The demise of the 'asset'

I'm a scruffy oik (as I'm sure Chris Cobra will attest!) and when I was after my previous car, I was fairly open to suggestion so went to the local MB dealer to see what they had on offer. I was completely ignored so I went across the road to the Jaguar showroom where I was immediately offered a cuppa and any help if I needed it.

I'm not as scruffy as the "oik" who wandered in to H R Owen in the '60s and was told to leave the premises by salesman #1, only to be welcomed with open arms with a "Hello, Mr Jagger, how can I help you today?" from salesman #2.
I'm amazed to read that appearance is used to judge clients.
Some one I know well used to come in the the garage with frayed collars and oil stained clothes, yet he was one of the nicest people I knew, and could have bought the whole dealership several times over cash!
I wouldn't be surprised that any one with a lady in their house has some of "his" products in their house.

Fine pilot as well, had a tar runway on his farm, but such a great person, nothing fake or put on about him.

I can see many sales people here missing out on people like him.
 
I remembered an experience I once had at a Jaguar dealer. I'd rang them first but when I turned up I was ignored so I wondered around for a bit and then sat and read a mag for a while until I thought I'd wasted enough of my time and I then got up and left. It was then that a salesman actually ran after me but he didn't catch me before I got to my car. When I got home the phone rang with the most grovelling and embarrassing apology. I can't remember what I went on to buy but it wasn't a Jag.

I did buy a used Jag once. There were a couple of paintwork marks and the salesman agreed to fettle everything I pointed out. When I picked the car up it had been washed and polished but none of the paint blemishes had been touched and inside the car there was loose change in the cubby holes, sweet wrappers in the back and sticky stuff on the back seats where the previous owners children had probably sat and ate the sweets before dropping the wrappers all over. Inside the car looked as if it had never been touched since the previous owner gave it up. I didn't bother complaining but I dd tell the whole truth when I got a follow up customer satisfaction call. I suppose dealers will vary but some clearly just don't care.
 
Last edited:
Conscious that this has gently slid off topic slightly, but I get a phone call from my local BMW dealer every 2-3 years asking how I’m getting on with my car and if I’m interested in changing. This, plus their fantastic customer service is why I keep buying from them, hopefully they’ll not change in line with the experiences of others on here.
 
I drive a Kia now. Finances are not what they were.
Jolly good cars, Kia.

I've been driving Kias with pretensions (AKA Hyundai) for about twelve years now. Extremely good value.
 
Jolly good cars, Kia.

I've been driving Kias with pretensions (AKA Hyundai) for about twelve years now. Extremely good value.

That's the cruel bit, they are good. So good in fact I feel a bit of a schmuck for paying top money for Mercs, Volvo's and even Lexus - although the Lexus was really a cut above anything else I've sampled.

Drove that Ceed from Spain back to Scotland in 27hrs only stopping for fuel, food, ferry and toilets. 1400odd miles in 27hrs. Done that in all my high end cars and was no more backachy or tired feel driving the Ceed as I was the S80, GS or E class.

Can't wait to order (when funds allow) an Xceed new off drivethedeal.com when funds etc allow.
 
Last edited:
I'm amazed to read that appearance is used to judge clients.

Well we've all seen 'Pretty Woman' with Julia Roberts -- playing a hooker -- in a posh shop.
 
I'm amazed to read that appearance is used to judge clients.
Well we've all seen 'Pretty Woman' with Julia Roberts -- playing a hooker -- in a posh shop.

I've experienced this myself. I was thinking about buying a Cayman S a few years ago when I had an M3. I called the local Porsche dealer & made an appointment to take one for a test drive. At the time, the Beamer was in the shop for some work, so I turned up on my Fireblade, jeans & bike jacket etc. They weren't happy that I was really interested and suggested that I was just there for a joy ride. Luckily, I had a family member working there, but he was on a day off. I called him and he sorted it out.

I never did get one, a big regret from me, but the Mrs was paranoid about having a Porsche on the drive. If I had of gone ahead with it, I would have purchased it elsewhere that's for sure.
 
Can someone describe what where the expectations the moment he purchased a Nikon D850 ( brand new or used ) .
What was the original thought behind this .
 
Can someone describe what where the expectations the moment he purchased a Nikon D850 ( brand new or used ) .
What was the original thought behind this .
Don't really understand the question, but if it is what I think it is, only "he" could describe that, no one else could explain for him, but maybe I have it completely wrong :)
 
Don't really understand the question, but if it is what I think it is, only "he" could describe that, no one else could explain for him, but maybe I have it completely wrong :)
It is only because of my bad English . Someone is buying a Nikon D850 to take photographs for amateur or professional use . Not as an investment in the long term .
For a professional this is a valuable tool that will give him profit . For an amateur a valuable tool that will give him the desirable quality in his work .
These are the original expectations and not a future profit of selling the camera .
 
It is only because of my bad English . Someone is buying a Nikon D850 to take photographs for amateur or professional use . Not as an investment in the long term .
For a professional this is a valuable tool that will give him profit . For an amateur a valuable tool that will give him the desirable quality in his work .
These are the original expectations and not a future profit of selling the camera .
Yes, I think most people would agree with that, but it is still nice when something holds it value :)
 
Yes, I think most people would agree with that, but it is still nice when something holds it value :)
Or just for the value not to plummet dramatically.

As many have posted though, if you genuinely can’t afford the massive depreciation of the latest and greatest, buying second hand when most of the value is already gone is the way to do it.

Buying a brand new camera at launch price is the best way to lose a lot of money. And if you do that and then swap systems it’s almost a bonfire of your cash.
 
Interesting thread agree with Hans that they are tools to do a job but do see people’s point about not wanting to lose too much when they trade in for the next model when it comes out :)
do people think that depreciation has got worse for camera gear in the last couple of years or has it always been high ?
I have never sold any of my cameras, they have always been well used and people shy away from anything with a high shutter count , I’ve never actually had a Camera go wrong though, by the time I get a new camera the old one normally has a shutter count of about 70K
 
For me the value of a camera is the original purchase price divided by the number of images taken. And for the camera that I use most often that works out at 2p per image. The resale value is irrelevant.
 
I guess that's the difference between film and digital camera's. Digital cameras are constantly evolving with innovation after innovation, getting better and better, which devalues the price of older models.

Film cameras are essentially a lightproof box, so there's less room for technical innovation meaning a film camera from 40 years ago will be just as good as a film camera from 30 years ago.
 
I guess that's the difference between film and digital camera's. Digital cameras are constantly evolving with innovation after innovation, getting better and better, which devalues the price of older models.

Film cameras are essentially a lightproof box, so there's less room for technical innovation meaning a film camera from 40 years ago will be just as good as a film camera from 30 years ago.

Indeed, in a film camera, the thing recording the image was the film. The body from an imaging point of view didn't really matter at all.

With modern digital cameras (excluding medium format systems with a digital back) the sensor is inbuilt to the camera I'd argue it is the most important aspect of the system as the sensor records the image and upgrading the body can see all sorts of technical gains to your image from the colour depth, shadow recovery and size (if that matters).
 
Last edited:
Or just for the value not to plummet dramatically.

As many have posted though, if you genuinely can’t afford the massive depreciation of the latest and greatest, buying second hand when most of the value is already gone is the way to do it.

Buying a brand new camera at launch price is the best way to lose a lot of money. And if you do that and then swap systems it’s almost a bonfire of your cash.
The other option is to wait for the right promotions, which can make a significant difference to the overall cost - I recently made the jump from my old Sony A900 to a Sony A7iv, the £500 trade in bonus AND £200 discount made a big difference to the 'affordability' of the new camera!
 
I nearly bought an S6 from there years ago. I didn't like them. Ironically they are owned by lookers group, who have Taggarts Volvo on the other side of the "8" and they're very helpful.

I drive a Kia now. Finances are not what they were.

The S6 (Avant) would have been the more obvious choice for me to replace the XF Sportbrake's large boot, but I had a hankering for a supercharger. Would have quite liked a V8 as I've never had one, but head won over heart.

Current car is still worth as much as I paid for it, possibly even a little more. That's an all time first for me, especially with cars.
 
You could look at this as a depreciation of your assets.

Or you could look at it as an opportunity to buy pro quality lenses in reasonable condition at the same price as slow consumer lenses are new.
 
The S6 (Avant) would have been the more obvious choice for me to replace the XF Sportbrake's large boot, but I had a hankering for a supercharger. Would have quite liked a V8 as I've never had one, but head won over heart.

Current car is still worth as much as I paid for it, possibly even a little more. That's an all time first for me, especially with cars.


V6 Sportbrakes can be hard enough to find - the V8s are like rocking unicorn pooh!
 
V6 Sportbrakes can be hard enough to find - the V8s are like rocking unicorn pooh!

Aye, no petrol V6 Sportbrake in the UK (x250 and x260) moved me to another brand. I think the Americans get the petrol V6 with AWD in Sportbrake, although you'd think the UK would get the full range. Agree re. V8 Sportbrake, the limited run obviously didn't help but the bork factor would put me off anyway! lol
 
Out of curiosity, I watched an auction of a Nikon D810 (because I own one), it sold for £549, that's a camera that six years ago sold for over £2000. In the very early 80's I owned a Nikon FM2n film camera, I think I paid about £110 for it (although I'm not entirely sure and some 23 years later I sold that camera on eBay for, yes, £110. Ok there is inflation to be taken into account but nevertheless, that was good value. When I see things like the D810, it makes me wary about spending on new camera equipment, especially the actual camera. Even lenses don't really hold the value that one might expect although I'm not sure why. Manufacturers come out with new models all the time and second hand value of the previous one plummets -- yes that is the way of the world I know.

Take the Nikon Z7, when released it cost not far off three grand but was superseded by the Z7ii a tiny bit over two years later so second hand ones now go for a little over a thousand; that's a big drop.

Fifteen years ago, I bought a Yanagisawa saxophone for two thousand pounds, with the right climate for its sale now? about £2000, despite one new model being introduced in the meantime -- that is my only asset. Oh, apart from my tiny house which I bought 20 years ago for £60K and is now valued at £235K - should have bought two!

It all makes me wonder if there is any photographic equipment that holds its value for years or should even the highest quality gear be, in the end, considered disposable.

Damn it, all this talk of depreciated bargains and I've just had a 'sod it' moment. D810 now bought for £539, hopefully it won't be too well used lol
 
Damn it, all this talk of depreciated bargains and I've just had a 'sod it' moment. D810 now bought for £539, hopefully it won't be too well used lol
Well they were well over two grand when they came out so that's probably quite a bargain. Unfortunately my own D810 was bought new so you have the swing and looks like I got the roundabout :confused::)
 
Well they were well over two grand when they came out so that's probably quite a bargain. Unfortunately my own D810 was bought new so you have the swing and looks like I got the roundabout :confused::)

Yeah but you got 6yrs with it that @gman didn't - and as life is finite £1400 pales into insignificance over that time.

Both of you got the swing, he gets a cheap but very capable camera, you just had a very capable camera from new.
 
For me the value of a camera is the original purchase price divided by the number of images taken. And for the camera that I use most often that works out at 2p per image. The resale value is irrelevant.

That is a wonderful way of looking at things, unfortunately if I do that with my camera it comes out at 25p per image (not including any resale value).

I used the formula on quite a few other things that came to mind:

My van is a waste of money as most of the time it sits outside my house until I need to go to the builders merchants or take my dogs to the vet.

My TV is excellent value for money at 0.1p per minute so far.

I think the best value of all is my garden spade as considering its age and the amount of use it has had against its purchase price, I can consider it a free garden tool. The same can't be said for my generator which at £800 for about thirty hours work in anger is extraordinarily poor value -- but then you have to take into account the energy security potential which is more difficult to quantify.

I kept bees for six years and including the sale of honey, I think I broke about even when I gave up and sold it all. So there you have it, if you want something that maintains its value, keep bees (be prepared for stinging pain on a regular basis though).
 
Last edited:
I buy more lenses than camera and I often look at it a slightly different way :D When I take a picture I'm really happy with possibly on a day I've really enjoyed I think it's paid for itself :D That may be a little extreme but it's what I often think :D
 
Last edited:
Well they were well over two grand when they came out so that's probably quite a bargain. Unfortunately my own D810 was bought new so you have the swing and looks like I got the roundabout :confused::)

A well used swing with lots of wear might be more accurate! lol But so long as everything works, then I don't mind!

Splashed out a bit more for the lens though, as I didn't want to risk marks on the glass. Ended up going over my total budget by £200 but for £1,200 I think I now have a pretty capable setup for dog, family and landscape stuff.
 
I buy more lenses than camera and I often look at it a slightly different way :D When I take a picture I'm really happy with it possibly on a day I've really enjoyed I think it's paid for itself :D That may be a little extreme but it's what I often think :D
Me too
The joy I get from sharing one image I'm proud of is priceless (like all moments of joy).
 
Cheap compared to 35mm film! At around a tenner for 36 exposures just for the film, plus D&P costs, it soon adds up!
It used to be pretty cheap. I seem to recall that in the seventies a frame cost about 2p for each developed, but not printed, frame. Of course wages were much less then so perhaps it just seemed cheap because there wasn't much else to spend money on (no computers, phones, streaming services etc.).
 
  • Like
Reactions: zx9
USED TO BE being the operative words! I keep having to remind myself that the '70s were 50 bloomin' years ago!!!
 
I remember when I got back into bikes about 20 years ago, I was putting 10-12k miles on them a year. People said that they would lose value, but I bought an 8 month old Fireblade for £6k, had it for 5 years, it went to Europe at least once if not twice a year, was used a commute into London a couple of times a week, plus did a couple of long weekends in the Lakes or Wales every year. I sold it for £4k. I think I had my monies worth out of that, more than any car I've ever owned.
 
Unless specifically for investing purposes, I don't really bother worrying about resale or residual values. I buy what I need for the purpose or if for pleasure then if it provides smiles then it's worth it as you can't get time back.
 
I use the Bank of England's inflation calculator to compare prices from then to now: https://www.bankofengland.co.uk/monetary-policy/inflation/inflation-calculator

The Pentacon FM I bought for £20-0s-0d in 1967 would now cost me £303 and each cassette of FP3 I put in it at 7s-6d is equal to £5 today! :wideyed:

I realise it is the general CPI they are using but if one gets specific it's a bit out. In 1973 a gallon of petrol went up to 50p (shameful, it was 35p before). The website doesn't allow for less than a pound so I've said that two gallons is a £1, so that's 9 litres for a quid and the website says a £1 then that will buy £10 now; oh, if only I could get 9 litres of petrol for £10 :(

Indeed, IIRC, diesel was cheaper than petrol then and I have a diesel van now so it costs me even more.
 
Last edited:
I realise it is the general CPI they are using but if one gets specific it's a bit out. In 1973 a gallon of petrol went up to 50p (shameful, it was 35p before). The website doesn't allow for less than a pound so I've said that two gallons is a £1, so that's 9 litres for a quid and the website says a £1 then that will buy £10 now; oh, if only I could get 9 litres of petrol for £10 :(

Indeed, IIRC, diesel was cheaper than petrol then and I have a diesel van now so it costs me even more.
But again, fuel is an outlier, the CPI is more likely to be statistically valid than a single item that’s subject to geopolitical pressures.

Fuel btw was up to a £ a gallon by the time I was buying it in 1981.

Outlier at the other end:
Bog standard Oven ready chicken would be about £5.50 per kilo if it’d followed the CPI (it’s actually £3.50 ish and that’s after a sustained period of food inflation running at much higher than cpi)

Electronic goods btw (which would include cameras) have reduced in price massively compared to cpi. A colour tv at 1973 prices would be a couple of grand today, whereas in reality it’s a quarter of that*

*clearly the reason ‘big telly’ can be used as a hook for headline writers designed to trigger old folk ;)
 
Last edited:
Back
Top