New Profoto speedlite leaked

Had a good month last month... so...

A1-1.jpg


Replacing an SB5000, this is my first Profoto unit... I'll probably start building a location system from here.

I've read all the scoffing about the price above. Yes it's expensive but at the same time it strikes me as good value... Quality oozes out of it as soon as you open the box, similar to the feeling I got when I unboxed my Irix 11mm Blackstone lens... everything moves with a satisfying quality feel, makes my SB5000 feel like a toy.

Turn it on and sheer joy... an intuitive and easy to understand menu system. Maybe it's my total lack of patience or maybe I'm just thick but I could never get to grips with Nikon flash menu's. This is in a different league of user friendliness.

First impressions:
Huge easy to read display and intuitive menu system.
Super fast recycle time.
Intuitive manual zoom ring.
Modelling LEDs a big plus (very handy for assessing the zoom setting).
Magnetic attachments super fast and easy to use... and they're strong and stable (to coin a phrase).

All I have to do now is take some pics with it!
 
Flashman said:
I could never get to grips with Nikon flash menu's
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Mind you, I had a great time with my SB900 (x6)
but these A1's are another ballgame!
 
kman said:
so whats verdict?
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In my operations, the most important aspect
is the smooth integration to the entire Profoto
TTL system. All other benefits are marginal
since I had no problem with the SB900s.

Cool modifiers + outstanding power + perfor-
mance and the expected reliability = brilliant!
 
mike weeks said:
A fool and his money are soon parted
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I'd say the same about Bentley ownership… but I'm like you
when it comes to expenses like that. They can afford it, cool!

Anything Profoto costs something but it gives you a tool that
was well thought, performs flawlessly and that, if you are in
business, maybe comfortably amortized. I can use it, cool too!
 
A Profoto speedlite makes zero sense for anyone not already committed to the Profoto system. But if you are already committed, it makes 100% sense.
 
mike weeks said:
A fool and his money are soon parted, a flashgun for £1k - all a bit emperors new clothes if you ask me, enjoy
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The odd thing is no one stops to properly test the damn thing, we don't know how consistent it is, we don't know how well it handles high volume, all we do know is most people think it's too expensive.

Seems odd no one's done an in depth review on this thing yet.
 
HoppyUK said:
give it a try and I bet you buy one (or three) ;)
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I did try it. I got one and two are coming soon.
Already sold 3x SB900 and will sell the others
too with their Power Extenders and PW as well,
of course. Interested? :cool:
 
Personally I’m still worried about having a flash head that leaks...

Anyway it’s not a flash for £1000... it’s a portable studio head. Totally different. Honestly don’t any of you know what you’re talking about! :)

(All meant in jest)
 
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simonbarker said:
Seems odd no one's done an in depth review on this thing yet.
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It's plug and play… nothing more.
Not exciting for most but a thrill for me!
 
simonbarker said:
The odd thing is no one stops to properly test the damn thing, we don't know how consistent it is, we don't know how well it handles high volume, all we do know is most people think it's too expensive.

Seems odd no one's done an in depth review on this thing yet.
Click to expand...

What, you mean we should not believe that all those paid users could be wrong?
 
Eloise said:
It’s a game changer? :)
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Somehow it is and not.
  • It is compared even to the SB5000 that came on the
    market much too late, yes.
    … Nikon was not clever with the slave method.
  • It is in terms of extreme use… contrary to Nikon's
    heat problems at extreme fire rate. The A1 has none.
  • It is as well when one has to set up for 32 heads of
    a corporate shoot within 30 min and 3 min per head
    for the shooting itself.
The disappointing thing is there is so little fuss using it…

I will be able to say more when I get hold of the two other units.
 
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mike weeks said:
And anybody paying £1K for a flashgun probably should be committed
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There is more than just commitment!

Think of the smooth integration into the TTL system and
no more need of the very reliable PWs.

Simple, precise, constant… and, when one does his home-
work like I did, no so expensive after all.
 
Kodiak Qc said:
no more need of the very reliable PWs.
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That was the last thing that many of us thought about PW (I was so happy to sell mine for a good price and buy something that actually worked) and if that is your benchmark then things become clear - knowing the language barrier do you understand the term "to be committed"?

i understand why some might want these, with a big stretch of the imagination but not for me

Mike
 
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mike weeks said:
knowing the language barrier do you understand the term "to be committed"?
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I google translated your reply and I think I understood it.

For as long as I used the PW system, it never failed me.

Add the SB900 + power extender + PW = over a grand!
For me, The A1 is a darn good system simplifier using
the latest Profoto tech and it eases my work immensely.
 
HoppyUK said:
A Profoto speedlite makes zero sense for anyone not already committed to the Profoto system
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See my reply in #62, Richard.

Economically, it makes a lot of sense for me.
 
Eloise said:
Sorry for a basic question... what’s a PW?
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I am sorry, Éloise, with these gear, i presumed
all knew… :oops: :$

PW = Pocket Wizzard. :cool:
 
In the last 10 years I can only remember one instance where I shot with direct flash straight at a subject (as a fill light against harsh sun). The problem I've had with all the youtube videos of it in use (by sponsors) is that they dont really show proper pulled back BTS/how the light looks per image along with settings and measurement of distances etc - just cinematic cutaways of the flash transitioning to a quick flash (pun intended) of the final retouched image.

I think id like to borrow/rent one before making my conclusions. I don't mind the price - sick of constantly recharging AA's
 
kman said:
In the last 10 years I can only remember one instance where I shot with direct flash straight at a subject (as a fill light against harsh sun). The problem I've had with all the youtube videos of it in use (by sponsors) is that they dont really show proper pulled back BTS/how the light looks per image along with settings and measurement of distances etc - just cinematic cutaways of the flash transitioning to a quick flash (pun intended) of the final retouched image.

I think id like to borrow/rent one before making my conclusions. I don't mind the price - sick of constantly recharging AA's
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It's a ridiculous amount of money for most people, but for those who use it as a tool that helps them to earn their living, it's maybe not wildly excessive.

I haven't looked at any sponsored videos, I get so annoyed whenever I look at Profoto videos because they are so insulting to any viewers who actually know anything about lighting, when it's patently obvious that the light that's being shown could not possibly have created the photos that are shown. There's nothing wrong with PP work, but it shouldn't masquerade as lighting - so, if they aren't showing BTS shots then the reason for this is obvious.
mike weeks said:
And anybody paying £1K for a flashgun probably should be committed :exit:

Mike
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@Kodiak Qc in this context, "committed" means that the person has serious mental health issues and is forcibly detained for their own safety and the safety of others.
 
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Garry Edwards said:
in this context, "committed" means that the person has serious mental health issues and is forcibly detained for their own safety and the safety of others.
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Then I got it wrong from GT :mad:

Thanks for the clarification. :cool:
 
HoppyUK said:
A Profoto speedlite makes zero sense for anyone not already committed to the Profoto system. But if you are already committed, it makes 100% sense.
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Disagree

Eloise said:
It’s a game changer? :)
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Disagree
I see this as an natural evolution in strobes, systems and flash photography. There is no reason to buy into Nikon, Canon, Sony etc and a studiosystem, maybe even a third brand for portable highpowered heads if you can get it all from one brand and it's good quality. It may expensive but the time save and more efficient way of working going from on camera flash to off camera without having to change to a trigger with a different menu system can be significant for the professionals. See the succes Godox enjoys, how many posts just on this site recommend buying into that system just for the reason of having those options. The A1 will make Profoto more Interesting for photographers with the needs and budget compared to Elinchrom and what else. As mentioned earlier Profoto is the third brand offering the complete package in flash equipment and I really think that buying the speedlights offered by the camera makes now makes zero sense.
 
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soeren said:
Disagree


Disagree
I see this as an natural evolution in strobes, systems and flash photography. There is no reason to buy into Nikon, Canon, Sony etc and a studiosystem, maybe even a third brand for portable highpowered heads if you can get it all from one brand and it's good quality. It may expensive but the time save and more efficient way of working going from on camera flash to off camera without having to change to a trigger with a different menu system can be significant for the professionals. See the succes Godox enjoys, how many posts just on this site recommend buying into that system just for the reason of having those options. The A1 will make Profoto more Interesting for photographers with the needs and budget compared to Elinchrom and what else. As mentioned earlier Profoto is the third brand offering the complete package in flash equipment and I really think that buying the speedlights offered by the camera makes now makes zero sense.
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I believe Richards point is that an efficient ecosystem that outperforms all the camera brands already exists at a fraction of the price of the Profoto.

Godox have got it sorted, Profoto don't have as many portable alternatives as Godox (though this speedlight is interesting).

So for a Profoto user, this speedlight is a brilliant addition.

To anyone not already committed, but needing this 'speedlight', then a Ving speedlight, an AD200 and an AD600 is a better use of £1000 (ish)
That gives an entry into a truly flexible system, and no more AA batteries (except for the transmitter)
 
Phil V said:
I believe Richards point is that an efficient ecosystem that outperforms all the camera brands already exists at a fraction of the price of the Profoto.

Godox have got it sorted, Profoto don't have as many portable alternatives as Godox (though this speedlight is interesting).

So for a Profoto user, this speedlight is a brilliant addition.

To anyone not already committed, but needing this 'speedlight', then a Ving speedlight, an AD200 and an AD600 is a better use of £1000 (ish)
That gives an entry into a truly flexible system, and no more AA batteries (except for the transmitter)
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I do agree with this and I find Profoto very expensive though if color consistency and things like support if things go wrong is of importance this may not be so crazy.
 
soeren said:
I do agree with this and I find Profoto very expensive though if color consistency and things like support if things go wrong is of importance this may not be so crazy.
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That's vary by country, in the U.K. we can get Godox products with support.

And have you seen direct colour consistency comparisons between the 2 brands? I haven't and not in the habit of assuming a negative.

There's often 'scare stories' about colour consistency and flash. But compared to the mix of light sources I deal with regularly they're a non issue. And with flash, modifiers often add more colour issues than actual light output temp.
 
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Phil V said:
That's vary by country, in the U.K. we can get Godox products with support.

And have you seen direct colour consistency comparisons between the 2 brands? I haven't and not in the habit of assuming a negative.

There's often 'scare stories' about colour consistency and flash. But compared to the mix of light sources I deal with regularly they're a non issue. And with flash, modifiers often add more colour issues than actual light output temp.
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https://petapixel.com/2016/12/05/dont-get-pay-700-godox-ad600-vs-2100-profoto-b1/

https://fstoppers.com/originals/profoto-b1-vs-godox-ad600-flash-photography-155679
Godox is in many ways better than Profoto and for most of us the color consistency is not important so we like godox and I for one would never buy Profoto.
 
Phil V said:
That's vary by country, in the U.K. we can get Godox products with support.

And have you seen direct colour consistency comparisons between the 2 brands? I haven't and not in the habit of assuming a negative.

There's often 'scare stories' about colour consistency and flash. But compared to the mix of light sources I deal with regularly they're a non issue. And with flash, modifiers often add more colour issues than actual light output temp.
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For a high end product photographer, colour consistency is enormously important, but only a tiny percentage of photographers are in this very specialised market.

And anyway, the Godox IGBT flashes are extremely consistent in terms of both colour temperature and output. Obviously, the IGBT flashes that offer a "speed mode" do have a wide colour range, that's an inevitable tradeoff for people who need these incredibly short flash durations, as the power is reduced, the light becomes more and more blue, but is still extremely consistent, shot to shot. This mirrors the performance of the Alien Bees Einstein, the pioneer in IGBT technology.

Move away from "Speed Mode" and you'll struggle to measure, let alone see, colour inconsistency. I used to carry out very detailed colour consistency tests, my Minolta Color meters couldn't measure a difference of less than 10K, and it was often possible to fire 10 shots that recorded at identical temperature, in other words within 10K of each other. 10K is nothing, very few people can see a difference of less than 100K and for most people, 300K is probably OK.

Be aware too that Companies grow and evolve over time. BMW make some very good cars, but years ago they made some pretty horrible Isetta bubble cars:)
So too with Godox. When they bought the Company a few years ago they inherited some awful flash heads, which they still make, for example this one http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Godox-150...102192?hash=item4d419a2270:g:-SwAAOSwTf9ZOhfY and they still sell it as a Godox product (also sold under other names, e..g. Neewer, who are major customers of theirs). Godox's current product range should probably not include these poor legacy products, and they shoulde not be judged on them.

There are still photographers out there who seem to think that their clients judge them on the equipment they own, and in some cases this may be the rationale for buying the most expensive. It's not true of course, clients only care about results, but there you go...
My take on this is that people can buy what they like, spend what they like for whatever reasons they like, but sometimes it can be hard to justify that expenditure based on performance. My main hobby is clay pigeon shooting, and I have shotguns that cost around £2000 each - some of the people I shoot with spend well over £10,000 on a shotgun, and the price isn't reflected in their success. Conversely, I know someone who thinks that £50 for an antique shotgun is a lot of money and I can't be critical of his viewpoint, because he generally hits more clays than I do - in other words, there's snobbery and inverse snobbery in just about every field, both are fine in themselves, but let's not kid ourselves that we actually need to buy the most expensive, and let's not kid ourselves that a Company that's operating in a tiny niche market, and which struggles to sell enough of any product to recover its development costs, is selling at a high price because it's a better product.
 
Phil V said:
Godox have got it sorted, Profoto don't have as many portable alternatives as Godox (though this speedlight is interesting).
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Isn't it about the same? Profoto doesn't really have an equivalent to the AD200 (B2 comes close but isn't the same) but equally so Godox doesn't do anything like the Pro-B4.
 
Garry Edwards said:
and let's not kid ourselves that a Company that's operating in a tiny niche market, and which struggles to sell enough of any product to recover its development costs, is selling at a high price because it's a better product.
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So they're more expensive despite being inferior or equal?
 
simonbarker said:
Isn't it about the same? Profoto doesn't really have an equivalent to the AD200 (B2 comes close but isn't the same) but equally so Godox doesn't do anything like the Pro-B4.
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Godox have a selection of speedlights, the AD200, 360II and 600,

you can gang 2 200's to make a 400ish and 2 600's to make a 1200 ish whilst that's not a Pro B4, it's as much power in a slightly more fiddly but smaller package.

Godox also has a bunch of Manual flashes that integrate, IGBT studio heads etc etc.

But they're aimed at different markets.

As for who'd buy Profoto - If I was the kind of photographer I used to fantasise about being; Me.

I was the young mechanic with a huge Snap On tool chest, I'm happy to dine in Michelin starred restaurants; I appreciate paying over the odds for a premium product :)
 
simonbarker said:
So they're more expensive despite being inferior or equal?
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It's simple economics.
If you manufacturer a left handed waterproof watsit that costs £100,000 to develop, and only sell 100, then each one has to be sold for £1,000 to recover your development costs.
But a larger Company, selling to the mass market, may be able to sell 1,000 of that product, in which case they only have to charge £100 to recover the same costs.

And then add in production costs, because with volume, unit costs go down dramatically. And then there's distribution costs too, when there are a lot more customers, distribution costs a lot less and retailer profit margins are a lot lower because of price competition.
 
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