The Amazing Sony A1/A7/A9/APS-C & Anything else welcome Mega Thread!

nandbytes said:
Fully silent shutter has banding issues along with issues of rolling shutter. Not to mention I think you only get 12-bit RAWs.

A9/ii are pretty much the only bodies where permanently using silent shutter is viable.

For the most part it's fine.
Can slightly ruin your bokeh at around 1/4000s and also may cause some rolling shutter type issues again around 1/4000s.
Have a read of this

What’s the fastest shutter speed you should use with EFCS on the a7RII? - the last word

Yesterday I looked at shutter travel time for silent shutter operation on the Sony a7RII. Incidentally, we noted that the electronic first curtain shutter (EFCS) pretty faithfully emulated the acceleration of the mechanical second curtain, at least at 1/500 second. On the Nikon D810, EFCS stops...
blog.kasson.com blog.kasson.com

Though the testing with A7Rii I think A7C has a higher clearance speed than the A7RII body. Si you are probably fine till 1/2000s.
Click to expand...

I've seen banding with my Panasonic cameras but the latest ones seem to have an anti flicker function and banding now seems to be banished... or at least I haven't seen it for a long time. I see from the pdf that the A7c has an anti flicker function, doesn't that help with electronic shutter banding?

I can't say I've seen electronic shutter bokeh effects either.

Having to manually switch between mechanical and electronic for wide aperture shots in good light is yet another right royal pita. I hoped we'd left that behind at least in ff but apparently not. 1/4k would limit me to f2.8 or smaller unless I want to go back to juggling ND's, and I don't.
 
Just a quick 'snap' of my local church with my (just arrived) Tamron 28-75mm f2.8 DI lll RXD
Looks plenty sharp on the home computer.

a7iii, Tammy 28-75mm, 1/200th @ f5.6, ISO 100




St. Peter's Church.jpg
 
woof woof said:
Is there any drawback to using the electronic shutter all the time?

PS.
If anyone has any examples of pictures affected by efcs I'd like to see them. I have mine on just about all the time and I'm yet to see something and think "Ah Ha! EFCS has spoiled that."
Click to expand...

I remember seeing side by side images noticing the differences in the 'bokeh' between the different shutter types but I've never looked at any of my images and thought anything was amiss or wrong or looked odd to be honest.
 
Malfis said:
Just a quick 'snap' of my local church with my (just arrived) Tamron 28-75mm f2.8 DI lll RXD
Looks plenty sharp on the home computer.

a7iii, Tammy 28-75mm, 1/200th @ f5.6, ISO 100




View attachment 298079
Click to expand...
Stop posting images from the 28-75 please, making my decision for a general zoom so difficult.
I want the size and weight of the Tamron, with the specs of the Sigma. Why couldn't sigma use more plastic.
 
Went out to a couple of local places today and yesterday within a couple of miles of home. Just trying out tracking and burst rates on my Sony 70-350mm.. I need some practise with this lens to get the kind of quality Mike Stephen gets with his. I find it more difficult to use than my16mm prime. Anyway, I've posted a couple of cows, lol. And I was in Totteridge Common just off Whetstone high road where there's a lake. There were a few people fishing there and some ducks in the water. I did spot however a bird in a tree, probably about 80 to 100 feet up maybe. I don't know what this bird is called, can someone ID it? But I was surprised as I didn't expect to see one of those. The problem is that this was taken at 4.30pm and it would have been great if it was earlier in the day because this photo is quite noisy. This lens needs a lot of daylight to avoid higher iso and the sony a6600 doesn't seem to have much ISO tolerance. But it's a first attempt at wildlife anyway.


Cow B&W by Merlin 5, on Flickr


Cow 2 by Merlin 5, on Flickr


Bird by Merlin 5, on Flickr
 
Merlin5 said:
Went out to a couple of local places today and yesterday within a couple of miles of home. Just trying out tracking and burst rates on my Sony 70-350mm.. I need some practise with this lens to get the kind of quality Mike Stephen gets with his. I find it more difficult to use than my16mm prime. Anyway, I've posted a couple of cows, lol. And I was in Totteridge Common just off Whetstone high road where there's a lake. There were a few people fishing there and some ducks in the water. I did spot however a bird in a tree, probably about 80 to 100 feet up maybe. I don't know what this bird is called, can someone ID it? But I was surprised as I didn't expect to see one of those. The problem is that this was taken at 4.30pm and it would have been great if it was earlier in the day because this photo is quite noisy. This lens needs a lot of daylight to avoid higher iso and the sony a6600 doesn't seem to have much ISO tolerance. But it's a first attempt at wildlife anyway.


Cow B&W by Merlin 5, on Flickr


Cow 2 by Merlin 5, on Flickr


Bird by Merlin 5, on Flickr
Click to expand...
It’s a Cormorant.
 
LeeRatters said:
I remember seeing side by side images noticing the differences in the 'bokeh' between the different shutter types but I've never looked at any of my images and thought anything was amiss or wrong or looked odd to be honest.
Click to expand...

I've taken side by side pictures and not seen any differences. I'm not saying there are no differences, just that I haven't seen them. Maybe they are subject, composition and light dependant and only show up in a percentage of pictures? Even then maybe we'll only see the problems if we see side by side pictures.

It's a worry, I suppose, but a choice between efcs or electronic only isn't as big a put off for me as having to switch between the two manually as with my Panasonic cameras set to auto shutter shooting above 1/4k is a seamless process, the camera just does it. OK, with a kit lens or f2.8 zoom you may very rarely if ever exceed 1/4k but with a prime and shooting wider than f2.8 in good light (and sometimes even smaller) it's something that's going to need a button push or calling up a setting to change and then potentially reset just to enable wider aperture use and that's something which I'd find annoying, maybe as annoying as using ND's.

I just can't understand why they've done this. To me this isn't really an entry level camera, on price and built etc it looks arguably more of a mid to higher end camera.
 
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More on electronic, efcs and not...

I came across a link to this on DPR...

phillipreeve.net

Limitations of the electronic shutter function - phillipreeve.net

Many E-mount cameras feature an electronic shutter option, but there are some limitations you should be aware of when using EFCS or silent shutter
phillipreeve.net phillipreeve.net

To me it's difficult to know exactly what he's saying in some examples but I agree that an auto setting would be nice, if someone at Sony cares enough but I doubt they do.

More.


Someone in DPR saying the Canon RP has the same options, efcs or electronic and no full mechanical, 1/4k. I didn't know that...

A7C full mechanical shutter: Sony Alpha Full Frame E-mount Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review

Expert news, reviews and videos of the latest digital cameras, lenses, accessories, and phones. Get answers to your questions in our photography forums.
www.dpreview.com www.dpreview.com
 
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As it's quiet and before I turn this pc off and go and watch Leicester v Wolves and Man City v Liverpool, some pictures, A7 and Nikon 85mm f2 AI-S.

In these the leaves seemed to be almost floating on the light.

noxJoC7.jpg


fMB2k47.jpg


The last one. Just leaves in bands of light.

unSwxcL.jpg


I'm looking forward to going back next Friday.
 
woof woof said:
More on electronic, efcs and not...

I came across a link to this on DPR...

phillipreeve.net

Limitations of the electronic shutter function - phillipreeve.net

Many E-mount cameras feature an electronic shutter option, but there are some limitations you should be aware of when using EFCS or silent shutter
phillipreeve.net phillipreeve.net

To me it's difficult to know exactly what he's saying in some examples but I agree that an auto setting would be nice, if someone at Sony cares enough but I doubt they do.

More.


Someone in DPR saying the Canon RP has the same options, efcs or electronic and no full mechanical, 1/4k. I didn't know that...

A7C full mechanical shutter: Sony Alpha Full Frame E-mount Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review

Expert news, reviews and videos of the latest digital cameras, lenses, accessories, and phones. Get answers to your questions in our photography forums.
www.dpreview.com www.dpreview.com
Click to expand...
I have EFCS on permanently, zero issues
 
nandbytes said:
Fully silent shutter has banding issues along with issues of rolling shutter. Not to mention I think you only get 12-bit RAWs.

A9/ii are pretty much the only bodies where permanently using silent shutter is viable.



For the most part it's fine.
Can slightly ruin your bokeh at around 1/4000s and also may cause some exposure issues again around 1/4000s.
Have a read of this

What’s the fastest shutter speed you should use with EFCS on the a7RII? - the last word

Yesterday I looked at shutter travel time for silent shutter operation on the Sony a7RII. Incidentally, we noted that the electronic first curtain shutter (EFCS) pretty faithfully emulated the acceleration of the mechanical second curtain, at least at 1/500 second. On the Nikon D810, EFCS stops...
blog.kasson.com blog.kasson.com

Though the testing with A7Rii I think A7C has a higher clearance speed than the A7RII body. So you are probably fine till 1/2000s.
Click to expand...
Still problems with banding in certain artificial lighting scenarios, which is poor for a sports camera, seems that floodlighting can be a big problem.
 
imattersuk said:
Still problems with banding in certain artificial lighting scenarios, which is poor for a sports camera, seems that floodlighting can be a big problem.
Click to expand...
I think it's very specific scenarios where it has that problem. For the most part it's not a problem from what I hear from people who use professionally for sports and weddings where there are indoor lightning.
 
nandbytes said:
I think it's very specific scenarios where it has that problem. For the most part it's not a problem from what I hear from people who use professionally for sports and weddings where there are indoor lightning.
Click to expand...
I've seen the same issue on the Z's too, there's still no perfect camera. I wish Fuji had gone full frame, if they had better light gathering capabilities I would never have switched.
 
imattersuk said:
I've seen the same issue on the Z's too, there's still no perfect camera. I wish Fuji had gone full frame, if they had better light gathering capabilities I would never have switched.
Click to expand...
On Zs and even RF, or Fuji or Olympus or even other Sonys it's more of an issue you can't use silent shutter for action, you'll have rolling shutter to contend with.
A9/ii silent shutter is different

The clearance speed of mechanical shutters is 1/160s-1/250s
Most electronic shutters have the shutter clearance speeds of 1/15s (high Res bodies) -1/60s (lower Res bodies), plus they shoot only 12-bit RAW with lower dynamic range.

A9/ii on the other hand has a clearance speed of 1/160s in electronic shutter along with a dynamic range close to mechanical shutter thanks to its high speed readout and processor. So it gets over most of the issues you get with electronic shutter.
The banding issues mostly a non-issue on A9 for the most part unlike other bodies. As I said above A9/ii are pretty much the only bodies where permanently using silent shutter is viable
 
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What's full electronic shutter like on these cameras?

Edit: actually found this a good read.
photographylife.com

Mechanical vs Electronic Shutter vs EFCS

Many cameras today let you choose between a mechanical shutter, electronic shutter, or EFCS. Picking the wrong one can harm your photos and image quality.
photographylife.com

Going to be a non issue for me fastest thing I photo is a toddler.
 
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nandbytes said:
On A9/ii?
They are great with almost no issues and blackout free shooting.

Wish there was a 36-45mp version or one comes out one day lol
Click to expand...
No more the A7C if you have compared it yet.
For instance when to use it when not.
I'll probably just leave it on default EFCS.
 
robj20 said:
No more the A7C if you have compared it yet.
For instance when to use it when not.
I'll probably just leave it on default EFCS.
Click to expand...

I'd use it only in natural light with slow or static subjects.
Basically if you can get away with mechanical you should use that instead
 
robj20 said:
What's full electronic shutter like on these cameras?

Edit: actually found this a good read.
photographylife.com

Mechanical vs Electronic Shutter vs EFCS

Many cameras today let you choose between a mechanical shutter, electronic shutter, or EFCS. Picking the wrong one can harm your photos and image quality.
photographylife.com

Going to be a non issue for me fastest thing I photo is a toddler.
Click to expand...

Is the readout as slow as the mk3, if so, good luck with that. Toddlers aren't statues.
 
I think some people just like to make huge deals of minor things. You read some sites and the A7C is the worst camera ever made because it isn't an A9 in a smaller body with a full size EVF and all the controls, but still smaller and lighter.
I can't wait to get mine.
 
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robj20 said:
I think some people just like to make huge deals of minor things. You read some sites and the A7C is the worst camera ever made because it isn't an A9 in a smaller body with a full size EVF and all the controls, but still smaller and lighter.
I can't wait to get mine.
Click to expand...
It doesn't need to be the best camera on sale but it does need to meet requirements. You/we just need to weigh up the pros and cons and there's nothing wrong with that. The big issue for me is the 1/4,000 shutter speed with no way of quickly and automatically getting over that that I can see. Everything else seems to have a workaround. I'll just wait for something else and if my A7 dies there's the A7III.

Hope you're happy with yours.
 
robj20 said:
I think some people just like to make huge deals of minor things. You read some sites and the A7C is the worst camera ever made because it isn't an A9 in a smaller body with a full size EVF and all the controls, but still smaller and lighter.
I can't wait to get mine.
Click to expand...

welcome to the internet :D
my favourite is when people who have never used one trying to tell me how it's basically the same size/bulk as the MK3.
I own an A7C, I own an A7RIV, I owned an A7RIII before it. think I am pretty well capable of and more qualified to decided for myself if there is any real world difference in size lol.
 
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nandbytes said:
A7C+tamron 28-200mm

I am pretty impressed with the compactness and IQ from this combo.
Wouldn't put the lens on my A7RIV but on A7C its very good.
Click to expand...

At what picture size or magnification do you think any lens weaknesses would be visible? If for example you view an A7RIV + 28-200mm picture at the same size and viewing distance that you'd view an A7c + 28-200mm picture what would the differences be? What do the extra mp's bring you?

I'm not being argumentative, I am just wondering, we all know that some lenses are better than others.

I've long thought that the end image and how it is to be viewed is the key and starting point for both the kit and the settings. I do think that 24mp is enough for me for an A3 print and I do think it's easily enough for me for a 100% crop to be looked at on a screen. Apart from the extra cropability, I'm not sure what I'd do with more mp's.
 
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