Underage Rioters - should the parents be held responsible?

[Flash In The Pan]

How's this for the parent being held responsible?

 

[Bernie174]

Respect is all very well, but for whatever reason it's becoming absent.
You can blame a lot of thing for that, but I think its the lack of anticipation of consequence.
For example, get nicked for stealing a mars bar. Whats the result? Erm, a caution. Mild b...telling off. In one ear, out the other. So, shrug shoulders, and nick 2 mars bars next time. Consequence? Mild telling off. So, now you have created the problem, you've taught someone that you can do things wrong, and lets be honest, they know they are and have nothing more than a telling off.
By the time we get to offence 4 or 5, its not nicking mars bars, its far more serious, but the consequence is the same.
Now, when I was 12, I got caught nicking sweets, and to be honest, it hurt. It hurt a great deal. Have I done it since? No. Why not? Well, simple really, for the same reason I don't try to put my hand in a flame, because I learned at an early age, that it hurts!
Yes, you can look at it the other way, and say well, my father could have sat me down and talked about it. Would have have worked? Nope.
I behaved at school, because I knew that a wack round the backside hurts. A cane would in all probability hurt a great deal more. I didn't need to experience that to know it. In fact, the cane was used once at the school I spent my 3rd/4th/5th/6th year in, it didn't need to be used more, because the threat was enough.
To be fair, there was also another reason why I behaved, and it applied to everyone at the last school I went too. It was a Forces Education School, in Germany. Now, the rules were you misbehaved, and your father got posted back to the UK. That was a disgrace, and cost him money (loosing overseas allowance and duty free living). Strangely, the offending rate of my peers was FAR lower than the equivalent in the UK.
So whats the lesson here?
Simple, when parents are forced to control their children, they can and do.
When there are consequences of actions, then the actions are thought about, and that consequence acts as a deterrent.
Lastly, what detrimental effect did the system I was brought up in have? Answer none. Ex Service children were actively courted by not just the Forces themselves, but the Police, Fire Service, Civil Service and banks to name a few, simply because they were better behaved.

 

[u8myufo]

They seem to be trying that in a few places, thing is Graham if you are in support of that then would you mind explaining what good that is going to do :shrug:.

 

[Flash In The Pan]

They seem to be trying that in a few places, thing is Graham if you are in support of that then would you mind explaining what good that is going to do :shrug:.

I think the reasoning is that it will force parents to take responsibility for the actions of their children and serve as a warning to others that the behaviour witnessed recently won't be tolerated.

 

[Jo]

Hell yes! parents should be held responsible. They should loose job seekers if on it. Because while they have not been working they have also not being working at raising their children correctly.

It should be the case for all parents of those caught because each child has parents and they are the peers of other children.

For the looters themselves:

I think there should be a few boot camps set up, ran by officers of the forces who are good at teaching youths that join up some proper respect and discipline. There have been a few closures recently of bases. Open a few back up and have them detain these youths for a minimum of 1 year each. It might work out cheaper than any other punishment that can be given, and I would hope that it would work better than other punishments too.

If after another year these youths get into more trouble then they should go into normal army bases and mix with real army personnel.

I'd rather my taxes were spent on actually trying to solve the problem instead of detaining the problems for a short period, only for them to go out and do it again.

I think this should be the case for all looters under the age of 25. Those over that age should get 2 choices ... a prison sentence or an option to sign up for the army, regardless of what they have looted.

I've not been to bed yet so this is just me babbling. I will probably come back later and change my mind

 

[Jo]

Ahh just checked my email before closing down to go to bed...

I signed the e-petition yesterday to stop all benefits for those convicted. There has been a response from the government http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/7337

Night night, or should that be morning morning xx

 

[u8myufo]

I think the reasoning is that it will force parents to take responsibility for the actions of their children and serve as a warning to others that the behaviour witnessed recently won't be tolerated.

Ok that is acceptable if the parents themselves are responsible, but there must also be a percentage where the parents are equaly as bad and who are maybe Unemployed, Alcoholics, Prostitutes, drug users or a combination of all, and have given up on most things in life or what it has to offer. There might be some of these kids who are actualy the parents and their children are tucked up in bed being looked after by a friend whilst they are out doing this damage. Let us assume then that " X " amount have been evicted and all the law abiding citizens are jumping for joy. Where exactly does that leave those people? Roaming the streets at night, breaking into empty housing and squatting :shrug: You might also have to consider that if evicted there is a strong possibilty they will have babies or very young infants with them, many of which will have taken no part in the rioting or looting. That then becomes another issue altogether with social services. A few years of this and seeing young kids searching through rubbish tips and sleeping wherever they can will be no more uncommon than Mexico, India or any other country that has washed their hands of it. Personally I think a poll choice of " It depends " would have been good as not all things in life are Black and White.

 

[wibbly]

How many people posting on here have children?

It's an incredibly boring subject that lack of discipline and bleeding heart liberals have destroyed our society and turned us into what we are today.

The fact that offering violence to our children teaches them right from wrong and respect for others. What utter crap! If you bring children up from an early age to respect other people and their property and their belongings and the simple lesson that they do unto others that they want done to them children have respect for others. No violence towards them, no beatings, no fear instilled into them.

I have 3 kids 16,14 & 5. I started off with the idea that I should bring them up the same way that I was, that if they did wrong I should proffer violence towards them - slap the back of their legs, a good old clip round the ear. All that proved to do was make them scared of me, just as it did with my Parents and eventually reticent. You can carp on all you like about not doing you any harm but no one likes being smacked regardless of age. Imagine if someone gave you a backhanded today doing something wrong?

By talking with my kids, explaining right and wrong, making sure they understood what the differences were, making sure they knew what respect is - earning it for themselves and giving it, I have never needed to resort to violence with my kids since. It's a far better option, maybe those that do like to slap their kids around should try it.

As a society we also need to take those kind of methods into the world. In days gone by we had that belief, we preach no respect anymore, but it works both ways from authority and from the kids and young parents who may struggle with their responsibilities.

I'm certainly no bleeding heart liberal, I believe in discipline - but I think respect is a far greater thing to teach - and that does not come from the hand, the fist , the sword or the gun!

 

[u8myufo]

How many people posting on here have children?

It's an incredibly boring subject that lack of discipline and bleeding heart liberals have destroyed our society and turned us into what we are today.

The fact that offering violence to our children teaches them right from wrong and respect for others. What utter crap! If you bring children up from an early age to respect other people and their property and their belongings and the simple lesson that they do unto others that they want done to them children have respect for others. No violence towards them, no beatings, no fear instilled into them.

I have 3 kids 16,14 & 5. I started off with the idea that I should bring them up the same way that I was, that if they did wrong I should proffer violence towards them - slap the back of their legs, a good old clip round the ear. All that proved to do was make them scared of me, just as it did with my Parents and eventually reticent. You can carp on all you like about not doing you any harm but no one likes being smacked regardless of age. Imagine if someone gave you a backhanded today doing something wrong?

By talking with my kids, explaining right and wrong, making sure they understood what the differences were, making sure they knew what respect is - earning it for themselves and giving it, I have never needed to resort to violence with my kids since. It's a far better option, maybe those that do like to slap their kids around should try it.

As a society we also need to take those kind of methods into the world. In days gone by we had that belief, we preach no respect anymore, but it works both ways from authority and from the kids and young parents who may struggle with their responsibilities.

I'm certainly no bleeding heart liberal, I believe in discipline - but I think respect is a far greater thing to teach - and that does not come from the hand, the fist , the sword or the gun!

I have three myself David, two boys 29,28 and a Daughter of 20, all well mannered and holding good jobs, and for the records they did get a slap when it was felt necessary. As for myself I doubt very much if you or your children have been brought up in the same situation as a lot of others. Again I am not defending anybody here but it seems to me that a lot of people on here are making comments whilst using an F/stop of 1.8, they need to look at the whole situation with more DOF. Nobody raises children by a book it is something that us humans have to figure a lot out for ourselves, and deal with a childs tantrums or behaviour as it comes along. You might have two parents who will discipline their child the same way, on the other hand you might well have two people that have themselves been brought up under different rules morals etc. I have witnessed a child being told off or punished and in the eyes of one of the parents the other has taken the wrong approach in dealing with it. A lot of women let kids get away with more imo as they spend more time with the kids in general so are more than likely to be stressed out, anything for a peacefull life it seems, you only have to see them in the supermarkets letting them run ragged and screaming the place down. A lot of these women look like ordinary well dressed people but for some reason feel no need to stick their child in a trolley or have them on a harness, this is where it all starts imo you are letting the child dictate what it wants to do. Bringing up children is something that none of us know how it will turn out untill such times we can look back and say yes we did well.
This might be way off the mark but another thing that has to be considered imo is the fact the last two or three generations of children have been brought up on not only junk food full of chemicals but how about the fact of so many different races getting together and having children :shrug: What do I know about human anatomy, but are things like this actually making a difference of how the human brain is developing, after all the brain is what is responsible for our thoughts and actions as well.

 

[Lindsay D]

Respect is all very well, but for whatever reason it's becoming absent.
You can blame a lot of thing for that, but I think its the lack of anticipation of consequence.
For example, get nicked for stealing a mars bar. Whats the result? Erm, a caution. Mild b...telling off. In one ear, out the other. So, shrug shoulders, and nick 2 mars bars next time. Consequence? Mild telling off. So, now you have created the problem, you've taught someone that you can do things wrong, and lets be honest, they know they are and have nothing more than a telling off.
By the time we get to offence 4 or 5, its not nicking mars bars, its far more serious, but the consequence is the same.
Now, when I was 12, I got caught nicking sweets, and to be honest, it hurt. It hurt a great deal. Have I done it since? No. Why not? Well, simple really, for the same reason I don't try to put my hand in a flame, because I learned at an early age, that it hurts!
Yes, you can look at it the other way, and say well, my father could have sat me down and talked about it. Would have have worked? Nope.
I behaved at school, because I knew that a wack round the backside hurts. A cane would in all probability hurt a great deal more. I didn't need to experience that to know it. In fact, the cane was used once at the school I spent my 3rd/4th/5th/6th year in, it didn't need to be used more, because the threat was enough.
To be fair, there was also another reason why I behaved, and it applied to everyone at the last school I went too. It was a Forces Education School, in Germany. Now, the rules were you misbehaved, and your father got posted back to the UK. That was a disgrace, and cost him money (loosing overseas allowance and duty free living). Strangely, the offending rate of my peers was FAR lower than the equivalent in the UK.
So whats the lesson here?
Simple, when parents are forced to control their children, they can and do.
When there are consequences of actions, then the actions are thought about, and that consequence acts as a deterrent.
Lastly, what detrimental effect did the system I was brought up in have? Answer none. Ex Service children were actively courted by not just the Forces themselves, but the Police, Fire Service, Civil Service and banks to name a few, simply because they were better behaved.

I would agree with that. Just look at the animal world, and how juveniles are firmly yet carefully kept in line so that the group or society can maintain order and ultimately survive and thrive both as individuals and members of a group.

I wonder if you and I were at the same school in Germany - we were stationed at RAF Bruggen at the time.

I've seen behaviour from some of my acquaintances' kids which is frankly shocking, even through those parents are educated professionals. Behaviour which should not go without reprimand, but routinely does. I dread certain people showing up at my home with their kids because I know my place might get damaged or else I'll be criticised for not providing a 'child friendly' environment. When the kids misbehave the parents just smile and shrug, which infuriates me, even when I'm subject to rudeness from their offspring. A good talking to wouldn't go amiss and some appropriate sanctions imposed. As Bernie said, if there's no consequence at all to bad behaviour then it's little wonder the children just get worse and worse, with no respect at all for their parents or any other adults. I stress not all my friends' children are like this, some are impeccably behaved, but the bad contingent is too big these days in my opinion. Whilst I believe it's largely down to the parents and the individual when they are old enough to understand personal responsibility, there will always be cases where peer influence pays a role - the kids susceptible to that are often the ones who know that the penalties at home won't be all that bad.

Edit: I just want to say that I find violence towards children abhorrent, however children do know the difference between being abused and a light smack which in some instances can reinforce the point the parent is forced to make. For that reason I think parents should be allowed to lightly smack their kids if there is no other way of controlling their behaviour. I know that it stopped me when I was naughty, not because it necessarily hurt but because it was embarrassing to be put over your parents' knee.

What Rich describes is endemic now - many parents have given up because they know they can be lenient and nobody will look down on them for it (quite different when I was small) plus it's easier to give the kid what it wants in order to stop the tantrums, which of course is a downward spiral. A lot of parents just don't care about bad behaviour and make excuses for it 'oh, they're just kids, it's normal to smash the place up/scream incessantly etc etc'.

As far as my own social circle goes, the best behaved kids I know are often from single mothers many of whom work extremely hard to instill the values which will give the kid a good moral compass. I see some wealthy families letting their children think they're god's gift to society, no wonder they're complete horrors.

 

[wibbly]

how about the fact of so many different races getting together and having children :shrug: What do I know about human anatomy, but are things like this actually making a difference of how the human brain is developing, after all the brain is what is responsible for our thoughts and actions as well.

You were doing so well, and then you went all Daily Mail on us. What a ridiculous statement! Probably the most ridiculous I've read on here, and I am learning as I read more there are some absolute ****ing clowns on here! :shake:

Are you David Starkey in disguise?

 

[Splog]

You were doing so well, and then you went all Daily Mail on us. What a ridiculous statement! Probably the most ridiculous I've read on here, and I am learning as I read more there are some absolute ****ing clowns on here! :shake:

Are you David Starkey in disguise?

Why is it ridiculous? Please do share the reasoning behind your post.

 

[onona]

How is that not ridiculous, Splog? He's insinuating that mixed race children may have different brain development. That's frankly a rather disturbing remark to make.

 

[Splog]

How is that not ridiculous, Splog? He's insinuating that mixed race children may have different brain development. That's frankly a rather disturbing remark to make.

Maybe they do! I really don't know or care, but it was a reasonable question to ask. I also don't see why it should be 'disturbing' ... Physical changes occur so why should the brain be exempt?

 

[Flash In The Pan]

How is that not ridiculous, Splog? He's insinuating that mixed race children may have different brain development. That's frankly a rather disturbing remark to make.

I think Charles Darwin mooted something similar, mind you so did the Nazis*.....









* not a Godwin-invoking reference

 

[Flash In The Pan]

Interesting that the example of Philadelphia is being highlighted on the tv, with the trouble they've been having along similar (although not so violent) lines as England. They've introduced a 9pm curfew for under-18s, is that what's needed here?

 

[wibbly]

Why is it ridiculous? Please do share the reasoning behind your post.

It's quite simple really, our friend here is alluding to the fact that a lot of societies problems here in the UK are due to interbreeding between different races. Well quite simply this round of rioting was nothing to do with race and nothing to do with what colour was throwing bricks or breaking into shops or looting. It was simple anarchy regardless of colour.

If anything the issue is one of class, and we've got Margaret Thatcher to thank for that one considering she destroyed any class system that did exist and turned everyone into complete wannabes!

I think it's quite safe to assume this has absolutely nothing to do with colour or race or interbreeding :shrug:

 

[Bernie174]

Lindsay D

No, I was up the other end in the oasis of civilisation amongst a sea of Pongos, that was RAF Gutersloh.
Even though the school I went too was infested by the lower orders from the Green machine, they also behaved.
So my question is this. How can a large group of what should according to the Liberal left be disturbed and damaged children due to their itinerant life style, who were also, certainly while in the UK at the time, on the poverty line, dependent upon their fathers rank and specialisation, behave in a civilised way. Commit little in the way of crime, and less in the way of general yobbery, and yet an equivalent group in the UK, not be so bound by that way of behaviour?
The answer is very simple, for us, there were consequences. For the equivalent group, there are not.

 

[Splog]

It's quite simple really, our friend here is alluding to the fact that a lot of societies problems here in the UK are due to interbreeding between different races. Well quite simply this round of rioting was nothing to do with race and nothing to do with what colour was throwing bricks or breaking into shops or looting. It was simple anarchy regardless of colour.

If anything the issue is one of class, and we've got Margaret Thatcher to thank for that one considering she destroyed any class system that did exist and turned everyone into complete wannabes!

I think it's quite safe to assume this has absolutely nothing to do with colour or race or interbreeding :shrug:

Ah well! ..... Not sure how you could get all that from what seemed to me to be a simple, innocent and reasonable question. :shrug:

 

[Oggy]

Under age rioters?

Could someone tell me the minimum age for rioting?

There was a chap on the box (not exactly bursting with O levels) who was bleating that his 16 year old son was out looting while he was asleep - what could he do about it.

My thought was that he had had 16 years to sort the problem and failed.

 

[Flash In The Pan]

Under age rioters?

Could someone tell me the minimum age for rioting?

for the purposes of this poll under 16 years of age

 

[Toggerman]

Edit, I can't be bothered, these types of threads wind me up too much.

 

[u8myufo]

You were doing so well, and then you went all Daily Mail on us. What a ridiculous statement! Probably the most ridiculous I've read on here, and I am learning as I read more there are some absolute ****ing clowns on here! :shake:

Are you David Starkey in disguise?

Well first of all David let us clear one thing up as you quoted in your other reply " I am not your Friend ". I class a friend as someone who actually listens to my views, opinions and will then DISCUSS their reason`s for not believing in anything I have said. You on the other hand have blatently dismissed it without yourself giving any thoughts on the matter, perhaps it is too much for you to string two sentances together :shrug: For your information perhaps you might want to take a look here http://www.academic.marist.edu/mwwatch/fall05/science1.htm Do a search for human brain developement and pick any link you wish, I think you will find they all end up at the same conclusion. Let us try another search shall we? http://www.parentingtoolbox.com/2011/01/07/child-behavior-problems-were-big-concern-for-2010/ Well I just picked one link and look what we have If you had read my post properly you might have realised that I was not saying this was the cause of it all but perhaps it might play a part in it. If any of the information about the brain not reaching maturity untill around the age of 25 is to be believed, what then on a long term basis do you think is happening when teenagers are having children :shrug: I may not have had a private education like yourself but I am clever enough not to buy a daily paper when the same info is already out there on the net I am sorry you feel there are so many clowns on here as you so put it :nuts:, was the proceeding word to Clowns due to a lack of spelling knowledge or is your keyboard broken? One final thing, I may not be the brightest button on TP but I at least have the courtesy to address people by their names if it is available to see under their avatar, and people say the kids of today have no manners :shake::shake:

 

[nilagin]

On BBC News 24 this afternoon a reporter was outside a Manchester court. He said a 12yr old boy had been taken into the police by his mother after she had seen his picture displayed on the side of a police vehicle. The reporter said he had asked the mother if she fel tresponsible for him. He said her reply had been that she felt responsible for him now, but not then at the time of the riots and looting as she can't keep an eye on him 24 hrs a day as (and this is the best bit) she has 11 other kids.:shake:

 

[Flash In The Pan]

You have to wonder where this lad's parents were...

The Telegraph

Matthew Chin, 18, of Darville Road, north London, admitted violent disorder on Holloway Road on August 9 and attempted burglary of a Carphone Warehouse at the same address. With 21 previous appearances before the courts but no prison sentences he was warned he was going to jail.

 

[u8myufo]

You have to wonder where this lad's parents were...

He might be wondering that himself Graham :shrug: And some more sad truth http://world-traveler.hubpages.com/hub/Common-Child-Behavior-Problems

 

[Bernie174]

u8myufo

The problem with physiological theory is that often they turn out to be just that, theory.
How many times have we seen one theory turned on it's head, and the opposite become the norm?
I have policed an inner city slum area, and to be fair, there were far more honest upright kids and parents there than there were bad. It's also true to say that there were about the same proportions of an up market suburb I walked the streets for money in a few years later.
I can't make this into a thesis that can be argued about by theorists, and I'm not going to try to, because I'd rather base my opinion on what I experience in place of a thesis.
I'm afraid, that the cause is simply the consequence argument.
To expand on that, leaving my experience aside, look at a number of those convicted of looting so far. Are they all unemployed? No. Are they in dead end jobs? No. There are nurses, teachers, Soldiers all jobs where you expect the post holders to have a sense of responsibility, yet they got themselves nicked.
Go back to the first night of the rioting, and leaving aside the supposed causes of that per sae, and examine the Police reaction. Nothing. Looting was allowed to happen. Now I accept some of the reasons for that, it was Saturday night, and the chances of calling in the cavalry in the form of off duty officers were slim (personally, if I was off, I didn't answer the phone until I knew who'd called!), so in terms of priorities, I can understand why looting came down the list of priorities.
But that in itself became the problem. On the Sunday morning we were bombarded with images of whole scale looting, and no Police reaction. In other words, no consequence.
Now it doesn't take much of a leap of imagination to see what was going through a lot of peoples minds, simply the thought, 'I can get away with it'.
In short, and I am as guilty of doing it, the problem is being over analysed, its cause is actually simplistic, greed, opportunity and lack of consequence = looting.

 

[u8myufo]

u8myufo

The problem with physiological theory is that often they turn out to be just that, theory.
How many times have we seen one theory turned on it's head, and the opposite become the norm?
I have policed an inner city slum area, and to be fair, there were far more honest upright kids and parents there than there were bad. It's also true to say that there were about the same proportions of an up market suburb I walked the streets for money in a few years later.
I can't make this into a thesis that can be argued about by theorists, and I'm not going to try to, because I'd rather base my opinion on what I experience in place of a thesis.
I'm afraid, that the cause is simply the consequence argument.
To expand on that, leaving my experience aside, look at a number of those convicted of looting so far. Are they all unemployed? No. Are they in dead end jobs? No. There are nurses, teachers, Soldiers all jobs where you expect the post holders to have a sense of responsibility, yet they got themselves nicked.
Go back to the first night of the rioting, and leaving aside the supposed causes of that per sae, and examine the Police reaction. Nothing. Looting was allowed to happen. Now I accept some of the reasons for that, it was Saturday night, and the chances of calling in the cavalry in the form of off duty officers were slim (personally, if I was off, I didn't answer the phone until I knew who'd called!), so in terms of priorities, I can understand why looting came down the list of priorities.
But that in itself became the problem. On the Sunday morning we were bombarded with images of whole scale looting, and no Police reaction. In other words, no consequence.
Now it doesn't take much of a leap of imagination to see what was going through a lot of peoples minds, simply the thought, 'I can get away with it'.
In short, and I am as guilty of doing it, the problem is being over analysed, its cause is actually simplistic, greed, opportunity and lack of consequence = looting.

I can see where you are coming from Bernie and believe myself there is a lot of truth in what you have said. I wonder though whilst they are setting light to buildings and destroying peoples houses or indeed killing others, are they thinking logically " I can get away with this " :shrug: Looks like we will have to wait and se what comes of all this in the end.

 

[wibbly]

Well first of all David let us clear one thing up as you quoted in your other reply " I am not your Friend ". I class a friend as someone who actually listens to my views, opinions and will then DISCUSS their reason`s for not believing in anything I have said. You on the other hand have blatently dismissed it without yourself giving any thoughts on the matter, perhaps it is too much for you to string two sentances together :shrug: For your information perhaps you might want to take a look here http://www.academic.marist.edu/mwwatch/fall05/science1.htm Do a search for human brain developement and pick any link you wish, I think you will find they all end up at the same conclusion. Let us try another search shall we? http://www.parentingtoolbox.com/2011/01/07/child-behavior-problems-were-big-concern-for-2010/ Well I just picked one link and look what we have If you had read my post properly you might have realised that I was not saying this was the cause of it all but perhaps it might play a part in it. If any of the information about the brain not reaching maturity untill around the age of 25 is to be believed, what then on a long term basis do you think is happening when teenagers are having children :shrug: I may not have had a private education like yourself but I am clever enough not to buy a daily paper when the same info is already out there on the net I am sorry you feel there are so many clowns on here as you so put it :nuts:, was the proceeding word to Clowns due to a lack of spelling knowledge or is your keyboard broken? One final thing, I may not be the brightest button on TP but I at least have the courtesy to address people by their names if it is available to see under their avatar, and people say the kids of today have no manners :shake::shake:

What utter rubbish, without actually bothering to respond as to whether or not I need to have the courtesy to call you by your name or not which seems a pretty pathetic attitude, or the fact as to which words I wish to use in any of my posts, you seem to have missed the whole point of what I found so appalling.

how about the fact of so many different races getting together and having children :shrug:

You don't seem to actually make reference to this whatsoever in your response. I wouldn't argue the point with you regarding brain development up to mid 20's. that is well known research material.

I'm assuming you will soon reach this age yourself!

 

[Splog]

u8myufo

<snip>
Now it doesn't take much of a leap of imagination to see what was going through a lot of peoples minds, simply the thought, 'I can get away with it'.
In short, and I am as guilty of doing it, the problem is being over analysed, its cause is actually simplistic, greed, opportunity and lack of consequence = looting.

Indeed! .... But there was also a majority of worthless scum that felt they were able to set fire to shops, peoples homes and assault people. These were the people that started the looting and the violence, the others were simple fools and neither group have a place in a decent society, although I can sympathise for the fools.... The others are scum and should be removed from society.

 

[Flash In The Pan]

Go back to the first night of the rioting, and leaving aside the supposed causes of that per sae, and examine the Police reaction. Nothing. Looting was allowed to happen. Now I accept some of the reasons for that, it was Saturday night, and the chances of calling in the cavalry in the form of off duty officers were slim (personally, if I was off, I didn't answer the phone until I knew who'd called!), so in terms of priorities, I can understand why looting came down the list of priorities.

I think there's probably a lot more behind the police "inaction" than that, most of it political, dictated from on high and more to do with the proposed budget cuts than it simply being Saturday night....

 

[u8myufo]

How is that not ridiculous, Splog? He's insinuating that mixed race children may have different brain development. That's frankly a rather disturbing remark to make.

Why do you class it as disturbing? Although I am glad you used the word "May" All I was trying to put across was the fact that long term does anybody know what changes are taking place in the human brain. Nobody is calling anybody stupid or anything else here. There have been quite a few disturbing comments made over the centuries, I wonder how many of them have become reality :shrug:

What utter rubbish, without actually bothering to respond as to whether or not I need to have the courtesy to call you by your name or not which seems a pretty pathetic attitude, or the fact as to which words I wish to use in any of my posts, you seem to have missed the whole point of what I found so appalling.



You don't seem to actually make reference to this whatsoever in your response. I wouldn't argue the point with you regarding brain development up to mid 20's. that is well known research material.

I'm assuming you will soon reach this age yourself!

If I can quote you from your earlier reply Dave "It's quite simple really, our friend here is alluding to the fact that a lot of societies problems here in the UK are due to
interbreeding between different races. Well quite simply this round of rioting was nothing to do with race and nothing to do with
what colour was throwing bricks or breaking into shops or looting. It was simple anarchy regardless of colour. "

You are right Dave I do not make reference to it at all, it was just something that I thought could be playing a small part in it all, along with no doubt a hundred and one other reasons, however all you have done imo is exaggerated my comment, but like I have said in the past,what do I know? Do you ever sit and listen to what your children`s thoughts and views are on things in life or do they have to show you hard scientific facts and figures before you listen to them :shrug: As for my mental age the Wife might agree with you on that one