What flash brackets for 2 flash set up?

[Phil V]

I’m not sure you’ve been to any nightclub type venues. The ‘ambient’ light is invariably just strobes/coloured disco light type things. It’s generally very dark. There isn’t really enough light to capture much without raising the ISO to stupid levels, which impacts on image quality. I’m hoping to capture the event with atmosphere; lighting that looks like ‘disco’ lighting. Rather than blast daylight balanced white light at everything. Using a coloured filter over the lens or just one flashgun will render everything in that colour pretty much. Could be ok, but not what I’m going for. Hence the desire to use two different colours on the flashes.

Most of the responses you’ve got are from people who’ve shot many kinds of ‘events’ not necessarily in a ‘nightclub’ but hundreds of thousands of images in bars and hotels around dance floors and working around ‘disco lights’.

Obviously we’re also ‘old’ which means you’ll want to aim for something ‘different’. Which is understandable but also we’re offering the benefit of our hard won experience and so for you to treat that advice like only you know what’s required is somewhere between disrespectful and outright ignorance.

Have a minute to step back and consider what you’re trying to achieve, why, and if there might be something in what others are suggesting.

 

[Bridges]

Have a minute to step back and consider what you’re trying to achieve, why, and if there might be something in what others are suggesting.

Ok.

The point of this thread was to actually ask about brackets to hold the flash units. I wasn't asking about alternative lighting methods. I've decided on my set up, I just wanted a bit of feedback on possible solutions to hold the flash units.

This isn’t a human face.
This is what happens when you chase an ‘idea’ without considering the market.

‘Ooh that’s quirky’ is interesting, but not a substitute for ‘ooh thats a good picture of me looking gorgeous’.

But as others have said, I’d be interested in the results. Not just what the images look like, but what effect it has on sales.

I know it's not a human face. It was the first object I grabbed just to do some test shots; I wanted something white so as to see how the two colours worked together. I'm going to continue testing with live subjects. As for 'considering the market', and 'effect on sales'; why on earth have you decided to go off on that tangent? Mystifying.

we’re offering the benefit of our hard won experience and so for you to treat that advice like only you know what’s required is somewhere between disrespectful and outright ignorance.

But I do know what's required (in temrs of lighting); I've put some time, thought and effort into it. I'm not discounting other people's advice, I'm just explaining why their ideas might not/will not work so well. This, I know from _experience_. So I'm not being 'disrespectful' or 'ignorant' in any way. This is just a thread about some flash brackets; no need to get so worked up about it.

Essentially what I'm after is something like this:



But longer.

 

[Faldrax]

The largest I could spot on Amazon was 30cm

https://www.amazon.co.uk/UTEBIT-Extension-Flash-Aluminum-Flash-Tripod-Microphone/dp/B08NSX1R5Z

You may find the simplest solution to get the holder you want is to get one of these, then find someone local who can machine a longer bit of aluminium bar, and transfer the screws over.

 

[swanseamale47]

Slightly off topic (and I'm not having a go at the OP) but a serious question is night clup photography still a thing? (showing my age) back in the day 1970s is was popular but nobody had camera phones. I cant help but wonder if theres still a market.
I can see what the OP's getting at with the lighting, and I'd love to see the finished result when it's finally sorted out. Good luck to you.

 

[Bridges]

The largest I could spot on Amazon was 30cm

https://www.amazon.co.uk/UTEBIT-Extension-Flash-Aluminum-Flash-Tripod-Microphone/dp/B08NSX1R5Z

You may find the simplest solution to get the holder you want is to get one of these, then find someone local who can machine a longer bit of aluminium bar, and transfer the screws over.

Yes, I'm thinking that is probably the best way to get what I need. Because even if I bought 3 of those 30cm bits, when put together, including overlap, they'd still be less than 90cm. I need something to be extendable to at least 1m'. It's annoying that there's loads of otherwise suitable things available. But I am also thinking that as the flash units are pretty light, I might be able to get away with some strips of hardwood; that is easily doable for me as I have woodworking facilities. Even some flat 4mm or so aluminium strips about 30mm wide and 400mm long, would be drillable. It's cutting aluminium that's the issue. I only have a bandsaw for woodworking, not metal. I suppose I could buy a new blade suitable for metal, but then there's heat etc, I don't really want to be doing that.

 

[Fixer]

Actually, perhaps what with all these camera phones these days some artistically lit and dare I say unusual or crazy lighting might well be a refreshing change !!!

 

[Ed Sutton]

Yes, I'm thinking that is probably the best way to get what I need. Because even if I bought 3 of those 30cm bits, when put together, including overlap, they'd still be less than 90cm. I need something to be extendable to at least 1m'. It's annoying that there's loads of otherwise suitable things available. But I am also thinking that as the flash units are pretty light, I might be able to get away with some strips of hardwood; that is easily doable for me as I have woodworking facilities. Even some flat 4mm or so aluminium strips about 30mm wide and 400mm long, would be drillable. It's cutting aluminium that's the issue. I only have a bandsaw for woodworking, not metal. I suppose I could buy a new blade suitable for metal, but then there's heat etc, I don't really want to be doing that.

You can cut thin ally bar with a hacksaw. That's what I've used when bodging some thing up from it.

 

[Bridges]

Slightly off topic (and I'm not having a go at the OP) but a serious question is night clup photography still a thing? (showing my age) back in the day 1970s is was popular but nobody had camera phones. I cant help but wonder if theres still a market.

There's a 'market' for everything; you just need to have a good product. With a good product, you can influence how the market reacts, or create a niche. If you define a genre too narrowly, then it won't allow you to think beyond norms and conventions. It's always good to push the boundaries and explore beyond them. Not saying that will always work, but you see an awful lot of incredibly clichéd photographs where the taker is trying to emulate some 'look' or other, but not applying enough personal input. So you get a lot of stuff that's been done before, and better. I see a lot of 'street' photography this way. I'm not saying what I'll do will be ground-breaking, or even any good necessarily, but hopefully it'll be a lot of fun. If it works it works; if it doesn't, I can fall back on experience of tried and tested approaches. Whether it 'sells' or not is of little concern to me. I will produce something form the event that will work in terms of 'telling the story', regardless.

I'll be experimenting with a technique and look that I've seldom seen used before, let alone in a nightclub type setting. I actually first got the idea when I shot an event on stage in a small club which had LED spotlights which kept changing colour (annoyingly, mostly). But I got a few shots with the red and blue combo I'm thinking about, which actually looked pretty good. But that was with relatively 'static' subjects, not people moving about rapidly. And these were powerful stage spots, not disco lights. I can't be lugging a studio/stage spotlight kit onto a dancefloor, it needs to be small and portable obvs. The nightclub scenario brings with it all manner of major issues for photography. I can't think of many more challenging environments. But I like a challenge; a lot of workI do is in poor/low lighting situations, so I'm used to having to work for it. Whatever I do, it will be compromised in terms of what I'd ultimately like to achieve, but the only real option is a proper staged set up with studio lights, and that will be defeating the object.

 

[Bridges]

Actually, perhaps what with all these camera phones these days some artistically lit and dare I say unusual or crazy lighting might well be a refreshing change !!!

Many years ago, I experimented with using red, green and blue filters over the flash (a nice little Vivitar unit that came with 'creative' colour filters), positioned in different locations. I had to use multiple exposure as I only had one flash! so it was tricky. Film as well, so I needed to get it right without wasting valuable frames. It worked very well; where the colours overlapped of course the resulting highlights were white, but with the coloured 'fringes' in other areas. That's now made me thing of using a 3rd flash. Which complicates things even more....

Re camera 'phones; they've replaced the compact snappy cam, but are perhaps a little more versatile. But you tend to only get 'snaps' in club type settings, as they're not capable of much more in such low light. Having said that, I've had some quite atmospheric and interesting results using my iPhone in such situations; 'Live View' records several frames and composites them, so you get an interesting blurred effect. But yeah; I want to avoid the 'camera 'phone' type picture...

 

[Phil V]

I have a slightly better version of this that’s a great start point.

And add one of these for the second flash

And a couple of ball head cold shoes and you’re good to go

And I’m not ‘worked up’ I’m just pretty much convinced that what you’re proposing will have limited value.

And bluntly I find it mystifying that anyone would want to make a change to a commercial venture without considering customer requirements.

But what do I know eh?

 

[Faldrax]

Yes, I'm thinking that is probably the best way to get what I need. Because even if I bought 3 of those 30cm bits, when put together, including overlap, they'd still be less than 90cm. I need something to be extendable to at least 1m'. It's annoying that there's loads of otherwise suitable things available. But I am also thinking that as the flash units are pretty light, I might be able to get away with some strips of hardwood; that is easily doable for me as I have woodworking facilities. Even some flat 4mm or so aluminium strips about 30mm wide and 400mm long, would be drillable. It's cutting aluminium that's the issue. I only have a bandsaw for woodworking, not metal. I suppose I could buy a new blade suitable for metal, but then there's heat etc, I don't really want to be doing that.

Are you sure having something 1m wide with your camera in the middle is a good idea, particularly in an environment with low lighting and lots of people who have been drinking?
At that size, the chances of people bumping into it in a busy environment would seem to be quite high, and I would be concerned of the risks both to your camera gear (if it was knocked out of your hands) and of injury to those who bump into it.

 

[Bridges]

Are you sure having something 1m wide with your camera in the middle is a good idea, particularly in an environment with low lighting and lots of people who have been drinking?

No not at all! It’s quite frankly daft. But hey; you never get anywhere without trying. The crowd will be very good natured and chilled out anyway, so I’ve no major concerns. I’ll try to stand at the sides and can shoot from the DJ platform, so won’t be in the midst of it all too much. The idea is to get a few good shots early on, then put it all away and just shoot with the camera and one unfiltered flash if necessary. It’ll be just a part of how I intend to capture the night.

 

[Fixer]

Hey, why not at some point in the photoshoot have the humans hold the flash guns for you - there must be some designated drivers you could coerce?

 

[Bridges]

Hey, why not at some point in the photoshoot have the humans hold the flash guns for you - there must be some designated drivers you could coerce?

I had thought of that, for a few shots at least. But that would bring with it other potential problems; people will be, shall we say, 'merry'. I think putting my equipment in the hands of the intoxicated might not be a brilliant plan...

have a slightly better version of this that’s a great start point.

And add one of these for the second flash

I have no idea what those things are because I can't open the links. I already have two mini ballheads that I ordered a couple of days ago; see my previous posts.

And I’m not ‘worked up’ I’m just pretty much convinced that what you’re proposing will have limited value.

And bluntly I find it mystifying that anyone would want to make a change to a commercial venture without considering customer requirements.

I have no idea what you are obsessed with the 'value' of what I'm proposing. I have no idea of what your notion of 'value' is anyway. And I'm mystified by your mystification.

But what do I know eh?

I have no idea.

 

[sk66]

I’m not sure you’ve been to any nightclub type venues. The ‘ambient’ light is invariably just strobes/coloured disco light type things. It’s generally very dark. There isn’t really enough light to capture much without raising the ISO to stupid levels, which impacts on image quality. I’m hoping to capture the event with atmosphere; lighting that looks like ‘disco’ lighting. Rather than blast daylight balanced white light at everything. Using a coloured filter over the lens or just one flashgun will render everything in that colour pretty much. Could be ok, but not what I’m going for. Hence the desire to use two different colours on the flashes.

Been quite a long time since I've gone to clubs... and they all vary in their ambiance/scene/lighting; even by time of night and event/act. So, no... IDK exactly what you are planning on working with; but I would liken it to any other "event" type photography. And for that there are four basic options.

You have "available light" only style- crank the ISO as needed.
You have "paparazzi" style- direct flash on camera; maybe a bounce card- this is what I see as most common in current nightclub photography with flash.
And you have a little more advanced lighting- bounced from walls, 1 flash at arms reach, etc.
Beyond that you are getting more into posed photography and staged (pre-positioned) off-camera lighting... but that's more corporate/sports/wedding type events.

Essentially what I'm after is something like this:

View attachment 401889

But longer.

The largest I am aware of is 90cm (I think)... It's an OWL Bracket. And even at that size it's only intended for dental/macro type photography.

 

[swanseamale47]

If you can shoot from the DJ platform I'd be tempted to mount the lights on stands behind there and avoid the hassle of trying to move around with a possible akward set-up, you could also get better separation of the lights probably. Although it would limit your angle of shooting a lot.
It's going to be a try it and see what works and what doesnt I suspect.

 

[Bridges]

If you can shoot from the DJ platform I'd be tempted to mount the lights on stands behind there and avoid the hassle of trying to move around with a possible akward set-up, you could also get better separation of the lights probably. Although it would limit your angle of shooting a lot.
It's going to be a try it and see what works and what doesnt I suspect.

Yes, but that would be a 'static' set up and of limited use. I need to get 'into' the crowd a bit more.

There is no perfect solution for what I have in mind, is the simple answer. It might not work at all. But we'll see.

The largest I am aware of is 90cm (I think)... It's an OWL Bracket. And even at that size it's only intended for dental/macro type photography.

And it's ridiculously expensive. I'm going to order some 4mm aluminium strips, and drill some holes I think.

 

[Bridges]

Lol! So I've made an error with the SC-24. I thought it had a 3-pin connector to attach to the TTL flash sockets of various TTL cords and some speedlights. It doesn't; it has an 8-pin connector which attaches to the DW-20 finder for the Nikon F4 film camera! Which, by pure coincidence, I also have. Although I have never actually used it. And am unlikley to. Hey ho, it can always go straight back on Ebay. I'm starting to get the feeling a lot of the bits I'm buying will go straight back onto Ebay. What I think I need now, is an AS-10 and a SC-18 TTL cord to connect the two flash guns up for full TTL use. Lordy. How much is that R1C1 set again...?

 

[Bridges]

I've decided to stop titting about and have bought another SB-700 off Ebay. This will allow full wireless off cameraTTL function, so only one flash needs to be connected via the SC-17 cord. Heavier and bulkier, but far more versatile and powerful. And less faffing about with cords and adapters etc. Quite frankly I don't know why I just didn't go with this option from the very beginning. Plus, the coloured filter can be cut to fit inside the clip-on diffuser. Neat and tidy. The SB-700 isn't a huge unit, not as big as the SB-900/910s. Plus will be useful for all sorts.

So now I have a bunch of other bits to have to flog. Sigh...

 

[Bridges]

SB-700 has arrived. I shall try some shots with the two flashguns. One thing that I miss form my DSLRs, is the lack of built in pop-up flash. Such a thing is scoffed at by some, as it's truly not that useful, but it can serve as a wireless flash commander; the SU-800 wireless commander is silly money, even s/h, and the built-in flash can be set so as to not affect the image. The SU-800 is effectively a speedlight without the flash bit; a s/h SB-700 or similar does the same job near enough, but at a fraction of the cost. Annoying.

And... the 'new' SB-700 is DoA. Corrosion on battery contacts. Very annoying. That'll be going back asap. So, the search continues...

 

[swanseamale47]

SB-700 has arrived. I shall try some shots with the two flashguns. One thing that I miss form my DSLRs, is the lack of built in pop-up flash. Such a thing is scoffed at by some, as it's truly not that useful, but it can serve as a wireless flash commander; the SU-800 wireless commander is silly money, even s/h, and the built-in flash can be set so as to not affect the image. The SU-800 is effectively a speedlight without the flash bit; a s/h SB-700 or similar does the same job near enough, but at a fraction of the cost. Annoying.

And... the 'new' SB-700 is DoA. Corrosion on battery contacts. Very annoying. That'll be going back asap. So, the search continues...

They are also very handy if your traveling light (pun intended) and dont want to carry a flash. Ok it's not the best lighting in the world, but the best flash is the one you have with you.

 

[Bridges]

They are also very handy if your traveling light (pun intended) and dont want to carry a flash. Ok it's not the best lighting in the world, but the best flash is the one you have with you.

Yeah, occasionally useful. Only occasionally though. I have used a small homemade diffuser/reflector that adds upwards bounce, it's a lot more pleasing that way. But I wish Nikon had gone with in-body camera IR flash control for the wireless flash system. They now use a radio system but it's hideously expensive compared to other brands' offerings. Nikon appear to be winding their flash provision down somewhat; I suppose they've conceded that other brands offer far more competitive products. I do like the reliability of a Nikon flash though; used all sorts of 3rd party options, and never been completely satisfied. Had 3rd party guns fail on me at critical moments. I understand Godox and a couple of other brands are pretty decent these days though.

Ordered a 'mint' SB-700. Considerably more expensive, but the excellent pics in the description showed it's a very clean, hardly used item. Boxed too. Too many shabby looking guns around; you have no idea how much they've been hammered. Too many with battery contact corrosion too; people need to stop using cheap crap batteries.