Why care about what others think, just enjoy what YOU do

droj said:
Or on the other hand, maybe she was too private a person to embrace social media. But then again, it might've suited her. Who knows?
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Nobody, but I'd be willing to bet is all
 
Cagey75 said:
I bet if FB was around at the time she'd have shared her images a lot more
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Even these days not everyone is on FB, Twitter, Instagram, etc. For instance, this forum is the only 'social media' I've regularly got involved with in the last couple of years (I've nothing against social media, if you like that sort of thing then fine, but I just don't see the point of Twitter, FB, etc.). I have a Flickr account so I can post photos on here, but that's usually used for my film stuff. My digital photos don't normally get shared, other than showing a few friends some photos on my phone screen. Not for any real reason other than I'm not ready to share them yet.

That's the way I want it at the moment, that's the way Vivian Maier may well have wanted it at the time. She's no longer around to ask (something that will inevitably happen to us all one day), I'm just glad someone who knew something about photography found her film archive and stopped it going into a skip (or dumpster as they call them over there).

Perhaps, more pertinently, that's one of the downsides of digital photography... unless someone has the password to your computer and knows you have taken a lot of photos and can be bothered to look through the files, then your work may well be lost before it's even found. How many 'Vivian Maiers' would be discovered after their death these days?
 
Mr Badger said:
Even these days not everyone is on FB, Twitter, Instagram, etc. For instance, this forum is the only 'social media' I've regularly got involved with in the last couple of years (I've nothing against social media, if you like that sort of thing then fine, but I just don't see the point of Twitter, FB, etc.). I have a Flickr account so I can post photos on here, but that's usually used for my film stuff. My digital photos don't normally get shared, other than showing a few friends some photos on my phone screen. Not for any real reason other than I'm not ready to share them yet.

That's the way I want it at the moment, that's the way Vivian Maier may well have wanted it at the time. She's no longer around to ask (something that will inevitably happen to us all one day), I'm just glad someone who knew something about photography found her film archive and stopped it going into a skip (or dumpster as they call them over there).

Perhaps, more pertinently, that's one of the downsides of digital photography... unless someone has the password to your computer and knows you have taken a lot of photos and can be bothered to look through the files, then your work may well be lost before it's even found. How many 'Vivian Maiers' would be discovered after their death these days?
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I was being humorous, I barely look at FB myself
 
I'm old, miserable and grumpy and enjoyinging every minute of it, 60 years young at the end of this month.

Really do not care what people think anymore, do my upmost not to mix with the 'gerneral public' who, the majority these days, get on my nerves.
 
Caerus said:
Most forums have pressure or strong views on gear or how to go about things. Just ignore it.
I am on tons of forums and they are all the same.
If your on a denim forum, you get laughed at if you don't have Japanese Jeans or at least high end ones.
On a watch forum you should have at least a Seiko or better and mechanical not quartz.
You would need to be a Dr or something to afford all the "right" gear for every hobby.
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A1 100% :) :) :)
 
Mr Badger said:
Perhaps, more pertinently, that's one of the downsides of digital photography... unless someone has the password to your computer and knows you have taken a lot of photos and can be bothered to look through the files, then your work may well be lost before it's even found. How many 'Vivian Maiers' would be discovered after their death these days?
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i was talking to my son last night about this very subject
my line of thought was the ultimate goal for a digital photo was to end up as a print
social media is all very well but how many will survive in say another 50 years ?. i'l be long dead by then the chances of anything digital surviving i have stored is going to be very slim at best
 
cosmicma said:
i was talking to my son last night about this very subject
my line of thought was the ultimate goal for a digital photo was to end up as a print
social media is all very well but how many will survive in say another 50 years ?. i'l be long dead by then the chances of anything digital surviving i have stored is going to be very slim at best
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Perhaps not - as the means of storage changes and the ability to compress all images also increases then it is quite possible for photos taken now to survive possibly for hundreds or thousands of years.
Prints in fact are likely to be more ephemeral than a digital image because paper is subject to the ravages of time, decay, damp etc, whereas digital images can be copied ad infinitum down the years and even for millennia to come.
Whether they are worth keeping virtually for ever is, however, something else.
 
petersmart said:
Perhaps not - as the means of storage changes and the ability to compress all images also increases then it is quite possible for photos taken now to survive possibly for hundreds or thousands of years.
Prints in fact are likely to be more ephemeral than a digital image because paper is subject to the ravages of time, decay, damp etc, whereas digital images can be copied ad infinitum down the years and even for millennia to come.
Whether they are worth keeping virtually for ever is, however, something else.
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what you say is very true but my point was more to do with who when i'm gone is going to keep the archive and transfer it to the latest storage as and when it arrives ?
i think there is more chance of photo albums being passed down so to speak than a hard drive / cloud storage full of images
 
People treasure physical prints. Even cracked and faded ones. Same for slides. How many of us have old family photos of people we have never known, and often can't identify?

Digital files stored invisibly will be trashed without even being looked at because it's too much trouble to fire up a device to view them, whereas a box of prints or an album, even a photobook, can be flicked through as soon as it's found.

Of course younger generations might think differently. And when the time comes that people can have digital information uploaded to their brains...
 
Ed Sutton said:
Of course younger generations might think differently. And when the time comes that people can have digital information uploaded to their brains...
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It may happen sooner than you think. The Wikipedia article on cyborgs shows a surprising amount of work is already in progress: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyborg
 
I've been a fan on Frank Zappa since I was young (others may not be, and that's cool).
I must have been in my early teens when I first heard "The meek shall inherit nothing'. One line stuck out immediately.... ' Do what you want to, do what you will, just don't mess up your neighbours thrill'. I always figured if everyone took the same attitude the world would be pretty sweet.
 
CanNik said:
BIn reality who cares and why do people care enough to moan about what other people do, have they nothing better to moan about.
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So how should I respond when someone tells me that pro’s will laugh at me for not shooting in Manual? Do I ignore them? Call them out for bullying? Or just accept that they must be right because they’re you?
 
For my two cents, I think it begins in photography school or a photography class you've taken. The teacher has to grade everyone. So he/she has to draw a comparative line where on one side it is 'good' and the other side it is 'bad'. And, thereafter, everything is in those terms. If you strive to do better as a photographer, then life almost has to be this way. If you strive to become or are a pro it definitely had better be this way or you are soon over taken and out of business by your peers.

But, maybe you are talking beyond these simple terms. As for chatting here, amongst us, it makes for lively conversation. Just think how boring and uninteresting it would be if we all agreed. And, it can get quite harsh sometimes if you let it. Such as when everyone else agrees you are wrong. That is, only you are wrong. But, that's the group-up, bandwagon everyone wants to be a member of. Because being alone and doing it your way gets pretty lonely and frustrating. It is all sort of a strange dynamic of human nature, seems to me. It is a good idea to understand human nature. Goody-two-shoes is not right all the time. Wait your turn. Or go find some where else to play.

What works for me is first understanding the environment we share - writing on forums on the internet. On the internet you can be completely anonymous. You can actually be many different 'people' at the same time. Let's say you are a member of 10 forums. Then you can create 10 different personas, and be which ever you like at any given time. You can be Godzilla on one forum. And, you can be Goldie Locks on another forum. So, whatever mood you are in that night - 'had a tough day at work?' - then you can become Godzilla and go to that forum and take out your frustrations in a good, loud, name calling, brawl. You don't want to be Mr. Poor Me, I'm Autistic all the time. That would be soooo boring. On Friday nights after putting up with the boss all week a good head banging bout with the boys at the bar (pub) was the way I sometimes liked to relax and start my weekend. But, today there is no tolerance for that anymore. So you go find it where you can.
 
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Try shooting LF film…...The concentration and time required to ensure that you don't stuff the shot and waste a sheet of film keeps you too occupied to give a damn about what other people think ….In fact I've yet to receive critical comment from onlookers and other togs, quite the contrary, they are usually fascinated and impressed by the process unfolding infront of their eys!
 
Phil V said:
So how should I respond when someone tells me that pro’s will laugh at me for not shooting in Manual? Do I ignore them? Call them out for bullying? Or just accept that they must be right because they’re you?
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Here's a secret. Don't tell anyone. Most pro's shoot in auto mode. Shush! Don't tell anyone.
 
NickD said:
Do what you want to, do what you will, just don't mess up your neighbours thrill
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Which is a good approach to life. Just remember to wear headphones when you have the music cranked up to 10 or you'll almost certainly "mess up your neighbours thrill".
 
ancient_mariner said:
I suspect about half the forum users remember decimalisation. ;)
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Well, that's your two pennorth! Oops. Yes, I'll admit it, I remember the days when if you got a birthday card with a ten shilling note in it you were in clover!

As for camera modes, I quite often shoot in 'P' mode if I don't need shutter or aperture priority for the shot. Which camera mode settings you use will depend on the type of photography you do, and the lighting conditions you're doing it in, and the effect you want.

I've a small collection of old film cameras to play with that are fully manual (including the focus.. and some of them don't have that option either!), so I know how to drive one. However, in most lighting conditions, a modern multi-zone metering DSLR will get the exposure right a lot quicker and more often than I will, particularly in changing light conditions. So why not let it do the job?

For the avoidance of doubt, there is nothing wrong with using P, A or S and letting the camera do the work if you understand what you're doing and know the limitations and constraints.
 
Mr Badger said:
Yes, I'll admit it, I remember the days when if you got a birthday card with a ten shilling note in it you were in clover!.
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I distinctly remember the Saturday when I went with my dad to the horse races and he came away £50 up. My share was 10s 6d to buy an Airfix Sunderland kit. Once I mentioned my new possession at school I had friends I never knew existed! :woot:
 
CanNik said:
not spend time in Photoshop after stuck in my office all the time as I have to when shooting for a magazine, sometimes being Autistic....... not Artistic, has its benefits :)
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I actually suffer with very mild autism for what it's worth that was diagnosed only very very recently. It's a gift in many ways as it gives me a determination and focus to get things 100% perfect.

I do like, like you to shoot landscapes as I am also not great with people and like you I spend the bulk of my photography time in front of a camera.

But what is a photograph. Your digital camera captures data - your processing suite converts that RAW data into a basic image. If you don't use photoshop or any editing you aren't putting your stamp on the image, rather simply Apples (I use Aperture 3) or Adobes etc interpretation of that RAW data. If you shoot JPEG you are simply getting the camera companies processing (which often happens to be really good) of the image. So you do need to spend some time getting that RAW data to look the way you want it to. That IS making a photograph now using digital cameras. You probably have been doing this a lot longer than me, I know you have. In film you chose the type of film for the task, the paper, the developing fluid, dodge and burn etc. People always spent time in dark rooms getting the final result right. It starts right in camera, but it ends right in processing.

That said - if you do this for a living you need to present your images in a way that you like them - but also a way that appeals to buyers. You have to sell your vision, your composition and subject. If you teach photography (run workshops) you need images that make clients want to book you. I also prefer to be out shooting - processing is the work done to get the end result.
 
DG Phototraining said:
I stand corrected :D

I actually had a Cokin 'Rainbow' filter in the late 70's - it wasn't this good though

Dave
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I think I had one of those and the amazing starburst one... pretty sure they were giveaways on the front of a magazine and they pretty much went into the camera bag and never saw the light of day.
 
TheBigYin said:
pretty much went into the camera bag and never saw the light of day.
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Just as welI. Let me bore you with a story from the spring of 1969.

I found a circular starbust filter in the junk box at the camera shop that was once in Canfield Gardens opposte the Finchley Road John Barnes that is now Waitrose. They wanted two bob for it and I handed over the money and scooted out of the shop before they changed their minds. Having read all about these great new filters in Photography Magazine I couldn't wait to try it and I knew just the subject: Hampstead's White Stone Pond. I taped the filter to the lens of my old Nikon, chose my spot and waited for the sun to drop to the right height. My intention was to get a seriously arty contre jour shot of the sun over the other side of the pond. Having banged off a whole cassette of FP3 (I was spending money like water that day) I rushed home to develop and contact print the film.

It had worked better than I could have hoped and I chose 3 sufficiently different versions to print (borderless glazed 8x10 of course). Straight into a card backed envelope with a stamped return label (which would never be needed I was sure) and off to a well known and art oriented photography magazine of the time. A week or so later it returned with a letter that said (more or less): "having discussed this with my staff I must inform you with regret that our policy of not publishing manipulated pictures means it is not suitable to our needs. I do congratulate you on the high quality of the work but our readers would immediately spot that this is not a photograph that could ever be taken normally and must be a dark room trick".

...and people complain that they've been accused of Photoshopping their pictures!

:tumbleweed:
 
Nod said:
I don't really care what others think BUT, if I was selling my services, I would need to take my customers' opinions into account. Keep the customers happy and if the customer is yourself, good luck!
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Not just the customer but also industry peers to benchmark the value for money being provided. Example: a local Wedding Photographer with the sound bite-

‘if you want affordable high quality full day's professional coverage & you find it for less than my no strings one off charge, (fixed again this year at just £500 all in) good luck & hope you are not disappointed because there are so many charlatans out their trying to undercut experienced professionals like myself.”

With sample of the product delivered

View: https://youtu.be/sDZMDFs7yXQ
 
Baz777 said:
I'm old, miserable and grumpy and enjoyinging every minute of it, 60 years young at the end of this month.

Really do not care what people think anymore, do my upmost not to mix with the 'gerneral public' who, the majority these days, get on my nerves.
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Me too Barry
 
jamesev said:
Not just the customer but also industry peers to benchmark the value for money being provided. Example: a local Wedding Photographer with the sound bite-

‘if you want affordable high quality full day's professional coverage & you find it for less than my no strings one off charge, (fixed again this year at just £500 all in) good luck & hope you are not disappointed because there are so many charlatans out their trying to undercut experienced professionals like myself.”

With sample of the product delivered

View: https://youtu.be/sDZMDFs7yXQ
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He's got amazing consistency - I bet he was delivering the exact same product in the '70's. :exit:
 
ancient_mariner said:
Maybe they are for £500, but TBH even at that price I'd expect them all to be in focus.
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When I stopped doing weddings (around 1980) the 12, 24 or 36 shot album was still the standard offering from the studios in Devon and Somerset although some of the newcomers were beginning to push the "reportage" style. It was all very formal with the photographer acting as master of ceremonies (vicar/priest permitting) at the church and liasing with the actual MC at the reception if there was one. The price included the album and the studio filled it with the pictures specified according to the deal. The studio I worked with didn't step outside the package though I took on a few less formal deals when the studio had no bookings for me. Because the system was so formalised we could take on up to 3 weddings per operator if they were 12 picture deals and the times worked out right. One memorable June weekend I managed 4 weddings as did the boss and another operator after our fourth operator got rushed to hospital with a burst appendix.

I can already hear the sharp intake of breath from current wedding photographers but hey! the past is, as they say, a different country. :naughty:
 
We are constantly seeking that acknowledgement from others, we want that LIKE on Facebook and Instagram, each Like gives the brain a little chemical kick, a little dose of euphoria, it is like a drug, literally, our brain is just a massive chemistry set anyway. So biologically we are wired to want that LIKE. We seek that affirmation.

Psychologically, no doubt it is unhealthy to seek that constantly, it does nothing for your self-esteem, the happiness it brings isn’t real, the adoration you get from it is as fleeting as any 15mins of fame.

But we all want it, because we are wired that way.
 
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Raymond Lin said:
We are constantly seeking that acknowledgement from others, we want that LIKE on Facebook and Instagram, each Like gives the brain a little chemical kick, a little dose of euphoria, it is like a drug, literally, our brain is just a massive chemistry set anyway. So biologically we are wired to want that LIKE. We seek that affirmation.

Psychologically, no doubt it is unhealthy to seek that constantly, it does nothing for your self-esteem, the happiness it brings isn’t real, the adoration you get from it is as fleeting as any 15mins of fame.

But we all want it, because we are wired that way.
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Isn’t that what benchmarking is, although I agree that the current method of benchmarking/acceptance is through social media where the vast majority aren’t qualified to benchmark score and do so more from emotional perspective rather than an expert one
 
sirch said:
And ultimately that is probably why the OP started this thread.

TBH some of us need far less validation than others.
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That begs the question why. Have they studied what constitutes a good photo / set of photos for their market, after all there’s a potential raft of difference between a technically brilliant photo and a commercially brilliant one.

Of course on the flip side you could get some needing less validation because they are deluded and don’t want to hear that they are far from proficient,
 
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