Disabled photographers society

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How many of you just joined the DPS to use the 'free' studio? I think its probably all of you which is probably not much more than an handful, causing all this bother and you are now throwing your toys out of the pram cos youv'e been rumbled or, maybe you were using the studio for commercial gain and its your pockets thats been hit? I don't know, am only asking a question? Its seems that theres a Chief of Staff, maybe a few cronies who sometimes seem to be members and sometimes not .thats weird as well. Theres an underlying bitterness amongst you that sems a bit weird, especially Chris, get a life................. If I had you in any sort of organisation you would have been kicked into touch yonks since. I think you have nothing better to do than stir it. Jan and her husband seem to have got you sussed.
Well done the DPS for getting your house in order it can't be easy with these types ready to put the boot in just to make a point or boost their self importance. I hope it does go into litigation just to teach them a thing or two.................. for goodness sake move on,
take up knitting.
 
mrsb1964 said:
How many of you just joined the DPS to use the 'free' studio? I think its probably all of you which is probably not much more than an handful, causing all this bother and you are now throwing your toys out of the pram cos youv'e been rumbled or, maybe you were using the studio for commercial gain and its your pockets thats been hit? I don't know, am only asking a question? Its seems that theres a Chief of Staff, maybe a few cronies who sometimes seem to be members and sometimes not .thats weird as well. Theres an underlying bitterness amongst you that sems a bit weird, especially Chris, get a life................. If I had you in any sort of organisation you would have been kicked into touch yonks since. I think you have nothing better to do than stir it. Jan and her husband seem to have got you sussed.
Well done the DPS for getting your house in order it can't be easy with these types ready to put the boot in just to make a point or boost their self importance. I hope it does go into litigation just to teach them a thing or two.................. for goodness sake move on,
take up knitting.
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a couple of things for you to consider. Personal insults and rudeness will not be tolerated here, so please dont do it.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion, respect theirs and make valid points, not just sniping

Some of the posters here helped out at the place and were actively involved. Where you? Why come here and poke the wasp nest?
 
:clap::clap::clap::clap:
Well done that lady!!!
Just about hit the nail on the head I think...I'm glad someone else spoke up..:bonk:
 
I'm finding it really interesting that there are all these "new members" that have just joined TP, adding comments to this post! mmmm, perhaps it should be the DPS you should be commenting to not TP!
 
Matty thank you for your comments. May I make clear I certainly have no financial interest in the studio whatsoever apart from paying towards its cost on the four occassions I used it along with the other DPS members there. People are missing the other side of this and that is around how the volunteers and members supported members new to photography, it wasn't all about a studio. Having been one of those who did help others I find the earlier thread particularly insulting. I sincerely hope through all of this I have not sunk to the level of insulting individuals - infact in previous threads I have asked explicitly that that did not happen even knowing that peoples views would be very different to my own.


Chris
 
quite right smithphoto, its not a good light that is being cast by some of the comments. I have no affiliation with the DPS or have any personal preference for my forum members, both sides are coming across badly in some posts, and the 'new' people registering just to shove a sticks in the nest does come across as a rather poor. There is an opportunity for the DPS and its members to strike out and create a new path, ideas can be thrashed around and im pretty sure studios could be found that would offer days and facilities for use by members, why not use the chance to make a difference instead of petty in-fighting, name calling and mudslinging
 
Densley said:
Matty thank you for your comments. May I make clear I certainly have no financial interest in the studio whatsoever apart from paying towards its cost on the four occassions I used it along with the other DPS members there. People are missing the other side of this and that is around how the volunteers and members supported members new to photography, it wasn't all about a studio. Having been one of those who did help others I find the earlier thread particularly insulting. I sincerely hope through all of this I have not sunk to the level of insulting individuals - infact in previous threads I have asked explicitly that that did not happen even knowing that peoples views would be very different to my own.


Chris
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perhaps now is the time for you and the DPS to start talking about what YOU can do for them, and how they can help you and your co-volunteers?
 
Matty,

Would wholly agree, earlier this week I emailed the DPS asking that a thread was placed on their forum asking that DPS members actively joined this forum to discuss this issue properly - I would prefer that discussion actualy happened in private within the DPS but to date that does not appear to have been possible. It would be great if that could be a joint statement preferably with some extremely strong ground rules about behaviour, I am waiting for a reply to that email. #There has to be a constructive discussion here, the very sad part of this is that this society does some very good work in ALL of its present and past parts.

Chris
 
smithphoto said:
I'm finding it really interesting that there are all these "new members" that have just joined TP, adding comments to this post! mmmm, perhaps it should be the DPS you should be commenting to not TP!
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I believe that they have been banned from the DPS website which is why this discussion came here.
Just a point:-
I received a letter from the departing Chairman where she 'instructed' people to come to this website, that's why I came here in the first place..
 
Jan

Please note, my join date is shown as March 2009 that was actually six weeks prior to me having any knowledge of this issue, you will also see that I have posted work in the forums elsewhere on this site. I note your TP join date is June 2009.

Shirley encouraged people to have their say on this issue through the joining of this thread, effectively you have taken her up on that. I am pretty certain she did not ask YOU to supprt her only to participate in the discussion

Chris.
 
I would like to congragulate Densley, on still trying to keep the thread constructive, It is a shame that the DPS issue has come to an outside forum and other publications , but all the other areas seem to have been closed. Leaving quite a few members very sad and angry.
It would be great if the DPS moved forward and consider regional divisions, surly this could only benifit the national membership. It will be interesting to see if they reply to these questions
 
Something I just learned which I wasn't aware of until now.

During the time the Vassall Centre was open it was only advertised to DPS members as being available one day a month. Was everyone aware of that? I was of the impression that the place was open every day for DPS membership.

The average attendance was fifteen people. Some of the members from Bristol did congregate there on 18 occasions but this was not an official DPS event just a local get together organised by the former Chairman.

So, for the priviledge of one day a month when the studio was used by the DPS the DPS were expected to fund it to the tune of £5200 a year??

Now I know that I am not a bit surprised that the DPS took it upon themselves to close the centre down there and then. How can that be fair to the national membership who were paying for it and getting nothing at all in return??

Now you guys that have been making so much fuss, PLEASE justify one day a month at the astronomical amount of £5200. Many disabled people receive only state benefits yet you expected them to subsidise you? Oh now Come on, get real.. I am absolutely horrified now I've found this out!!!!!!!
 
Sorry Jan incorrect.

The studio ran a monthly studio day o n the second Saturday of the month that was open to any member of the DPS, It ran weekly Photoshop courses, The studio was then available to ANY member of the DPS to use as they wished. Because the studio was run by a charity it could not charge for that use but could only request a donation. The studio was also advertised for use outside of the DPS, obviously to help raise funds for it.

As to the costing your figures would appear to differ from those in the orignal letter letter sent to current members of the DPS when the studio closed. Now this suprises me because if you had seen that original letter you would not now be finding out the cost of running the studio. The cost of running the studio was estimated at the figure you quote but that is then offset by donations and receipts for use of it. The aim would be to raise more donations to help offset its costs. If the studio continued to make a loss and bankrupcy appeared possible then it would have to act, but, they only needed to give three months notice to quit so could act at any time.

Are you aware that taking account of the set up costs and the first years running of the studio amounting to a total of around £7200 plus all os the costs of doing the normal things the DPS does, the DPS still managed to make an operating SURPLUS last year. As I have said elsewhere, this is not a rich charity but having looked at its publically available accounts one sees that over the last five years its financial position has moved from an operating loss to profit.

Chris
 
But that still doesn't justify the expenditure for just one day a month when the DPS officially used the studio does it? Why should members of the DPS pay for that? How many studio days around the country would £5200 have paid for so that all the members could make use of them?
Fair to all?? I think not!!!!!!!
The other other thing in your own reply which surprises me is that the place was open to non members, yet at the same time, genuinely disabled people had no access to it because they were two far away. You've not answered the question.. why should the DPS subsidise them??
Incidentally I didn't say I had just found out about the costings I said I had only just found out that it was officially only used by the DPS one day a month which you seem to have confirmed
 
Jan,

You have also missed my point.

The DPS did not officially use the studio for one day a month it was rented, effectively it WAS the DPS's studio. The studio was available at any time for DPS members to use, DPS members held keys to the centre so members could use it whenever they chose (and did). The centre is extremely accessible with excellent disability friendly facilities. If a member wanted to use the studio at 8 p.m they could. If an outside person used the studio they were made aware of the cost of running it and, to my knowledge, always made donations often in excess of what was suggested. The DPS DID NOT officially use it one day a month it had 24/7 x 365 access to it to do what ever they choose to do in it.

Chris
 
You're telling me that all DPS members had keys to the studio? All of them had 24/7 access 365 days a year

Don't you mean that some members predominantly from the local area had keys and some members had 24/7 access 365 days a year?

Would you please answer my question? Why were DPS members expected to fund it??

Or is there no answer?
 
Jan I will correct what I said, but I think you are playing with my words.

Within the Bristol area, nominated members of the DPS acted as key holders, not all. But I stand by the second part, if a member from outside of Bristol wanted to use the studio that could be arranged, keys could be made available to them. So yes ANY members of the DPS COULD access the studio.

In answer to your last part of your post, why did the DPS hold it as a long term goal, not my inference and, perhaps more importantly why did the committee agree to the setting it up in the first place. This project didn't just happen by chance in Bristol it happened with the consent of the DPS committee.

Chris
 
Yeah, yeah, just imagine the scenario, some poor disabled guy arrives from Outer Mongolia at three am. and knocks on your door, (assuming you were one of the keyholders) clutching his camera bag and his DPS membership card and says please Mr Densley would you let me into the DPS studio?

How many times a week did that happen?

I suppose you still can't think of answer to my question which is why you're not answering it.
 
my understanding is that this was a pilot scheme? Im sure that revenue couldhave been generated to keep the place open, there are many schemes all around the country that are set up by charities, they have raffles, fund raisers etc to keep the initiatives going, selling prints, open days, raffles, sponsored events, were any of these things ever discussed with the members using the place, and those with keys?
 
Jan said:
Yeah, yeah, just imagine the scenario, some poor disabled guy arrives from Outer Mongolia at three am. and knocks on your door, (assuming you were one of the keyholders) clutching his camera bag and his DPS membership card and says please Mr Densley would you let me into the DPS studio?

How many times a week did that happen?

I suppose you still can't think of answer to my question which is why you're not answering it.
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Jan why are you so intent on getting an argument out of Chris? You are coming across as confrontational
 
matty said:
my understanding is that this was a pilot scheme? Im sure that revenue couldhave been generated to keep the place open, there are many schemes all around the country that are set up by charities, they have raffles, fund raisers etc to keep the initiatives going, selling prints, open days, raffles, sponsored events, were any of these things ever discussed with the members using the place, and those with keys?
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Not as far as I know Matty, most of the members were completely in the dark as to what was going on. There are about 500 members of the DPS, only 15 used this centre according to the figures I have seen.
 
Jan I think others might see my comment in a slightly different way.

May I ask a question, and may I have a straight answer?

Twice you have referred to receiving a ltter from Shirley, there is an inference there that it was sent direct to you from her. Am I correct?

Why do I ask, well because we do no have your current contact details and we are fairly certain we never sent you a letter, I may be wrong. I think you may mean you have received a copy of her letter from another member of the DPS. My point, Shirely never wrote to YOU.

May I also ask, you do not have to answer this question, when did you or John rejoin the DPS?

Chris
 
Jan said:
Not as far as I know Matty, most of the members were completely in the dark as to what was going on. There are about 500 members of the DPS, only 15 used this centre according to the figures I have seen.
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Im not being confrontational, I am taking up cudgels for the majority who deserve to know the truth. Remember many disabled people wold find it quite difficult to use this forum please matty and some of them are simply not confident enough to join in.
 
I kinda hoped this thread would have died over the last few weeks...............zzzzzzzzzzz
 
Densley said:
Jan I think others might see my comment in a slightly different way.

May I ask a question, and may I have a straight answer?

Twice you have referred to receiving a ltter from Shirley, there is an inference there that it was sent direct to you from her. Am I correct?

Why do I ask, well because we do no have your current contact details and we are fairly certain we never sent you a letter, I may be wrong. I think you may mean you have received a copy of her letter from another member of the DPS. My point, Shirely never wrote to YOU.

May I also ask, you do not have to answer this question, when did you or John rejoin the DPS?

Chris
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It was actually sent to John but was addressed to J Abbott, I am also J Abbott and I opened it.

Why would you have my contact information? Were you the membership secretary as he's the only person who should have it.

I'll tell you why, and I'll quote the last paragraph of the letter "p.s I only have last years membership list, so if you know of any members who may not have received this message please feel free to pass it on to them" .

Maybe you're on a sticky wicket here Densley because it is very bad policy to have address lists with people's name and address floating around and I'd be furious if anyone did that and I'm sure most people would be.

We are now members of the DPS incidentally. We re-joined.
 
Jan,

I accept your comments about people not being able to access this forum, that we be equally true from both sides of this divide.

If we are trying to advocate for other people then it would be healthy to make it clear whose views we are expressing, I believe very passionately that disabled peoples voices should be heard in their own right. I am very willing to put others peoples views to this forum even if they are very different to mine. I will accept peoples PM to me from which ever side of this argument they sit on, I will also try to find a way that they can contact me outside of this forum if that helps people put forward their view. There is a but, I will only do that making those comments in a separate entry and the comments will be creditted to the person making those comments. The only reasons I will not do that are, if the comments breach the rules of this forum or they are in anyway personal.

I think if we wish to advocate for people, especially those with quite profound disabilities it is very important they own their own comments.

Chris
 
Jan,

There is only one Abbott listed as having received a letter and they do not live where you do. You have also stated to me privately that you did not receive the letter from the DPS direct which would indicate that you were not members back in early May.

Feel free to make available any of the comments I have made to you privately, there is nothing there I would not dislike seeing on this forum.

Referring to the DPS letter you said

I've already seen it thanks it was sent to me by a member who is watching but not participating in this discussion.

I do however accept that that member could in practice be John although I believe Joh had already contributed to this forum by that time.

Chris
 
How do you know i did not get 1, I can assure I did get 1 through the post from Shirley Britton.And how do you know i am not on the list if you say you do not know my address, you must know my address to beable to say i did not get 1.
I think this now comes under the data protection act which you have breached if you have a confidential address list that only the membership secretary should have. I think this need looking at ASP.
John Abbott
 
Jan said:
So, the best thing to do is stop all this bickering, and united as a group representing people with disabilities work towards the common good.
After all we live in a world at the moment where the government is falling apart, there is a recession, and it’s hard enough for the disabled to survive. So maybe it’s time to start behaving like grown-ups??
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Its a shame that you havent taken your own words on and headed off down that road.

J.R.Abbott yesterday 09.07 said:
which I intend to 'share' with committee if and when I rejoin the DPS
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J.R.Abbott yesterdayat 19.04 said:
Sorry about that but I am a member of the DPS
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made the decision then

Jan said:
Not as far as I know Matty, most of the members were completely in the dark as to what was going on. There are about 500 members of the DPS, only 15 used this centre according to the figures I have seen.
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somewhere back on page 1 or 2 its mentioned

This thread is not nothing more than Jan trying to score points off Densley, so if no-one else has anything valuable to add, its time to let it go. I suggest you all convene at the AGM bar and talk it all over.
 
J.R.Abbott said:
How do you know i did not get 1, I can assure I did get 1 through the post from Shirley Britton.And how do you know i am not on the list if you say you do not know my address, you must know my address to beable to say i did not get 1.
I think this now comes under the data protection act which you have breached if you have a confidential address list that only the membership secretary should have. I think this need looking at ASP.
John Abbott
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I dont care if he got your address from rummaging in your dustbin, this is another inflammatory post, take it to PM because anymore and this thread is closed.
 
I think you should close this thread matty, it's just going around in circles and nothing constructive coming out of it. I've been saying for days that this bickering should stop.. I'm glad someone agrees..
Whatever anyone says isn't going to alter anything is it?
 
Sorry Matty,
I think its not going anywhere either just gettin out of hand now best place for it is in the bin.Thanks for you time and effort and the forum.
John.
 
sadly I'm inclined to agree that the thread is going no-where.

Densley you have tried to keep the thread constructive but others have not but I feel that this argument should really have been taken up at the AGM over a pint and a civilised chat!

Jan, you have esculated this thread today despite calling for folk to behave like grown-ups, and some of your posts are directly contradicting some of your other posts in this thread, so im not 100% sure your intentions are honourable

Im closing the thread today, though i may reopen at a later stage if there is good news to add to this thread.
 
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