I could slap her face !!

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bigrob

bigrob

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I am not a violent man I swear but I could slap her face.

Last year one of the mum's at my son's rugby started taking photos at the matches.

She then uploades all the photos to her FB page.

After a few matches she asked me for some advice on camera settings as a lot of her photos were blurred.

I went through settings with her and suggested she get a faster lens. She then bought the Siggy 70-200/2.8.

6 months later she got a good shot of my son playing rugby league. I tagged the photo and asked if I could get the full res photo.

Her husband emailed me a 125kb copy. I then emailed back explaining what I meant by full resolution. Nothing came.

A few weeks later I tagged two other photos and asked for them.

Nothing, nada, zilch etc etc

Okay so be it.

I have now started putting shots of the team on my website so that people can buy them if they like.

I sent out an email to all the parents with the address, explaining how best to navigate the site etc.

Within about half an hour she "replies to all" saying
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My photos are on Facebook - I restrict them to be available to friends only so just send me a friend request if you want to look at them.

If anyone wants copies just let me know and I'll stick them on a disc for you.
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That is why I could slap her. Others may be generous with their interpretation but I see it another way - hence the rant.

I haven't told her that she can just upload a high res version to FB, so people can download direct from there ;)

A mate then emailed me

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I think it’s nice that ****** will burn hers onto a DVD and give it to anyone who wants it at no cost - show’s you up for the money-grabbing charlaton that we know you to be!!!!!
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I did laugh at that mind.

Still I know that at the end of the day if I produce a product of much better quality then I will still get sales, but this does make it harder.

I have helluva lot of room for improvement - hence why I post for C&c in photo sharing section.

The challenge has been set though.

That is my rant over for the day. Bed at midnight and up at 5am for work after being out for 16 hours yesterday.
 
happens to us all....all the time.. i do my kids football and the league have my logo on there website and i am invited to do all cup finals which i do so long as i am the only photogrpaher... in that i mean pitchside and presentations.. I dont do any games now where its a free for all because i would be wasting my time when facebook is flooded witht he same pics.. at 600pixels even OOF poor pics can look good sharpened enough so i dont bother competing..


unless i am getting paid..then i dont care who is there
blackburn ladies i have one guy who stands behind me taking the exact same pics i take.. i dont have exclusive rights and i am being paid so i dont bother..
 
bigrob said:
A mate then emailed me

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I think it’s nice that ****** will burn hers onto a DVD and give it to anyone who wants it at no cost - show’s you up for the money-grabbing charlaton that we know you to be!!!!!
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.
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LOL was that a joke or was he serious?
 
Ct

He's a good friend and was taking the p*ss out of me.
 
Here's another little story fom the same day.

One of the mum's when she saw I turned up with my stills camera said "Aaarh I was hoping you were going to video today as I wanted a copy".

This match was against our biggest rivals.

I then said to her

"Oh so you wanted me to video and then give you a DVD. Hmm I am still waiting for the two photos of Oli (my kid) that your husband took 16 months ago when he was about to play for Kent for the first time. When I asked him for the third time a few months ago I was told - it's at the bottom of a long list of things to do"


I know I sound like a miserable bugger but I'm not. I'm just sick of some people who want to take take take and never give.
 
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What's her photo's like though? If you're taking better shots it doesn't matter.

Do you sell to raise money for the team/club or for yourself? I sell for a small amount but it's amazing how much builds up over the season.
Mind you, despite the website explaining all money goes to the team (and it really is a small amount per pic) it's a shame to constantly discover my watermarked photo's on other sites such as facebook etc.
Usually a reminder email sorts out the issue.
 
Byker28i said:
What's her photo's like though? If you're taking better shots it doesn't matter.
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free poor shots are preffered over good paid for shots when using on facebook :( unless your buying a print to hang on your wall then I disagree..it does matter
 
I have totally changed my mind regarding face book, used to love it, it got my name out there, and im thankful for that, now it's a tool for me to keep an eye on my images, I ask for the thieves to remove the pics, 24 hours later email facebook and get them to remove them.

Just had one player email me asking why I got facebook to remove my pic, "It's good advertising for you, it has your web address across it". Ah well, I suppose thats good then :LOL:
 
I have no problem with her taking photos, putting them on FB & giving them away. It's not for me to tell her to sell hers.

It was the fact that she was replying to my email to everyone telling them hers are for free.

Most of hers are pretty poor, but as Kipax says

KIPAX said:
free poor shots are preffered over good paid for shots when using on facebook :(
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The difficulty for me is, is it worth my time to do it. Probably not.

Probably better for me to photograph sometimes but only to get shots of my son.
 
There's a rather annoying American woman who comes over for Appleby Horse Fair and anyone who wants a copy of her Appleby photos (normally loads of people), she emails a high resolution copy to them free of charge.

She is blonde, mid 30's slim and attractive (ish). Wears a white t shirt and makes a big thing about sitting or standing in the river to 'get the shots'. Of course, she gets the attention she so well deserves.:) She announced to me last year 'I've photographed horses all over the world but these are the real thing'. (Yawn).

Then she buggers back off to America to her ranch with her horses she sells for thousands of dollars. She recently put something on facebook warning people that she'll take action against them if the 'steal' her images.

She has a photography business in America.

her generosity should mean none of us could make a sale. However, on my page, I was quite surprised to receive a message from a person who was at Appleby with one of their horses and the person ordered several A3 copies which I sold to her for a nice price. She even drove the 80 miles to my house to collect them.

I'm not a jealous person, and I haven't got anything against American white t shirt wearing blondes in rivers but hey ho. She does really annoy me though.:)



Lisa
 
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Quote:The difficulty for me is, is it worth my time to do it. Probably not.

Probably better for me to photograph sometimes but only to get shots of my son.Unquote.

You've answered your own question. You're flogging a dead horse with this woman. Just blank her in future. :):)

Lisa
 
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Crazyhorse said:
There's a rather annoying American woman who comes over for Appleby Horse Fair and anyone who wants a copy of her Appleby photos (normally loads of people), she emails a high resolution copy to them free of charge.

She is blonde, mid 30's slim and attractive (ish). Wears a white t shirt and makes a big thing about sitting or standing in the river to 'get the shots'. Of course, she gets the attention she so well deserves.:) She announced to me last year 'I've photographed horses all over the world but these are the real thing'. (Yawn).

Then she buggers back off to America to her ranch with her horses she sells for thousands of dollars. She recently put something on facebook warning people that she'll take action against them if the 'steal' her images.

She has a photography business in America.

her generosity should mean none of us could make a sale. However, on my page, I was quite surprised to receive a message from a person who was at Appleby with one of their horses and the person ordered several A3 copies which I sold to her for a nice price. She even drove the 80 miles to my house to collect them.

I'm not a jealous person, and I haven't got anything against American white t shirt wearing blondes in rivers but hey ho. She does really annoy me though.:)



Lisa
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I feel a trip to Appleby coming on this year!

Ducking stools anyone?
icon_twisted.gif
 
LOL! I'd love to post a pic but that is sooooooooo unprofessional.:):)

Lisa
 
Lisa

We don't care re the unprofessioanl bit.

We demand a photo ;)
 
I just searched for images from the Appleby Horse Fair and realised that it's the one from My Big Fat Gypsy Wedding.
 
bigrob said:
I just searched for images from the Appleby Horse Fair and realised that it's the one from My Big Fat Gypsy Wedding.
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I've got my own Appleby Horse Fair page on Facebook with 1200 members, I'll put a pic of her on here at lunch time. It's a bit naughty though isn't it? Mind you, I am interested in finding out which model of camera and lens she uses, so you guys could tell me. Eyes on the camera please.....:):):)
 
I'm always happy to give away full res images taken of the local rugby team. I'm not a professional with no wish to be. I don't put much on facebook, usually only a couple of my son and its only open to friends and family but whenever I am asked for a photo I take the persons email address and send them a full res photos for nothing. Occasionally I am asked for a print which I never do.
 
Tom Harper said:
I'm always happy to give away full res images taken of the local rugby team. I'm not a professional with no wish to be. I don't put much on facebook, usually only a couple of my son and its only open to friends and family but whenever I am asked for a photo I take the persons email address and send them a full res photos for nothing. Occasionally I am asked for a print which I never do.
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Ah yes, I remember you from a few months back...kicked up a bit of a stink about payments. I seem to remember you being just as belligerent then too.

I don't intend to engage in a long and pedantic argument with you, but let me say this one thing:

Fools never prosper.

And this is the most foolish thing I have ever seen pronounced on TP.

Be warned my friend, there are plenty of people out there who can bite you on the arse if you take away their livelihood.
 
jamesb84 said:
Be warned my friend, there are plenty of people out there who can bite you on the arse if you take away their livelihood.
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They'll do one hell of a sight more than nibble his backside if he tries poaching someone's livelyhood in Prestina!
 
jamesb84 said:
Ah yes, I remember you from a few months back...kicked up a bit of a stink about payments. I seem to remember you being just as belligerent then too.

I don't intend to engage in a long and pedantic argument with you, but let me say this one thing:

Fools never prosper.

And this is the most foolish thing I have ever seen pronounced on TP.

Be warned my friend, there are plenty of people out there who can bite you on the arse if you take away their livelihood.
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Here we go again. The pro photographers that complain at the amateurs taking work from them or food of their plate. Is it foolish to cut a neighbors grass for them when they are on holiday or is that taking work away from landscape gardeners if I pick a friend up from the pub is that taking business from taxi drivers. Photography is nothing more than a hobby for me my photos are not of a professional standard and so I am happy to give them away. We don't all see photography as money making tool that only those willing to pay have a right to enjoy.

I might come across as belligerent but I have yet to hear any argument that does not rely on threats, insults or just dumb assumptions that everyone owes the professionals a living to make me think I should charge for sending someone an email with a photo attachment that takes me all of 30 seconds of my time to send them.
 
You never did answer Andy's question about what you do for a living by the way?
 
Tom Harper said:
Here we go again. The pro photographers that complain at the amateurs taking work from them or food of their plate. Is it foolish to cut a neighbors grass for them when they are on holiday or is that taking work away from landscape gardeners if I pick a friend up from the pub is that taking business from taxi drivers. Photography is nothing more than a hobby for me my photos are not of a professional standard and so I am happy to give them away. We don't all see photography as money making tool that only those willing to pay have a right to enjoy.

I might come across as belligerent but I have yet to hear any argument that does not rely on threats, insults or just dumb assumptions that everyone owes the professionals a living to make me think I should charge for sending someone an email with a photo attachment that takes me all of 30 seconds of my time to send them.
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Trust me mate, you couldn't take food off my plate if you tried. I'm perfectly happy with my contacts and contracts.
 
Tom Harper said:
I'm always happy to give away full res images taken of the local rugby team. I'm not a professional with no wish to be. I don't put much on facebook, usually only a couple of my son and its only open to friends and family but whenever I am asked for a photo I take the persons email address and send them a full res photos for nothing. Occasionally I am asked for a print which I never do.
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Some will learn, some don't want to. Simple fact of life.

I think the main problem is that you seem happy and content to rub it in people's faces. I'm not a pro either, I earn less from my photo's in a year than my main job gives me weekly. The difference is this, I know the value and worth of what I do, and the harm it has on others. Simple fact of consideration for others.

Phil.
 
jamesb84 said:
Trust me mate, you couldn't take food off my plate if you tried. I'm perfectly happy with my contacts and contracts.
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Then why are you so upset at the mere mention of it. Already the tone has turned to threatening just because I give away a few photos. Its exactly what happened before its impossible to discuss this issue on here in a reasonable way.
Its as if you think that by threatening and insulting anyone who contradicts the groupthink in these forums its going to make it go away by stopping anyone from contradicting your opinion.
Insult me all you want threaten me all you want it does not make your argument any more compelling.
 
Tom Harper said:
Then why are you so upset at the mere mention of it. Already the tone has turned to threatening just because I give away a few photos. Its exactly what happened before its impossible to discuss this issue on here in a reasonable way.
Its as if you think that by threatening and insulting anyone who contradicts the groupthink in these forums its going to make it go away by stopping anyone from contradicting your opinion.
Insult me all you want threaten me all you want it does not make your argument any more compelling.
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OK, let's discuss this reasonably then.

Firstly, I'm not upset by the mere mention of it. What I think grates on a number of people is the fact that in a thread where the prevailing emotion has been against people doing freebies, you've come in and stated openly and unabashedly that you give away freebies. It might come across as "trolling", and it certainly raises some hackles.

I personally have no problem whatsoever with you giving away your photos. I have people who appreciate the effort and work involved in producing the images that I do. They appreciate it by paying me to produce the images...some even ask for me by name as they like the style I produce. That's not me boasting, but illustrating why I'm not bothered.

However, in some quarters photography is a dog-eat-dog world, and those people who are trying to sell what you are giving away for free will suffer. Those people will inevitably be "somewhat miffed" at your statements. Coincidentally, a lot of those same people are members at TP. Ergo, you may find that you leave quite a lot of people here "somewhat miffed" when you make your same bold statements. It's a question of audience you see...if you were to say "I give away photos for free" on facebook for example, you'd probably get quite a few appreciative replies and even some requests for photos.

Say the same on here, and you'll probably be shot down for it. There is one thing I agree with you on though, you state that "I'm not a professional with no wish to be"...you're right. Professionalism is all about being diplomatic and knowing your audience.

So far with your posts on this subject you have shown to be seriously deficient in both those qualities.
 
phil8139 said:
Some will learn, some don't want to. Simple fact of life.

I think the main problem is that you seem happy and content to rub it in people's faces. I'm not a pro either, I earn less from my photo's in a year than my main job gives me weekly. The difference is this, I know the value and worth of what I do, and the harm it has on others. Simple fact of consideration for others.

Phil.
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I am not trying to rub it in anyones face but I also refuse to be silenced just because others disagree. Its like a pack of bullies the moment you say something that others don't like they pounce not with reasoned arguments but with threats and insults. I don't beleive the quality of my photography is of any threat to anyone. If people want a quality product they can pay for that from elswhere. I simply pass on a few photos that hopefully brighten up a few peoples day, I make no apologies for that.
 
jamesb84 said:
OK, let's discuss this reasonably then.

Firstly, I'm not upset by the mere mention of it. What I think grates on a number of people is the fact that in a thread where the prevailing emotion has been against people doing freebies, you've come in and stated openly and unabashedly that you give away freebies. It might come across as "trolling", and it certainly raises some hackles.

I personally have no problem whatsoever with you giving away your photos. I have people who appreciate the effort and work involved in producing the images that I do. They appreciate it by paying me to produce the images...some even ask for me by name as they like the style I produce. That's not me boasting, but illustrating why I'm not bothered.

However, in some quarters photography is a dog-eat-dog world, and those people who are trying to sell what you are giving away for free will suffer. Those people will inevitably be "somewhat miffed" at your statements. Coincidentally, a lot of those same people are members at TP. Ergo, you may find that you leave quite a lot of people here "somewhat miffed" when you make your same bold statements. It's a question of audience you see...if you were to say "I give away photos for free" on facebook for example, you'd probably get quite a few appreciative replies and even some requests for photos.

Say the same on here, and you'll probably be shot down for it. There is one thing I agree with you on though, you state that "I'm not a professional with no wish to be"...you're right. Professionalism is all about being diplomatic and knowing your audience.

So far with your posts on this subject you have shown to be seriously deficient in both those qualities.
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Ah! you had to finish with a little dig but what the hell I'm a big boy so can live with that.

I like your expression the, ''prevailing emotion' because that is what gets in the way of reasonable discussion and start the insult flying before the issue can be discussed.

I am trying to understand where the harm is in doing a friendly favor lies. Since digital cameras came along the market for professional photography has changed and professionals have to acknowledge that rather than berate anyone who openly states what thousands of people do every day.

While I might give away photos from a rugby match I would never dream of trying to photograph someone’s wedding but that is also not to say if someone from the wedding asked for a copy of a photo I took I wouldn’t give it to them.

If you’re a good photographer an amateur like me will never worry you, I think part of the problem lies in the fact that any tom dick or harry can pick up a camera and claim to be a professional these days and while they might have made a decent living for a while now with the prevalence of digital cameras they are the ones struggling to stay afloat.
 
I dont have any problems wiht what Tom or anyone else does with there pictures.. your pictures your choice.. You can check my history on these forums and you will see this has been consistant for all my time here.. always been the same for me.. your pics.. your choice.. none of my business..

But I am with phil8139 here.. you jumped in to cause a reaction that you knew would happen.. I can only guess that you where a bit bored today :)
 
I'm with you on this Kipax.

It is up to Tom whether he gives his photos away or not. However he seems to have posted just to inflame others.

Tom - please reread my original post and then come back and make a proper contribution to the thread.

Please re-read my original post what it was that annoyed me about the woman.
 
KIPAX said:
I dont have any problems wiht what Tom or anyone else does with there pictures.. your pictures your choice.. You can check my history on these forums and you will see this has been consistant for all my time here.. always been the same for me.. your pics.. your choice.. none of my business..

But I am with phil8139 here.. you jumped in to cause a reaction that you knew would happen.. I can only guess that you where a bit bored today :)
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Actually I didn't just jumped in I made a comment on the subject under discussion on the issue of giving away free photos.I was just offering another side as it seemed that the discussion was making out that there is something intrinsically wrong with offering free photo which I don't believe there is. Just because I represent another side of that view and make a simple statment of this, suddenly I am labelled a trouble maker and everyone feels they have free reign to threaten and insult me. Take a look at how quickly people start the insults and threats when all I did was make a statment of my viewpoint.
I am open to free discussion on any topic and do not deliberatley make statments just to provoke a bitter reaction. I thought forums were places for free discussion where all points of view were welcomed and not censored by the pack in the form of personal attacks insults and threats.
 
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I think you provoked anger as you just came in and said you give yours away.

Based on my original post - if I was emailing all your rugby team to direct them to my website to look and buy my photos, would you email everyone back to say?

"oh by the way mine are free if anyone wants them"
 
Tom Harper said:
I'm always happy to give away full res images taken of the local rugby team. I'm not a professional with no wish to be. I don't put much on facebook, usually only a couple of my son and its only open to friends and family but whenever I am asked for a photo I take the persons email address and send them a full res photos for nothing. Occasionally I am asked for a print which I never do.
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Your first post is a great post, your pics your decision, however, you did jump in with 'Im Free' and you don't see that for some people that can harm their earning potoential. Just requires a little consideration in how you portray your feelings, that's all.

Tom Harper said:
I am not trying to rub it in anyones face but I also refuse to be silenced just because others disagree. Its like a pack of bullies the moment you say something that others don't like they pounce not with reasoned arguments but with threats and insults. I don't beleive the quality of my photography is of any threat to anyone. If people want a quality product they can pay for that from elswhere. I simply pass on a few photos that hopefully brighten up a few peoples day, I make no apologies for that.
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I feel that you are trying to rub it in peoples faces, why else would your argument only state that you're free and what harm can it do? It's not a pack of bullies either, different people have different views, yours are as valid as anyones. The problem is the general public will always take a free option over a quality one if they don't understand the value of it.

Tom Harper said:
Actually I didn't just jumped in I made a comment on the subject under discussion on the issue of giving away free photos.I was just offering another side as it seemed that the discussion was making out that there is something intrinsically wrong with offering free photo which I don't believe there is. Just because I represent another side of that view and make a simple statment of this, suddenly I am labelled a trouble maker and everyone feels they have free reign to threaten and insult me. Take a look at how quickly people start the insults and threats when all I did was make a statment of my viewpoint.
I am open to free discussion on any topic and do not deliberatley make statments just to provoke a bitter reaction. I thought forums were places for free discussion where all points of view were welcomed and not censored by the pack in the form of personal attacks insults and threats.
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I think you need to appreciate both sides of a topic before you close your eyes and ears to what others think - that is the real debate. Walk into the small local butchers and tell him that asda sell their meat cheaper, watch his face and tell me he will be happy with your point of view that all meat is the same. Open discussion can only work if poeple can grasp a little of both sides of opinioins.

Phil.
 
phil8139 said:
It's not a pack of bullies either, different people have different views, yours are as valid as anyones.

I think you need to appreciate both sides of a topic before you close your eyes and ears to what others think - that is the real debate. Walk into the small local butchers and tell him that asda sell their meat cheaper, watch his face and tell me he will be happy with your point of view that all meat is the same. Open discussion can only work if poeple can grasp a little of both sides of opinioins.

Phil.
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Bullies use intimidation to make their point and if you read through the first few posts after mine everyone of them has an implied threat or insult. That is classic bullying behaviour.

I fully appreciate both sides of the argument I understand that the professionals believe that by me giving away free photos potentially can harm their business but for me this is not a strong enough argument to stop me doing it. If somerone has an other argument I am willing to listen but repeating this one again and again does not make it any more convincing.

As I previously mentioned the photography market is evolving faster than ever and many markets are drying up thanks to the widespread use of digital cameras. Photographers need to evolve with the market and not just blame amateurs for stealing their business. Charities give clothes food etc away for free but they still haven't put marks and Spencer’s out of business.

Just yesterday some stock photographer on BBC news was saying how difficult it had become to make a living but she branched out and found other ways to market her work and stay on top, as the best always will.

I have yet to be convinced that the people I give a free photo to would have paid to have one otherwise.

The argument about walking into a butchers has no relevance here. A butchers is not an open forum for discussion, if it were i would happily discuss price wars with them.
 
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Fair points, badly made. I can see I could never get a reasonable discussion from you, we think totally different, that's ok. We will walk along and nod occasionally.

Phil.
 
bigrob said:
I think you provoked anger as you just came in and said you give yours away.

Based on my original post - if I was emailing all your rugby team to direct them to my website to look and buy my photos, would you email everyone back to say?

"oh by the way mine are free if anyone wants them"
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Of course I wouldn't do this and can see why it annoyed you. I don't tout for business but am happy to accomidate a friendly request.
I could understand the pros argument if I set up a stall or website offering free photos, but for me its laughable to beleive no one should ever give their photos away for free and should always charge.

I could just imagine my mates face next time I pick him up from the airport and then ask him for a few quid, telling him its not really for me but it helps keep the other cabbies in business!
 
phil8139 said:
Fair points, badly made. I can see I could never get a reasonable discussion from you, we think totally different, that's ok. We will walk along and nod occasionally.

Phil.
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Or is it simply that you have no other argument to make and realise that insults don't help your cause.
 
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