E.Scooters

[JohnC6]

For about a year we've had four E-Scooters across the road. They were blue. On August 1st the county council then gave the contract to Voi who have 310 across 179 bays in Gloucestershire. About 20m away from my home is one of these bays (white box markings) and, as you see,at a bus-stop. The maximum number I've seen there is 10..there are 10 here. A few days ago there were 5 either side of the bus-stop. I've seen a lady from the company arrive in a van a couple of times to move them all to the right of the bus-stop where the bay is. It can only accommodate four. I do wonder if the bus drivers report it to management who then complain to Voi. It's only a ten month contract so they won't want to cause problems.

On another aspect of E-Scooters. Yesterday, one went along the road at approximately 40mph. It was a private scooter and it's illegal to use them on the road. What I don't understand is that when legislation was passed it made it illegal to ride a private one on the public highway but allowed on private land . They must surely have realised that they'd be used on the roads, anyway. They should have stuck with the trials for those companies who hire them out. I can't recall the last time I saw a police car around here. Our road is a 30mph limit. The rider, a young man, did not wear a safety helmet..I haven't seen a rider who does. Whether they have their own or hire them theye riders will drive on the footpath and when they come to a side road they just go from one pavement across the road to the other without looking out for any traffic turning into the side road. I wonder how many accidents there have been and what kind of injurioes have been sustained. A few weeks back I looked out of the window at 8.15am to see an odd sight. A young lady..about 18.. riding along the road on a hire scooter wearing a smart long beige coat, a nice handbag on her arm and flowing brown hair..no helmet.

 

[lindsay]

They are a blight. Great idea badly implemented. The hire ones are left all over the place blocking paths or occasionally being dumped in a brook or pond. The profusion of privately owned ones that go much faster than they are supposed to. They all use the pavements and roads as if they own them, the users, whilst hire ones are not supposed to be on the roads, they are sometimes; the private ones only supposed to be on private land but of course who has private land to use them on? Is there any enforcemernt>? No. Do the users/owners have safety checks or insurance or contribute to maintenance of the roads/paths via a tax? No. Their sale should be either banned or controlled by the creation of a mandatory licensing scheme that tracks ownership and requires an insurance tab be purchased and available.
Frankly if I'm driving along and one gets in my way forcing me into avoidance manoeuvres, I would have no problem knocking one over if the alternative was hitting a tree or another car. They shouldn't be on the road, so the fault is with them.

 

[Nod]

Unfortunately, it's not, Lindsay. Despite them being (usually) unlicensed, unregistered motor vehicles that are (in most places) illegal, they're not fair game. Unfortunately! Similarly, electric bicycles, many of which seem to now be basically electric mopeds, needing no pedal input from the rider.

On the plus side, there have been a few prosecutions of users of both types, resulting in the loss of the riders' driving licenses.

 

[troutfisher]

The owners/users of them seem to have no road sense at all, I am just thankful for my dash cam so I will have of record when one pulls out in front of me and gets knocked off.
But like a lot of these things the politicians pass the laws but don't provide the funding to enforce them

 

[Pound Coin]

There are badly behaved users of the roads on all forms of transport. Scooters and electric bicycles are new and different, so catch our attention. I'm sure if the police were able to get out and enforce, they would be catching people across all forms of transport.

In the future there is no place for huge SUVs in towns and cities and there needs to be good replacements. Public transport, walking, cycling, small electric devices.

The biggest issue with hire scooters is that (generalisation) rather than taking people out of cars, they have taken people off buses.

 

[Sky]

Instead of being what they could have been; a cheaper, environmentally friendly, bus/taxi alternative they are just a very dangerous nuisance to all pavement users - 20mph on the footpath FFS.

If they were to implement some control method to keep them on the road and off the pavements by REALLY HEAVY fines and punishment. In addition, apply the same punishments to cyclists at the same time of course, as a lot of those are just as bad.

Lastly, we shouldn't forget geriatrics and the lazy fat b**t***s using mobility scooters. The legal version of these are bad enough in some people's hands, but some of the European imported models can achieve 15-20mph too.

 

[AndrewFlannigan]

If they were to implement some control method to keep them on the road and off the pavements by REALLY HEAVY fines and punishment. In addition, apply the same punishments to cyclists at the same time course, as a lot of those are just as bad.

Agreed.

However, if you want to put the blame where it belongs, call out the civil servants and local government officers, who are enthusiasts for these mad ideas and are responsible for pushing them to MPs and councillors.

Who remembers when it was illegal to ride a byke on the pavement? Now there are signs, on pavements which are three feet wide and next to busy roads, telling pedestrians to share that space with cyclists.

 

[Pound Coin]

Agreed.

However, if you want to put the blame where it belongs, call out the civil servants and local government officers, who are enthusiasts for these mad ideas and are responsible for pushing them to MPs and councillors.

Who remembers when it was illegal to ride a byke on the pavement? Now there are signs, on pavements which are three feet wide and next to busy roads, telling pedestrians to share that space with cyclists.

View attachment 401990

Out of interest, what are those lorries doing there?

 

[Garry Edwards]

Bikes, e-bikes and e-scooters can cause danger to pedestrians, but they are very vulnerable and cause most of the danger to themselves. I don't think that it's the vehicle type that causes the problem, it's more the attitude of the users, who seem to think that the laws don't apply to them, and the only answer to that is enforcement, which is far too weak.

Our laws, although often ignored, are actually very strict. China, which is way ahead of us in many ways, has very lax laws on two-wheeled transport. They've had electric mopeds for many years, things are changing now because more and more people can afford cars, but for many years the only transport available to most people has been bikes and low-powered electric and petrol mopeds and similar. From memory (not completely sure about this) only motorbikes of 250cc or above need a driving licence and insurance. And nobody cares about maintenance either, if it goes then that's good enough.

People can and do carry as many passengers as they like, it's normal to see a complete family, complete with shopping and dog, on a moped. And there are hundreds (at least) on every road. Here, we see occasional groups of cyclists out on a club run, blocking the roads, making it impossible to pass safely, in China they have much wider roads . . .

But, the big difference there is enforcement. Police are everywhere, and when any laws are broken they are enforced.

 

[Cobra]

There is a huge culture, here. of those damned things zipping about all over pedestrian areas. weaving in and out of traffic on the roads.
And yet personal ones are still illegal, unless you hire those uber things.
Which when they run out of juice are just abandoned in the most inconsiderate of places, blocking foot paths and alley ways.
Not everyone that comes across them is fit enough or able enough (wheel chair users, young mum's with buggy's etc) to move them.
I'm not totally against them, well that is I am, until they are properly regulated, and at the very minimum 3rd party insured.

 

[JohnC6]

A great result this morning. Every Saturday night some yobs knock the scooters over . We don't usually have any problems but the last few weeks that has happened. This morning there was an extra scooter bringing the total to 11. The company before the current one only had 4 in place and there were usually one or two left so not a great demand. My intention was to note how many scooters were there every day for a week .I'd already started this at 8.30am this morning with a photo, noting all the registration numbers. so I would be able to show which scooters hadn't been used over a week and, hopefully, to get them to take some away. At 10.45 I took photo one. At about 12 noon a van pulled up by them and a man got out and righted the scooters and he had a hand-held device checking whatever. I went to have a word with him explaining that 11 were far too many and that the previous company only had four there. I pointed out that they were also obstructing the bus-stop and outside the painted box which accomodated four. He said they were authorised to place 10 at each location .He said there was an ebb and flow with them and his job was to balance them out..ie the number at each location. Disappointingly, he told me they were placing more scooters at various locations It was an amicable conversation. If you want something it's never a good idea to berate someone. Result ? He took away six.

 

[Mr Bump]

like most i have a love/hate with the whole scooter brigade but i also feel the SUV parked on the pavement is just as bad or even worse, also zipping on the road without insurance or a helmet well that just the same as a bicycle and certainly much greener and cleaner than using a car , we need to find solutions not just identify problems it seems all the UK seems to do is find problems.

 

[woof woof]

There are badly behaved users of the roads on all forms of transport. Scooters and electric bicycles are new and different, so catch our attention. I'm sure if the police were able to get out and enforce, they would be catching people across all forms of transport.

In the future there is no place for huge SUVs in towns and cities and there needs to be good replacements. Public transport, walking, cycling, small electric devices.

The biggest issue with hire scooters is that (generalisation) rather than taking people out of cars, they have taken people off buses.

Many "SUV's" have the same footprint on the road as a humble family car. Some of the "huge" ones have the same footprint or even less of a one as an ordinary estate car.

I find the targeting of SUV's is usually based on the bigotry of eco zealots with half functioning brains. The sort of people who will happily see all UK industries shut down and ignore the result that everything has to be made in much more polluting factories in China (possibly by slave labour but we'll just ignore that and not talk about it) and shipped half way around the world which will all result in a much larger environmental impact.

My "SUV" probably does more mpg and it probably does it cleaner than just about any car I've ever owned.

 

[Pound Coin]

Many "SUV's" have the same footprint on the road as a humble family car.

Arrant nonsense, unfortunately.

The humble family car was tiny. Just go to a classic car show. Or even have a look at the original Range Rover and see how small it is now.

 

[Pound Coin]

like most i have a love/hate with the whole scooter brigade but i also feel the SUV parked on the pavement is just as bad or even worse, also zipping on the road without insurance or a helmet well that just the same as a bicycle and certainly much greener and cleaner than using a car , we need to find solutions not just identify problems it seems all the UK seems to do is find problems.

Yup.

 

[Mr Bump]

Many "SUV's" have the same footprint on the road as a humble family car. Some of the "huge" ones have the same footprint or even less of a one as an ordinary estate car.

I find the targeting of SUV's is usually based on the bigotry of eco zealots with half functioning brains. The sort of people who will happily see all UK industries shut down and ignore the result that everything has to be made in much more polluting factories in China (possibly by slave labour but we'll just ignore that and not talk about it) and shipped half way around the world which will all result in a much larger environmental impact.

My "SUV" probably does more mpg and it probably does it cleaner than just about any car I've ever owned.

absolute rubbish your SUV is as clean an e-scooter?
wow your credibility just nose dived, sorry

 

[Box Brownie]

Many "SUV's" have the same footprint on the road as a humble family car. Some of the "huge" ones have the same footprint or even less of a one as an ordinary estate car.

I find the targeting of SUV's is usually based on the bigotry of eco zealots with half functioning brains. The sort of people who will happily see all UK industries shut down and ignore the result that everything has to be made in much more polluting factories in China (possibly by slave labour but we'll just ignore that and not talk about it) and shipped half way around the world which will all result in a much larger environmental impact.

My "SUV" probably does more mpg and it probably does it cleaner than just about any car I've ever owned.

absolute rubbish your SUV is as clean an e-scooter?
wow your credibility just nose dived, sorry

Sorry, did miss it.....but where does @woof woof say his current car is as clean as an e-scooter

 

[LCPete]

The issue with SUVs is the weight if some fool tailgating us in a Range Rover smashes into the back of us our chances won’t be good also their high bonnet is far worse for any pedestrians they hit

edit to add that of course farmers and people living in the middle of nowhere need a vehicle that has off road capability but surely in town there’s no place for them

 

[woof woof]

Sorry, did miss it.....but where does @woof woof say his current car is as clean as an e-scooter

The problem is that a lot of people seem to bring their own misconceptions and prejudices to the debate and of course there's a complete lack of joined up thinking in environmental debates. Add that to an inability to comprehend and a willingness to misrepresent and we have what we have. A complete brainless thoughtless mess.

 

[Sky]

Don't get me started on pavement parkers - selfish, inconsiderate f***ing c**ksu***rs.

 

[woof woof]

The issue with SUVs is the weight if some fool tailgating us in a Range Rover smashes into the back of us our chances won’t be good also their high bonnet is far worse for any pedestrians they hit

edit to add that of course farmers and people living in the middle of nowhere need a vehicle that has off road capability but surely in town there’s no place for them

Again with the singling out of SUV's and generalisation. If you're going to make an argument like this you can't pick and choose and instead must include all vehicles of similar type/design.

 

[AndrewFlannigan]

Don't get me started on pavement parkers - selfish, inconsiderate f***ing c**ksu***rs.

You mean like this one...

 

[Jelster]

You mean like this one...

View attachment 402188

Yeah, but he's a van driver, he's allowed to leave his van just about anywhere so he doesn't have to walk to far, isn't he?

 

[Cobra]

we need to find solutions not just identify problems it seems all the UK seems to do is find problems.

And the award for the funniest comment of last week goes to ....

I and others have been saying for years, far too many people find the negative in anything, reply to positive comments, by finding something negative,
in everything when they don't agree with the subject.

And yet when there is something they think they should get on board with, they are off like He-Man on battle cat to save the world.

 

[Sky]

You mean like this one...

I can tolerate van drivers for a quick pick up or drop off - they often don't have a choice and normally just involves a few minutes wait.

At least the kerb is low enough there to enable a wheelchair to get off the pavement to go around or crossover. In most cases for me, it involves turning round and going back until I find a drop-kerb and this is often half a mile or more.

The most annoying ones are like these a*s*holes:

 

[Pound Coin]

The sooner pavement parking is banned across the UK (and enforced) the better.

 

[AndrewFlannigan]

The most annoying ones are like these a*s*holes:

All the social conciousness of a rabid weasel!

 

[LeeRatters]

Arrant nonsense, unfortunately.

The humble family car was tiny. Just go to a classic car show. Or even have a look at the original Range Rover and see how small it is now.

So you're comparing something like @woof woof 's SUV with a 1960's family car...

ALL cars are bigger these days than back then!

My mate has a Merc SUV (I can't recall the exact model) He also has an Audi A4 saloon. They are virtually the same size bar a few inches.

 

[the black fox]

Don't get me started on pavement parkers - selfish, inconsiderate f***ing c**ksu***rs.

you obviously dont live in rural or semi-rural Wales where the street plans were laid out at the turn of the century >pick any century from when the romans invaded onwards ...if cars/suv's/vans were not parked half on the pavement then the emergency services would not have access to lots of streets .off road parking exists in some places but mainly they don't have it .. and don't start well use a bus one every couple of hours if you happen to live on a bus route .. and these days most supermarkets are in out of town locations try bringing home a weeks shopping on a push bike !!
and as for e.scooters and e.bikes most are now faster than vehicles thanks to our new national 20mph speed limit

 

[Pound Coin]

ALL cars are bigger these days than back then!

Yes.

That is the point. Cars have grown a lot on the back of more comfort and more safety for occupants. There are a lot of people that aren't occupants.

 

[Sky]

you obviously dont live in rural or semi-rural Wales where the street plans were laid out at the turn of the century

No, the Isle of Wight - where most of the infrastructure is just the same as rural Wales, but with a few less sheep.

If a road is not wide enough to accommodate a parked car then they should not be allowed to park in that road - simple. There is absolutely NO EXCUSE for vehicles to block pavements - they are there for pedestrians and in a lot of cases are actually damaged by parked cars because they're not strong enough to support them.

Parking on the pavement endangers people's lives by forcing them into the road - especially the most vulnerable; children, the blind, mums with pushchairs and aggressive whingeing old t***s like me in wheelchairs.

 

[woof woof]

So you're comparing something like @woof woof 's SUV with a 1960's family car...

ALL cars are bigger these days than back then!

My mate has a Merc SUV (I can't recall the exact model) He also has an Audi A4 saloon. They are virtually the same size bar a few inches.

My next door neighbours "car" takes up more space on the road than my "SUV."

It's a fallacy that SUV's are oversized monsters clogging up city streets. They may be higher than your average car but their on the road footprint is often not excessive. This is why it's important not to talk about specific types of transport or apply labels such as SUV as they can be evocative, discriminatory and misleading and often IMO only represent a prejudice of one view.

 

[Pound Coin]

It's a fallacy that SUV's are oversized monsters clogging up city streets.

Indeed. It isn’t just SUVs.

 

[Cobra]

So a cyclist, horse rider or someone on a legal e-scooter actually has more 'rights' than a driver to be there. As in, they actually have a legal right; you don't.

That makes no sense whatsoever.
Drivers and M/cyclists have passed a competency test.
The same cannot be said for most horse riders cyclists or e-scooter riders.
Nor are they taxed for use on the roads, nor insured, for any damage they may cause.

 

[Pound Coin]

It may not make any sense, but it is true.

In order to operate large motorised machinery on the roads you need a license.

 

[Cobra]

In order to operate large motorised machinery on the roads you need a license.

And once passed a test have a legal right to be there.
Where as the afore mentioned just ride rough shod through the laws, having no insurance, no road tax ( call it what you will)
or any form of competency certificate to prove they are capable of sticking to the laws of the road.

 

[Cobra]

3: Neither are you. Road Tax was abolished in 1937.

I know you would be pedantic about that. so I have no need to tax my car to be able to use it on the roads? then? if its funded elsewhere?

1: Why would you think that being allowed to drive a motor vehicle should require a competency test?

The same as being able to prove that you are in full control of what ever mode of transport you are using on the PUBLIC roads, highways and by-ways.

 

[Cobra]

so it's really not a good idea to bang on about 'road tax', as the stats and figures soon discount this as being at all significant. You're not paying VED to use the roads; you're paying it cos your vehicle causes problems to the whole of society.

I have a radical idea, instead of staff baiting, and arguing with other members, in general,
how about you actually take some images, post those those images, get involved with the photography forums generally, its much safer

 

[Cobra]

Oh, I will, and I have. As for 'baiting'; having had to listen to such views for so long I find it more useful to respond to them with facts.

You are on a fine line here, returning previously banned are not welcome.

 

[Pound Coin]

And once passed a test have a legal right to be there.
Where as the afore mentioned just ride rough shod through the laws, having no insurance, no road tax ( call it what you will)
or any form of competency certificate to prove they are capable of sticking to the laws of the road.

Only if they also keep their licence, and have insurance, and their vehicle has a valid MOT.


As for riding roughshod over the laws, I believe 85% of drivers admit to speeding. So presumably they aren't capable of sticking to the laws of the road?