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Hi guys
I'm Debbie from Gloucester. Have been a member of a camera club for a couple of years now but seem to be a bit stuck in my photography taking and would like to develop and become a better photographer. Any ideas?
Thanks
 
I am probably not the person to give you advice, however quick question what sort of things do you want to photograph and what is wrong with your photos now? Could you post some photos you think could be better?
I liked Tony Northrup's book but many others don't.
 
I would suggest You Tube you will probably gain far more information than you will from members of your camera club.
If your on FB you will find a number of help groups on there as well.:)
There are also a number of photographers here on TP who will offer help to you ;) just ask :)
 
Hi guys
I'm Debbie from Gloucester. Have been a member of a camera club for a couple of years now but seem to be a bit stuck in my photography taking and would like to develop and become a better photographer. Any ideas?
Thanks

Welcome to TP :)

You need an entry level DSLR or CSC type camera. Then read this tutorial on the Exposure Triangle by our Pookeyhead, and practise the effects that changing the settings makes so you really understand what it's all about https://www.talkphotography.co.uk/t...ure-theory-but-were-afraid-to-ask-101.440126/

Then you're on the way - just get out there are shoot pictures. Share them with your camera club members, post them up here, ask questions. Shoot some more, ask more questions, read, learn, shoot, ask etc. Put the effort in (it's not difficult) and the rewards will follow (y)
 
I'm Debbie from Gloucester. Have been a member of a camera club for a couple of years now but seem to be a bit stuck in my photography taking and would like to develop and become a better photographer. Any ideas?Thanks
What would you like to develop... Black & White or Colour? Negative or Slide ;-)
The answer is the Film & Conventional section lol!
Is that an amiable 'idea'?

Howeblier.... you say you are in a camera club.... which implies you'e not an absolute beginner.. but 'stuck' in your photography... which is rather ambiguous.

Photography on it's own can be a rather introspective persuit; it's primarily a recording medium, not a creative one, inspiration has to come from outside the camera, creation has to come from outside the camera, the camera only records what you have been inspired to create. As such, it's a wonderful compliment to other hobbies or interests, but without that parallel external stimulus, it can tend to stagnancy.

Meanwhile Camera-Clubs... I am a Marxist BTW... I wouldn't want to be a member of any club that would have ME as a member!..... (Groucho rather than Karl, if I need to explain the joke for the younger generation!).... Clubs can be curious entitles; and camera clubs, with that tendency to introspection in the pursuit has to start with, can be very peculiar indeed! How much you can get out of a club will almost always depend on how much you put in, and there is a rather large efficiency loss in that, and one that follows a law of diminishing returns, the more you try and put in!

To compress a rather long ramble; my major passion is for motorbikes; once upon a time these things were tools; a cheap way to get to work, when you could't afford a car! Now they are more often bits of leisure equipment, ridden most often not for any real purpose, but 'just' for the fun. Compromising my Marxist principles then, I have been encouraged to join a few motorcycle clubs over the years, and there are many of them, all with hugely differing 'remits'. At one end, there are the social clubs.... and to offer illustration, I attended a one make 'Owners-Club' meet not long ago... I wondered if I was in the right place, or I had got the dates mixed up... there wasn't a motorbike to be seen! I wandered in in my crash hat, and was eventually approached by a chap with a beard clutching a pint of real ale.. and 'introduced' and spent most of the evening chatting to folk about their bikes, most of which were cosseted in garages as it was still 'too cold' to ride them... or they were in 'bits' being renovated or customized.... it seemed that to many members, the bike was something to be played with and talked about, fiddled with in the garage, and ridden, hopefully, if it was 'fixed', to the ONE club annual rally each year! On the other hand, I was invited to a a Motorcycle Touring Club 'meet' some time ago.... I had to ride 60 miles into the wilderness to get there, and it was pretty obvious I hadn't got place or dates mixed up, when I found the pub, with fifty bikes taking over the place and a field full of tents, a big bonfire and a marquee center stage, and a rock band playing loudly with enthusiasm. Talk of 'bikes' was limited; most of the natter was about other rallies and who had been, and how drunk they had got! I have been to many many other events over the years, and attitudes have varied from anywhere between extremes, and bikes featured more or less predominantly; but where they have, its often been 'show specials' that have been the main feature, and debate over whether 'trailer trophies' that look great but arrived in the back of a van, rather than their own steam, deserved a rosette in 'show'. Counter-point to that? Competition Clubs. My preferred form of masochism is "Observed Section Trials" a sport that if you are old enough, you may recall being on TV in a show called 'Kick-Start', where we have to ride a marked 'section' through gates, round, through, or over 'obsticles' which could be anything from a tree... vertical or lying down! to a stream, a big hill, a builders skip or a wrecked car or even a huge drain-pipe; and the objective is to get from one end of the section to the other (usually very slowly!), under watchful gaze of an 'observer', without falling off! Or stopping, or putting a foot down, or missing a 'gate'. Its a very 'technical discipline, and the observer marks your score sheet as you go, and you might ride 30 sectons in an event, and when the scores from each section are tallies at the end, one with the lowest score wins. I find it has more 'interest' than racing, which is just tearing around and round in circles as fast as you can... which I have also tried... but outside that 'challenge' 'the 'club'; You get some club chatter, which can vary from, "OK, where's the pub then?" to "Ah, well, what you need is a double wiffle valve" and rampant debate in contention "No! You need to lean backwards! Its all in the technique not the technology!".. and a glance round reveals that many haven't even engaged in that! They have come, they have ridden, and they just go home again! But common across the entire club scene... the 'leisure' activities associated with the bikes predominate, and if you ask any-one if they still use a bike to get to and from work, they look at you as if you have just landed from another planet!

This is 'clubs'; they all have their own unique flavor; some are strictly business,, whatever that business may be, putting on a show, or setting a tough competition, or throwing a great party... or just milling about nattering technicalities over a pint of real ale....

So what sort of Camera club are you in? Are they ardent competition photographers? Are they deeply into exhibition photography? Or is it a bunch of camera geeks sat about talking f-stops and the advantages of Full Frame over crop sensors or the unique 'warmth' of Velvia 120? But more important, are YOU getting anything from it?

To offer rhetorical question always proffer, whenever this "In a Rut with my Photography!" query comes up; WHY DID YOU PICK UP A CAMERA TO START WITH?
Enthusiasm you had when you started, has probably been lost along with the objectives you had. It's like the bikes.... getting 'in' to it and worried about clearing a section or dropping a tenth on lap-times, or dropping concourse marks for having metric rather than witworth bolts on show, or obsessed with your oil viscosity or clutch actuation, or the benefits of hard luggage over soft, or how much Tenassee Mash some-one drank at the last 'gig'... all sort of makes you forget, that you USED to to this JUST t get to work with a grin on your face, rather than a grimace!

Get back to your beginnings, get back t basics, you may find the enthusiasm again, you may likely find the direction you seek. Club Photo may or may not be part of that; another interest may be a part of that; BUT likely, the biggest difference will be in change the way you look AT 'photography', and inverting that 'introspection' of the pursuit, and sorting the wheat fro the chaff, in what aspects of the pursuit you gain from, and what aspects sap you.

To become a 'better' photographer, you MAY have to stop thinking of yourself AS a photographer.... you likely have to stop looking AT photography as that pursuit in itself, and look outside the photography to find what gives that photography purpose, and gives YOU pleasure.

BUT... STILL plenty of opportunity for Development in the wonderful world of FILM! Any many many different chemistries you can play with 'developing' ;-)
 
One day I will take photos that are great - all in focus, good composition, etc, and others where nothing goes right. I'm not consistent I suppose. I take mostly landscapes as that's what is available.
 
Teflon- mike
Thank you for your message. Not into motorbikes!
The sort of club you mention is very familiar to me. The one I belong to is very into competitions and I think this is how I now look at my photos. I am always looking at them and thinking of what a judge would say.
I need to go back to taking photos for fun and not for a judge!
I do enter the competitions for the critique, not to win, but perhaps I need to stop taking it on board for EVERY photo that I take and just go out and enjoy myself!
Thanks for your insight
 
There are two sides to photography - one is technical and the other is cultural. You can gather info about the technical from all over the place. For the cultural aspects, the best source is looking - at the work of others, and your own. None of us can look enough. Great photographers, mediocre photographers, historic photographers, humble photographers, pretentious photographers ... and I would firmly recommend stepping outside of the 'club' enclosure - it's likely too hermetic. You have to become you (photographically), and it isn't prescriptive by others.
 
I need to go back to taking photos for fun and not for a judge!
Absolutely.

My own exposure to cam-club was twenty five years back and I signed up to do City & Guilds at night-school. By dint of duristiction, this was at Solihul Tech, and the tutors and lab tech were all keen clubbers, from Solihul RPS or rivals Redditch; who between them vied for exhibition & competition awards, and it was only when one of the tutors showed us some of his pictures in a lecture on 'presentation & mounting' and I blurted "I recognise that one!", realised that it had been in one of the photo mags I was buying two or three of a month, and going back, the competition & exhibtion pages were stuffed full of the two clubs entries, they were two of the most prolific in the country at the time! And the course, loosely ran to culb principles with photo challenges set each week, and a class comment & critique of results a fortnght later.
It was, particularly informative, and did challenge me to tackle subjects I would never have considered on my own; but at the same time, it did take me a long way down that road of introspection, where so much of the 'point' of a picture was being lost, trying to achieve 'effect' or 'impact' or chasing techncal merit, and the photo's were usually contrived, pretentiouse and ultimately lacking in 'interest'.

I had actually signed up for the course for a couple of reasons, main one was that I had got 'in' to photo while at uni, and on a grant-cheque budget, and inspired by a copy of Langford's "Darkroom Handbook", I'd chanced on in the book-shop and bought instead of the 'steam tables' and 'Engineers Beam Theory' I really needed for my course Lol! I had taken to shooting slide film and kitchen sink developing it, in order to afford to take photo's!

Thing was, that bulk loading slide film, and using an E6 chemistry 'kit' to develop it, wasn't really going very far 'in' to doing this whole photography lark.. but people wodering why they never got to see my pictures handed round in a Truprint envelope, presumed that I must be REALLY 'in-to' my photography.... and I felt a bit of a fraud, essentially a prolific snapper, with a bunch of photo mags and no more than a developing tank in the bathroom! I wanted to learn 'the rest'... and I didn't have a darkroom, or an enlarger... and the college DID!

NOW! Between the different tutors with different bents for dfferent aspects of the persuit, I did learn to print, and eventually got my own enlarger, and later still set up a home dark-room; but the course was, predomnantly, about picture taking, and stepping past point and shoot, and a lot of it was particularly equipment driven, and getting folk using hand held meters, exploiting apertures and setting up studo flashes... as you cant really take great landscapes in a class-room! But, very much SLR camera orientated, and learnig to exploit the versatility of them.

HOWEVER; we had one tutor, who was I must now admit, was actually not that 'old'! He was then probably younger than I am now! BUT, whilst a keen club competitor, he was very much inspired by Ansel Adams, and the school of 'Straight' photography, and spurning the techncal to concentrate on the image... at this point we step into the oragins of "Lomo", and whlst that brand naming excersise has perverted a lot of what was then described as 'Serendipty Photography' or 'Punk Pictures'; This tutor was a fan of junk-shop cameras, and seeing what you could do wth them...

He actually set us a junk-shop camera assignment, to go buy a camera and a roll of film for under a fiver, and come back with pictures to C&C from it, and explain them. The objective to counter-point another tutors assignments pontificating on Exposure Values and aperture settings, and looking at knobs and dials; and with a hopefully simple and probably 'meter-less' camera with a few and crudimentary 'settings', to 'Use your EYES', and meter by f-16 sunny, maybe apply the 'zone system' but concentrate not on the camera but what we pointed it at!

For me, that excersise was a flop; but it did inspire me; I was already a fan of serendipity photography, and developing had been an extenson of that; the thrill of not knowing what you'd get, and 'discovering' it as it came out the soup! BUT a necessty born of using winder equipped SLR's and 'Spray & Pray' machine gunning at college rock-gigs and other events, working fast, burning film and hoping for those serendipiteose surprises when they came out the tank.

This 'Junk Shop' aproach to serendipity was a completely different kettle of fish; working ever so slowly, with something of incrdibly limited versatilty, and an incredibly restricted number of frames, trying to just get anything at all!

Juxtoposition, illuminated a seperation in my own photography, which I shall describe as being between 'fast photo' and 'slo-photo'.

Slo-photo being that slow, deliberate aproach; paying attension to detail, both in the scene and in the camera, and taking the time and aplying the patience and diligence to get the 'best' from a situation.

Given an, even then, 'old', Sigma MK1 all metal, all manual M42 screw fit SLR that had fallen out of some-ones loft I was helping clear when they moved, that they couldn't remember how to use, was the start of me putting together what I thought of as a 'Pocket Money Period, all prime outfit'.

It's a loverly camera; all metal, all clock-work, its very tactle, chunky and clunky! And actually not much less sophsticated than the electronic Olympus OM's I had as 'front-line' cameras at the time. It has just as useful a range of shutter speeds and apertures, possibly better on some of the prime lenses I have! BUT, lacking 'zoom' lacking any automation; it has a through the lens swing needle light meter, but that's it! It's a camera you have to be a bit more considered and deliberate with; especially taking it out with maybe just one or perhaps two lenses fom the bag. And for me was a nice compromise, not being quite as 'restricted' as say my Ziess Ikonta 'folder'.. another camera that fell out of a cupbard during a house clearance when my Gt Aunt went into a 'home' lol! A loverly bit of kit! Fantastc 'fixed' 105mm Ziess lens, and scale focus.. no vew finder to compose with! Just a wire framing guide and a scale to set the subject distance you measure or guess! No light meter, and only about four shutter speed settings and maybe five apertures! That really does demand some concouse thought and slow you down!

For the 'sport' and pleasure of using cameras these are fantastic devices. You dont get loads of pictures out of them. They dont do much if anything for you, you really have to 'get involved' and work to get anything.... usually pretentiouse rubbish in my case, but still; for the love of the persuit, this sort of photography 'delivers'.

The OM's remained, and have now, eventually, been suplanted by an electric picture maker, for 'fast photo'. Automation letting me work fast, and burn... well, not film any more, silicon memory perhaps? Automatic exposure taking away a lot of the chores, and 'capture the moment'.

Fast-Photo, then sort of suits event or candid photography, and the objectve is to get 'better' snap-shots, A-N-D these days THAT is all I aspire to from it. Ironic that all that easement of these cameras should leave me to better concentrate on 'the subject'... and that its the slo-photo cameras that lack much if any fidleability but demand fiddling, that change the emphasis and beg that added consderation of compostion and subject, and better suit landscape or portrat photo.

NOW, this all brings me back to the top, and humourouse suggestion that if you want to 'develop' in your photography, maybe you need to try film..... as well as get back to basics and rediscover what got you into it all in the first place....

From my own adventures in photography; I was early into digital, without a digital camera! Doing another 'course' in IT I discovered the dgital dark-room, and that it was a lot cheaper than real chemicals and paper, and you could get to the point of discoverig what a 'hash' you'd made of a pcture a lot sooner! But, early direct to digtal cameras were horendousely expensive and significantlt poor in IQ, so I stuck to my 35mm film cameras and got a high end scanner, for that stuff. Though around 2003 I did buy a Digital 'Compact' which, proved remarkeably versatile and useful and took over from my prebiouse 35mm 'pocket camera', an Olympus XA2.... which I was give as a birthday present in 1981, and yup.. where it all started!

Anyhow; spurning Digital SLR's for a long time; making ever more use of widge-pact; it was only a couple of years ago when the last of a succession of them expired, and I was looking for another, and disalusioned by the way camera phones have polarised the market, and price of 'decent' compacts rival entry level DSLR's I bit the bullet and bought one.

Which, serendipiteousely closes the loop.... no longer does the electrc picture maker slip in my pocket, to go every where with me, and demand little thought or attension. The 'slo-photo' Folder and Sigma still consume space as they always have, and sit about waiting for me to have the 'urge' to go play cameras... and so, the DSLR sits in the bag that used to home the OM's, to NOT go every where with me, and to not get used that much, and to leave me out and about, hunting through my pockets, 'wishing' I'd brought a camera.... Remember bikes! If I am heading off for a week-end on the bike, loaded up with camping kit and a pillion, the 'bulky' camera bag is the first thing returned to to the house when I am struggling with straps trying to make all the luggage fit!

But, imagine, returning the gadget bag to the house, and as I put it down, spottng on the shelf, looking falorn that beloved Olympus XA2 'compact' 35mm film camera, that, when it all began, lved my pocket and went everywhere with me..... and the 'light-bulb' apearing over my head, as I reach oer, check its got film in it and slip it into my jacket pocket as I return to finish strappng sleeping bags!

I always kept a 'compact' in the car 'just in case' and I have a loverly Konica C35 zone focus compact that has been in very occassional service for many years in that role; BUT, uyng into widgetal, has serendipiteousely taken me full crcle, and begged putting that little XA2 back in my pocket... and you know what?

It's everything it always was; and I just apreiate it more now; but, it's a snap shot 'fast photo' camera AND its a slo-photo considered picture maker. I can think about it as much or as little as I want to, and get good snap-shots or pretentiouse rubbish!

To wit; point is, there may be some inspiration in there; AND looking for a new direction, film photo MAY offer some unexplored teratory to investigate and enjoy, and certainly oportunity to 'develop'... AND you dont have to stick to the path and follow the track of 35mm SLR's or aspire to Medium Format. There's a awful lot more to the world of film, and 35mm range-finders and compacts are astoundingly neglected, and hence under valued! Yo can buy a great camera for a tenner; add a roll of film, and go take great photo's with it and have a lot of fun along the way. Add a dev tank and some chemicals and a cheap scanner, and for under £50, you are set up to explore the whole chibang!

Said at the start that photography has a tendancy to itrospection; and in that widgetal, making so much 'craft' of concentional photography redundant, has only re-inforced the trend and drawn the 'centre' of that introspection into the camera. Without finding other interests to gve the camera purpose, indulgng that instrospection n the persuit, 'slo photo' cameras, film cameras, and the dying art of developng... is a region withn the persuit full of opotunity and interest still to be explored and enjoyed for its own sake.. that I HOPE I might have inspired you to ponder....
 
HiTeflon-Mike

Thank you so much for the time it must have taken you to write all this in reply to my question.

I hadn't thought about film as I started with digital. I work full time too so don't really have the time to do all of the developing that it entails. Maybe when I retire!

I am going on a couple of workshops which will hopefully give me something to think about and develop.

I am stepping back from the club scene for a while to get back to the enjoyment of photography and will take it from there.
Have taken a few I am quite happy with recently.
Thanks again
 
Hi Debbie, do you have a camera phone ? If so, start taking snaps with it, take pics of everything, don't think about it, point and shoot. Modern camera phones are very forgiving and this way your brain will begin to free itself from thinking about the technical aspects of taking pictures and your creativity processes will increase. Have a look at this TP thread see how easy it is to take great fun pictures.Post a few on there ..

Secondly, start making notes (notebook or digital note taker such as one-Note, evernote etc, or sign up to Pinterest and save your fave pics there as idea boards, don't worry about how you will take the pictures, just start a collection and then see where your thought processes are taking you, THEN, start to think about how you would take similar pictures, which may involve learning a new aspect of photography, such as the courses and workshops you have sourced.

Hope this helps, moving away from your comfort zone is a bit of a jolt but it does pay dividends.
 
Just a passing remark about clubs, I belong to 2 Clubs. The Dog club Xmas Dinner everyone had their Cameras, and at the Camera club dinner no one had their Camera. :snaphappy:
 
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" . . .at the Camera club dinner no on had their Camera . . "

Yes, that's not uncommon, our club is the same ;)
 
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