The virus. PPE. Part 1

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Retune said:
I don't think there's any realistic doubt about this.


The link with SARS and civets is clear, the link with the new virus and pangolins much less so - it's just a plausible theory based on the sequence evidence. They've found a bat virus that's very similar to the new virus, and a pangolin virus that is less similar in general, except in a few regions that are even closer to the human virus than the bat virus is. Perhaps similar viruses to these have swapped genetic material while co-infecting pangolins. But perhaps a human was directly infected with a bat virus (or a virus from some third animal) that we just haven't sampled. People who live in the rural areas near the bat colonies have evidence of direct exposure to bat coronaviruses. The first documented COVID-19 case did not have a link to the market, and an even earlier case has been reported in the press.
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pmac said:
By any chance are you Chinese and taking the hump?
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I’m not prepared to go very far in defending those buggers in Peking BUT it was the Americans who first started posting conspiracy theories about the virus being an escaped Chinese bio-warfare bug so its not surprising the Chinese have retaliated.

I don’t know but would guess the silencing of the whistleblowing doctor was more to with their general policy of secrecy than any top-level decision :(


We know they have plenty of bots actively posting everywhere spreading lies even before this. Which is well documented as are most of these things he has said.

Let’s be realistic he himself posted to say he had been arrested and told not to speak about it under the new law Xi implemented months before ,meaning anyone that said something they didn’t like could be charged with spreading rumours against the state.
There are countless others that have since disappeared for spreading news from in Wuhan about how bad it actually was.

There was massive outcry across China by the public which similarly was all wiped from the internet until they got smart and used different hashtags.
Then the government publicly apologised for this and said the officials were being investigated(the way there government party/China works you pass the buck to someone lower)
The issue is Chinese people forget these things quickly as the ccp has such a great propaganda machine.

As for wet markets it’s well know that’s pretty much confirmed where it came from ,a bat and a pangolin similarly sars was know to have come from wet markets and as was posted before they will reappear as soon as this is gone as it’s such an earner and in ploys many people.
After sars it was quietly re introduced and was even added to law that all these wild animals could be eaten or used for medicine.

There is a difference about stating where it came from and using it to discriminate or attack Chinese or Asian people.

My wife is Chinese and even asks what is wrong with Chinese people and the fact that they eat everything, but you have to remember that while China fronts as this super rich country only about 10% of those are actually rich the rest sit in or under the poverty line so have but no choice.
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Bobsyeruncle said:
Tonight, not tomorrow night.
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A well regarded pub restaurant in one of the local villages is starting a take away service to get over the bans. Having sampled their offerings several times I predict they will be one business that is likely to come out of the panic at least as well as they went in. :giggle:
 
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You know what? I can't be bothered with this **** any more. Easier to just ignore this thread.
 
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AndrewFlannigan said:
A well regarded pub restaurant in one of the local villages is starting a take away service to get over the bans. Having sampled their offerings several times I predict they will be one business that is likely to come out of the panic at least as well as they went in. :giggle:
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If the lockdown restrictions progress there as they have here, take aways , pizza deliveries etc will stop very soon!
 
Asha said:
If the lockdown restrictions progress there as they have here, take aways , pizza deliveries etc will stop very soon!
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The law of diminishing returns applies here. Carrying isolation too far will cause more economic, social and health damage than the disease. A great deal of industrial, governmental and social activity has to continue just to keep our society from collapsing.

Where governments generally have failed is in isolating and testing incoming travellers then tracing their contacts. In Britain there is still time to put that regime in place but I think that the “civil liberties” crowd, who are already making wild claims about actions to contain the infection, will try to disrupt such measures.
 
The announcement that pubs, cafes and restaurants will close is good news, but that it does not cover any take away food they sell is a little concerning.

There was no mention of stopping non-essential travel which is understandable as it would be nightmare to police.

Therefore is it now time for us to take that one on and decide to stop our own non-essential travel?

Dave
 
Someone explain how this works please.
Everything is closed down and no one is allowed to go out
So the vast majority of the population that do manual work won't be, many unemployed with no wages so not paying tax or NI
How long can we survive on that ?
People who can't work from home losing their homes and going into debt
There isn't an endless supply of funds to keep things going forever so how long can the country be shut down
be fore services have to suffer
I know this will be unpopular but wouldn't it be better to indentify those most at risk and isolate them, from what
I have read most people will survive
 
AndrewFlannigan said:
A great deal of industrial, governmental and social activity has to continue just to keep our society from collapsing.
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The close social activity is exactly what is giving the virus the ability to transmit between us!!

A take way/ meal out in arestaurant is not a necessary requirement to live...it is a pleasure.

By contrast, ensuring the availabilty and distribution of food and medicines is essential.

It is that simple!
 
Gremlin said:
Someone explain how this works please.
Everything is closed down and no one is allowed to go out
So the vast majority of the population that do manual work won't be, many unemployed with no wages so not paying tax or NI
How long can we survive on that ?
People who can't work from home losing their homes and going into debt
There isn't an endless supply of funds to keep things going forever so how long can the country be shut down
be fore services have to suffer
I know this will be unpopular but wouldn't it be better to indentify those most at risk and isolate them, from what
I have read most people will survive
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Indeed. That is why advice given to the government, and actions taken, will be based on many more factors that just medical.

People will moan and know better of course, but isn't that always the case?
 
Interesting info from Kevin Rawlinson of the Guardian, I'm amazed at the stupidity of some people.

Pubs in Penge, south-east London, had already started filling up well before the prime minister’s announcement that they must close down.

The high street, whose environs host six pubs, still had five open as Boris Johnson addressed the nation. There were surreal scenes as the big-screen televisions beamed Downing Street’s daily press conference that carried news of one of the most wide-ranging peacetime changes to British life while, directly underneath them, games of pool continued undisturbed.

Shortly after the announcement, as the prime minister was still speaking, one customer headed out to call a friend: “Listen, you’d better hurry up and get here because all the pubs are shutting at 7pm. Hurry up,” he was heard to say.

At another pub about 250 metres away, a sign on the door assured customers that, as a response to the Covid-19 alert, children would no longer be allowed in until further notice. The bar was full, friends were greeting each other with handshakes and horse racing continued to be shown on the televisions.

At a Wetherspoon’s further up the road, customers had been told that they must sit apart and try to use the app when ordering, but it too stayed open. It too was still was doing a roaring trade.

Source https://www.theguardian.com/politic...fusion-over-key-workers-list-as-schools-close
 
jakeblu said:
Interesting info from Kevin Rawlinson of the Guardian, I'm amazed at the stupidity of some people.

Pubs in Penge, south-east London, had already started filling up well before the prime minister’s announcement that they must close down.

The high street, whose environs host six pubs, still had five open as Boris Johnson addressed the nation. There were surreal scenes as the big-screen televisions beamed Downing Street’s daily press conference that carried news of one of the most wide-ranging peacetime changes to British life while, directly underneath them, games of pool continued undisturbed.

Shortly after the announcement, as the prime minister was still speaking, one customer headed out to call a friend: “Listen, you’d better hurry up and get here because all the pubs are shutting at 7pm. Hurry up,” he was heard to say.

At another pub about 250 metres away, a sign on the door assured customers that, as a response to the Covid-19 alert, children would no longer be allowed in until further notice. The bar was full, friends were greeting each other with handshakes and horse racing continued to be shown on the televisions.

At a Wetherspoon’s further up the road, customers had been told that they must sit apart and try to use the app when ordering, but it too stayed open. It too was still was doing a roaring trade.

Source https://www.theguardian.com/politic...fusion-over-key-workers-list-as-schools-close
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The French govt has today appluaded the bulk of the population for their dicipline and willingness to adhere to restrictions that have been in place for the past week.

However they have also expressed dismay ( as have some of the general population) at those who have basically chosen to bury their heads in the sand and continue to socialise and go out as if there is no national / global problem .

I find myself overwhelmed with a mixture of emotions ranging from anger , shame , sadness and a certain amount of fear having read this post from Steve.


For the sake of the UK population that are accepting how infectious this virus really is and indeed its potentail to be mortel; I hope that the govt, having now commenced with closures and restrictions, dont delay further in controlling those who I can only describe as fools and enforcing whatever controls are deemed as necessary using the police and military as is the case here.
 
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Dave70D said:
but china might try and help others now if they are on top on this deadly mess.
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They are.

There have been several reports such as the one below including discussion about them sharing research findings, including the genome information that has sped up the development of a vaccine, and distributing PPE around the world.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...tself-as-a-leader-in-tackling-the-coronavirus

Whether this is adequate help is another question, but they do seem to be trying to help.
 
Asha said:
Aequate or not , the most important imo is that EVERY country help each other in whatever way possible.......Not one nor the other is in a position to wait for "someone else" to resolve a global pandemic
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Agree that every country should get their heads together to try and get it sorted.
 
Asha said:
Aequate or not , the most important imo is that EVERY country help each other in whatever way possible.......Not one nor the other is in a position to wait for "someone else" to resolve a global pandemic
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Indeed, my question about adequacy was not meant as a criticism, just reflecting the lack in my ability to make that judgement.
 
myotis said:
Indeed, my question about adequacy was not meant as a criticism, just reflecting the lack in my ability to make that judgement.
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My appologies Graham if my response has made you believe that I considered your post was critiszing....That is not the case!

I would be very surprised if the production of a vaccin was to come from the research and tests of just one country, hence the importance of the govts globally to unite in their efforts.
 
Asha said:
My appologies Graham if my response has made you believe that I considered your post was critiszing....That is not the case!

I would be very surprised if the production of a vaccin was to come from the research and tests of just one country, hence the importance of the govts globally to unite in their efforts.
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Ah, yes, re-reading what you said, I realise I could interpret it differently. I agree with your comments about co-operation.
 
So impressed by our PM Porky Johnson, who has built a career on lies and deception, standing before the cameras and saying with a straight face “trust me if you.do as I say all this will be over in 12 weeks” (paraphrasing) :(.
 
arclight said:
Fascinating and encouraging to see how much work is ongoing.
Thanks for posting that, Toni.
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There are some very clever and dedicated people out there ( the world over) who work relentlesly to protect us from ailments and care for us when we do succumbe.

At this very moment communities of Paris are applauding the medical services from their balconies
 
Asha said:
Aequate or not , the most important imo is that EVERY country help each other in whatever way possible.......Not one nor the other is in a position to wait for "someone else" to resolve a global pandemic
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America first........
 
Gremlin said:
Someone explain how this works please.
Everything is closed down and no one is allowed to go out
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When was that announced?

Gremlin said:
So the vast majority of the population that do manual work won't be, many unemployed with no wages so not paying tax or NI
How long can we survive on that ?
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Thought ssp etc was available?

Gremlin said:
People who can't work from home losing their homes and going into debt
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Thought there was a mortgage break and people where going to be paid up to 85% of their wages?

Gremlin said:
There isn't an endless supply of funds to keep things going forever so how long can the country be shut down
be fore services have to suffer
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Which ones?

Gremlin said:
I know this will be unpopular but wouldn't it be better to indentify those most at risk and isolate them, from what
I have read most people will survive
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Yes, round them up and put them all together somewhere? How would that work exactly?

myotis said:
They are.

There have been several reports such as the one below including discussion about them sharing research findings, including the genome information that has sped up the development of a vaccine, and distributing PPE around the world.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...tself-as-a-leader-in-tackling-the-coronavirus

Whether this is adequate help is another question, but they do seem to be trying to help.
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Dave70D said:
Good and so they should too.
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That sounds like you want to say it's their fault they should clear up the mess?
 
KitsuneAndy said:
Still no help for self employed people I see
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Thought "The self-employed will gain access to the equivalent of statutory sick pay, and be given tax deferrals" plus I assume are able to take the mortgage holidays offered etc? Don't get me wrong Im not saying it will be necessarily enough, but it's not "no help".
 
arclight said:
Listen to this, please:-

https://www.lbc.co.uk/radio/present...tor-nhs-cant-cope-with-coronavirus-stay-home/

I heard that doctor live on LBC.

Sickening to hear what our health professionals are having to do whilst imbeciles behave in a way that degrades the efforts of some of the finest people in the country and threatens the lives and wellbeing of us all.
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OMG!!! If that is what they are still doing when they catch the virus and they will, the sad thing then is they will want help.
 
Donnie said:
Thought "The self-employed will gain access to the equivalent of statutory sick pay, and be given tax deferrals" plus I assume are able to take the mortgage holidays offered etc? Don't get me wrong Im not saying it will be necessarily enough, but it's not "no help".
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£94 a week is what SSP is.

Mortgage holidays aren't worth taking, they actually cost you more, as after the holiday your repayments go up to cover the additional interest you've accrued.

Whereas if I was a Ltd company I could be claiming 80% of my salary back from the govt.
 
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