Durst m301 colour + Ilford multgrade filter conversion table

Messages
235
Edit My Images
No
Just bought a durst m301 colour. I had a M605 colour a few years ago and I remembered that Ilford have a table so you can dial in the colour enlarger to match a given filter.
I have found the table https://www.ilfordphoto.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/Contrast-control-for-Ilford-Multigrade.pdf but I'm confused by the single colour filter and dual colour filter tables on page 3. Might be a silly question but which would I use? For instance they list that for a 4 filter you want 140m and for the same filter on the other youd want 17y/76m. They both say they would achieve the contrast 4 filter so I cant see the need for 2 tables :confused:
 
It looks like the dual filtration provides a more accurate grade setting than the single filter, but will need additional exposure time. This can be an advantage for dodging and burning, so worth trying.
 
It looks like the dual filtration provides a more accurate grade setting than the single filter, but will need additional exposure time. This can be an advantage for dodging and burning, so worth trying.
Ah right I got you.
Also is there any table that that gives the additional times for a given filter? So a 5 filter needs the correct exposure x2 for example
 
Ah right I got you.
Also is there any table that that gives the additional times for a given filter? So a 5 filter needs the correct exposure x2 for example
I think your best bet would be test strips for each grade setting, as this is likely to save time and paper at a later date. I see that Ilford are suggesting lesser time changes between grades for dual filtration, but testing should clarify that. It's not the most enjoyable part of darkroom work, but should be helpful in the longer term. Enjoy!
 
I think your best bet would be test strips for each grade setting, as this is likely to save time and paper at a later date. I see that Ilford are suggesting lesser time changes between grades for dual filtration, but testing should clarify that. It's not the most enjoyable part of darkroom work, but should be helpful in the longer term. Enjoy!
Cheers.
Lastly when I’ve watched videos of people making prints they often use the 00 straight away. Why would you not just start out without anything at all?
 
.Multigrade paper is designed to be grade 2 with no filtration when using single filters. Grade 2 is a standard that allows a decent range of tones when most papers were single grade, so it became a reference point for printing.

In order to do away with the need to have packs of different grades of paper, multigrade was developed to allow the use of Ilford colour filters in the filter drawer of b&w enlargers, and it was then decided to come up with a way of using colour heads on enlargers to achieve a similar outcome.

It's a decent idea to start testing at grade 2 and then decide whether a harder or softer grade would work better for a particular print.
 
Cheers.
Lastly when I’ve watched videos of people making prints they often use the 00 straight away. Why would you not just start out without anything at all?
A 0 or 00 filter is sometimes used for contact sheets as it displays the maximum detail that could possibly be extracted from each negative - since there will be little or nothing that is all black or all white. The printer can then assess the contact sheet and choose an appropriate grade for each negative.

Another use of the 0 or 00 grade would be as one component of a spilt grade print, where an exposure with a very soft grade is followed or preceded by an exposure with a hard grade.
 
Both Methods (single & dual filter) will initially need correcting for exposure but with the Dual filter method, once the correct exposure is found it will need very little correction to change grades where as the single filter will need re-calculating completely.

I always used the dual filter method because of this.
 
There is absolutely no need whatso ever to guess what filtration values to use to obtain a set filtration with Ilford MG5. There should be a printed leaflet in with every packet/box of paper which tells you what the filtration should be to get a particular grade. This is constant for 3 different filtration values depending on what enlarger you are using Some enlargers use what are known as 'Kodak' Values such as my LPL. Then there are 'Durst' Values, which you need and a 3rd one which is specifically for the Leica V35, although I had heard that this was close enough to one of the the values to be ignored. I may be wrong.

With all three there are single filtration and dual filtration. I use the latter, i.e. dual filtration. The filtration needed for the hardest or softest grades are the only ones that need a change of exposure. If you start off with Grade 2 as your benchmark, always use the dual filtration so you can go up and own the scale without needing to re-assess the exposure. With a Durst enlarger you can dial in a true Gd 5 but with my LPL and others of the same make or group will only give you a grade 4.5.

If your film developing techniques are consistent there should be little to gain by going above Gd 3 or below Gd1. The exception being dull weather or a subject with poor contrast or bright sunshine with deep shadows or burnt out highlights.

If you use Gd 2 and assess that an exposure an exposure is good for most of the print, but there are areas that do not have enough detail or are too dark, then don't swap the filtration around because that will only shift the light or dark areas every where on the print. Read up about the technique of 'dodging' where using something stuck to a bit of wire such as a small piece of paper to reduce the light on that area. Or the opposite, using you hands. or a piece of paper with a hole cut in it and held under the lens to allow more light to reach the area that is under exposed. It takes practise, practise and more practise to get it right nut once you do that is like riding a bicycle, you never forget.

Also I take the developing times that Ilford suggest as the very minimum! (at 20 degrees C) I usually develop for at least 25%, more but never less. When I started out printing very nearly 60 years ago you could not extend developing times too much because that would stain the paper, fortunately now that risk has gone. One printer who was giving a demonstration about printing was a bit of a cynic who said "You pay for the silver content of the emulsion - so make use if it". Working under the light of a safelight reduces the ability of the eyes to see when the correct depth of tone is reached, so always use the time method of visual inspection, except in certain circumstances is nothing but guesswork. But whatever you do, at first, be prepared to waste a bit of paper.
 
Last edited:
I’m probably going to have to do some exposure for the contrast. The colour head on the 301 only goes to 100 so the conversion table doesn’t convert exactly. Either 100 is the same as 170/130 or it doesn’t go that high.
 
I’m probably going to have to do some exposure for the contrast. The colour head on the 301 only goes to 100 so the conversion table doesn’t convert exactly. Either 100 is the same as 170/130 or it doesn’t go that high.
Never having used a smaller Durst this is not something I have been aware of. That must remain a position of doubt that can only be answered by Ilford or someone who has used a durst enlarger before. I have used a Durst may years ago but that was one of the larger models that I initially used for colour printing and that gave a full scale of filtration
 
Never having used a smaller Durst this is not something I have been aware of. That must remain a position of doubt that can only be answered by Ilford or someone who has used a durst enlarger before. I have used a Durst may years ago but that was one of the larger models that I initially used for colour printing and that gave a full scale of filtration
Same. I owned a m605 a long time ago and I assumed this one would be the same.
It’s hard to tell exactly whether or not the 100 rating on the 301 is the same as 130/170 on the m605 as when I just tried it to make sure it worked I used rodinal as a makeshift paper developer until mine arrived. The print did come out a little flat. It does have contrast but the blacks aren’t very black and the whites could be whiter. This is probably because I exposed the print for 40sec in an attempted to give it more contrast with the maximum setting the 301 would give me. I’m going to try it again with the identical settings and same negative when my paper developer arrives. If the result is the same then the maximum the 301 gives must be a less than the 605 gave and less than the highest contrast filter ilford have. If that’s the case then I’ll just buy a set of the above lens filters and hold them under the lens by hand. £90 for a set of below the lens filters is too much for me at the moment
 
There's a student set of filters for under £14, so that might be worth a look? Ilford are also doing free delivery on orders over £15 placed by Friday, so possibly get a paper developer as well?
 
Last edited:
Back
Top