Windows networking problems

RobertP said:
You have people here that know a lot more about networking than I do so I'll leave them to it.
The only thing I'd throw into the pot is firewall
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:plus1:
When I had issues connecting my laptop to the desktops, nas etc, it was the firewall restrictions that were causing the problems. Firewall on each pc needed to be altered to allow the throughput of data.
 
Keith W said:
You will have extreme fun trying to network a win7 computer with any other computer not running win7

I have never managed it to this day which sort of confirms what some people say, that it can't be done
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I am networked with XP,XP64,Vista 64 Home Premium,Win7 Starter and Win7 Ultimate.

Although it did take a wee bit of head-scratching at times!
 
hmm where is it getting popcorn from..

what router and ISP are you using?

to turn off ipv6 (youll need to be logged on as an admin account), from network and sharing center -> change adapter settings -> right click LAN or Wireless depending on what youre using and select properties -> should see internet protocol version 6, untick and OK.
 
neil_g said:
id turn off ipv6 also, it may not resolve this issue but its something else that can go wrong.
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Someone else (not on TP) who is helping me with this also suggested turning off IPv6.

So what I've done on my W7 machine is:
> Explorer
> Network
> Network and sharing centre
> Change adapter settings
> Local area connection
> Change settings of this connection
> UNCHECK Internet Protocol Version 6 (TCP/IPv6)
> OK

I've rebooted and checked that the setting has stuck.

Result: No change to the pingability. I can still ping pc-2 (W7) and laptop (XP) by name, but not pc-1 (XP) or server.
 
RobertP said:
Brings back memories of similar problems with master browser on our work network but that was all XP.

You have people here that know a lot more about networking than I do so I'll leave them to it.

I have XP and even an old windows98 computer talking to windows 7 at home with no problems so it can be done.

The only thing I'd throw into the pot is firewall and anti virus settings. Kaspersky that I use has a habit of blocking network shares until settings are changed to allow the lan to be trusted.
Click to expand...

Must agree about firewalls and security, surprised it wasn't mentioned before now;)
 
Very good point - turn the firewall off on every machine, on the Windows 7 machines, turn off all 3 firewalls.

See if this makes any difference.

XP firewalls tend to block incoming traffic, Windows 7 can and will block outgoing as well as incoming traffic.
 
Mikesphotaes said:
I am networked with XP,XP64,Vista 64 Home Premium,Win7 Starter and Win7 Ultimate.

Although it did take a wee bit of head-scratching at times!
Click to expand...

Ditto Win 7 & XP - it certainly can be done.
 
Dale_d3100 said:
The last part is 'ping LFH-3' will use DNS to resolve the name. If you open up a My Computer Window and type in '\\LFH-3' it will resolve the name using WINS. To you its the same, but the computer uses 2 different methods to return the information.

For \\computername to work correctly, each computer should have a share made available.
Click to expand...
OK, I understand now. As you say, to me it looks the same, but there are two different name-resolution processes going on behind the scenes.

I've tried it, and from my PC I can browse files on \\pc-2 (W7) and \\laptop (XP). But I can't browse files on \\pc-1 (XP) or \\server. So that's basically the same set of results I had with the ping tests.

Just as a check, I can browse files on the server if I connect to it via its IP address. Interestingly though, I can't browse files on pc-1 if I try to connect to it via its IP address. And I can't even ping it via its IP address. Very odd.
 
does PC-1 have any file shares?
 
OK, I've turned off the Windows firewall on my PC (pc-3, W7), pc-1 (XP), laptop (XP) and server.

From my PC I still can't ping server by name. However, if I try pinging pc-1 by name, something very slightly different happens. Instead of telling me the name isn't recognised, it tries to ping but times out.

Also, if I try to browse files on pc-1, it tries to connect. I don't think I have the right user permissions to actually connect to anything on there, but at least it's recognising that there is a machine there when I try to browse files on \\pc-1.

So that's half a step forward, perhaps. But still no change with regard to the server...
 
What can the server ping?

I've not used WHS, do the clients have to subscribe to it/join it?
 
Dale_d3100 said:
does PC-1 have any file shares?
Click to expand...
Yes.

But I can't connect to them from my PC. It tells me that I "might not have permission to use this network resource" and it suggests that possible reasons are blank passwords not allowed (I don't know how to set that), logon hour restrictions (I'm pretty sure that's not the case) or a policy restriction has been enforced (no idea what that means).
 
Stewart,

Can you install/try what I suggested on the XP machines:

To see if this is a possible cause, open up the Network tab on Explorer on the Win 7 machine. Does it see all the PCs there? Does it populate the list quickly or does it search for computers (if it populates quickly, it is because the list is being provided by the Master Browser)? What does opening the Network Places->Windows Network (or whatever it is) on the XP machine show?

To debug this further, you need to use browstat.exe available from Msoft here: http://www.microsoft.com/download/en....aspx?id=18546

This only works on XP. Run the command: browstat status <domain> where <domain> is your XP domain name.

If you want some (not so) light background reading, take a look here: http://www.chicagotech.net/browser.htm and also here: http://www.chicagotech.net/troubleshootingbrowser.htm

Post the output of the browstat command and I'll have a look at it.
 
StewartR said:
Yes.

But I can't connect to them from my PC. It tells me that I "might not have permission to use this network resource" and it suggests that possible reasons are blank passwords not allowed (I don't know how to set that), logon hour restrictions (I'm pretty sure that's not the case) or a policy restriction has been enforced (no idea what that means).
Click to expand...

To access a computer remotely, the user on the PC must have a password set.

With a workgroup it is best to set the same user ID and password on all machines as this will help connect to each other without any additional security prompts.
 
arad85 said:
... open up the Network tab on Explorer on the Win 7 machine. Does it see all the PCs there? Does it populate the list quickly or does it search for computers (if it populates quickly, it is because the list is being provided by the Master Browser)? What does opening the Network Places->Windows Network (or whatever it is) on the XP machine show?
Click to expand...
OK....

On my W7 machine, I've opened My Computer and clicked on Network in the left-hand-pane. In the right-hand pane it has the following:
  • Under the 'Computers' heading: pc-3 (this one), pc-2 (the other W7 machine), and laptop. It doesn't show pc-1 (the XP desktop).
  • Under the 'Network infrastructure' heading: the Linksys WAG354G wireless router.
  • Under the 'Other devices' heading: the server. Interestingly it is identified here by its name.
This list populated instantaneously.

On the XP laptop, I've opened My Computer and clicked on My Network Places > Entire Network > Microsoft Windows Network > Workgroup. Initially it listed just the file shares on itself, but then very quickly indeed - less than 2 seconds - it also listed the three desktop machines (pc-1 running XP, and pc-2 and pc-3 running W7). It didn't list the server. But when I browsed files on the server by entering \\server in the address bar, it added the server to the list.
 
Have all the machines done all the Windows updates?

Run Windows update on all machines until there are no more updates.

Other Devices - it is probably seeing the Server as a media device or media server (different to file sharing)
 
arad85 said:
To debug this further, you need to use browstat.exe available from Msoft here: http://www.microsoft.com/download/en/details.aspx?id=18546

This only works on XP. Run the command: browstat status <domain> where <domain> is your XP domain name.

Post the output of the browstat command and I'll have a look at it.
Click to expand...
OK. I've installed browstat on the XP laptop and its output is as follows:
C:\Documents and Settings\LensesForHire>browstat status


Status for domain WORKGROUP on transport \Device\NetBT_Tcpip_{AF770667-17B5-4E07
-B3D5-0076EB8BD234}
Browsing is active on domain.
Master browser name is: LFH-3
Could not connect to registry, error = 53 Unable to determine build of br
owser master: 53
\\\\LFH-3 . Version:06.01 Flags: 51003 NT POTENTIAL MASTER
1 backup servers retrieved from master LFH-3
\\LFH-3
There are 4 servers in domain WORKGROUP on transport \Device\NetBT_Tcpip_{AF
770667-17B5-4E07-B3D5-0076EB8BD234}
There are 1 domains in domain WORKGROUP on transport \Device\NetBT_Tcpip_{AF
770667-17B5-4E07-B3D5-0076EB8BD234}

C:\Documents and Settings\LensesForHire>browstat status


Status for domain WORKGROUP on transport \Device\NetBT_Tcpip_{AF770667-17B5-4E07
-B3D5-0076EB8BD234}
Browsing is active on domain.
Master browser name is: LFH-2
Could not connect to registry, error = 53 Unable to determine build of br
owser master: 53
\\\\LFH-2 . Version:06.01 Flags: 51007 NT POTENTIAL MASTER
1 backup servers retrieved from master LFH-2
\\LFH-2
There are 4 servers in domain WORKGROUP on transport \Device\NetBT_Tcpip_{AF
770667-17B5-4E07-B3D5-0076EB8BD234}
There are 1 domains in domain WORKGROUP on transport \Device\NetBT_Tcpip_{AF
770667-17B5-4E07-B3D5-0076EB8BD234}
Click to expand...

Does that make any sense?
 
Last edited:
StewartR said:
On my W7 machine, I've opened My Computer and clicked on Network in the left-hand-pane. In the right-hand pane it has the following:
  • Under the 'Computers' heading: pc-3 (this one), pc-2 (the other W7 machine), and laptop. It doesn't show pc-1 (the XP desktop).
  • Under the 'Network infrastructure' heading: the Linksys WAG354G wireless router.
  • Under the 'Other devices' heading: the server. Interestingly it is identified here by its name.
This list populated instantaneously.
Click to expand...

Dale_d3100 said:
Other Devices - it is probably seeing the Server as a media device or media server (different to file sharing)
Click to expand...

Well, the server is also listed as a media server under the 'Media devices' heading. But I didn't mention that because I didn't think it was relevant.

It's very annoying that on this screen it recognises the server by name, but I can't access it by name!
 
There loads of different protocols that operate, some broadcast (DLNA for media) so everyone picks it up, DNS need a central server (your router) and WINS which can be a nightmare (it either self builds and manages which can be a nightmare or you setup a WINS server and it works perfectly).

A long term solution would be to upgrade from WHS 2003 to Small Business Server 2011 ESSENTIALS. It is a very similar to WHS, but features centralised security and will provide DHCP and DNS and all of these problems will dissapear. it will also make fax, printer and file sharing easier.
 
Dale_d3100 said:
Windows Home Server is a very cut down version of Server with all the domain parts removed, however it can manage parts of the network for you...

http://www.dummies.com/how-to/content/how-to-add-a-windows-7-computer-to-a-windows-home-.html
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Ha ha. The very first instruction in that piece reads:

Start your favorite Web browser and open the server.

If you call your WHS server something other than server, substitute that name into the URL: http://server:55000. Your browser goes directly to your Windows Home Server server’s Connector Setup page, using your local network.
Click to expand...

I can't do that, because my PC doesn't recognise the server's name! (But I can do it using the server's IP address.)
 
Are the machines kept up to date with Windows Update?
 
Just an update.

It's definitely a windows master browser issue. At the moment, the server thinks it's in the workgroup WORKGROUP on its own. The 3 desktops and 1 laptop think that they are in the workgroup WORKGROUP together, without the server. We have two workgroups with the same name on the same network at the moment.

Just about to try turning off computer browsers and rebooting the whole network, to see if we can force the server to become the master browser.
 
I wondered how long it would be before some type of on site was required! :-D

Remoting or are you actually there?
 
still not convinced on the browser issue, browser service relies on DNS/NETBIOS to resolve names.

quote ms:

Once a browse list is presented to a client computer, the client computer must resolve the NetBIOS name entry of any computer listed in order to view shared resources. Therefore, all client computers must be able to resolve the Internet Protocol (IP) address of all computers in the domain. In most networks configurations, this means that the distributed WINS infrastructure must be working properly.
Click to expand...
 
Get a domain involved, centralised security makes it all simpler :)

I hate workgroups if you need to rely on it.
 
This is one of those threads where you have to keep checking back to see if it is sorted yet and what the problem was :)
 
We have the following

3 workstations w-1, w-2, w-3, a laptop and a server

laptop & w-1 run XP
w-2 and w-3 run Win 7
server runs WHS2003

laptop, w-1, w-2 and w-3 can all ping each other via their netbios names
laptop & w-1 (i.e. the xp machines) can ping server via its netbios name

server cannot ping anything via netbios name
w-2 and w-3 cannot ping server via netbios name

everything can ping everything else via ip addresses (one of the workstations had a firewall stopping pings getting through). It appears Win7 has a stricter NETBIOS strategy. If the machine isn't in the Master Browser list, it doesn't appear to try and resolve it. The key question to resolve at the moment is why the system thinks it has 2 identically named workgroups on the same subnet.
 
PS. The pinging/net name resolution is completely consistent with the master browser configuration.
 
Do the XP machines have any software on them that is related to the WHS? Do the Windows 7 machines need anything installing before they can connect to the WHS?

Have they all got the correct date and time and in the correct time zone to within a minute or 2 of each other (can cause random issues)
 
WHS is just a stripped back version of 2003/2008 server (depending on which WHS it is) so shouldnt need anything.

did we ever figure out where the "popcorn" dns suffix was coming from either?
 
neil_g said:
WHS is just a stripped back version of 2003/2008 server (depending on which WHS it is) so shouldnt need anything.

did we ever figure out where the "popcorn" dns suffix was coming from either?
Click to expand...
Actually, this gives me an idea.

The server has a static IP config, the others have dynamic IP config. The DNS suffix may be configured in the router and give that suffix to any DHCP client. The server may not have that and may think it is in a different network....

Stranger things.

Stewart: can you post a ipconfig /all from the server?

Also, which router is it?
 
neil_g said:
WHS is just a stripped back version of 2003/2008 server (depending on which WHS it is) so shouldnt need anything.

did we ever figure out where the "popcorn" dns suffix was coming from either?
Click to expand...

shouldn't is never a good word ;)
 
arad85 said:
Actually, this gives me an idea.

The server has a static IP config, the others have dynamic IP config. The DNS suffix may be configured in the router and give that suffix to any DHCP client. The server may not have that and may think it is in a different network....

Stranger things.

Stewart: can you post a ipconfig /all from the server?

Also, which router is it?
Click to expand...

its certainly worth a shot. if it needs to be on a particular then reserve it on DHCP.
 
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