weeks. FWIW, if I was to change over to Godox (and it's tempting ;)) I'd be looking at a couple of their lithium speedlights, two AD200 units plus some accessories, and two AD600 heads. Maybe add a 1200Ws head to that :D Not saying that's the perfect outfit for everyone, but it'd suit me nicely (y)
 
Last edited:
A zoom head on the AD200 would be really nice. The 35mm fixed fresnell gives me kind of a meh feeling. I was wery keen on getting one when it was released, now im in doubts.
Edit. Btw, fresnell zoom heads for the AD360, Bowens mount? Cheap? :) Does such exist?
 
Last edited by a moderator:
HoppyUK said:
The thing about speedlights is they're very small and light, fast and convenient, can be used on-camera or off-camera, with a zoom/tilt/rotate head. There are lots of situations where I find all those things very useful and I would not want to be without them.

Despite appearances, the AD200 is not a speedlight. And it's not a proper monolight strobe either - it's kind of like a monolight but with a few bits missing, such as a proper modifier mount and modelling lamp. In a way, it falls between two stools, but the AD200's great strength of course is that it can be used something like a speedlight, or you can add a few items and it becomes a fully fledged studio/location strobe. Which is all pretty amazing.

I've been using an AD200, AD360 and AD600 for the last few weeks. FWIW, if I was to change over to Godox (and it's tempting ;)) I'd be looking at a couple of their lithium speedlights, two AD200 units plus some accessories, and two AD600 heads. Maybe add a 1200Ws head to that :D Not saying that's the perfect outfit for everyone, but it'd suit me nicely (y)
Click to expand...
Maybe I havnt been paying attention but what are you using now?
 
soeren said:
Maybe I havnt been paying attention but what are you using now?
Click to expand...

My lighting system has just evolved, like most I guess. I've always had a bunch of speedlights and a few studio heads - currently, mainly four Yongnuo 600RT guns and four Elinchrom D-Lites for studio. I can do most things with that, one way or another, but there's often a lot of faffing around ganging speedlights and synching different stuff. And I lack ultimate power outdoors.

Only a few years ago, speedlights and studio strobes were separate items, generally used separately and for different things. Now the technologies have merged, or more accurately, battery IGBT speedlight technology has just got a lot more powerful. As a result, flash has moved outdoors in a big way, it's affordable(ish), the creative potential is enormous and challenging, and I want to move with it. Most manufacturers have not grasped this change, and Godox is frankly the only brand to properly embrace it with a comprehensive solution. No doubt others will follow but Godox has also set the bar pretty high (y)

Studio work is easy on the equipment front - two or three heads, not much power, no remote control or HSS or auto-TTL etc needed or wanted. But outdoors, it's just the opposite and my current outfit doesn't really cut it.
 
To me the only thing a "speedlight" does is high speed sync.Otherwise it just does the same as a flash from 30yrs ago. Just a flash with HSS that's it. If you don't need HSS why even bother buying one ?
 
HoppyUK said:
The thing about speedlights is they're very small and light, fast and convenient, can be used on-camera or off-camera, with a zoom/tilt/rotate head.
Click to expand...
Mount an AD200 on a gorilla-pod type thing and it becomes really versatile in terms of how/where it can be positioned... the only thing missing is zoom.

soeren said:
The 35mm fixed fresnell gives me kind of a meh feeling.
Click to expand...
I agree, I would really like zooming but it's not really "a problem" compared to a speedlight... a DIY snoot gets the job done (or there's a barn door accessory).

HoppyUK said:
FWIW, if I was to change over to Godox (and it's tempting ;)) I'd be looking at a couple of their lithium speedlights, two AD200 units plus some accessories, and two AD600 heads. Maybe add a 1200Ws head to that :D Not saying that's the perfect outfit for everyone, but it'd suit me nicely
Click to expand...

I would be similar; one V860, two AD200s, one AD600... the AD360 seems kind of like an outlier now, but I'll be keeping it. I'll probably be unloading all of my Nikon speedlights and getting the V860, and I have the 2 AD200's. But I don't really see getting the AD600 as I just don't have the need for that kind of power/functionality w/o mains power and I already have larger heads... but you never know I might be overcome by a moment of weakness at some point.
 
shapeshifter said:
To me the only thing a "speedlight" does is high speed sync.Otherwise it just does the same as a flash from 30yrs ago. Just a flash with HSS that's it. If you don't need HSS why even bother buying one ?
Click to expand...
sk66 said:
Mount an AD200 on a gorilla-pod type thing and it becomes really versatile in terms of how/where it can be positioned... the only thing missing is zoom.


I agree, I would really like zooming but it's not really "a problem" compared to a speedlight... a DIY snoot gets the job done (or there's a barn door accessory).



I would be similar; one V860, two AD200s, one AD600... the AD360 seems kind of like an outlier now, but I'll be keeping it. I'll probably be unloading all of my Nikon speedlights and getting the V860, and I have the 2 AD200's. But I don't really see getting the AD600 as I just don't have the need for that kind of power/functionality w/o mains power and I already have larger heads... but you never know I might be overcome by a moment of weakness at some point.
Click to expand...

Good debate. I'm unmoved, but no argument. Horses for course and all that :)

I use speedlights on-camera (with off-camera light ;)). I use them for interiors dotted around all over the place. I have a run'n'gun flash bracket with two speedlights and a small softbox. For those things, AD200 either won't fit, or has too big a footprint on a mini-tripod, or is too heavy. So I'll be sticking with speedlights. And for outdoor flash, I absolutely need the power of an AD600 with HSS. Or two :)

I might forego auto-TTL on the AD600, simply on grounds of cost - the extra would go towards a second AD200 to double-up for almost as much power with auto-TTL. BTW, I don't understand the big price difference between the manual version AD600 and auto-TTL version - like £150. AFAIK the basic AD600 (with HSS) has 99% of the gubbins needed for auto-TTL already installed. It just needs a software tweak to fire the pre-flash and the trigger/camera does the rest?
 
Warning, warning. Imminent GAS attack allert :LOL:
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Well lets re-focus this thread.

One speed light only and nothing else.

Mounted on the camera.

When would you use that ? I read some even use it sunlight to get rid of harsh shadows under the eyes etc.

Indoors, diffusers.
 
GTG said:
Well lets re-focus this thread.

One speed light only and nothing else.

Mounted on the camera.

When would you use that ? I read some even use it sunlight to get rid of harsh shadows under the eyes etc.
Click to expand...

Yes, fill-in flash, usually with the sun behind the subject. One of the most popular and effective uses. Even the pop-up is good for that.

Indoors, diffusers.
Click to expand...

I also use on-camera flash for wall/ceiling bouncing, with or without the highlight panel, or with a Lumiquest QuikBounce, and also BFT - Black Foamie Thing, here http://neilvn.com/tangents/about/black-foamie-thing/
 
  • Like
Reactions: GTG
GTG said:
Well lets re-focus this thread.

One speed light only and nothing else.

Mounted on the camera.

When would you use that ? I read some even use it sunlight to get rid of harsh shadows under the eyes etc.

Indoors, diffusers.
Click to expand...
As Hoppy said, for direct fill or bounced... those are the strengths of speedlights for run-and-gun photography (it works equally well in other situations).
It can also be used as the primary light source, but there aren't a lot of situations where that looks particularly good IMO.
 
Last edited:
GTG said:
Well lets re-focus this thread.

One speed light only and nothing else.

Mounted on the camera.

When would you use that ? I read some even use it sunlight to get rid of harsh shadows under the eyes etc.

Indoors, diffusers.
Click to expand...
Exactly why I gave the answer I did. I understood your question. As I said they do nothing more than HSS over a flash from 30 yrs ago.
 
  • Like
Reactions: GTG
shapeshifter said:
Exactly why I gave the answer I did. I understood your question. As I said they do nothing more than HSS over a flash from 30 yrs ago.
Click to expand...

Modern speedlights are more powerful (mostly), recycle much faster, do HSS, auto-TTL metering, they can deliver incredibly short flash durations and strobe very rapidly, they bounce and zoom and swivel and tilt, they can control multiple remote flash units by reliable radio, they're cheap as chips - and they also flash! But apart from that, you're right, they do nothing new. Long live the Vivitar 283.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top