Cutting Negatives

[Blasted]

Is there a particularly good technique for cutting negatives into strips? I've just been trying to cut some rolled up 35mm and was a tad worried about clipping the image.

Thanks

 

[Carl Hall]

I always just use a decent pair of scissors and take my time cutting them

 

[Blasted]

I always just use a decent pair of scissors and take my time cutting them

I was hoping to hear that there was some sort of magic guillotine type machine.

 

[ChrisR]

I always worry about it, too, specially when it's hanging vertically in the shower cubicle after processing. But as Carl says, good scissors, good light, take your time.

I haven't cut a rolled up film for some time, but expect I will sometime have to as I've found some rolled-up negatives my father shot! I suspect flattening after cutting will work best. I use a nice heavy photo book for the purpose (HCB Photographer in my case).

 

[ChrisR]

I was hoping to hear that there was some sort of magic guillotine type machine.

I've watched the folk in ASDA doing it, they do have a machine that helps them sleeve and cut at the same time... but it's 4 feet tall and presumably part of the minilab kit!

 

[Ceejay]

There is . Speed graphic sell them product code apsc £4.95 + p/p. Perfect straight cut.
35mm only. First call sell one for med. format, bit dearer though but good quality.

C

 

[Kevin Allan]

Now that I've seen the picture at the SpeedGraphic web site (http://www.speedgraphic.co.uk/mounts_and_magazines/ap_slide_cutter_35mm/1475_p.html) I realise I already have one somewhere - now to look for it !

However if you have your film hanging up to dry, I think you'll have to take it down and put in on flat surface to use the cutter, and the risk of getting more dust on your negs in that process may be worse than the risk of cutting the negs in the wrong place.

 

[ChrisR]

What we need is for @stevelmx5 to design and KickStart a derivative of that guillotine that incorporates a descending hanger for the dried film and a way to get the cut section into the sleeve... when I watched the ASDA folk doing it, it was all so flat it went in perfectly easily (and cut after going in the sleeve, or perhaps while a little bit was protruding)...

Sorry Steve, perhaps we should stop inventing things for you to invent for us...

 

[StephenM]

I use scissors for 35mm and roll film when dealing with negatives. With slides for mounting I use a mounting press with built in cutter.

My negatives are filed in pages for a ring binder so I have to "cut and stuff". I suppose that, if armed with one of the long sleeves that holds a complete film, it would be possible to slide the whole film in and then cut film and sleeve to length. As a pessimist, I'd worry about a small piece of grit at the top of the sleeve scoring the entire length of the film as I passed it down.

The simplest solution though is to use cut film rather than the miniature sizes

 

[stevelmx5]

What we need is for @stevelmx5 to design and KickStart a derivative of that guillotine that incorporates a descending hanger for the dried film and a way to get the cut section into the sleeve... when I watched the ASDA folk doing it, it was all so flat it went in perfectly easily (and cut after going in the sleeve, or perhaps while a little bit was protruding)...

Sorry Steve, perhaps we should stop inventing things for you to invent for us...

Hmmm, thanks for another idea going round my head Chris!

How about a new film hanging unit that has a standard clip built in to the top then a wire each side which has a sliding guillotine which acts as a bottom weight to keep the film flat until it's dry. Once it's dry, slide the guillotine up and cut your negatives into however many you want to fit into your holders.

You can keep the negatives hung downwards to dry flat and no need to have a flat surface big enough to lay out your entire roll of film.

 

[angelpaaul]

How about a new film hanging unit that has a standard clip built in to the top then a wire each side which has a sliding guillotine which acts as a bottom weight to keep the film flat until it's dry. Once it's dry, slide the guillotine up and cut your negatives into however many you want to fit into your holders.

You can keep the negatives hung downwards to dry flat and no need to have a flat surface big enough to lay out your entire roll of film.

Well, what are you waiting for?

 

[stevelmx5]

Well, I've been wracking my brain and looking at any existing options for hangers with built in guillotine (which I can't find). While I was searching I started doodling an alternative cutter that's the same simple pressed steel as a leader cutter or the tabletop cutters for movie reels;





If I laser cut a very simple shape from 1mm steel plate it should have enough flex to create the guillotine effect and cut cleanly across the film (either 135/120 with the same cutter) but also it could be clipped to the bottom of the film when it's wet to replace the bottom weight. If the clip was rotated 90 degrees it could be lightly attached to the bottom of the film using the flex without actually cutting the film.



When you want to cut the film you can just hold it tight with one hand at the bottom (still hanging from the top clip) and clip it with the other hand. The cutout shape at the bottom is so light can get through the film from behind to let you see where the frame lines are before you cut.

If you want to fit the negatives straight into sheet holders you could simple slot them into holder then clip them at the top meaning you don't have to touch the negative at all before it goes into the holder.

 

[stevelmx5]

This is how it would clip to the bottom of the film without cutting it;

 

[stevelmx5]

I was just wondering if this is more complex than it needs to be when a simple pair of scissors can cut the film just as well?

The main issue I can see is that there's always the risk of cutting in the wrong place if you can't see the frame edge properly. The best way around that is to have light coming from behind the film so you can see the edges so would it be useful building in a small strip of light to the cutter so it directly sits behind the film?

 

[RaglanSurf]

The light source would be really useful to me, particularly when cutting non-standard neg sizes or negs that are very indistinct at the edges.

Or a holder that held exactly 6 frames of 35mm and allowed positioning of the cut point over a light.

 

[stevelmx5]

I've got some Electroluminescent ('EL') panels at home from when I was testing out light sources for my lightbox. They would be ideal because they're no thicker than a piece of paper and can be powered with a basic button cell. The battery holder could be mounted to the back of the cutter and the EL panel stuck to the front lower section so the film passes over the top of it. The benefit of using a light source and a single cutter is you're then not restricted to a certain film/size as well as keeping the size and weight down.

 

[stevelmx5]

 

[Nod]

I was just wondering if this is more complex than it needs to be when a simple pair of scissors can cut the film just as well?

The main issue I can see is that there's always the risk of cutting in the wrong place if you can't see the frame edge properly. The best way around that is to have light coming from behind the film so you can see the edges so would it be useful building in a small strip of light to the cutter so it directly sits behind the film?

I was going to add the backlighter as a refinement to your original concept but I see I don't have to!

 

[stevelmx5]

How about something like this?

 

[Paulmag]

I always just use a decent pair of scissors and take my time cutting them

Works for me and has for 50yrs I also never use film squeegees prefer to run film through my fingers never scratched one yet.

Look forward to seeing if you get something made

 

[stevelmx5]

I've always used scissors too but I'm not exactly delicate with my negatives on the whole so maybe I'm not the target market :0). I reckon if the parts were bought in bulk direct from China it would keep the cost below £5-7. From the UK it's looking at nearer £10 without the actual steel.

I'll try and put one together with the EL panel I've got to see how well it works anyway.

 

[ChrisR]

I too have difficulties seeing the inter-negative gap when looking sideways at a film hanging in the door of the shower cabinet. I think for a tenner I would buy one of these, assuming one could see where the cut is going to occur, which could be by matching the negative against a guide mark further down the cutter body. This would be easy for 135 but more tricky for 120 as frame spacing is more variable (even given the 4.5, 6 and 9 cm thing).

 

[Carl Hall]

inter-negative gap

wow, "inter-negative gap", that's an awesome phrase! I'm going to write that one down for future use

 

[stevelmx5]

I'm working on the plan to have the EL panel directly below the film at the cutting edge which would make it easy to see the end of a negative and the cut can then be made accordingly. The only marking would be in relation to where the cut would occur so it could be used on any film type and to cut any number of negatives depending on your negative sleeves.

I'm not 100% sure how clean the cut would be from the basic steel guillotine (although film splicers have used similar for a long time) so I've also looked at using both a rotary cutting blade that's slid across the negatives and also a simple razor blade on a sprung section that can be squeezed together by hand to cut.





I'm trying to use the best option for single handed use so you can hold the bottom of the negatives with the other hand. My concern with the rotary blade is that it has to be a wider unit to accommodate an 18mm blade which is the smallest I can currently find online online (although the disk from a glass cutting tool may also work and be much smaller). With an 18mm blade it may be too wide to use comfortably.

The razor blade design is more complex but still relatively simple with a couple of bolts/springs and would be easier to use one handed. The risk is that a standard blade is 60mm wide, as is 120 film but there is some margin so it could be 61/62 leading to the cut being too narrow. I'll test it out later when I get home.

Whichever cutting method used, there would be an angled bevel machined into each half of the cutter to create a channel for the film. As well as keeping the negative square for the cut, it also reduces the risk of it kinking when passed through the unit.

 

[Asha]

Is there a particularly good technique for cutting negatives into strips? I've just been trying to cut some rolled up 35mm and was a tad worried about clipping the image.

Cut with scissors in good light.

There is . Speed graphic sell them product code apsc £4.95 + p/p. Perfect straight cut.

C

Gimmick gadget which no doubt serves a purpose if you can be a***d digging it out and faffing about.....like most "aides", in my hands it would likely be used half a dozen tmes then find itself at a car boot sale after I came across it and realised it hadn't been used in years ....Oh my, how many gadgets have found their merry way out of my home like that!

Forget the idea and .....
Cut with scissors in good light.

However if you have your film hanging up to dry, I think you'll have to take it down and put in on flat surface to use the cutter, and the risk of getting more dust on your negs in that process may be worse than the risk of cutting the negs in the wrong place.

A very good point which gives reason to stick with the the above mentioned method:
Cut with scissors in good light.


In conclusion, simply Cut with scissors in good light Has that not already been mentioned?!!

 

[stevelmx5]

I'll put you down for one when I've made them Asha ;0)

 

[Asha]

I'll put you down for one when I've made them Asha ;0)

I'll look forward to receiving one in August as a birthday pressie......then car boot it for a small fortune in spring next year

 

[ChrisR]

Something you might not have thought of, @stevelmx5 ... along with a few others, I would not be able to operate such a device right handed (can't do a close pincer grip... some folk are just plain southpaws!). Now the obvious idea would be to turn the whole thing round and thread it the other way, so moving the cutting grip from the right to the left. That would probably be easy to do, but if not thought of in advance might come up against some glitch, like the clamping effect not working that way round, or the right/left-handed scissor effect (or something... my design imagination is not good enough). (Not by any means suggesting you're designing this for me, just for a general population that includes a few people like me!)

 

[Asha]

^^ triple price for lefties^^

 

[stevelmx5]

Good point Chris. Whilst the cutter could be flipped around to use the guillotine with your left hand it's not going to help with the EL panel being on the back ;0). If I use either the rotary cutter or Stanley blade it wouldn't matter which hand you used because the film is passed through the cutter from the back and can be cut using left or right hand.

 

[stevelmx5]

Ok, how about this seeing as we all know how to use scissors and it even caters for left and right handers without a battery in sight :0)



I've cut this out of black card and glued white paper to the top to give a brighter background. It would be neater cut from a single piece of white card.

It can be slid over your hanging negatives and has enough friction to stay in place without risking scratches on the negatives.

For the left handers showing the guide in the correct place with blank negative between the two markers. The negatives can then be cut with scissors while holding the bottom of the roll with your other hand.



This shows the marker in the wrong place;



Simply flip it over to use for right handers;



Also works for 35mm or any other film size



I'm considering making this design open source ;0)

 

[stevelmx5]

If white card isn't bright enough, the entire guide could be cut out of an electroluminescent panel and a small battery pack fitted to the rear. Alternatively, a smaller EL panel could be cut to just go under the middle guide section.

 

[ChrisR]

Dead simple, I like it! Would need careful choice of materials, I think; there would be a tendency to close the scissors too much, cutting into the end of the V slot. Want something that would resist cutting without blunting or twisting the scissors?

 

[RumpFace]

Having processed and cut up and mounted a great many films of all kinds of formats I can honestly say the best way is to sit down (it does make a difference) at a bench or table covered with soft cloth, thin bladed but sharp scissors and cut it that way. We used to have an auto loader for 35mm but it jammed constantly and was more trouble than it was worth.
Start at the end and work backwards, that's how we do it.

 

[stevelmx5]

Dead simple, I like it! Would need careful choice of materials, I think; there would be a tendency to close the scissors too much, cutting into the end of the V slot. Want something that would resist cutting without blunting or twisting the scissors?

I reckon something like either 1-1.5mm acrylic that could be laser cut or stamped steel plate would be best. The lasercut acrylic would be cheaper to produce though.

 

[Asha]

Ok, how about this seeing as we all know how to use scissors and it even caters for left and right handers without a battery in sight :0)

Brilliantly simple ...You could be an inventer Steve

and best of all it would still require that the film is........:

"Cut with scissors in good light"

 

[stevelmx5]

Hey, I never said I wouldn't use scissors..I'm just helping with the issue of seeing where to cut ;0)

 

[Asha]

..I'm just helping with the issue of seeing where to cut ;0)

OK let's upgrade a tad:

"Cut with scissors in good light whilst wearing specs"

 

[excalibur2]

I'd go for just scissors as well, but did find it took a small bit of experience to get the cut exactly in the middle...then I could do it blindfolded

 

[Nod]

Viz style top tip...

Shoot a blank frame every 6th shot so there's a nice big place to cut into strips. (135 obviously!)