The virus. PPE. Part 1

Status
Not open for further replies.
cambsno said:
But its ok as long as you wash your hands.... err.... if I cant go inside someones house, how will I do that???

Don't get me wrong - it is right to allow the lifting of such measures but the detail and communication is just dumb!
Click to expand...

Wet wipes
 
KitsuneAndy said:
Durham Police have found that the trip to Barnard Castle was a breach in the rules, and would have warranted police intervention had it been reported at the time.
Click to expand...


It is a real shame the necesity for people to post lies in this thread - as @NeilA1975 has shown with his later post; Durham Police most certainly haven't said he broke the rules at all; they said he "might have been a minor breach".

That's a million miles away from he has breached, especially since he has denied it - fortunately people do not get convicted on suspicion of committing an offence.

The other people who have been fined for breaches - if you pay your fine you have made an admission of guilt.

I also find it surprising that you have constantly reffered to South korea's aggresive police of Track & Trace and you have marvelled at it; yet you have no intention of using the app? Maybe you would like to be a bit more like S.Korea and it just becomes a law where you have to have it?


As a last note - can someone show me the 15 pages of discussion on Kinnock breaching and admitting breaking the lockdown rules? Starmer is a hypocryte - he wants a political advisor dismissing but not an elected politician!

Then there is Sturgeon - she supported a medical advisor who admitted breaking lockdown and openly said she shouldn't resign - where are the pages of criticism in respect to these as there is with Borris defending someone who has denied any breach and there is insufficient evidence to prove he has?
 
Last edited:
RWDW said:
It is a real shame the necesity for people to post lies in this thread - as @NeilA1975 has shown with his later post; Durham Police most certainly haven't said he broke the rules at all; they said he "might have been a minor breach".
Click to expand...

Again, I'll believe the Barristers and Lawyers and ex chiefs of police explanation of why they use the term "might", over someone with zero experience of the matter on a forum.

Kinnock did break the rules, the difference is, he apologised for it. he also didn't stay overnight. And he didn't have any hand in writing the rules.

The scottish case, she did resign.

So not really as many similarities as you'd like to believe.

As for your "insufficient evidence to prove he has?" he said he went home to his wife who he suspected had COVID, then went back to work. I am genuinely amazed some people are still arguing that he didn't, and that a 60 mile drive to test your eyesight is perfectly legitimate.
 
Fuji Dave said:
Mum is in hospital as they think she might have the virus and because i was at hers a few days ago i have now been told i must stay in, you could say my head is screwed up at this moment.
Click to expand...

What an awful worry. I hope it quickly turns out well.
 
RWDW said:
It is a real shame the necesity for people to post lies in this thread - as @NeilA1975 has shown with his later post; Durham Police most certainly haven't said he broke the rules at all; they said he "might have been a minor breach".
Then there is Sturgeon - she supported a medical advisor who admitted breaking lockdown and openly said she shouldn't resign - where are the pages of criticism in respect to these as there is with Borris defending someone who has denied any breach and there is insufficient evidence to prove he has?
Click to expand...

You need to read the posts earlier with the links to a post from a Barrister who explains what the police statement means, and Nicola Sturgeon, within hours said she had made a mistake in her judgement on this and that her CMO should resign. The CMO also admitted she had made a mistake and apologised for what she had done when she resigned.
 
myotis said:
You need to read the posts earlier with the links to a post from a Barrister who explains what the police statement means, and Nicola Sturgeon, within hours said she had made a mistake in her judgement on this and that her CMO should resign. The CMO also admitted she had made a mistake and apologised for what she had done when she resigned.
Click to expand...

"Nevermind Cummings, what about these people who've either apologised, or apologised and resigned?" isn't the best argument that's ever been presented on here.

It's not the worst either mind.
 
Politicians of all brands can be so stupid, the amount of support and credibility Borris could have got by acting correctly in this matter would have been immense.
 
KitsuneAndy said:
"Nevermind Cummings, what about these people who've either apologised, or apologised and resigned?" isn't the best argument that's ever been presented on here.

It's not the worst either mind.
Click to expand...
I'm not entirely sure I follow the point you are making here, and why part of it is in quotes. I've maybe missed something :-(
 
Fuji Dave said:
Mum is in hospital as they think she might have the virus and because i was at hers a few days ago i have now been told i must stay in, you could say my head is screwed up at this moment.
Click to expand...

Sorry to hear this, hope everything goes well for you and your family.
 
latestarter said:
Wet wipes
Click to expand...

Completely useless unless they are impregnated with 70% alcohol, which as far as I am aware do not exist (other than medical sterets which are literally just less than 1 inch square!)
 
Fuji Dave said:
doctor phoned me saying mum has a chest infection and will phone me tomorrow with the results of the swab. then i have to pray to god that both of us dont have it as neither of us stand a cat in hells chance of surving it. if she has caught it then it was from one of her carers who never wear ppe.
Click to expand...
Fuji Dave said:
100% agree as why I had to go over to Mums on Tuesday was, to tell the carers to wear PPE
Click to expand...

Sorry to hear about your mum and hope it turns out to be Non-covid related.

However, I do want to explore your now twice mentioned and not picked up on statements re carers not wearing ppe?

You seem to be saying you witnessed the carers of your mum not wearing ppe when they should have been? Were they refusing, or did they not have enough? Either way did you speak to their superiors / supervisors?
 
Donnie said:
Sorry to hear about your mum and hope it turns out to be Non-covid related.

However, I do want to explore your now twice mentioned and not picked up on statements re carers not wearing ppe?

You seem to be saying you witnessed the carers of your mum not wearing ppe when they should have been? Were they refusing, or did they not have enough? Either way did you speak to their superiors / supervisors?
Click to expand...


They just grubbled when I said about it, so I emailed them and said my Mum might have caught the virus from your staff. The answer I got back was hope your mums fine.
 
Fuji Dave said:
They just grubbled when I said about it, so I emailed them and said my Mum might have caught the virus from your staff. The answer I got back was hope your mums fine.
Click to expand...

OK, then (and it's up to you) but I'd be asking them for their complaints policy (which will vary as to if they are carers from the NHS or subcontracted ones) and where they fit into your Clinical Commisioning Group locally and emailing them too. I'd add your MP to the list! If they are ignoring PPE being given to them that should be addressed ESPECIALLY if your mum turns out to be covid positive!
 
Donnie said:
Completely useless unless they are impregnated with 70% alcohol, which as far as I am aware do not exist (other than medical sterets which are literally just less than 1 inch square!)
Click to expand...

I was joking.
Common sense is possibly the answer.
 
Donnie said:
OK, then (and it's up to you) but I'd be asking them for their complaints policy (which will vary as to if they are carers from the NHS or subcontracted ones) and where they fit into your Clinical Commisioning Group locally and emailing them too. I'd add your MP to the list! If they are ignoring PPE being given to them that should be addressed ESPECIALLY if your mum turns out to be covid positive!
Click to expand...


Once I hear of Mums results tomorrow I will be giving My Life hell.
 
KitsuneAndy said:
They didn't say that at all, they said they were examining whether he broke the *regulations* and not the stay at home advice, the stay at home advice was also a rule we were expected to follow.
Click to expand...

I honestly have no idea what you're going on about.
The stay at home advice was for everyone apart form those with exceptional circumstances which he firmly believed, rightly or wrongly applied to him and his situation.

This all of course, ignores the fact that he could have infected more members of Downing Street, as he went back to work after initially going home to care for his suspected Covid infected wife. Which of course, is another break in the rules.
Click to expand...

I get that people, such as yourself probably despise Cummings but simply making assumptions in order to support your bias doesn't look good Andy.
 
KitsuneAndy said:
I think I'll believe what actual barristers are saying thanks. Unless you have more relevant qualifications than them that is?
Click to expand...

Even if the police had stopped him and deemed his trip out was unnecessary, it was a minor breach and wouldn't have warranted any further action, no fine, nothing.
So pretty much a storm in a teacup despite the multiple allegations.
 
Donnie said:
Completely useless unless they are impregnated with 70% alcohol, which as far as I am aware do not exist (other than medical sterets which are literally just less than 1 inch square!)
Click to expand...

Alcohol wipes are pretty much standard issue in almost every lab handling biological materials - unless they're too tight to buy them & substitute with a spray & tissue. Klercide, Azowipes etc.
 
NeilA1975 said:
Even if the police had stopped him and deemed his trip out was unnecessary, it was a minor breach and wouldn't have warranted any further action, no fine, nothing.
So pretty much a storm in a teacup despite the multiple allegations.
Click to expand...
All but one allegations have been shown to be true and admitted. I don’t get why you think “minor breach” is important. No one said he should be imprisoned or executed or whatever. A breach is a breach and he should have resigned or been sacked as many others have been. Every one of these breeches is minor and unlikely to have major effects (though they could), it’s the sum of all of them which is a problem. Judging by what you say I assume you are not abiding by any of the advice/instructions?
 
NeilA1975 said:
Even if the police had stopped him and deemed his trip out was unnecessary, it was a minor breach and wouldn't have warranted any further action, no fine, nothing.
So pretty much a storm in a teacup despite the multiple allegations.
Click to expand...

I believe they would have advised him to go back home - they have said it MAY have been a breach, but Boris and Cummings won't acknowledge that, instead saying NOTHING was wrong. That is what is annoying people. The perception is that its one rule for them and one for us.
 
sphexx said:
All but one allegations have been shown to be true and admitted. I don’t get why you think “minor breach” is important. No one said he should be imprisoned or executed or whatever. A breach is a breach and he should have resigned or been sacked as many others have been.
Click to expand...

There's been several untrue allegations and assumptions over the last few days, but in any case, I don't think there's any evidence to suggest he went out to intentionally disobey the law - for me that's the difference and clearly backed up by the Police's statement that they wouldn't have taken any action.
As for other's resigning or being sacked I see Stephen Kinnock still has his seat, as does Tahir Ali.

Judging by what you say I assume you are not abiding by any of the advice/instructions?
Click to expand...

Then you'd be both wrong & stupid for making such a ridiculous assumption. :)
 
Last edited:
ancient_mariner said:
Alcohol wipes are pretty much standard issue in almost every lab handling biological materials - unless they're too tight to buy them & substitute with a spray & tissue. Klercide, Azowipes etc.
Click to expand...

Im assuming you can't get them in sainsburys though :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
 
NeilA1975 said:
There's been several untrue allegations and assumptions over the last few days, but in any case, I don't think there's any evidence to suggest he went out to intentionally disobey the law - for me that's the difference and clearly backed up by the Police's statement that they wouldn't have taken any action.
Click to expand...

I didn't know that the law had been changed so that ignorance of it is now a defence? :thinking::thinking::thinking::thinking:
 
KitsuneAndy said:
Again, I'll believe the Barristers and Lawyers and ex chiefs of police explanation of why they use the term "might", over someone with zero experience of the matter on a forum.

Kinnock did break the rules, the difference is, he apologised for it. he also didn't stay overnight. And he didn't have any hand in writing the rules.

The scottish case, she did resign.

So not really as many similarities as you'd like to believe.

As for your "insufficient evidence to prove he has?" he said he went home to his wife who he suspected had COVID, then went back to work. I am genuinely amazed some people are still arguing that he didn't, and that a 60 mile drive to test your eyesight is perfectly legitimate.
Click to expand...

Of course the Lawyer David Alen Green has a very left wing political bias so it's no surprise to find him trying to twist the Durham police Statement! (Writing for The guardian & New Statesman:

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/new-statesman/

Fact is you wrote "Durham Police have found the trip to Barnard Castle was in breach of the rules" - that statement is not true.

Anyway - hopefully we can now move on from this "something-a-do over nothing"
 
sphexx said:
More “you couldn’t make it up” news:
‘Up to 350,000 Covid-19 test samples – those carried out at drive-through centres between 2 April and 6 May – are believed to have been taken without recording individual NHS numbers or full addresses,”

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...g-hit-struggle-match-results-with-nhs-records
Click to expand...


Not surprised.
My wife and daughter were tested 4 days ago while my daughter had to stay in hospital for a couple of days. She has since been discharged, but still not had the results.
 
Last edited:
Donnie said:
I didn't know that the law had been changed so that ignorance of it is now a defence? :thinking::thinking::thinking::thinking:
Click to expand...

It isnt which you probably already know but you'll also be aware that we're living through an extraordinary time where its very easy to make a misjudgment thinking what youre doing is reasonable when it may well not be, hence the Polices approach to dealing with such situations.
 
RWDW said:
Of course the Lawyer David Alen Green has a very left wing political bias so it's no surprise to find him trying to twist the Durham police Statement! (Writing for The guardian & New Statesman:

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/new-statesman/

Fact is you wrote "Durham Police have found the trip to Barnard Castle was in breach of the rules" - that statement is not true.

Anyway - hopefully we can now move on from this "something-a-do over nothing"
Click to expand...
I’ll ask you again as you didn’t answer me last time, have you provided that link because it shows that the new statesman has a high level of factual reporting? I’m betting not.
 
NeilA1975 said:
Even if the police had stopped him and deemed his trip out was unnecessary, it was a minor breach and wouldn't have warranted any further action, no fine, nothing.
Click to expand...
Assuming he would have returned home of course when told to do so.

I kinda get the feeling he’d have probably said “What! Don’t you realise who I am!” :)
 
NeilA1975 said:
It isnt which you probably already know but you'll also be aware that we're living through an extraordinary time where its very easy to make a misjudgment thinking what youre doing is reasonable when it may well not be, hence the Polices approach to dealing with such situations.
Click to expand...

But they don't accept they made a misjudgement and do the right thing and hold hands up. According to Boris he did nothing wrong, so why do you see it as a misjudgement when he doesn't?
 
The major breach was travelling while infected instead of going into isolation. It also turns out he is supposedly a co owner of the cottage he stayed at so that would make it travel to a second home which isn't an essential journey. Childcare excuse is hogwash as they have family in London nearby.
 
Donnie said:
I didn't know that the law had been changed so that ignorance of it is now a defence? :thinking::thinking::thinking::thinking:
Click to expand...
NeilA1975 said:
It isnt which you probably already know but you'll also be aware that we're living through an extraordinary time where its very easy to make a misjudgment thinking what youre doing is reasonable when it may well not be, hence the Polices approach to dealing with such situations.
Click to expand...

While I'd possibly accept that off Joe Bloggs, I find it hard to accept when its the architect of the very rules that were drawn up thats breaking them :thinking::thinking::thinking:
 
Donnie said:
Were they refusing, or did they not have enough? Either way did you speak to their superiors / supervisors?
Click to expand...


My fil has a private career who’s been with him years (& who can be a bit of a firebrand). Because she’s been quiet tenacious in insisting his other, council employed careers wear PPE they ( the other careers) have just withdrawn care../
 
NeilA1975 said:
Even if the police had stopped him and deemed his trip out was unnecessary, it was a minor breach and wouldn't have warranted any further action, no fine, nothing.
So pretty much a storm in a teacup despite the multiple allegations.
Click to expand...

The storm isn't because of him breaking the rules. It's because the PM is bending over backwards to pretend he *didn't* break any rules that the rest of us were supposed to follow.
 
RWDW said:
Of course the Lawyer David Alen Green has a very left wing political bias so it's no surprise to find him trying to twist the Durham police Statement! (Writing for The guardian & New Statesman:

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/new-statesman/

Fact is you wrote "Durham Police have found the trip to Barnard Castle was in breach of the rules" - that statement is not true.

Anyway - hopefully we can now move on from this "something-a-do over nothing"
Click to expand...

Again, I'll believe the lawyer's, barristers and ex police chiefs thanks.
 
NeilA1975 said:
It isnt which you probably already know but you'll also be aware that we're living through an extraordinary time where its very easy to make a misjudgment thinking what youre doing is reasonable when it may well not be, hence the Polices approach to dealing with such situations.
Click to expand...

Most of us of course, wouldn't pre-empt the public thinking it was the wrong thing to do by publishing the story in the press, but pretending we never left home.

Unless you actually already knew it was a "misjudgement" or as people not talking rubbish just to defend Cummings would say "against the rules".
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top