Quick wedding photography advice

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The problem is not so much your mate claiming againt you but more that the venue may not allow you to shoot/ act of the official photographer without it. On that basis if you damaged something in the venue and they believed you to be acting as the official photographer they would put a claim again you for the damages. Again that really depends on just how hands on you are getting with the photography and if you are going to stand out as "the photographer"
 
Just want to put forward my experience as a non-pro, from the wedding I shot last year.

It was for the brother of a very close friend of mine. He saw my (landscape and macro!) photos on Facebook, and decided I was the man for the job. I didn't want to do it, and explained every issue that might prevent me from doing a reasonable job. Right down to kit failures and the fact I'm not much of a people person. They still wanted me. I was both a guest and photographer. They covered my hotel and petrol costs, and I got drinks bought for me all night, once the majority of the photography was over.

So, here are a few things I learned from that one event. I don't know if they'll be helpful to you or not, as I guess each event and venue have their own foibles, and everyone has their own style.

Check out the venue beforehand. Make sure you know where the sun will be positioned when the ceremony ends, so you know where to put people for the group shots. Nobody wants to see a load of squinting faces.

If you can speak to the priest (or whoever is presiding) beforehand, then do it. I was so nervous, and he really put my mind at rest after I explained I was a total n00b.

The Best Man (or woman, in my case) should be able to help with the group shots. Gathering people together, and bossing people around, etc. I couldn't have done it without her.

Ask the wedding couple what sort of shots they want. Pretty obvious really! My couple wanted some shots with them pulling stupid faces. Not my sort of thing, but hey, this was their day.

Don't be backward in coming forward. I am an incredibly shy person, but forced myself to be assertive for the group shots. I found that the guests treated me with quite a bit of respect, which really brought me out of my shell. :)

Not sure if this is the case with all weddings, but the mother of the groom was a right sodding nuisance. Try to bite your tongue if you feel like you're going to scream at her. :D

With regard to camera settings, I stuck with aperture priority for the most part, and kept an eye on the shutter speed in the church, adjusting the ISO if necessary. To avoid blown dress highlights I underexposed by 2/3 of a stop, knowing I could fix most, if not all, underexposed bits in LR. I shot in RAW, by the way.

If I think of anything else then I'll add it. I don't want to start any arguments. Just putting forward my experience. Incidentally, I never want to shoot a wedding again, but don't regret the learning experience. ;)
 
big soft moose said:
And what exactly is he going to do when both batteries go flat , or the camera starts throwing Er99 just before the first dance etc - anyone can 'cope' while everything is going swimingly , what sorts the pro's from the walts is whether they can cope when things go wrong , and your 'freind' is going to fall distinctly on the walt side of the fence.

come to that I don't see any refference to a flashgun on that kit list - please tell us he isnt shooting weddings with the integral on camera flash :cuckoo:
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I use flashes but I'll just state for the record jeff ascough canon ambassador and voted one of the top 10 wedding photographers in the world by never uses flash ! it is not essential to have flash the guy just understands light he is a genius..
 
fracster said:
So it is not justification for hiking prices or deterring people from starting out then?
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I agree so many of these so called pros try to discourage others from starting out in wedding photography making it sound all bad and there's no way you can do it absolute rubbish yes weddings are hard but everyone must start somewhere I started doing wedding cheaply for customers who didn't have a lot of money and that's how I gained experience built my confidence and portfolio I hate reading these forums for these guys to get on there high horses encourage give hint tips stop trying to put people off!
 
I've read this thread with interest and its another prime example of a TP wedding advice thread

OP asks for advice and gets flamed by the usual suspects, what's wrong with encouraging folk to have a go at something ? the OP clearly states the conditions he's shooting under and to me it sounds like a perfect way to have a go and gain some experience with a minimum of pressure.
everyone had to start somewhere, even the holier than thou wedding brigade, why not offer help and advice as opposed to deterring folk ? if half the wedding togs on here are as good as they claim they are, they shouldn't fear competition from amateurs having a go, should they ?

The thing that does annoy me though is when certain wedding togs are only too happy to promote themselves and drum up business either by their signature or posting their shots on here, yet aren't prepared to constructively help advise people starting out.
 
canonjim said:
I use flashes but I'll just state for the record jeff ascough canon ambassador and voted one of the top 10 wedding photographers in the world by never uses flash ! it is not essential to have flash the guy just understands light he is a genius..
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A genius that also has access to bodies with good high iso capabilities and very fast lenses :)
 
fracster said:
I genuinely wonder, out of all the weddings done over the years, how many lenses have exploded, cameras metamorphised into cream doughnuts, batteries melted grips and cards sent themselves to Santa have ever actually happened?
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I'm quite happy to say yep to that - twice. Well not quite a cream doughnut, and one time was user error, but it matters not a bit. Thats two weddings when one of my cameras wouldn't take a photo when needed. I'd of been in s*** without a backup
 
canonjim said:
I agree so many of these so called pros try to discourage others from starting out in wedding photography making it sound all bad and there's no way you can do it absolute rubbish yes weddings are hard but everyone must start somewhere I started doing wedding cheaply for customers who didn't have a lot of money and that's how I gained experience built my confidence and portfolio I hate reading these forums for these guys to get on there high horses encourage give hint tips stop trying to put people off!
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I'll start but saying I'm a hobbyist and in no way a pro. However, have 2 DSLR bodies, speedlites, filters, gadgets, gizmos and more glass than the wife will ever realise :suspect:

Does this mean my images will be pro quality, of course not. I don't think anyone is suggesting that you'll do a rubbish job if you don't have £1000's of kit. Nor are they suggesting that lots of kit makes you instantly give you pro quality results.

Certainly I don't read anyone's comments here to the OP as trying to discourage, I think they are offering sound advice based on his original post. I know I would want to be offered best and worst case scenarios from people who have gone from a similar position to the OP to making a living out of this. Then an informed choice can be made knowing everything that can be considered.

Most threads of this nature take the same route :bang: because the OP's can seem a little unprepared (although, of course, I'm not suggesting that is always the case) and I think a little tough love is applied to try and stress the reality of the task.

You wouldn't take your car to a mechanic to replace the brakes saying "it's ok he doesn't have insurance and all the kit, he's just starting out and he does have a lively set of halfords spanners". :shrug:

As I said, I'm not nor do I claim to be, a pro. Please consider this the opinion of a hobbyist. :)
 
mrgas said:
I've read this thread with interest and its another prime example of a TP wedding advice thread

OP asks for advice and gets flamed by the usual suspects, what's wrong with encouraging folk to have a go at something ? the OP clearly states the conditions he's shooting under and to me it sounds like a perfect way to have a go and gain some experience with a minimum of pressure.
everyone had to start somewhere, even the holier than thou wedding brigade, why not offer help and advice as opposed to deterring folk ? if half the wedding togs on here are as good as they claim they are, they shouldn't fear competition from amateurs having a go, should they ?

The thing that does annoy me though is when certain wedding togs are only too happy to promote themselves and drum up business either by their signature or posting their shots on here, yet aren't prepared to constructively help advise people starting out.
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Excuse me
 
canonjim said:
I use flashes but I'll just state for the record jeff ascough canon ambassador and voted one of the top 10 wedding photographers in the world by never uses flash ! it is not essential to have flash the guy just understands light he is a genius..
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Top ten photographer or not, the lack of flash and lighting shows in the work. Some people like the look, others do not. Looking at a lot of his shots, in places, some fill flash would have made them even better.

He has a style, the other nine of the top ten photographers also have a style that includes using lighting. Each to their own I suppose.

All great photographers are masters at understanding light.

He might be a Canon Ambassador, but last time I saw his kit list, it included a pile of Leicas
 
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mrgas said:
I've read this thread with interest and its another prime example of a TP wedding advice thread

OP asks for advice and gets flamed by the usual suspects, what's wrong with encouraging folk to have a go at something ? the OP clearly states the conditions he's shooting under and to me it sounds like a perfect way to have a go and gain some experience with a minimum of pressure.
everyone had to start somewhere, even the holier than thou wedding brigade, why not offer help and advice as opposed to deterring folk ? if half the wedding togs on here are as good as they claim they are, they shouldn't fear competition from amateurs having a go, should they ?

The thing that does annoy me though is when certain wedding togs are only too happy to promote themselves and drum up business either by their signature or posting their shots on here, yet aren't prepared to constructively help advise people starting out.
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Nice to know i`m not alone.............;)
 
mrgas said:
sorry was there something in my post you didn't understand ?

I was merely commenting how many of these wedding advice threads go the same way thanks to the same people
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Which Is why I tried very hard to not be negative and offer some constructive advice
 
just to be clear /moderator hat/

:suspect: you know it's funny, most [not all, but most] of the downward slide in this thread seems to be caused by people who are predicting the thread will slide, not the actual people offering genuine advice and opinion. Of course, everyone will have their own view on the best way of approaching it, but the majority [again, not all, but most] of the posts have tried to offer constructive advice on actually doing it, not telling the OP not to do it.

So, here is a novel idea for a wedding thread, shall we try and keep it that way. :rules:
 
The first wedding I shot I ran out of memory cards and had to drive home, dump photos I'd overshot, and come back to the wedding reception. It was all good though, it was for a friend (forgot to mention I had a card error and thought I'd lost all my photos!).

Good luck and have fun!
 
canonjim said:
I agree so many of these so called pros try to discourage others from starting out in wedding photography making it sound all bad and there's no way you can do it absolute rubbish yes weddings are hard but everyone must start somewhere I started doing wedding cheaply for customers who didn't have a lot of money and that's how I gained experience built my confidence and portfolio I hate reading these forums for these guys to get on there high horses encourage give hint tips stop trying to put people off!
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I wouldnt have said that warning someone of the pitfalls was discouraging - igor asked for help and advice, he was given help and advice and much of the advice came from those who do this for a living and are well aware of the vasrious things to watch out for along the way.

thats considerably more helpful than patting him on the head and assuring him that it'll all be fine just go for it

I can't see why anybody would be put off by being told that its a good idea to have back up kit and insurance - far better that than that they find out the hard way when their single camera dies , they get sued by an irate bridezilla and subsequently lose their house and credit rating through not taking a couple odf cheap and simple steps to protect themselves.

(okay so you don't need either as a guest , but the OP asked for advice on covering a wedding, not on getting good shots as a guest)

I agree that its a shame that these threads always seem to go south , but the reason is not the pro's/experienced giving realistic advice, but those who think its a good idea to slate them for doing so
 
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canonjim said:
I use flashes but I'll just state for the record jeff ascough canon ambassador and voted one of the top 10 wedding photographers in the world by never uses flash ! it is not essential to have flash the guy just understands light he is a genius..
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Ive no doubt of jeff ascough's genius - but i bet he isnt working with one 60D and 15-85 lens and one spare battery, and he's shot considerably more than 3 weddings

It is of course possible to work with just natural light , but that implies a degree of aptitude and knowledge that only comes from experience, it doesnt imply that its a good idea for someone starting out to assume they don't need a flashgun.

Come to that working soley with natural light will also require reflectors and such - and they werent listed as kit on the post in question either

(That said i did once have both flashguns fail and have to shoot the later part of a reception - fortunately after the first dance - with just the onboard flash - I made myself a bounce reflector for it out of a folded up white place card and about half a yard of duct tape , and the resultant pictures were okayish - but i certainly wouldnt have wanted to try that for the ceremony, formals, or the first dance... plus had I not been prepared i wouldnt have had a bit of card with several yards of duct tape wrapped round it, and a folding knife in my camera bag and such improvisation wouldnt have been possible)
 
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micloi said:
A genius that also has access to bodies with good high iso capabilities and very fast lenses :)
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jeff mainly shoots with 5dmk2 which is at a great price just now :D he has used 1d4 too but prefers the lighter body of the 5d read his blogs and on canon website.
 
Richard King said:
Top ten photographer or not, the lack of flash and lighting shows in the work. Some people like the look, others do not. Looking at a lot of his shots, in places, some fill flash would have made them even better.

He has a style, the other nine of the top ten photographers also have a style that includes using lighting. Each to their own I suppose.

All great photographers are masters at understanding light.

He might be a Canon Ambassador, but last time I saw his kit list, it included a pile of Leicas
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i agree with you some flash would be nice but certainley not essential as jeff proves in his work.yeah leicas imo as just for pleasure i would say a luxury wouldnt mind a m9 myself lol
 
It is pretty disappointing to see these threads go the same way but your a guest and they have asked you to take photos just make sure you let them know that you are not a pro and will do your best but there guarantees .Im sure they will tell you they love your photos and if i were getting something for free i wouldn't complain you get what you pay for.. anyway just tell them and have fun on the day try and relax a couple of beers will help settle those nerves lol let us know how you get on :D
 
Yv said:
just to be clear /moderator hat/

:suspect: you know it's funny, most [not all, but most] of the downward slide in this thread seems to be caused by people who are predicting the thread will slide, not the actual people offering genuine advice and opinion. Of course, everyone will have their own view on the best way of approaching it, but the majority [again, not all, but most] of the posts have tried to offer constructive advice on actually doing it, not telling the OP not to do it.

So, here is a novel idea for a wedding thread, shall we try and keep it that way. :rules:
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You mean like spunking a load of money that the OP does not need to on kit that he, in all probability, will not need or use?

They guy is going as a guest to take some photographs free of charge, yet he needs PLI,PII and the bleeding FBI by all accounts.......:)
 
Lets just be realistic here

No one is going to die because the OP did not do the heart operation properly, or totally seal a flue pipe. Wedding photography is not important in that sense.

Yes if you are a professional, charging for doing the job properly, the couple will rightfully expect the job to be done properly, but the couple isn't employing a professional to do the job, so the best the OP can do will have to be good enough.

By the sounds of it the couple are aware of the OP's situation and experience.

While all the pro's in this thread rightly have backup of their backup gear, the couple are not paying for a pro, so it is unrealistic to expect the OP to turn up with a complete set of pro gear and a redundant set in the bag.

However experience says backup gear is desirable and if at all possible I suggest the OP tries to beg/borrow a spare set of kit. However in all likeliness, he will never need 2 set ups again, or not in the close future. If you cant get backup gear, you cant. I'm sure there are plenty of local peeps on here that would love to help, and would probably do a bit of second shooting with the OP

The other bits of info in my previous thread need to be taken account of - that is, you will need more batteries and memory cards than you think. Also that being prepared, and keeping it simple is the best approach for the OP
 
canonjim said:
I agree so many of these so called pros try to discourage others from starting out in wedding photography making it sound all bad and there's no way you can do it absolute rubbish yes weddings are hard but everyone must start somewhere I started doing wedding cheaply for customers who didn't have a lot of money and that's how I gained experience built my confidence and portfolio I hate reading these forums for these guys to get on there high horses encourage give hint tips stop trying to put people off!
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No one is saying dont start out we are saying dont start out something your not ready for, equiped for or expericnce for. There is a second wedding advice thred and i have offered the op there some experince/work to help her out. This is to help get the experince needed rather than simply jumping in. The thing is people come on here asking for advice and then when they get honest advice and when they take a look at worst case scenario someone always gets a bee in the bonet about that advice. It seems the OP is happy with that advice and is taking it on bored so for those who dont like it why not start your own thred about how much you hate wedding photographers.

The op has also said he has ome money to spend so why not spend it wisely on backup.

Weddings are not easy, things can go wrong and things do go wrong. Being aware of the possibilities before the day makes a big difference.

Also some people simply cant handle the pressure and speed of wedding photography sso gaining some experience before shooting a wedding be it for a mate or client is a great way to start.

canonjim said:
I use flashes but I'll just state for the record jeff ascough canon ambassador and voted one of the top 10 wedding photographers in the world by never uses flash ! it is not essential to have flash the guy just understands light he is a genius..
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This is not true. Jeff is very well know for his use of natural light yes but that does not mean he never uses flash. I have seen many of his images from situations such as first dance wen the shot would be simply impossible without any flash at all. Yes his use of flash is rair nut i am sure he will often use reflectors which if you know how ot use them and have an assitant/the right light will also work as great fill. On you own with bad light flash is a must have. And as others have said when flash is not used it shows. ITs a style that some people liike and some dont and also a style that is acutely much hardero perfect than many think. The truth is (and i am not suggesting eff Ascough to fall into this) most people who claim they dont like flash or only use natural light say that because they do not understand how to use flash correctly.
 
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Richard King said:
Which Is why I tried very hard to not be negative and offer some constructive advice
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I never suggested you were anything other than constructive, my post was a general comment hence the my wording when I said "typical". apologies if it came across as a dig at you personally
 
mrgas said:
I never suggested you were anything other than constructive, my post was a general comment hence the my wording when I said "typical". apologies if it came across as a dig at you personally
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So who were you slating? I was in a similar boat to Richard, I don't want anyone to go into a shoot with their eyes closed or hearing that there is no point taking precautions. I also didn't say they should buy everything, I pointed out that borrowing was probably the way to go to make sure they are prepared.
 
fracster said:
You mean like spunking a load of money that the OP does not need to on kit that he, in all probability, will not need or use?

They guy is going as a guest to take some photographs free of charge, yet he needs PLI,PII and the bleeding FBI by all accounts.......:)
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and if the OP had opened his first post by saying " I'm a guest at this guys wedding and i was looking for some tips on how to get good shots he'd have got a completely different set of advice

however he opened by saying that he want advice on covering a wedding and that he hoped to do similar ervents in the future.

Spending a few hundred notes (which the OP says he has to spend)on a second body and a flashgun which will be useful anyway is hardly spunking a looad of money on gear he doesnt need

and as to the insurance while he doesnt need it as a a guest , if he were covering a wedding which is what the thread title and first imply he would ... and at less than 25 notes for a days cover its not a bad precauation (and as i noted further up if hes working unpaid he might already have it on his camera insurance)
 
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mark1616 said:
So who were you slating? I was in a similar boat to Richard, I don't want anyone to go into a shoot with their eyes closed or hearing that there is no point taking precautions. I also didn't say they should buy everything, I pointed out that borrowing was probably the way to go to make sure they are prepared.
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and if it wasnt you or richard I'd presume it was me or andy (presuming it wasnt yv)

Pretty soon its going to get to the point that no one who knows what they are talking about will give any useful advice on wedding threads because everytime anyone does this happens

From now on perhaps we should all just say "of course you can do it, nothing will go wrong i'm sure you'll be fine... because that will be ,like, really useful :shrug:
 
big soft moose said:
and if it wasnt you or richard I'd presume it was me or andy (presuming it wasnt yv)

Pretty soon its going to get to the point that no one who knows what they are talking about will give any useful advice on wedding threads because everytime anyone does this happens

From now on perhaps we should all just say "of course you can do it, nothing will go wrong i'm sure you'll be fine... because that will be ,like, really useful :shrug:
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Exactly, there are some pretty great wedding togs here (not including myself) who give up a lot of time to share very helpful and honest info which they don't have to do. Over the years I've learnt loads from different forums and hope that people can learn from the guys here, if only they are allowed to talk without being beaten up.
 
KIPAX said:
The OP is going as a guest to the wedding.. he is taking his camera and wants to present them with some decent pics.. He isn't the official photographer hired for the wedding (paid or not)

I think the insurance, double kit and all manner of rsponses are a bit OTT
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+1

As always some people love to go OTT and scaremonger.


I changed a mates front brake pads the other day, didn't hear any motor mechanics telling me I needed to spend 12k on spanners and a hydraulic ramp, not to mention traders Insurance.


Sometimes a little encouragement goes a long way! As well as pointing out the pitfalls.
 
The Greek said:
+1

As always some people love to go OTT and scaremonger.


I changed a mates front brake pads the other day, didn't hear any motor mechanics telling me I needed to spend 12k on spanners and a hydraulic ramp, not to mention traders Insurance.


Sometimes a little encouragement goes a long way! As well as pointing out the pitfalls.
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If you'd asked how on motor trade forum full of proffesional repairers you probably would have done (i'm sure proffesional mechs just love enquiries like that)

Also if you are changing brake pads and your solitary spanner breaks you can just nip down to halfords and get another one... if you arent sure how to do the next bit you can just stop for a brew and look it up in a haynes manual ... you don't have the same luxury in a high pressure environment like a wedding where you need to be spot on all the time

(and like i keep saying if the OP had made it clear that he was only going to be a guest at a wedding from the start none of this stuff would have come up - he was asking about covering a wedding and the thread title gives the same impression. )
 
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