DxO PhotoLab 6, Lightroom Classic subscription, or DxO PureRaw 3 exporting into an old Lightroom version?

Martin-dc2

Martin-dc2

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Name
Martin
Edit My Images
Yes
New on here, been an amateur photographer for close to 20 years. Looking for some advice from the collective wisdom on here, as I've realised I'm rather out-of-date on the software side.

I've been soldiering on with an old version of Lr for several years (Lr 5.6, if you can believe that), while the editing/processing world has moved on massively.
...and I've just bought a Canon R7, whose RAW files my ancient Lr can't read. So I need to get with the times.

I used a trial version of PureRaw 3 last month for de-noising a bunch of very noisy RIAT photos taken with my part-time 7D1 (hence the upgrade to an R7, as second-body alongside a venerable but dependable 5D3), and was very impressed with that side of things. I'm also not a fan of subscription-pricing models, as they're a con for those of us who don't need to keep getting the "latest tech" every year or two (phones, cars, software, etc...). So I've been looking around for a Lightroom replacement.

- Capture One looks fantastic, but has a commensurate price tag and a learning curve I don't have the time to invest in.
- PhotoLab 6 looks like the obvious other contender, and is undoubtedly equal or superior to Lr Classic in processing abilities. But I'm reading mixed things about its database capabilities.
- Otherwise it seems like it's get a deal on an annual Lr Classic + Ps subscription without the 1Tb cloud storage (Amazon currently asking £90, vs £10/mth through Adobe), as little else seems to do the cataloguing as well as Lightroom.
- OR...I buy PureRaw 3, and use that as the RAW converter before exporting into my current Lightroom. But I wonder whether I'll miss out on some newer processing techniques?

Oh, and I can't wait for any Black Friday deals as I've got a trip planned next month and will need to get a bunch of photos from the R7 edited very soon after. So it's £200 for PL6 (for however long until I next want to upgrade), £90 for 1-year Lr Classic +Ps, or £90 for PureRaw 3 in-perpetuity but I stick with my old Lr version.


Has anyone moved from Lr to PL6 and can comment on the move? Has anyone trialled both and which way did you fall? Has anyone used an alternative workflow which won't come with a big learning curve?

Thanks,

Martin.
 
Welcome to the forum. Just to kick the conversation started....

I understand you don't want to wait for Black Friday deals - but there are rumours that DXO 6 will be refreshed in September/October. Who knows if it actually will. You missed Affinity Photo off the list of PS alternates also.
 
Have you considered using Adobe’s DNG converter (free) for your raw files. You can then continue with your current, perpetual licence, version of Lightroom as these DNGs can be imported and treated like any other raw files.

FWIW I did this for a while, using Affinity for pixel level processing (I found their rew processing capabilities lacking)

in the end I swallowed my pride and subscribed to adobe‘s package

You might need to buy something like Topaz Denoise of you need a modern noise reduction solution
 
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I had PS CS5 and then tried DxO and found it not very user friendly so I switched to the LR/PS package.
I pay the Adobe price (£9.98/m or 3 cups of coffee) as I can't be bothered with the offers, to save £30 and having to pay up front.
It's always up to date and there are loads of You Tube videos and other help for when you get stuck and the Adobe telephone support if you really get stuck.
 
Thanks all.

Mike - I have tried the DNG converter (and for some reason my download of it still won't find the CR3 files even after I've manually imported them onto my HDD), but I'm not 100% sold on effectively only being able to process each RAW file once - there's been the odd favourite shot where I've gone back to it again and tried something new, as my processing knowledge/skills have expanded. My understanding with DNG is you can't do that - you get one file, all the updates overwrite the original converted RAW. And if I keep the RAW file separately I still have the same conversion headache, and double (nearly) the storage needs.

Chris (Tulip) - will have to google Affinity, not come across that before. I'm guessing though that it'll be a front-end to then import into my existing Lr catalogue/folder structure?

Chris (fisher) - interesting...I'm wondering whether to trial PhotoLab 6 now just to see how I get on with it, as whether I like it or not I am rather embedded, experience-wise, in the Adobe architecture. Out of interest what issues did you have with it?
 
You may have already realised that there is the Adobe way and the not Adobe way. If you are embedded into the import with Lightroom then further process where needed in Photoshop then you'll hit snags if you don’t buy Adobe - unless you change your workflow.

I import using PhotoMechanic - there are simpler and cheaper ways of bringing images onto your computer - then use DXO 6 and then possibly Affinity. As is the way keeping your skill set in the software you know is easier than trying to find out how others do it.

I always keep my RAW files until i know I really don’t want them anymore so that I can go back and process when my knowledge increases. Storage is cheap even for a lot of big image files.
 
Martin-dc2 said:
I have tried the DNG converter (and for some reason my download of it still won't find the CR3 files even after I've manually imported them onto my HDD), but I'm not 100% sold on effectively only being able to process each RAW file once - there's been the odd favourite shot where I've gone back to it again and tried something new, as my processing knowledge/skills have expanded. My understanding with DNG is you can't do that - you get one file, all the updates overwrite the original converted RAW. And if I keep the RAW file separately I still have the same conversion headache, and double (nearly) the storage needs.
Click to expand...
Sorry, but I think you must be doing something wrong. You need to download the latest version of DNG converter to convert the latest raw formats. In my experience the converted DNGs are treated by Lightroom just the same as any other raw - ie the original file is unaltered, and the processing steps are memorised (ether in the catalog, or in a sidecar file - your choice) and applied next time you open the file in Lightroom
 
I use PureRaw2 as a raw converter for one camera that is too modern for LR6.
Works well enough and is simple enough to export straight in.
 
Martin-dc2 said:
Thanks all.

Mike - I have tried the DNG converter (and for some reason my download of it still won't find the CR3 files even after I've manually imported them onto my HDD), but I'm not 100% sold on effectively only being able to process each RAW file once - there's been the odd favourite shot where I've gone back to it again and tried something new, as my processing knowledge/skills have expanded. My understanding with DNG is you can't do that - you get one file, all the updates overwrite the original converted RAW. And if I keep the RAW file separately I still have the same conversion headache, and double (nearly) the storage needs.

Chris (Tulip) - will have to google Affinity, not come across that before. I'm guessing though that it'll be a front-end to then import into my existing Lr catalogue/folder structure?

Chris (fisher) - interesting...I'm wondering whether to trial PhotoLab 6 now just to see how I get on with it, as whether I like it or not I am rather embedded, experience-wise, in the Adobe architecture. Out of interest what issues did you have with it?
Click to expand...

TBH It was some time ago and I really can't remember I think I just found it not all that easy and intuitive
 
yzfmike said:
Sorry, but I think you must be doing something wrong. You need to download the latest version of DNG converter to convert the latest raw formats. In my experience the converted DNGs are treated by Lightroom just the same as any other raw - ie the original file is unaltered, and the processing steps are memorised (ether in the catalog, or in a sidecar file - your choice) and applied next time you open the file in Lightroom
Click to expand...
I agree something is going wrong - the newly-downloaded DNG converter can't find the CR3 files. My comment about DNGs being modified in the file was based on an article I read...if that's incorrect then that's a start.
...but I still need to get the bloody converter to work, somehow... :thinking:
 
In DNG converter, when choosing the raw files that you want to convert, you select the FOLDER that contains them NOT the individual files. IIRC (I’m not at my PC at the moment) attempting to open that folder shows it as empty. You then choose a location for the converted files and off you go. All raws in that folder will be converted.

sorry if I misunderstood, and you knew this already but HTH
 
DNG is Adobe's compressed raw format. It's still as much a raw file as ARW/CR3 etc. To use the converter, as said above, you tell the converter which folder the files that you want to convert live in, and it will then create a SECOND SET of files in DNG format alongside the original raws*.

FWIW I use the converter to turn the ARW files from my Sony A7III into DNG so I can import and edit them in LR6. The files are still true raw and fully re-editable. TBH when I changed from LR5.7 to LR6 I was disappointed, because the important adjustment bits work just the same, and although there's a pano and HDR tool, it gets little use.

My LR-alternative will probably be On1 Photoraw (new version out soon - watch for discounts). It's not perfect, but it is useful - better than LR for people/event photography in my hands, but not so good at creating mood photos. It's also quite Lightroom-like. But any of the packages you listed will be OK.

*Something I noticed was that importing ARW and DNG files into some applications alongside each other gave images with different appearance. The reason for this was that one format had camera & lens corrections automatically applied and the other did not.
 
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Mike / Toni - thanks...I'd just discovered that myself shortly before you posted (clearly not the first to make that mistake as it came up in a google search!) :ROFLMAO::headbang:
I'll have a play with them in LrC tomorrow, see how that works.

Toni - very good point. I've found myself manually correcting some of what Lr does to my RAW files, not least white balance (which it gets wrong spectacularly frequently - good job my eye is still well-calibrated! ;) )

Having read further around, I AM tempted to get a trial version of PhotoLab 6, see how I get on with that and how it gets on with my old Lightroom...might be that buying PL-7 in Oct/Nov (Black Friday?) and using as a plug-in with my Lightroom is the best compromise - newest (and best???) RAW editor allied to an old and trusted DAM tool?!?



Appreciate all the thoughts and opinions...if nothing else this exercise has reminded me to keep up with the software side of the art at least as much as the creative side.
 
I used to use photoshop but went to DXO for Raw conversion and Affinity for pixel editing
The only thing those programs can’t do is the catalog part of lightroom but DXO is an amazing raw converter and will clean up really high ISO files
I have taken band photos at maximum ISO on my R5 it was almost dark at the gig and DXO gave really decent results
I’m still on DXO 5 , apparently DXO 6 is a little bit better
Affinity for me anyway can do anything that I needed to do in photoshop
 
I moved onto a Canon R7 a few months ago.
I've used DNG for about 15 years and am still using Lightroom 6.14
So some comments
Comments above are sound.
Compatibility In the DNG Converter check the compatibility. Mine is set to Camera Raw 7.1 or later. You should probably use the same.
See https://helpx.adobe.com/uk/camera-raw/using/adobe-dng-converter.html
Colour profiles. Lightroom will default to Adobe Standard., Which is a bit yuk. You can add extra profiles easily. See below.
Lens Profiles. You will not have profiles of lenses introduced after LR5.7. Definitely not RF lenses. You can add extra profiles easily. See below.

How to add camera and lens profiles. Works with LR6.14
The camera and lens profiles used by Lightroom are provided with the “Adobe DNG Converter”.
Install the latest version from Adobe.

Camera profiles are held as .dcp files in
C:\ProgramData\Adobe\CameraRaw\CameraProfiles\Camera\<Manufacturer+Model>

To be able to use the profile in Lightroom need to copy it to
C:\Users\<User>\AppData\Roaming\Adobe\CameraRaw\CameraProfiles.

After copying the .dcp file(s) into the “CameraProfiles” folder, you should be able to start up Lightroom and have the new profile(s) available.

Lens profiles are held as .lcp files in
C:\ProgramData\Adobe\CameraRaw\LensProfiles\1.0\<Manufacturer>

To be able to use the profile in Lightroom need to copy it to
C:\Users\<User>\AppData\Roaming\Adobe\CameraRaw\LensProfiles\1.0\Downloaded.
Note that if the \Downloaded folder does not exist you need to create it.

After copying the .lcp file(s) into the “Downloaded” folder, you should be able to start up Lightroom and have the new lens profile(s) available.
 
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I was in your position about 2 year sago. I was using LR 6.14 as I hated the idea of the subscription model and after a bit of research plumped for DXO Photolab v5, which I intended to become my default processor. I started to use it in anger shortly afterwards but there were a few things I just couldn't get my head around. To quote one example, when you start developing a file, close down, then re-open it, (which is what most of us do isn't it?) all your develop history has disappeared. The sharpening/noise removal tool was excellent, however.

Then Adobe started adding some really excellent new tools to LR (eg much improved selection/masking tools) and I began to have second thoughts. So last Black Friday I decided to go back to LR with the subscription model and I'm glad that I did. Earlier this year it added AI noise removal which I found equally as good as DXO, although slower on my PC.

So I'm now back full-time with Lightroom. If you've been using LR for a long time already you will have virtually no learning curve to climb, and that really helps. That's what I would recommend.
 
tijuana taxi said:
I use PureRaw2 as a raw converter for one camera that is too modern for LR6.
Works well enough and is simple enough to export straight in.
Click to expand...
What is your workflow here exactly? What is the advantage of using PureRaw instead of the Adobe tool?
Mr B said:
I moved onto a Canon R7 a few months ago.
I've used DNG for about 15 years and am still using Lightroom 6.14
So some comments
Comments above are sound.
Compatibility In the DNG Converter check the compatibility. Mine is set to Camera Raw 7.1 or later. You should probably use the same.
Click to expand...
Have you found any problems with using newer versions of compatibility? I tried converting some Z8 files to use with LR6.14 but I kept the default ACR conversion setting which I think is version 14, I was missing the colour profiles which I've hopefully corrected now thanks to your guide above but there wasn't the exposure latitude I expected when using the highlight/shadow tools so I wondered if that's down to the compatibility being wrong.
 
Martin-dc2 said:
New on here, been an amateur photographer for close to 20 years. Looking for some advice from the collective wisdom on here, as I've realised I'm rather out-of-date on the software side.

I've been soldiering on with an old version of Lr for several years (Lr 5.6, if you can believe that), while the editing/processing world has moved on massively.
...and I've just bought a Canon R7, whose RAW files my ancient Lr can't read. So I need to get with the times.

I used a trial version of PureRaw 3 last month for de-noising a bunch of very noisy RIAT photos taken with my part-time 7D1 (hence the upgrade to an R7, as second-body alongside a venerable but dependable 5D3), and was very impressed with that side of things. I'm also not a fan of subscription-pricing models, as they're a con for those of us who don't need to keep getting the "latest tech" every year or two (phones, cars, software, etc...). So I've been looking around for a Lightroom replacement.

- Capture One looks fantastic, but has a commensurate price tag and a learning curve I don't have the time to invest in.
- PhotoLab 6 looks like the obvious other contender, and is undoubtedly equal or superior to Lr Classic in processing abilities. But I'm reading mixed things about its database capabilities.
- Otherwise it seems like it's get a deal on an annual Lr Classic + Ps subscription without the 1Tb cloud storage (Amazon currently asking £90, vs £10/mth through Adobe), as little else seems to do the cataloguing as well as Lightroom.
- OR...I buy PureRaw 3, and use that as the RAW converter before exporting into my current Lightroom. But I wonder whether I'll miss out on some newer processing techniques?

Oh, and I can't wait for any Black Friday deals as I've got a trip planned next month and will need to get a bunch of photos from the R7 edited very soon after. So it's £200 for PL6 (for however long until I next want to upgrade), £90 for 1-year Lr Classic +Ps, or £90 for PureRaw 3 in-perpetuity but I stick with my old Lr version.


Has anyone moved from Lr to PL6 and can comment on the move? Has anyone trialled both and which way did you fall? Has anyone used an alternative workflow which won't come with a big learning curve?

Thanks,

Martin.
Click to expand...
Great topic and it's one I've been thinking of starting myself.

What's the difference with PhotoLab and PureRaw, is the former a complete package but PureRaw is just a plugin and you're considering PureRaw so you can use the catalogue side of LR still?
 
JohnMcL7 said:
What is your workflow here exactly? What is the advantage of using PureRaw instead of the Adobe tool?
Click to expand...
I primarily bought PureRaw for its noise reduction qualities which is does very well.
Then found it using it as a converter works well with NR and lens corrections applied.
The advantage over the Adobe tool being that the files are already cleaned and corrected before any editing is undertaken.
My workflow is open with PR, convert and correct, if using the Deep prime option deselect sharpening.
Then send to LR 6.14 to edit as normal before exporting in whatever format is required.
 
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