The General Drone-Related Thread

Muzzieman said:
I certainly don't supply anything free of charge and after investing over 10k in training, gear and Licences i should think it reasonable to expect not to have to compete against joe blogs with his £500 phantom. .
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Things have always been like that though in fairness. I have over 30 years exp in the building sector, i have served my time as both a carpenter and then a plumber, officially, and cabinet making and some electrical too.
When i had my own business i had all the usual to contend with, wages, tax, insurance, equipment, liability insurance, vat, advertising, transport, holidays, sick days materials, work for which i never received payment, and having to contend with joe bloggs working out of the back of a van with little or no overheads, was it a pain, yep it surely was, did i ever feel the need to vent my annoyance at him, nope i didnt. I have even helped one or two out when they were in over their heads with something they didnt know how to fix.
We all have to start somewhere, but i cant imagine that too many people on here will actually go on to do anything commercial with their "£500 Phantom" (but i could be wrong)

Cant help but think that you have missed the point made above

4wd said:
Once again it sounds like an inventive interpretation pushed by those with a commercial interest in cornering business for themselves.
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By replying with

Muzzieman said:
As for the point of giving images away for free there is no business in that move so how can qualified pilots be cornering the market? I certainly don't supply anything free of charge and after investing over 10k in training, gear and Licences i should think it reasonable to expect not to have to compete against joe blogs with his £500 phantom.
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You dont want to have to compete with joe bloggs and you do have a commercial interest in joe bloggs not being able to do anything with any images or video that they may shoot.
Its coming across, to me anyway, that you are actually trying to corner the market.

I dont have a drone of any sort yet, but i hope to have one shortly.

Just my tuppence worth, for whatever its worth.
 
I'm not trying to corner any market. The simple FACT is than NO commercial work can be done with a drone without permission for aerial work from the Caa. End of. Believe me if I could have just started working without spending 3k plus on getting permissions and insurances I would have!
 
Honestly, I get the point that you are making, or at least the point that I think you're making. :)

OFFICIALLY it's illegal. I think that's your point.

Realistically though, how likely is it that the CAA (?) Will come knocking on little joey ' s door over an image that he took on his drone, which he then gave away free of charge.
I get that Officially they could, from what you have said, I'm not convinced that it's likely though.

I wonder if someone will come up with a way around it, (if you're right) (just hedging my bets) :)
Like maybe someone registering for permissions and for a nominal fee running other people's vids and images through their system so that IF the CAA do come knocking, it comes back to someone with the required permission.
Considering the apparent size of the hobby / enthusiast drone market that could potentially be a huge albeit unethical market.
I'm not condoning the breaking of laws :)
 
Don't get me wrong I am not trying to discourage anyone from buying or flying a drone. They are fantastic things to play around with but working with them is a totally different animal to flying it around a field. It's like me deciding that I'm going to be a taxi driver tomorrow, why not? I own a car I could do that!
 
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Can I get your number and book you to take me to a field to fly my drone whenever I get it ;)
Only problem is I'm in Ireland, but the field is only down the road :)

I feel your point is well and truly made. Been a pleasure chatting to you.

As someone who has gone down the route of registration and permissions are you at all open to queries from anyone that would like to know how to go about it or what's involved ?
 
Muzzieman said:
Don't get me wrong I am not trying to discourage anyone from buying or flying a drone. They are fantastic things to play around with but working with them is a totally different animal to flying it around a field. It's like me deciding that I'm going to be a taxi driver tomorrow, why not? I own a car I could do that!
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Yes you could but if you wanted to be a fomula 1 driver not so easy...:cool:
 
StuartH said:
Yes you could but if you wanted to be a fomula 1 driver not so easy...:cool:
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Not legally! Taxis are generally Hackney Cabs which require even more permissions, certifications etc. than Private Hire cars (as do their drivers.)
 
Weirdly, even while I was denied driving privileges a few years back (medical issue, not naughtiness!), I could have done an F1 experience including a few laps in an F1 car, even though I had surrendered my license. IIRC, Max Verstappen didn't have a road car license when he first started in F1 (and a few F1 drivers have been banned from the roads during their career!)
 
Derek897 said:
Can I get your number and book you to take me to a field to fly my drone whenever I get it ;)
Only problem is I'm in Ireland, but the field is only down the road :)

I feel your point is well and truly made. Been a pleasure chatting to you.

As someone who has gone down the route of registration and permissions are you at all open to queries from anyone that would like to know how to go about it or what's involved ?
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If ever I'm in Ireland I'll get in touch.
 
No one goes up to 5000 feet.
I meant 5000 feet distance.
Phantom 3 has altitude limit of 500m.
This is perfecty OK for example you might track up the side of a steep slope and go up much more than 400 feet but never be more than 100 feet above the surface.
 
[QUOTE="Muzzieman, post: 7562761, member: 66329"They do monitor the media to check for illegal usage. So, you take some images for an architect friend, they get featured in the press. Then the CAA comes knocking to see who supplied the aerial images and boom[/QUOTE]

Do you really think they have the resources to do this ?
 
Blank_Canvas said:
[QUOTE="Muzzieman, post: 7562761, member: 66329"They do monitor the media to check for illegal usage. So, you take some images for an architect friend, they get featured in the press. Then the CAA comes knocking to see who supplied the aerial images and boom
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Do you really think they have the resources to do this ?[/QUOTE]

They don't. They're also worried about far bigger things.
 
4wd said:
No one goes up to 5000 feet.
I meant 5000 feet distance.
Phantom 3 has altitude limit of 500m.
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OK. I obviously misunderstood your post, however I would point out that in aviation, altitude and height are measured in feet, whilst horizontal distances are measured in metres (and nautical miles), hence my confusion.
Even so, I'd also point out that 5000ft is a little over 1500m, which is 3 times the distance the CAA states represents a reasonable line of sight for drone use. I know that my own visual acuity is insufficient to pick out an object roughly the size of a football a mile away, and suspect it is for everyone else too.
 
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Realistically it depends on the location, I feel safe enough flying over my own land in a deep valley.
Not sure what dreadful thing might occur unless a grouse blundered into it.

It's pretty clear that anyone assuming that a Phantom 3 was being taken up to 5000 feet has anti-drone agenda, because usually only sensationalised newspaper articles and pilots come out with stuff like that..
 
£999 for basic kit, £1249 with extra battery, car charger and case - direct from DJI
You could manage without the special case but second battery is all but essential.
Extra battery alone £85

Depending on what the exchange rate does they will be cheaper in a few months time.
 
This doesn't look good....
http://droneinsider.org/new-easa-drone-regulations-threaten-kill-uk-european-drone-industry/

If these rules go ahead as they plan, it will make it very difficult to fly any drone over 250grms. Practically all home made or modded aircraft will be banned and to fly something like a Phantom it will need restricting (by the manufacturer), a transponder fitted, the drone registering and you will need a licence.

The hearing is next month by the way.
 
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Wissel said:
This doesn't look good....
http://droneinsider.org/new-easa-drone-regulations-threaten-kill-uk-european-drone-industry/

If these rules go ahead as they plan, it will make it very difficult to fly any drone over 250grms. Practically all home made or modded aircraft will be banned and to fly something like a Phantom it will need restricting (by the manufacturer), a transponder fitted, the drone registering and you will need a licence.

The hearing is next month by the way.
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Yeah had a read over some of this yesterday, looks basically like it would kill of anything over 50m without being "certified", not good.
 
phil_b said:
The new DJI Mavic Pro looks interesting, especially the size/portability

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4i9Uo_szlqU
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Controversial perhaps, but I think these "selfie" drones will contribute to the demise of the hobby in the UK. There's no direct radio link controlling the drone, it's all based on a WiFi link to the phone or tablet controlling it. Far too many people will hold up their hands after one of these randomly flies into a strangers face and say "but I did nothing wrong, it went out of control". No, you lost control.

For those of us currently flying UAS, the WiFi video link is very much the weak link, the radio control between Tx and Rx/drone is usually many multitudes stronger, so assuming the pilot is flying legally, on line of sight, it's not too tough to bring the drone home when the video link, GPS, supplemental controls go pear shaped.

I honestly think this could be a golden era for drone imaging, because as long as people keep using their device outside of the regulations (above 400ft, beyond 2400ft), we're going to be clamped down on hard. Those naive enough to deliberately ignore the guidelines will bear the blame from the rest of us who followed the rules. I know I'm going to fly as much as I can while I can still do it legally.
 
ronnus said:
the WiFi video link is very much the weak link, the radio control between Tx and Rx/drone is usually many multitudes stronger, so assuming the pilot is flying legally, on line of sight, it's not too tough to bring the drone home when the video link, GPS, supplemental controls go pear shaped.
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It's just going to auto RTH if control is lost.
 
4wd said:
It's just going to auto RTH if control is lost.
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RTH can never be relied on, every manufacturer states that. Also the five UAV's I've owned will only land on the point they last detected the transmitter, which may or may not be where someone's face is now. Even those that will land back at takeoff point state something like a 10' margin of error which again can be someone's face.
 
Wissel said:
This doesn't look good....
http://droneinsider.org/new-easa-drone-regulations-threaten-kill-uk-european-drone-industry/

If these rules go ahead as they plan, it will make it very difficult to fly any drone over 250grms. Practically all home made or modded aircraft will be banned and to fly something like a Phantom it will need restricting (by the manufacturer), a transponder fitted, the drone registering and you will need a licence.

The hearing is next month by the way.
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I would have thought that air traffic would go mad about the idea of transponders. 2 or more flying together on close proximity and their systems go mad ( they killed the idea of transponders in gliders for the same reason a couple of years ago )
 
ronnus said:
RTH can never be relied on, every manufacturer states that. Also the five UAV's I've owned will only land on the point they last detected the transmitter, which may or may not be where someone's face is now. Even those that will land back at takeoff point state something like a 10' margin of error which again can be someone's face.
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I think most faces would notice the thing buzzing loudly as it gently descended and stand aside?
I've had three Phantoms and never actually had RTH activate unless I do it myself for convenience.
P3 and P4 at least will often land within a foot of take off point however it's far more sensible to retake control when it's close and land manually.

Compared to all the danger you face while walking down a street from traffic or objects falling from buildings the chance of being hit by a UAV let alone injured or killed by one is vanishingly small.
Not quite sure why some people seem to be so fascinated with imagining endless scenarios where flesh gets chopped up.
Calls for dramatic new legislation are mainly coming from those with almost no experience in the subject other than reading sexed up reports describing implausible 'drone' activity in the media.
 
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I wish there was a separate thread for the drone ragers, so this could be for positive stuff like who's getting the new Mavic or Karma.

After some shaky early reviews where users apparently didn't refocus to infinity after take off, it seems the Mavic is very comparable to Phantom 4 image quality wise.
As a GoPro user I was very taken with the Karma, however I already have a Feiyu G4 gimbal so the main extra selling point is rather lost on me - and in every other area the Mavic washes the floor with it.
DJI have immense experience with UAVs and Gimbals - with rapid advancements in reliability and frankly astonishing new features.
GoPro have come up with something pretty basic by comparison, perhaps easier for first time users to get to grips with.
 
This is a nicely explained Mavic v Karma article.
http://www.wetalkuav.com/gopro-karma-vs-dji-mavic-drone/

The Mavic looks only a step or two away from throw it in the air and it instantly unfolds and hovers!

If you are looking for small and portable which do you go for from these... :LOL:

size-comparison-696x555.jpg
 
4wd said:
I think most faces would notice the thing buzzing loudly as it gently descended and stand aside?
I've had three Phantoms and never actually had RTH activate unless I do it myself for convenience.
P3 and P4 at least will often land within a foot of take off point however it's far more sensible to retake control when it's close and land manually.

Compared to all the danger you face while walking down a street from traffic or objects falling from buildings the chance of being hit by a UAV let alone injured or killed by one is vanishingly small.
Not quite sure why some people seem to be so fascinated with imagining endless scenarios where flesh gets chopped up.
Calls for dramatic new legislation are mainly coming from those with almost no experience in the subject other than reading sexed up reports describing implausible 'drone' activity in the media.
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Have you ever flown a drone with the GPS switched off? Most consumer models can hit 50MPH plus. Granted it would be bloody bad luck, but if you think someone can avoid something phantom sized that they're not expecting to be flying towards them, I'm really not convinced.

Your tone generally seems dismissive of the authorities, and the potential for drones to cause injury. It's the blasé attitude which is going to screw the hobby up, yes they're scare stories, and yes the media misrepresent drones atrociously, which is why I'm quite realistic about what can go wrong.

5 or 6 years ago you needed a lot of time, money and skill to fly model aircraft, now Johnny Anybody can pap a grand at maplin and have a phantom in the sky in ten minutes without any real understanding of the extent of the automation that's letting them do it.

If heavy handed legislation ever does come in to force I'll not just be blaming the media for sensationalising it, I'll also be blaming the guy who doesn't know or care about what can go wrong.

Also I'm not sure if you're referring to me as a "drone rager", I still fly three different models regularly, and I make sure I do it respectfully and within the rules set out.

Happy flying...
 
MrDrizz said:
Having watched the new drones from gopro and DjI I'm tempted, but then this puts me off

http://www.diyphotography.net/easa-...rones-wants-make-current-systems-illegal-fly/
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Send an email telling them you're not chuffed, it's the only thing to do at this stage. My concern is that this new legislation is clear the way for corporate delivery drones to exclusively use the airspace between 160 and 400 feet, Amazon and DHL are certainly bigging up the technology just now.
 
ronnus said:
Send an email telling them you're not chuffed, it's the only thing to do at this stage. My concern is that this new legislation is clear the way for corporate delivery drones to exclusively use the airspace between 160 and 400 feet, Amazon and DHL are certainly bigging up the technology just now.
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Wouldn't surprise me, if they think they can make more money out of DHL, UPS and Amazon that Joe Public then its the consumer who will get screwed every time.
Does look like it would push those who are a bit more "serious" about it down the route of going through the CAA qualification and restricting everyone else to what is being deemed a "safe" limit
 
chrism_scotland said:
Wouldn't surprise me, if they think they can make more money out of DHL, UPS and Amazon that Joe Public then its the consumer who will get screwed every time.
Does look like it would push those who are a bit more "serious" about it down the route of going through the CAA qualification and restricting everyone else to what is being deemed a "safe" limit
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I'm normally not a rule breaker, but I suspect I might be tempted to should draconian legislation be imposed. It's not an ANPR situation so I've no idea how the authorities would police such a situation, but the whole thing is leaving a sour taste in my mouth.

This is speaking as a hobby flier who's been at it since the models could have the rotorspan of a person and be powered by petrol, with absolutely no electronics assisting flight.
 
4wd said:
£999 for basic kit, £1249 with extra battery, car charger and case - direct from DJI
You could manage without the special case but second battery is all but essential.
Extra battery alone £85

Depending on what the exchange rate does they will be cheaper in a few months time.
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Seen them from offical retailers as £749 basic and £999 with the kit which isnt bad esp compared with the Phantom 4 price.
 
ronnus said:
Controversial perhaps, but I think these "selfie" drones will contribute to the demise of the hobby in the UK. There's no direct radio link controlling the drone, it's all based on a WiFi link to the phone or tablet controlling it. Far too many people will hold up their hands after one of these randomly flies into a strangers face and say "but I did nothing wrong, it went out of control". No, you lost control.

For those of us currently flying UAS, the WiFi video link is very much the weak link, the radio control between Tx and Rx/drone is usually many multitudes stronger, so assuming the pilot is flying legally, on line of sight, it's not too tough to bring the drone home when the video link, GPS, supplemental controls go pear shaped.

I honestly think this could be a golden era for drone imaging, because as long as people keep using their device outside of the regulations (above 400ft, beyond 2400ft), we're going to be clamped down on hard. Those naive enough to deliberately ignore the guidelines will bear the blame from the rest of us who followed the rules. I know I'm going to fly as much as I can while I can still do it legally.
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I thought it was still RX? As the range is quoted as 7 miles which surely cant be wifi?????
 
Ricardodaforce said:
CE version is 4.3 miles. Def not just a wifi connection.
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Yep my bad, a wee bit of research shows the Mavic is not a selfie drone in the slightest, it seems to be a sleek consumerised version of the Phantom, complete with dedicated controller, unless I'm missing someone?

Im also baffled as to why people get excited about how far a drone can fly when the law says line of sight. Maybe it's like a cars top speed, who knows...
 
ronnus said:
Yep my bad, a wee bit of research shows the Mavic is not a selfie drone in the slightest, it seems to be a sleek consumerised version of the Phantom, complete with dedicated controller, unless I'm missing someone?

Im also baffled as to why people get excited about how far a drone can fly when the law says line of sight. Maybe it's like a cars top speed, who knows...
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I don't understand that either. I always like to see where mine are.
 
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