Why are people buying electric cars?

[cambsno]

Interesting.

EVangelists used to be like vegans but worse, always banging on about their superiority, etc. I've mentioned on here numerous times in the past that a major factor holding back mass adoption of EVs was the owners themselves. Now they have become more mainstream the early adopters influence has been diluted and it's much easier to consider one as transport instead of a lifestyle choice and political statement.

Most of us just want reliable, reasonable transport with comfort, spaciousness and a decent range. Having a manual gearbox would be much nicer, but those are becoming rare on ICE cars too.

Personally I would just do what I wanted - I dont care about how other people feel. I do hate the vegan supremacy you mention but if I was that bothered it wouldn't stop me becoming a vegan. I dont really care about if people like EVs or not but dont like the reluctance to accept new tech or the false and negative statements. Its lazy.

 

[cambsno]

There's a case for saying it's EV's that are doing that. I think there's a good argument for ICE as it can be done well in the developed world without damaging the environment and exploiting the locals and slaves in the developing world plus done right ICE cars can last for a very long time whereas current battery technology arguably does not have that longevity leading to cars needing to be replaced more often. Plus of course and today we do not have the grid capacity to allow everyone to drive EV's.

These are old arguments and the faithful will never be persuaded otherwise. Improvements in battery or other technologies may change the balance but at the mo for me and I'd argue for anyone being honest and looking at the whole picture EV's as they are today are simply not the thing to replace all ICE with.

Are EVs as green as they make out, probably not, but that is not a factor for many. What is a nice benefit is that locally, the air will be better.

But some of your arguments are flawed - there are Teslas that have done hundreds of thousands of miles - there is one on 1.4m miles (although aside from the bodywork it must be like Triggers Broom!). Too early to say about longevity over 10-20 years, but that seems to be the thing with cars - do you really see that many 25 year old ICE compared to newer cars? And as for infrastructure - the day when everyone will have an EV is 30 years+ away. Just because there were not many petrol stations in 1900 doesnt mean we shouldnt have developed the car!

 

[Clive K]

That is not the impression I get.

There are a number of nay-sayers who think that EV is the work of the devil. Thankfully these have dried up but FB used to be full of pics of cars catching fire and people to say "look, another EV" when it was actually an ICE car. So much misinformation.

As I have said, there will be people for who this really doesnt suit or cant afford and thats fine. It does need a small change in habit but EV take less servicing, better performance, have no emissions. If someone says they live in a tower block and do 1,000 miles a week, yes, a diesel is a better option.

If you consider the environmental issues as a whole including the manufacturing, not just the exhaust emmissions, then they have a point. And when you consider that the UK Government will levy extra charges against evs to offset losses in fuel duty then I wouldn't be surprised if the running cost end up being the same. There is an econonomic principle of "what the market will bear". Drivers are used to paying whatever it costs per mile and evs will eventually be taxed to that level.

Evs might be the future. But for many drivers they aren't the now.

 

[Clive K]

Are EVs as green as they make out, probably not, but that is not a factor for many. What is a nice benefit is that locally, the air will be better.

But some of your arguments are flawed - there are Teslas that have done hundreds of thousands of miles - there is one on 1.4m miles (although aside from the bodywork it must be like Triggers Broom!). Too early to say about longevity over 10-20 years, but that seems to be the thing with cars - do you really see that many 25 year old ICE compared to newer cars? And as for infrastructure - the day when everyone will have an EV is 30 years+ away. Just because there were not many petrol stations in 1900 doesnt mean we shouldnt have developed the car!

Selective reasoning is fine for you, but its just a lazy way of not accepting the whole situation.

 

[LeeRatters]

Public EV charging in the UK generally costs 15p to 24p per mile, depending on the speed of the charger and your car's energy efficiency.

That's taken from Google search AI.

I filled the old Escort up on Sunday. Had a rough idea of the mileage done etc

It works out to do about 19 mpg That then worked out to about 40p per mile. So I'm guessing if the everyday car does about 36mpg that's going to be around 20p per mile*

So for the non home charger, there isn't any benefit at all. That's what the pro EV crowd just can't seem to understand. How would an EV benefit me?

That's based on Tesco Momentum 99 E5 fuel. Using standard E10 would obviously make things slightly cheaper per mile.

 

[Mr Perceptive]

That's taken from Google search AI.

I filled the old Escort up on Sunday. Had a rough idea of the mileage done etc

It works out to do about 19 mpg That then worked out to about 40p per mile. So I'm guessing if the everyday car does about 36mpg that's going to be around 20p per mile*

So for the non home charger, there isn't any benefit at all. That's what the pro EV crowd just can't seem to understand. How would an EV benefit me?

That's based on Tesco Momentum 99 E5 fuel. Using standard E10 would obviously make things slightly cheaper per mile.

Lee, in all honesty I don't think anyone has said that if you can't charge at home then you should still buy an EV.

Non-home charging costs are high, but they are becoming more competitive, but this is still a long way off. IMO a personal EV only makes financial sense if you can mostly charge it at home. My trip to Scotland (460 miles) in a my electric Volvo EX30 was only less in cost than taking my previous petrol Volvo XC60, as I could get a full charge at home before leaving, and used a discounted chargers on route (off the motorway). But the 600 miles I covered whilst on holiday didn't cost me any extra as the holiday cottage had a free-EV charger

 

[ancient_mariner]

This discussion is going on in other forums too. For cost comparison purposes, one the EV owners I know drove about 1900km from France to Belgium and back, using public chargers at a total cost of 140 euros including the initial home-charge - bear in mind charging in Europe is often cheaper than the UK. My diesel BMW X1 does a real world 1000 kilometres on about 97 euros of fuel (diesel is 2.35euros/£2 litres here right now). For me to do the same journey would cost about 185 euros.

 

[ancient_mariner]

Personally I would just do what I wanted - I dont care about how other people feel. I do hate the vegan supremacy you mention but if I was that bothered it wouldn't stop me becoming a vegan. I dont really care about if people like EVs or not but dont like the reluctance to accept new tech or the false and negative statements. Its lazy.

For me, life is more than just stuff, and I have options. I don't need to have an EV, and there's nothing about them that is especially desirable so they are therefore just an option. Making choices then allows many factors other than simple function to be at work, and being associated with people who are strongly negative is one such factor.

 

[Steep]

I find it rather tiresome when the little blue man and others try to make out that they are somehow superior to the rest of us because they now drive an ev and that we are either stupid for not buying one or are sabotaging the environment. The reason 30% of new vehicle sales are evs is down to incentives and restrictions on ice manufacture. Simple.

That's in your head, but if you find the discussion or the participants tiresome why do you continue to engage? This is one thread out of many thousands on the forum.
Personally when I find another member's attitude or actions that bad I mute them and get on with my life.

 

[Steep]

Are EVs as green as they make out, probably not, but that is not a factor for many. What is a nice benefit is that locally, the air will be better.

But some of your arguments are flawed - there are Teslas that have done hundreds of thousands of miles - there is one on 1.4m miles (although aside from the bodywork it must be like Triggers Broom!). Too early to say about longevity over 10-20 years, but that seems to be the thing with cars - do you really see that many 25 year old ICE compared to newer cars? And as for infrastructure - the day when everyone will have an EV is 30 years+ away. Just because there were not many petrol stations in 1900 doesnt mean we shouldnt have developed the car!

I think this is pretty much spot on. EV's may not be perfect but they are (imo) better and without any doubt they are getting better in every way, range, price, environmental greenness if that's a word.

 

[Steep]

Speaking of cost, I just had my 1st service done. I bought a service plan to cover the first 3 years including MOT for £550. I'm interested to hear what a similar ice price would be. My car is apparently a mid size SUV and Google says ice service plans can range from 500 to 1300 depending on the car. Pricing possibly changes by different area as well?

 

[ancient_mariner]

Speaking of cost, I just had my 1st service done. I bought a service plan to cover the first 3 years including MOT for £550. I'm interested to hear what a similar ice price would be. My car is apparently a mid size SUV and Google says ice service plans can range from 500 to 1300 depending on the car. Pricing possibly changes by different area as well?

The last service plan I had on the Skoda Karoq was about £420 per year and included 1 service and the MOT each year plus extended warranty. This was good value when they replaced suspension parts in my 6yo 90k miles car.

 

[LeeRatters]

Speaking of cost, I just had my 1st service done. I bought a service plan to cover the first 3 years including MOT for £550. I'm interested to hear what a similar ice price would be. My car is apparently a mid size SUV and Google says ice service plans can range from 500 to 1300 depending on the car. Pricing possibly changes by different area as well?

I've had my current Focus nearly 2 years. It's cost me about £150-200 so far for routine stuff and MOT's.

 

[LeeRatters]

Lee, in all honesty I don't think anyone has said that if you can't charge at home then you should still buy an EV.

Non-home charging costs are high, but they are becoming more competitive, but this is still a long way off. IMO a personal EV only makes financial sense if you can mostly charge it at home. My trip to Scotland (460 miles) in a my electric Volvo EX30 was only less in cost than taking my previous petrol Volvo XC60, as I could get a full charge at home before leaving, and used a discounted chargers on route (off the motorway). But the 600 miles I covered whilst on holiday didn't cost me any extra as the holiday cottage had a free-EV charger

In here, and other places, it's been said many times that an EV is better and we should all be driving them. But when one argues against it like I just did regarding cost (and that's not including the monthly cost of buying or leasing) we are still killing the planet with our selfish views.

 

[BillN_33]

The UK has the highest electricity costs in Europe - that need not be the case and should not be .......apart from EV considerations..........but to reduce the cost of living and particularly to support the less well off

Government policy on many things is inconsistent

they want to reduce pollution so they give you a grant to buy an EV, then take it away and then re-introduce it and then add 3p a mile on top of the most expensive electricity in Europe for you to use it ........ putting some doubt in people's regarding what the government want to achieve and what they will do next

 

[Clive K]

I've had my current Focus nearly 2 years. It's cost me about £150-200 so far for routine stuff and MOT's.

That's about the same as our 2008 Octavia 1.9td and 2010 Honda CR-V D-TECH using synthetic oil and having all the filters changed. We had the Octavia for 11 years and over 120k miles without anything other than a wheel bearing change. The Honda that I have had for 5 years and over 100k miles suffered from DPF problems that was sorted for about £400. Other than that, both needed brake pads just after we bought them and they are still on the cars. The Honda has just short of 200k miles on the clock and the Skoda wasn't far behind when we recently sold it.

I'm currently getting around 48mpg from the 4x4 manual box Honda and the automatic Octavia was doing around 56mpg.

 

[Clive K]

The UK has the highest electricity costs in Europe - that need not be the case and should not be .......apart from EV considerations..........but to reduce the cost of living and particularly to support the less well off

Government policy on many things is inconsistent

they want to reduce pollution so they give you a grant to buy an EV, then take it away and then re-introduce it and then add 3p a mile on top of the most expensive electricity in Europe for you to use it ........ putting some doubt in people's regarding what the government want to achieve and what they will do next

That is a big issue for many. As I said earlier there is an economic principle of pitching the price of something at what the market will bear. Whatever is an acceptable price per mile is what the ev car owners will be charged one way or another. The country needs to recoup revenue on fuel by other means.

Also, remember when we were all being steered towards diesel cars for environmental reasons?

 

[Clive K]

That's in your head, but if you find the discussion or the participants tiresome why do you continue to engage? This is one thread out of many thousands on the forum.
Personally when I find another member's attitude or actions that bad I mute them and get on with my life.

So why are you replying to this?

 

[Steep]

So why are you replying to this?

I'm not the one moaning about people disagreeing with me, that's you in case you forgot.

 

[Clive K]

Do you know of any circumstances were a person or business has not been able to buy an ICE car if they wanted to.

Yes.

 

[cambsno]

The UK has the highest electricity costs in Europe - that need not be the case and should not be .......apart from EV considerations..........but to reduce the cost of living and particularly to support the less well off

Government policy on many things is inconsistent

they want to reduce pollution so they give you a grant to buy an EV, then take it away and then re-introduce it and then add 3p a mile on top of the most expensive electricity in Europe for you to use it ........ putting some doubt in people's regarding what the government want to achieve and what they will do next

Have to agree, their thinking is all messed up.

 

[cambsno]

Do you know of any circumstances were a person or business has not been able to buy an ICE car if they wanted to.

Yes, me!

I wanted to buy a new Aston Martin Vantage - but they took one look at my finances and said goodbye!

 

[gman]

I go off what I can see with my own eyes over what's on the internet, but each to their own.

Street view is dated photographic evidence that everyone can see for themselves, rather than taking someone's word, which is more susceptible to confirmation bias, mistakes, exaggerations, fabrications etc. Just for example.

 

[AndrewFlannigan]

Street view is dated photographic evidence that everyone can see for themselves, rather than taking someone's word, which is more susceptible to confirmation bias, mistakes, exaggerations, fabrications etc. Just for example.

I agree that it should meet that description but wonder just how long it will be before someone finds a hole in the security and manipulates the images to their own benefit...

 

[gman]

I agree that it should meet that description but wonder just how long it will be before someone finds a hole in the security and manipulates the images to their own benefit...

Hack Google and then manipulate goodness knows how many images just to show more EV cars?