Canon 7D picture editing

IanC_UK

IanC_UK

TPer Emeritus
Messages
12,863
Name
Ian Cook
Edit My Images
Yes
Hi all, i have been suffering some major frustrations with my new 7D, and have been trying several different things to get over these, and wondering what experiences other 7D users are having.

This all started with a couple of pics i posted in Birds, that were rightly criticised, and ive been racking my brains trying to work out why.

I have included some pictures edited with different software and can see a massive difference, and would be interested to know how you are editing your shots and if you are happy as you think you should be with the results :)

I have turned off all of the settings in camera for Automatic Lighting Optimizer, Highlight Tone Priority, all sharpening has been turned off, all noise reduction is turned off, i have reduced the ISO choice from 1.3rd stop to full stop only, so i only have ISO 100,200,400,800,1600 and 3200 available.

I used to edit with LR2.6, then send the image to CS4, this seemed incredibly noisy and not as sharp as i expected it to be. I have now tried Canon DPP and then sent to CS4 for final editing. I have no edited levels, brightness, contrast, colour saturation etc, i have also not run noise reduction at all.

Here are some example pics, i have over cropped some of them, and some are at ISO 1600, with my new regime i am more than happy with some of the results i am achieving now, but would still be interested to hear from other users.

Edited in LR and CS4 (there is a slight colour cast difference between these 2 and this is only down to the RAW conversion)
Coal_Tit_LR.jpg


Edited in DPP and CS4
Coal_Tit.jpg


Edited in LR2.6 and CS4
Goldfinch5.jpg


Edited in DPP and CS4 (has had a slight tweak in levels)
Goldfinch6.jpg


This was done in DPP and CS4 as well
Yellowhammer2.jpg
 
Can see what you mean about a difference. You should have seen the results from lightroom2.5. Me I just use lightroom 2.6.
 
When I had my 50D I was using CS3, with results I was happy with. Got the 7D and the same processing was utter crap. Struggled with the whole damn camera if the truth be known. Now using PSE8 and I am far happier with the processing of this.

Don't know what the difference has been, as I am still doing the same things (Levels, contrast etc). Perhaps it's all in my head and I am really mad? Heaven only knows, but it worked for me!!

I convert from raw to tiff in DPP and then process the tiff files.
 
firstly AMAZING photos especially the goldfinch really spectacular :thumbs: regarding editing I use Gimp but to be honest i usually try to get it perfect in camera & usually only change them to B&W
 
I'm having the same problems Ian, shots that should be fine, taken in good light, are looking a little soft and lacking any real colour definition....they're making my 300/2.8 look like a 75-300. I initially went back checked the MA but it's fine.

I'll watch from the wings to see what transpires but I'll stick to the 1D3 for the time being.

Bob
 
It's weirdI'm failing so see the extra resolution benefits because the images seem noisier than my 40D at 100% and there are people who say you shouldn't compare a 100% crop from the 40D to 7D but I want to take advantage of the extra resolution to crop more!

I also tried shooting in jpeg at the weekend instead of raw with in camera sharpening increased by +2 from default and I'm still finding my shots aren't as sharp as I'm used to and that's using the 135L

I solely use Lightroom to edit my photos to minimise time spent, but I too have been wondering what's going on
 
Thanks for this Ian. So that's now you and CT suggesting I try DPP.

I have to say I've had some pleasing results from the 7D in good light but have been less impressed with images processed in LR in poorer light. I was using the 7D a lot but I've recently been using the 1Ds again a lot more. I'll give the DPP route a go if I can find the disk!

Paul
 
Must admit, have had mixed results with editing the raw from the 7D, have had some shots that I edited in elements, and when in the main work area after finishing the raw side of it, a tweek to the levels made them very noisy, try to doi it all in raw now as getting better results like that, also have noticed with night shots I could not get tru colour and had to use DPP to get them right.
 
im going to stick my hand up too, disappointed with results from the 50d, raw and jpeg, I dont feel that the picture quality is any better(if not, worse) than the 20d. Might give DPP a try and see if that gives me better results. It seems to me that there is a lack of clarity?
 
Oh dear.. I wonder if anyone has had this problem with new Nikon's.. like the D300s ect...


:shrug:








:naughty:
 
its swings and roundabouts, much like graphics cards...Nikon currently make the better cameras, but it wasnt that long ago that they didnt. Its frustrating more than anything, you KNOW that the lens you have is capable of sharp, clear images, but you cant reproduce them easily
 
I'm glad you're getting better results Ian. :thumbs:

Experiment with the Picture Style settings which make a huge difference to the colour and appearance of RAW images in DPP. I've taken to using 'Faithful' recently with the sharpening set to 3 instead of the default 0. I find that gives the most accurate colour rendition.

NR is set to Standard in camera. I don't do any NR or sharpening at the RAW stage and output the image to PSP as a TIFF.

I'm sure you'll get to grips with it mate. Unfortunately I'm not gonna be about much for a few days, my bro is reaching the end of a long struggle and was whipped into a terminal hospice over Christmas, so togging has to take a back seat for a while.

I'll be about when the dust settles if you need any help. :thumbs:
 
I don't have LR and just do straight RAW conversions in DPP. Nothing done with this shot it's a 100% crop at 800 ISO which I'm quite happy with. Used the 15-85 lens

1/160 f5.6 ISO 800
http://SPAM/c3whur/dec/Img_0488c.jpg
 
Interesting reading and a vast difference in the images Ian.

I wonder if the 5d2 would benefit too from DPP, I've never installed the software for any of the Canon dSLR's i've owned.
 
Would be good if you could post a straight conversion of the Coal Tit & Goldie Ian, maybe link them to a 1024 size if poss, better still a link to the original Raw file :shrug: No matter what prog I open an image up in it always looks different anyway, I usually stick to DPP for converting from Raw and then everything else in CS4, I know I use the
50D but would be interesting to see if what you are not happy with can be sorted in editing without worrying too much about in camera :shrug: btw the Yellowhammer looks great to me :thumbs:
 
Ive recently changed from a 450D to a 7D. Have been using photoshop elements 7 throughout my editing life, and I havent really noticed any difference on how it process the new raw files.
 
u8myufo said:
Would be good if you could post a straight conversion of the Coal Tit & Goldie Ian, maybe link them to a 1024 size if poss, better still a link to the original Raw file :shrug: No matter what prog I open an image up in it always looks different anyway, I usually stick to DPP for converting from Raw and then everything else in CS4, I know I use the
50D but would be interesting to see if what you are not happy with can be sorted in editing without worrying too much about in camera :shrug: btw the Yellowhammer looks great to me :thumbs:
Click to expand...

Just popping out to get some more test shots, but will see about linking to a raw or larger file later today, im pretty sure it is the editing now and not the camera, ive got hold of a beta copy of lightroom 3 and will try that as well see if they have changed anything significant in that as well !

Thanks all for the helpful responses though, is the first time a camera has seemed like a massive learning curve, even the 1d Mk3 didnt seem this hard to learn lol :)
 
IanC_UK said:
Just popping out to get some more test shots, but will see about linking to a raw or larger file later today, im pretty sure it is the editing now and not the camera, ive got hold of a beta copy of lightroom 3 and will try that as well see if they have changed anything significant in that as well !

Thanks all for the helpful responses though, is the first time a camera has seemed like a massive learning curve, even the 1d Mk3 didnt seem this hard to learn lol :)
Click to expand...

:thumbs: Tbh Ian I felt a bit down in the dumps after upgrading from the
450D to the 50D. There just seemed less to worry about configuration wise with the 450D and my images seemed better. I think in the majority of cases it is editing that makes you dissapointed with the final image, well it was in my case :) Look forward to some more shots from you :thumbs:
 
I've recently got a 7D.

After reading the long threads by CT et al on the 50D I have turned off Auto Lighting Optimiser, Highlight Tone Priority etc. High ISO Noise Reduction is set to standard.

I have Lightroom 1.x so am converting to DNG and then using my usual workflow which is Lightroom.

Personally I have not had any problems and am pleased with noise performance...

(compared to my 400D).

How do I do a 100% crop? I have some images taken at ISO1600 / 2000 - recent wedding which I was pleased with.
 
Hi - I know these are different images to yours (taken at a mate's wedding, high ISO + bounced flash) but basically shot in raw, converted to DNG, imported into LR. Basic tweaks for white balance, small crops, straighten, levels etc then export at 800px:


1/100 f/2.8 ISO 2000 @ 70mm (flash bounced off ceiling)

IMG_0253.jpg



1/60 f/2.0 ISO 1600 @ 50mm (flash bounced off ceiling)

IMG_0297.jpg
 
Freester said:
How do I do a 100% crop? I have some images taken at ISO1600 / 2000 - recent wedding which I was pleased with.
Click to expand...

Open the image at full file size - 100% or 1:1 whatever you want to call it. Using the crop tool, chop out a portion of the image 800 pixels or less on the longest side. Save as new image. (make sure you alter the file name so it doesn't overwrite the original) That's it - post it up!
 
swag72 said:
I convert from raw to tiff in DPP and then process the tiff files.
Click to expand...

Me too. Always used to use ACR in Potatoshop with my 30D, but I've struggled to find anything that handles the RAW files better than DPP with the 7D.

Some of my in-camera settings, if anyone's interested:

Auto lighting optimizer - off
ISO expansion - off
Long exp. noise reduction - off
High iso speed noise red. - disable
Highlight tone priority - enable

The image below is straight out of the camera, shot in Faithful mode. It's gone through DPP to save as a TIFF, then into PS to resize. I haven't made any adjustments - no sharpening, NR or levels etc, 1/3200, f5.6, iso400 with the 400mm f5.6L

birdy05.jpg


I have rarely used the noise reduction in DPP, only for a couple of iso800 shots that I wanted a bit more smoothness from, but I'd rather tweak it there myself if needs be than let the camera do it. I have stopped using Faithful now in favour of Neutral in the camera and making adjustments as required in DPP but to be honest, they're only minor if at all, usually just a bit of sharpening. The Standard shooting mode is actually pretty good on it's own if you're averse to playing.

OP - I notice in the first image that you used a 300mm f2.8L IS with a 1.4TC, yet your shutter speed is only 1/100th. Is it possible that a faster shutter speed may have helped with the sharpness here?
 
There is a lot of talk about the 1dsmk3, 7D and to some extent the 50D with people not having much sucess with LR converting RAW, I'm one who thinks the RAW conversion on my 1dsmk3 is crap with LR & ACR, DPP does a much better job of it. I also beta test for Phase One and C1pro 5 is way better than LR & ACR, but just not quite upto DPP, its just a pitty DPP has such an awful interface.
 
IanC_UK said:
To be honest i dont care if Nikon do or dont, i own Canon kit, it wasnt intended to be a canon v Nikon thread but somebody always has to turn them into one, joke or not !
Click to expand...

Not entering the silly N v C debate Ian. But I have to PP the RAW files from my D700 totally differently to how I did my D300`s.

And because I don`t hace CS4, then I use LR to import them before changing to DNG, I think it is a LR problem, but I ain`t no expert on PP,so i`ll just happily read what others think.
 
fracster said:
Not entering the silly N v C debate Ian. But I have to PP the RAW files from my D700 totally differently to how I did my D300`s.

And because I don`t hace CS4, then I use LR to import them before changing to DNG, I think it is a LR problem, but I ain`t no expert on PP,so i`ll just happily read what others think.
Click to expand...

Slightly more helpful than the other post though Ade :) thanks for the input, i thought it was me going mad, but it seems its wider spread than that :)

Thanks to everybody else for the suggestions etc, i have tried Lightroom 3 and its worse than LR2.6 at the moment, admittedly its beta, but i believe (and maybe wrong) that ACR and the LR Raw interface are almost the same which may be why adding DPP to the mix removes the excessive noise but still allows CS4 to edit the tiff normally as it no longer relies on Adobes raw conversion software ? Just a theory but it seems to be right ?
 
Sorry to go away a bit from topic but I shot all day on sunday in Auto ISO and jpeg (for once...to try camera processing). Maybe I was a bit harsh with my criticism but we'll see. Looking at a lot of my photos it was choosing ISO's of 1000 to 2000 so the noise I'm seeing isn't that bad considering, and with the shutter speeds it was allowing I think I could've got lower than that quite easily and thus lower ISO.

So I'll give it more time
 
I use DPP then convert to a tiff and do odd bits in either CS2 or elements i have had no problems
Regards
Lost
 
Chaz Photos said:
is the ACR in LR the same as in PS? I find ACR much better then DPP
Click to expand...

Yes its the same engine, in LR3Beta they have introduced a new engine (you can select between the v2 or v3 engine) and a whole host of enhancements to try to compete with C1pro.
 
Ahh I worked out how to 100% crop - thanks CT.

I must say I was really pleased with the noise when viewing at the native resolution. However at 100% the noise is quite apparent.

That said I'm no pixel peeper usually...

ISO 1600

IMG_0297_100pc.jpg



ISO2000

100pc_crop.jpg
 
Ian, as one of the critics of your last couple of posts - I must say that the images are an improvement! However they still don't have the same level of quality to them as your older work.

The coal tit still looks very flat and soft/ever so slightly out of focus. This may or may not have something to do with the dull conditions, and lack of contrast in the scene.. however this is addressed in the next photo..

My comments still stand on the goldfinch... I understand you haven't been able to reshoot it, but the birds head still appears a little blurry. It is however somewhat improved over the original version!

The yellowhammer on the other hand, is certainly the pick of the bunch and looks pretty much spot on!

Have you calibrated your lenses using the micro adjustments? No matter how much I look I just can't see the ultimate sharpness that you have been able to produce in the past - compare these with some of your kingfisher work and you'll see the difference!

If it were just the coal tit, I'd be inclined to put it down to the conditions but the goldfinch just makes me question my thoughts..
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top