what lens for football photography

I

iron maiden

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iron
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i do football photography at the moment in the kent league,
the floodlights are really bad,
i only have a cheap 70-300mm lens (350 pounds)
only goes to 4.5 aperture,

if i brought the canon 70-200mm 2.8 will it make a huge differance,


regards iron
 
yes you really need an f/2.8 lens :) the body you use will also make a difference
 
If you intend to cover football professionally then two body setup will be your ultimate goal. It is possible with one body but restricting. 70-200 f2.8 will give good coverage around the penalty area but struggle beyond espectially under poor floodlights. One possible solution could be the Sigma 120-300f2.8 but it is a bit of a compromise.

You should also be looking at pro sports bodies which offer higher burst speeds, better ISO range and faster focusing. Its a fair bit to layout so look around the S/H market, there are some good bargains out there (I know I'm selling one of my old bodies complete with 2 spare batteries and a rain cover! (y) ) . You'll also need laptop with ftp and learn how to caption images. Lots to lean but plenty of experience and advice on here ;)
 
It'll be OK for goalmouth action and stuff within 30 yards or so of you, so OK if you roam along the touchline and get action on your side of the pitch.

Generally the ideal combination is 2 bodies, one with a 70-200 and one with a 400 2.8, but then you're into big money.

What camera are you using, as 2.8 will get you faster shutter speeds, but if the lights are not good you'll need good high ISO handling as well. You're after at least 1/500th shutter speed.
 
i have a canon 7D,
i have only had it three weeks so still learning about it really,

so i need at least a 70-200mm 2.8

what settings do you use,
av,
 
iron maiden said:
what settings do you use,
av,
Click to expand...

Settings depend on conditions.. av is good for a cloudy day with fast changing lighting.. but not so good for a floodlight match...

The reason your camera has different settings is so you can use different setting depending on what your shooting and the conditions :)
 
Please don't take this the wrong way, but are you running a little before you can walk?

You mention in another thread that you're planning to photograph conference level and send to the papers. My ethos has always been, practice on lower leagues and iron any issues with lenses or processing and editing out BEFORE going to the bigger leagues and the papers.

A surgeon doesn't touch his first body when he's got to operate on it in an emergency...likewise, I don't feel that a fairly new (apologies if i've misunderstood) photographer should photograph their earlier football matches for a client.

Everyone is likely to be disappointed, and if you're very unlucky you may not ever get work from them again.

Running before walking has already been done by members on here, and it often fails...sometimes quite spectacularly.

By all means, ask lots of advice and get lots of lessons but don't go out and ruin your chances early on.

Prior Preparation Prevents Poor Performance.

As I said, don't take this the wrong way, but from the tone of the three threads you've started you seen quite new to sports photography. My advice would be to go and keep practicing A LOT before either a) spending a lot of money on lenses or b) making a fool of yourself with future clients.
 
Does seem odd that in this thread you dont know what lens to use or what setting to use on your camera... but want details how to sell your pictures to the papers in another thread... I suggest you read jamesb84 post at least twice and let it sink in :)
 
james i really understand what you are saying,
and i don't want to ruin any chances,

i want to learn as much as i can,
every match i do i will learn something else,

i am the photographer at herne bay fc,
it only a kent league fc but i want to start from the bottom and like work my way up the ladder,

i want to stay in the kent league until the end of the season and try to learn so much,
mainly from you guys,

since being on this site i have had so much feed back it's been amazing,

i don't want to ruin any chances at all,
i got my licence just mainly for the odd sunday game,
and i really did not think i would get it,

i do want to really learn from you guys if i can,
and i hope i can keep showing you my photos,

i always use m setting,
but people have mainly said av,

this saturday herne bay in the fa vase 4th round,
its going to be cloudy,
and maybe at half time the flood likes will be on,

would you use av,
and people have said use auto iso is that right,

thank you so much for all your advice,
 
KIPAX said:
Does seem odd that in this thread you dont know what lens to use or what setting to use on your camera... but want details how to sell your pictures to the papers in another thread... I suggest you read jamesb84 post at least twice and let it sink in :)
Click to expand...

Only twice??? methinks several times and then sit down and think it out lodgically.

1. Get the right equipment.

2. Learn how to use it.

3. Practice what you want to shoot until you reach the required standard.

4. Then and only then look to sell your images.
 
I liken football photography to Rally Driving, at night, possibly with no lights on around Welsh mountains with 400 foot drops.

You have not even got your licence yet.

I have to use the with respect line otherwise I will come across as mean and nasty again which apparently some people do not like - more about that in the last post - but with respect, if you are talking about using AV, then I always say it takes 2+ seasons making mistake after mistake to polish yourself off to a half decent standard - if you think AV is suitable, Id possibly suggest 4 years before you submit to a newspaper.
 
If you want to learn then submit your photos for C&C on the photo sharing Sports section.

The chaps on here are really helpful.

Yes it will be hard but if you have "what it takes" then with the C&C you get and lots of practise then you'll get there.
 
Not a bad analogy, I thought my surgeon one was ok... ;)

Looking back I'd probably have to agree with that assessment, 4 seasons is probably about right. Your work so far needs some direction and learning but with a good degree of patience I reckon you could improve it to the standard where you can submit to the non-league papers. I would (and I'm sure soccersnapper will agree) encourage you NOT to submit to agencies or approach them until you can produce suitable results for the lower league papers every time.
 
big rob and james,

i have here for your help so any help from anyone hear will be great,
 
iron maiden said:
where's the photo sharing section
Click to expand...
Might actually be a good starting point, post some stuff and the guys can assess your competence level based on what they see and your current gear, however judging by the questions youre asking im not sure youre ready to go to the next level, but hey, everyone has to start somewhere.

My only concern is that like a few before you all the good advice will go in one ear and out the other, listen to it, take it on board and act up on it.
 
jamesb84 said:
Please don't take this the wrong way, but are you running a little before you can walk?

You mention in another thread that you're planning to photograph conference level and send to the papers. My ethos has always been, practice on lower leagues and iron any issues with lenses or processing and editing out BEFORE going to the bigger leagues and the papers.

A surgeon doesn't touch his first body when he's got to operate on it in an emergency...likewise, I don't feel that a fairly new (apologies if i've misunderstood) photographer should photograph their earlier football matches for a client.

Everyone is likely to be disappointed, and if you're very unlucky you may not ever get work from them again.

Running before walking has already been done by members on here, and it often fails...sometimes quite spectacularly.

By all means, ask lots of advice and get lots of lessons but don't go out and ruin your chances early on.

Prior Preparation Prevents Poor Performance.

As I said, don't take this the wrong way, but from the tone of the three threads you've started you seen quite new to sports photography. My advice would be to go and keep practicing A LOT before either a) spending a lot of money on lenses or b) making a fool of yourself with future clients.
Click to expand...

I have to agree with James here

Whilst it is good to have your own license, you need to be in position to make the most of it and avoid doing things the wrong way and making a bad name....NOT a critisism of you but several of us have had problems in the past 12 months so we are a little cautious.

You clearly have a desire to progress and i recognise the same when i started.

All i can say is take time to practice on games where you don't need to produce results and learn the limits of your camera and yourself.

I made the mistake of spending £££££ on kit before i had learnt to walk and unless you have an understanding of the basics the you have the worlds most expensive point and shoot!

Keep shooting and practicing, post shots for crit, take the blunt crit on the chin, improve and keep posting!

You will need to grow a thick skin to succeed as a sports photographer :)
 
Totally agree with the licence theme. I got my BBL licence and soon realised my quality of photo's were not at the higher standard that the licence warranted. Still lots to learn about me and my gear. Was a good taster though and has given me a drive to exceed before I proceed ;)
 
I was just about to link to to Jamesb84's great tutorial, but................its gone!!! judging by the reason for editing, i'm not sure it will be back either!!

I too maybe tried to run before i walk, and in many ways still finding my feet. However i have been lucky along the way and with lots of advice, listening, taking it on board and then trying what i have been told in my next game, i have found my images improved very quickly (that may just be my opinion though, but as someone on here once mentioned, you need to believe your the best photographer at the side of the pitch, there are a lot of egos out there). I now work for an albeit small (but growing) agency and am covering the types of games that 18 months ago i could only dream about!!

So to repeat what many others on here have said, shoot, post images, listen to feedback, take it on board, try advice in your next match, shoot, post images and so on and so forth. Oh and be thick skinned and keep trying!!
 
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Think there's some really good advice here on getting more experience and walk before you can run analogies. My advice would be practice practice practice use what equipment you have to the limit of their capabilities, think about your positioning on the pitch to enable you to shoot with 'clean' backgrounds. If you've built up a relationship with players and staff look to shoot some feature material that won't be reliant on being in possession of a £6k lens . focus on the fans, focus on the build up pie/program sellers. See if you can get to some training sessions at this level they tend to lap up the attention, offer to do club headshots. Look in the newspapers (nationals) if your serious about this as a career look at what gets used day in day out on the back pages think about the position of the photographer to get the shot the best sports togs aren't lucky they read the game and know that player x always peels of to the left in celebration when he scores! ie they make their own luck

A great blog to look at is this one http://amasportsphotoagency.wordpress.com/

I used to work with Matt and he sums up the life of a sports/soccer photographer well and also has some great shots on show.
cheers Dan
 
I'm new to this forum stuff so think I may have gone off topic of the main thread professional soccer togs will usually but not necessarily have the following lenses and equipment

3x DSLR (1 remote camera for behind goal, 1 for short lens, 1 for telephoto)
400mm 2.8 - some use 300 mm but won't give full reach for good 'stock'
70 - 200mm 2.8 - most will use this as their short lens
24 - 70mm 2.8

and possibly a couple of teleconverters

around £20,000 worth of kit. But they all have one thing that can't be bought - passion for the game and a desire to capture it.
 
Dan Law said:
I'm new to this forum stuff so think I may have gone off topic of the main thread professional soccer togs will usually but not necessarily have the following lenses and equipment

3x DSLR (1 remote camera for behind goal, 1 for short lens, 1 for telephoto)
400mm 2.8 - some use 300 mm but won't give full reach for good 'stock'
70 - 200mm 2.8 - most will use this as their short lens
24 - 70mm 2.8

and possibly a couple of teleconverters

around £20,000 worth of kit. But they all have one thing that can't be bought - passion for the game and a desire to capture it.
Click to expand...

3 x 1D Mk III = £3900
400/2.8 = £3600
70-200/2.8 = £800
24-70/2.8 = £700
Converters = £350 n.b. second hand pricing on the above

Total = £9350k

Now obviously you need loads of accessories as well.

Remotes if you have a behind the goal camera
Memory cards
Laptop
3g Dongles from different carriers in case the signal is lousy and there is no WiFi
Pelican case
Stool
Gear insurance
Liability insurance
etc
etc

These all add up.
 
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Thread cleaned. Can we try and keep to the topic at hand please.
 
very interesting to read,
i will stay in the kent league,
learn as much as i can from everyone on here,
then get my photos as good as i can,
i will put them on here for you to see and get feedback,
then i hope one day i will be able to move up to the next level
 
iron maiden said:
very interesting to read,
i will stay in the kent league,
learn as much as i can from everyone on here,
then get my photos as good as i can,
i will put them on here for you to see and get feedback,
then i hope one day i will be able to move up to the next level
Click to expand...

The sooner you post some images the sooner we can identify any faults and/or weaknesses then the sooner your images will improve thus the sooner you can move up to the next level (y)
 
F.S.P. said:
A good combination for football & rugby is the 7D with Canon 100-400mm IS lens or Sigma 120-300mm 2.8 lens.
Click to expand...

Sorry I would have to dissagree. The focusing is not fast enough with the 7D and the Canon 100-400mm is not fast enough either.

Football is mainly played in winter in the UK and as the OP has posted a desire to offer images for sale then he will be shooting under floodlights (and pretty poor ones too) for most of the season so will need at least an aperure of f2.8. The Sigma could be a stop gap but that is not the fastest focusing lens on the market.
 
snapzz said:
Sorry I would have to dissagree. The focusing is not fast enough with the 7D and the Canon 100-400mm is not fast enough either.

Football is mainly played in winter in the UK and as the OP has posted a desire to offer images for sale then he will be shooting under floodlights (and pretty poor ones too) for most of the season so will need at least an aperure of f2.8. The Sigma could be a stop gap but that is not the fastest focusing lens on the market.
Click to expand...

Rugby Times have never had a problem with my images & other punlications in deepest winter with the 100-400mm lens.
Not every one as a f2.8 or f4 300/400 mm cashflow that all.
 
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I met a Pro who shot school sport with the 100-400 and Mk III and sold loads to the school.

He was shooting in good daylight though.
 
F.S.P. said:
Rugby Times have never had a problem with my images & other punlications in deepest winter with the 100-400mm lens.
Not every one as a f2.8 or f4 300/400 mm cashflow that all.
Click to expand...

Then you cant be shooting under poor floodlights with 100-400 f4.5/5.6.
 
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