Lens problem or user error?

The goblin

The goblin

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Marsha
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Hi everyone I have a Canon EOS 450D, I recently upgraded from the kit lens 18-55mm IS to the 15-85mm IS USM. I had problems with the kit lens in low light situations so upgraded as the blurb on WEX stated 'fantastic low-light performance' Well I just haven't experienced this yet!

My main subjects are my children, with a 7 month old a lot of photos are taken indoors on the floor. I was struggling to get any pictures in focus as I was going by the exposure level indicator, it ALWAYS said under exposed. To get it (apparently) correctly exposed meant a very slow shutter speed. Well have you ever asked a baby and a toddler to sit still? Needless to say all photos were out of focus!

I started ignoring the exposure indicator and try to keep my shutter speed at 1/125 unless I'm using a tripod or a flash. This is another problem, as certain photos require my Speedlite attached. As you can imagine with children sometimes you just need to grab your camera and shoot, faffing around attaching a flash means missing the shot, but having a camera sat around with a flash attached is risky with a toddler about!

So my question is am I using this lens wrong? I always work in manual exposure and I'm now trying to figure out if there is something else I am doing wrong? The ISO is on auto and always sits at 400 in whatever lighting conditions!

I'm sure there is extra information you might all need to help me here, but I'm new to this forum so please feel free to badger me for information.

Thanks in advance.
 
The 15-85mm has the same aperture widest as your kit lens, so wouldn't be able to perform any better in low light. You want a fast zoom like a 17-50mm f/2.8 or even better a fast prime like a 50mm f/1.4 or f/1.8.
 
Yeah the aperture isn't wide enough as mentioned by Joe. You could maybe bump the ISO a few stops more 800/1600 if it goes that high.

You will get an image that looks more 'grainy/noisey', but you can try some of the free noise reduction software.

Noiseware Community Edition Standalone 2.6 .

It may also struggle to focus in lowlight as well, so be aware of that too.


Andy
 
hello goblin, welcome to the forum.

as has been mentioned, the 15-85 is exactly the same aperture as your kit lens... it needs quite a bit of light to get a fast shutter speed, indoors especially.

from experience, it'd say 1/125 is way too slow for a moving toddler, regardless of focal length.

without getting another lens, you're either going to have to get that flash gun attached or raise your ISO.

i see from your camera bag, you've got the 85 1.8 - this is a much better lens (aperture wise, if not focal length wise) for indoor shots. you may also want to consider the canon ef 50 1.8 or sigma 30 1.4 if you need something a bit wider.

the 450d doesn't have great high iso performance and i think even with a 2.8 zoom you'd probably be pushing it, so i think a wide aperture prime is probably the only way to go indoors if you can't use your flash. i found that with my 24-70 indoors without flash i was regularly needing to up my iso to 2000 or more and i think the 450d only goes to 1600.... so you can see the problem.
 
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I think they refer to it as being good in low light due to the very good image stabilisation. You'll find you will be able to get very sharp images of still subjects in low light as the IS will keep the frame steady. Unfortunately if the subject moves the lens will perform in the same manner as the kit lens as the aperture is no better.

It's a very nice lens though!
 
If you are not using flash, there are three ways you can make adjustments to allow you to use a fast'ish shutter speed to prevent blurred photos due to subject movement.

Open the aperture as wide as possible. Chances are you are already doing this, and have discovered that the maximum aperture of your lens is not wide enough.

Up the ISO to a higher level. The only downside of this is that you will experience more noise in your images.

Turn more lights on in the room. This may not be practical if all of them are already turned on.

If with all these options your shutter speed is still not fast enough to prevent blurring due to movement, your only option really is to purchase another lens with a wider aperture, or use flash.
 
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Thanks Gents, it appears I need to do more research before splashing the cash!

You know my prime lens has been a little redundant lately, I need to dig it out and play with it more as I do get great results with it. Focal length is a problem though, especially when trying to get both children in a shot! This will obviously be beneficial for candid shots when they're bigger!

I have just started dabbling with the ISO settings, maybe the newest obsession of an upgrade to a 7D will be more tempting now!

I can see this forum is going to be bad for my bank balance :-D
 
personally for what you have said you shoot id sell the 15-85 and buy a 50 1.4 or 1.8 and then buy yourself something a little wider or longer aswell if you need it ..

the smaller the number (1.2,1.4,1.8,2.0, 2.8 etc) the more light it will let in and the faster it will be
 
Marsha,
I’d be tempted to use “off camera flash”. I’m not sure if Canon does the same system as Nikon for fully metered TTL CLS stuff but you can do the same sort of thing in manual mode with a cheapo eBay remote trigger. Set your flash to fire at full power and your shutter speed to the highest sync speed and place your flash high up on a book shelf, out of the way of tiny hands, pointing in the general direction and bounced off the ceiling. With a few test shots you can adjust the F stop (camera set to full manual mode) to suit the flash power and with the fast shutter speed the ambient room lighting will only be a small part of the overall exposure so it should be pretty close whatever the outside conditions. If you have more than 1 flash then the results will be better. Try out different positions for the flash to get the best results with regard to unwanted shadows etc…. Or just buy a 7D and use extra hi ISO…….;)

Andrew
 
Hi Andrew. A 7D is winging it's way here already:-) I ummed & ahhh'd but figured I have subjects to shoot so what the hell, ka ching goes the credit card!

As for flash stuff this is something I really need to learn! Maybe next time we're visiting Stuart I'll have to pick your brains.

On the remote thing, what am I looking for on eBay? I have a husbands paypal to spend:-D

Oh I dusted off my prime lens yesterday, I really need to use that more! But a snotty poorly baby isn't an attractive model right now!
 
Let me know what flash you have and I'll look into it. Did the 7D land? Stuart seems very happy with his new toy too!
 
Ooooooo, yes :D It obviously arrived 10 minutes before the snot monster woke up so I didn't have much time to play with it!

I put the 15-85mm on it and had a quick go, I didn't change any settings just took a few quick pictures, I got a few pin sharp photos without trying! Now I need to read the instruction manual and figure out all the knobs and whistles!

The best part is it came with a lovely little cashback voucher book and I can claim back £75 against my macro lens :D

I need my CF card to arrive now, I managed to get 14 photos and a 2 second video on my old 128mb card! When I fished the card out of storage it had 220 photos stored on it, oh how times have changed :lol:

Oh my flash is the 430EX II. I found this on eBay:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/PT04-Wireless...ories_CameraFlashUnits_JN&hash=item4149de0449

Is that what you mean?
 
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Don't forget the 7D will trigger the 430 flash off camera using the pop up flash. It's in the manual.
 
I've just discovered high ISO! DS was on the sofa so I grabbed a few shots before he tried to roll off. They looked good on the LCD screen but VERY grainy on the big screen. At closer inspection I found out it had taken them at ISO 3200!!!!!!

I obviously haven't read the manual yet for this camera, time is precious with two small people! I'm also still waiting for my 8GB CF card so not shooting in RAW.

I will get reading now (he's asleep) and maybe consider uploading a few images for some comments/ criticism in the portraits section. Got to learn somewhere right?

Thanks for all your tips, I will definitely be playing with the flash and remote business, eventually!

Marsha.
 
Turn off the automatic lighting optimiser, and the high-ISO noise reduction in the camera. Install the latest version of DPP (and the EOS utility) from the Canon website.
Under the tool-panel, there is a very good noise reduction facility.
Also, the on-board flash on the 7d ain't too shabby in itself. You can also bump up the output of the flash (assuming you are not in full-auto), I use the quick select feature, then the 8-way dial to move to the flash setting, and bump this up to +1 or +2 when required.
 
trevorbray said:
Don't forget the 7D will trigger the 430 flash off camera using the pop up flash. It's in the manual.
Click to expand...

Thank you for this.

Andrew I had a look at that video, watched a few minutes and decided it was too advanced.
Then I got the manual out to read about some basic functions. After a few pages I just skipped straight to the flash section. Obviously what little I had seen of the video stuck and I was flashing away at my husband, not how he would probably have liked;-)

I'm in awe! My 430EX has had very little use since I got it, that will be changing. Especially as it's actually very easy to set up. I just need to learn the basics and practice.

Thank you all for your tips and advice, my 'problem' lens has hardly left my 7D!
 
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