People like this **** me off

[Fresh Politics]

We have had threads on here before asking how much to charge for them type of shots and even sent copyright details in a text document.

That's just excessive. I got my photo taken by a council photographer with my MP, and he sent it to me in an email. Why can't all photographers be that cool and let people use images of THEMSELF? If I found out someone was selling an image of me standing on a beach, looking towards the ocean, without my permission, and was making ££ from it, then I'd totally sue.

Thinking like a photographer now. :bonk:

 

[scottcampbell]

The arrogance of the young is nothing new. Hopefully he will get some kick in the ass along the way and will grow up eventually. When I was young I was a punk rocker for a while, boy was I an arroagant ba$tard...........don't regret it though, and have grown-up....eventually. ;-)

Mind the ageism - I'm 14 .

 

[Fresh Politics]

Mind the ageism - I'm 14 .

And needs to lighten up.

 

[scottcampbell]

That's just excessive. I got my photo taken by a council photographer with my MP, and he sent it to me in an email. Why can't all photographers be that cool and let people use images of THEMSELF? If I found out someone was selling an image of me standing on a beach, looking towards the ocean, without my permission, and was making ££ from it, then I'd totally sue.

Thinking like a photographer now. :bonk:

It's not excessive at all.

 

[Flash In The Pan]

That's just excessive. I got my photo taken by a council photographer with my MP, and he sent it to me in an email. Why can't all photographers be that cool and let people use images of THEMSELF?

Sounds like a great business plan for a portrait business, you should nip out and buy £20k worth of camera gear and then give all your work away for free

 

[Keith W]

That's just excessive. I got my photo taken by a council photographer with my MP, and he sent it to me in an email. Why can't all photographers be that cool and let people use images of THEMSELF? If I found out someone was selling an image of me standing on a beach, looking towards the ocean, without my permission, and was making ££ from it, then I'd totally sue.

Thinking like a photographer now. :bonk:

Sue for what?

If you are in a public place then a photographer does not need your permission to take your picture and the photographer would own the rights to that picture and not you and is free to use that image to make ££££ as they see fit

There would be nothing you could do about it

 

[yoby]

So you're saying if a 'pro-looking-shot' taken on a £99 Fuji camera takes a photo of me and someone I admire, then I have more of a right to use that than if it's taken on a professional camera?

Nope, he was saying that if you can get one of your mates to snap you a professional quality picture on a point and shoot, and he's happy for you to have it/use it then go for it.

The issue, as has been mentioned in many forms many times here is that it's up to the photographer whether you can or can't use that photo. Irrespective of whether said photographer is a pro with 10K worth of kit. A Semi Pro with 1K worth of kit, an enthusiastic amateur with an entry level SLR or a passer by with a camera phone.

 

[scottcampbell]

Sounds like a great business plan for a portrait business, you should nip out and buy £20k worth of camera gear and then give all your work away for free

I think that Fresh Politics better get that idea launched quickly - it's so good I might have to do it myself .

 

[18-270]

So you're saying if a 'pro-looking-shot' taken on a £99 Fuji camera takes a photo of me and someone I admire, then I have more of a right to use that than if it's taken on a professional camera?

I now assume that you are simply being obtuse because of your own sence of omnipotence and will only answer this one because I feel it pointless to engage you much further.

IF the guy/doll with a £99 Fuji asks that you pay for it then you pay for it. If a profesional photographer is covering the event and being paid to do so, or even for that matter freelancing then you have to pay him to use his/her pictures.

It's very simple and I am more than sure you can graspe the difference, you just simply choose not to do so for the sake of argument and your own amusment. So I will no longer do this :bang:

 

[Fresh Politics]

I think that Fresh Politics better get that idea launched quickly - it's so good I might have to do it myself .

We're not a busy. We're an opinion website, more free than the Independent. I'm not in this for the money, if I wanted that I would have tried to set up some online business.

 

[chris321]

If I found out someone was selling an image of me standing on a beach, looking towards the ocean, without my permission, and was making ££ from it, then I'd totally sue.

Good luck with that one

Someone working in the media business with not the slightest understanding about copyright......if you're serious about this, you really need to learn about what you're getting yourself into. I'm sure you think it's hilarious that there's a bunch of irritated 'wierdos' with cameras on the internet, but you'll find it less funny when you're in court being sued for money you don't have by people you're thinking should 'lighten up'.

The law is the law, you may think it's stupid, but it'll hold up in court and what you think should be right, won't.

Congrats on trying to do something creative and constructive when you're young, but you're opening yourself up for a world of trouble. You've got good advice on here, whether you like it or not. Take it on board, lose some of the attitude, and good luck.

Chris

 

[Fresh Politics]

Good luck with that one

Someone working in the media business with not the slightest understanding about copyright......if you're serious about this, you really need to learn about what you're getting yourself into. I'm sure you think it's hilarious that there's a bunch of irritated 'wierdos' with cameras on the internet, but you'll find it less funny when you're in court being sued for money you don't have by people you're thinking should 'lighten up'.

The law is the law, you may think it's stupid, but it'll hold up in court and what you think should be right, won't.

Congrats on trying to do something creative and constructive when you're young, but you're opening yourself up for a world of trouble. You've got good advice on here, whether you like it or not. Take it on board, lose some of the attitude, and good luck.

Chris

I would take the advice, but I can't see it for the arrogance. As I've said, the site will be back online tomorrow better and legal. However, politically I believe the law should be changed if you're in the photo and said photographer is making money from a photo with you in it. I fully respect photo's being allowed to be taken in public places, but if it's off an individual than that individual should have as much say as to what happens to that photo as the photographer. My opinion, and unless I can make it law then I will abide by the law

 

[18-270]

... but if it's off an individual than that individual should have as much say as to what happens to that photo as the photographer.

imagine how much a football togg would have to pay out to use each crowd shot!

 

[Fresh Politics]

imagine how much a football togg would have to pay out to use each crowd shot!

You didn't read that right, I said individual photo-shot. I.e. of me only, or me with a few people.

 

[18-270]

You didn't read that right, I said individual photo-shot. I.e. of me only, or me with a few people.

I ask, where does the line get drawn? I guess for that we consult the law of the good and green land we live in. Be it an ass, it is the law :nuts:

 

[Fresh Politics]

I ask, where does the line get drawn? I guess for that we consult the law of the good and green land we live in. Be it an ass, it is the law :nuts:

Hahaha yes you consult the law, and said law shall be written as you have quoted! But seriously I have caved in to pressure, and will be updating the site so it is fault-free (unless you disagree with the articles ) tomorrow.

 

[chris321]

I would take the advice, but I can't see it for the arrogance. As I've said, the site will be back online tomorrow better and legal. However, politically I believe the law should be changed if you're in the photo and said photographer is making money from a photo with you in it. I fully respect photo's being allowed to be taken in public places, but if it's off an individual than that individual should have as much say as to what happens to that photo as the photographer. My opinion, and unless I can make it law then I will abide by the law

Well, that's where model releases etc come into play, but I'll let you read up all about that in your own time....

Just out of curiosity, in your ideal world, where would you have the line drawn? So a photo of just you should be your property...... what about you and a friend? 2 friends? 3 friends? Who would own it then?

 

[Fresh Politics]

Well, that's where model releases etc come into play, but I'll let you read up all about that in your own time....

Just out of curiosity, in your ideal world, where would you have the line drawn? So a photo of just you should be your property...... what about you and a friend? 2 friends? 3 friends? Who would own it then?

Hmm, I'd say if it's a friend photo with perhaps someone famous, or just a group of freinds photo, then it should be all of theirs. Shared property. However if it's a bunch of footy fans surrounding Rooney, then it would be the photographers photo.

 

[chris321]

Hmm, I'd say if it's a friend photo with perhaps someone famous, or just a group of freinds photo, then it should be all of theirs. Shared property. However if it's a bunch of footy fans surrounding Rooney, then it would be the photographers photo.

How many footy fans?!

 

[Fresh Politics]

How many footy fans?!

More than 1. Okay, say there's twenty footy fans - all members of the public, strangers to one another - that manage to catch a player after a game, and they get a photo taken with him. Then that's the photographers. However, if it's a say a group of friends that have won the oppotunity to meet the players, and they get snapped with them unknowingly, then it should be theirs.

 

[Flash In The Pan]

Would you like me to chuck you down a shovel?

 

[Fresh Politics]

Would you like me to chuck you down a shovel?

Now why would I want that? To make it clear, I do appreciate photographers..

 

[Flash In The Pan]

Now why would I want that? To make it clear, I do appreciate photographers..

To dig yourself out of that rather large hole

 

[On the Huh]

More than 1. Okay, say there's twenty footy fans - all members of the public, strangers to one another - that manage to catch a player after a game, and they get a photo taken with him. Then that's the photographers. However, if it's a say a group of friends that have won the oppotunity to meet the players, and they get snapped with them unknowingly, then it should be theirs.

Politically I think you're up your own ass. How will you ever get such a law passed?

 

[Oli R C]

What happens if part of the group are friends and the rest are all strangers? The strangers happen to be the ones that won the meet with the player, but do know their photo was taken. The strangers are, however, oblivious. And it turns out Rooney wants his cut too?

 

[Fresh Politics]

Politically I think you're up your own ass. How will you ever get such a law passed?

Thank you for putting it politely How are all laws passed? Through Parliament. I'd actually like to be a journalist one day, but it's a tough world out there.

 

[Fresh Politics]

What happens if part of the group are friends and the rest are all strangers? The strangers happen to be the ones that won the meet with the player, but do know their photo was taken. The strangers are, however, oblivious. And it turns out Rooney wants his cut too?

I seriously can't be bothered to think about my law, my opinion changes all the time as I pick up experience. Ask me that when I can vote

 

[On the Huh]

Perhaps the Daily Mail have some positions?

 

[Flash In The Pan]

I'd actually like to be a journalist one day, but it's a tough world out there.

Yup, the desire of most media outlets for a basic grasp of spelling, punctuation and grammar make it doubly so.......

 

[Fresh Politics]

Yup, the desire of most media outlets for a basic grasp of spelling, punctuation and grammar make it doubly so.......

Haha I can easily improve that to my 'real world' standards.

 

[Fresh Politics]

Perhaps the Daily Mail have some positions?

Whilst 'money is money', I have a serious hate for that paper.

 

[On the Huh]

Whilst 'money is money', I have a serious hate for that paper.

Then don't behave like them.

If you are fourteen shouldn't you be in bed by now?

I am thinking that your name should be changed from Fresh Politics to Fascism Politics, that way you can have a police state to control us photographers.

 

[Fresh Politics]

Then don't behave like them.

If you are fourteen shouldn't you be in bed by now?

I am thinking that your name should be changed from Fresh Politics to Fascism Politics, that way you can have a police state to control us photographers.

Haha the ability to use images is probably seen as more free to most people. And I'm 16, but do indeed have school at 8 however I have messed up my sleeping pattern. :bang:

No one on here will crush my journalistic dreams!

 

[Coldeh]

Well, that's where model releases etc come into play, but I'll let you read up all about that in your own time....

Model Releases are really only of use in the United States, where for the most part I believe they are required. In the United Kingdom however, if you are commissioned by an agent of the landlord (or the landlord themselves) or if you are on public property, you neither require consent nor a model release form.

 

[On the Huh]

Haha the ability to use images is probably seen as more free to most people. And I'm 16, but do indeed have school at 8 however I have messed up my sleeping pattern. :bang:

No one on here will crush my journalistic dreams!

Listen dude, I don't want to crush your journalistic dreams. I am impressed with your convictions and think with a little more open mindness you will achieve your goal. Good luck with that but remember as a journalist get both points of view before you report and not just rely on your own points of view.

 

[Keith W]

.....

No one on here will crush my journalistic dreams!

Your well on the way to doing that all by your self

 

[Fresh Politics]

Your well on the way to doing that all by your self

Then I'll have to work on my approach to working with people. Although if I become a journalist, I won't have to worry about photo's!

 

[realspeed]

FP has a typical student attitude towards reality, having been cosetted in the world of schools. I am sure that given a few years and a bit more maturity his outlook will change.
I don't think there are many of us out there that in our teenage years we didn't have a bit of rebellion in us , I know I did.

FP has strong views, and rightfully, but should also listen and take on board what others are saying. From the members side there is nothing more frustrating than giving sound advice from experience and having it either ignored or thrown back in their face. FP there will be a day when you will look back and say to yourself,"Actually those TP members did try and point out some mistakes which I could have avoided".

MY tip to you is listen and learn, at your age you may think you know everything but believe me you havn't even started yet.

Realspeed

 

[karmagarda]

Then I'll have to work on my approach to working with people. Although if I become a journalist, I won't have to worry about photo's!

Ok, I'll admit, by the end of this thread I'm preferring your approach. So I'm going to give you a break! I, for one, was honestly trying to give you advice, but felt you bit back at us. Now I can see you're trying to take it all on board and you are beginning to sound like someone who wants to give this a shot.

Look, fair play for taking down the site and having a go at making it more legit

Good luck with whatever you do, and for lordy sake, keep the latter attitude, not the former one!

 

[EdinburghGary]

A friendly message for Fresh Politics / and it's owner.....

In a previous life, about 4 years ago, I ran a fairly massive Car Insurance campaign - attracted about 2,000 people per day from all walks of life.

As part of said campaign, I hot linked to an image I found on google images, a small yellow sports car - the graphic was approximately 200 pixels wide, and 130 tall.

The campaign was online for about a month.

A year after the campaign, my office received a letter from Getty Images, they demanded something like £3,000. I was also bombarded with legal letters from their lawyers.

Every single excuse I threw at them was dismissed. We didn't host the photo. We merely linked to it. We found it on Google and did not know anyone else owned it. It was an ex employee who did it without our knowledge....yada yada yada. Nothing washed, the fine eventually hit £5K due to my attempt at burying my head in the sand.

I am not going to discuss the final outcome, but trust me, you do NOT want the pressure and stress associated with such actions.

if I need any photos that I can't take myself, I pay the PENNIES required somewhere like iStockPhoto....

I'm not going to get the boot in as I can understand how easy it is to take things for free, when it's well....so easy. I'm not morally perfect and piracy exists in most peoples lives. All I am saying, you have opened a can of worms by advertising image theft here.....if GETTY found me, and I have no idea how.....then you should be extra careful.

Good luck with your site, I hope its a success and I think its great a young person is working hard to do something they enjoy....just do it properly, and it will be more of a success, and a much less bumpy ride!!

I can scan the letters from Getty at some point if anyone wants a bit of a fright! They were absolutely horrid - they had printed screen shots and everything!!

Gary.