Thinking of ditching the D700

Laudrup said:
The Leica sensor and glass is better. The Leica will always win. It's better and fairer to compare the NEX against the competition it actually faces like the Micro 4/3 market etc.
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Well if you take a look at the first of the two links I posted where both cameras were using the same glass, you'll see that the Nex isn't just a bit sharper - it's considerably sharper. Try being a bit more impartial instead of seeing just what you want to see. The Leica doesn't come off at all well in that first test.

I don't actually read too much into this btw, given that I don't know how stringent Steve Huff was with his setup or how good he is at manually focusing a Leica. Lighten up - enjoy your Leica instead of trying to take over the world with it.
 
woof woof said:
My point was that in t'olden days film was never that flat and it wasn't too bothered about the angle light struck it anyway but these days sensors are much more flat and they do care about the angle at which light hits them.

I don't know if it's a real world worry as I've never used a Leica lens or any other rangefinder type lens on a DSLR. I just wondered.
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And that is why some people have had to have some lenses adjusted, digital is much less forgiving of little foibles. Don't forget some of these lenses being used are 50+ years old!
 
menthel said:
And that is why some people have had to have some lenses adjusted, digital is much less forgiving of little foibles. Don't forget some of these lenses being used are 50+ years old!
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I don't think I personally would care TBH :D A few foibles just add to character :D sometimes :D
 
woof woof said:
I don't think I personally would care TBH :D A few foibles just add to character :D sometimes :D
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You are preaching to the converted here! I think the vast majority of people here would think I am bonkers for still shooting film. As I sit here and type I can still smell the dev on my fingers from the 2 rolls of TMAX I have just souped!
 
I gave up film and either sold or gave away everything except the very first camera I ever bought (a Kodak, Made In England) and a Jessops compact so it's digital all the way now for me now although my G1 with manual Voigtlander 25mm f0.95 is a very film like experience with the screen folded away next to the body.

Generally I think that people look too closely, 100% viewing on screen and all :eek:.
 
menthel said:
You are preaching to the converted here! I think the vast majority of people here would think I am bonkers for still shooting film. As I sit here and type I can still smell the dev on my fingers from the 2 rolls of TMAX I have just souped!
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Well I have a foot in both camps as you know - I've got a few film cameras and you can have 'em when you prise 'em from my cold dead fingers. :D I love shooting my blad but I know what a pig it is to focus, especially in low light, and the fact is despite having some of the best Zeiss glass it all goes to rat droppings if you can't hit critical focus, and that bit can be challenging. Strangely though, I enjoy the whole ritual with MF whereas it titses me off big time with 35mm where I much prefer AF. :shrug:
 
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woof woof said:
I gave up film and either sold or gave away everything except the very first camera I ever bought (a Kodak, Made In England) and a Jessops compact so it's digital all the way now for me now although my G1 with manual Voigtlander 25mm f0.95 is a very film like experience with the screen folded away next to the body.

Generally I think that people look too closely, 100% viewing on screen and all :eek:.
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Again, agreed! If the photo looks good as a photo stop zooming in to pick out faults! I think that the OP is making his own decision based on his own, particular needs. But these kinds of threads always bring out the bizarre feelings people get about camera brands! From "Oh my god how can you ditch a D700" to the "Leica buyers are rich fools". Wierd. I buy cameras for doing a job. I want something to put my M fit lenses onto that won't really change the focal length, I bought them to be 35mm and 50mm! Therefore I shoot film with my M6 and wait for either M9's to come down in price or for someone to bring out a small rangefinder or mirrorless with a full frame sensor. But then that is what I want and not what people think I should buy! ;)
 
CT said:
Well I have a foot in both camps as you know - I've got a few film cameras and you can have 'em when you prise 'em from my cold dead fingers. :D I love shooting my blad but I know what a pig it is to focus, especially in low light, and the fact is despite having some of the best Zeiss glass it all goes to rat droppings if you can't hit critical focus, and that bit can be challenging. Strangely though, I enjoy the whole ritual with MF whereas it titses me off big time with 35mm where I much prefer AF. :shrug:
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So do I! I am sitting here smelling of developer whilst processing a bunch of shots from my 7D. ;)
 
grum said:
Spending vast amounts of money on a (not all that amazing) camera can do funny things to your eyes. ;)
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You get what you pay for. Hand made great lenses and bodies. Try getting a NEX repaired in 10 years and Sony will point and laugh at you.
 
Laudrup said:
You get what you pay for. Hand made great lenses and bodies. Try getting a NEX repaired in 10 years and Sony will point and laugh at you.
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While Leica do what exactly?

You'll be searching for a third party repairer too.
 
jamesoliverstone said:
Believe me, I don't get 10 years of use out of ANY of my cameras, I move with the times :LOL:

I still want an M9 though :D
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I wonder what a 10 year old M9 would be worth. Would there still be enough value in it to spend on the repair?
 
Johnd2000 said:
I wonder what a 10 year old M9 would be worth. Would there still be enough value in it to spend on the repair?
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The only thing you can really compare it to is the RD1.
There's one on eBay which doesn't state an age but if the serial numbers go sequentially then it was less than 3000th off the production line so chances are its 6 - 61/2 years old and it's going for £1300+. Think the MRSP at launch was just shy of $4k so not too bad as depreciation goes.

Still doubt Leica will entertain a repair to a digital body in 10 years time though.
 
Laudrup said:
You get what you pay for. Hand made great lenses and bodies. Try getting a NEX repaired in 10 years and Sony will point and laugh at you.
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Sounds like you're trying to justify the price tag to yourself.

The money you'd spend on a Leica M9 could keep most people in new cameras for the next 10 years - with a fairly regular replacement schedule.

I understand the mechanical Leica bodies are still valuable today and could be repaired but if you think that will stand true of the M9 and its digital components you're fooling yourself. In 10 years that M9 will be a fancy doorstop worth as much as a daily newspaper.

In the digital world technology moves too fast to simple say 'my Leica full frame is better than your compact system camera'. Compare the NEX-5n to the Canon 5dmkI as an example. The technology has advanced to a point where the new generation of crop sensors can match or even surpass older full frame ones.
 
The gadgeteer in me loves these types of threads, but the photographer in me dies a little each time I read one.
 
gingerweasel said:
Sounds like you're trying to justify the price tag to yourself.

The money you'd spend on a Leica M9 could keep most people in new cameras for the next 10 years - with a fairly regular replacement schedule.

I understand the mechanical Leica bodies are still valuable today and could be repaired but if you think that will stand true of the M9 and its digital components you're fooling yourself. In 10 years that M9 will be a fancy doorstop worth as much as a daily newspaper.
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I don't think you seem to understand at all. It's all there on their site.
 
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Is it? I just had a look and couldn't see anywhere that they guarantee to be carrying digital body spares in a decade.

Can you post a link maybe?
 
manualfocus-g said:
Some Leica M9P samples have now been added to the DPReview comparison thingy:

http://dpreview.com/reviews/studioc...&x=-0.22784056303715217&y=0.21968587072729434

The Nex-5N looks way cleaner than the Leica at high ISO to me, which is a cracking result for Sony and us cheapskates that love the Nex so much!
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The M9 is not known for being a high ISO camera. Up to about ISO 1000 is fine, push it higher and you won't be as pleased. It seems dpreview used a 75 Summarit, not the best lens to use.

fixedimage said:
Is it? I just had a look and couldn't see anywhere that they guarantee to be carrying digital body spares in a decade.

Can you post a link maybe?
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http://en.leica-camera.com/photography/m_system/m9/
 
gingerweasel said:
In the digital world technology moves too fast to simple say 'my Leica full frame is better than your compact system camera'. Compare the NEX-5n to the Canon 5dmkI as an example. The technology has advanced to a point where the new generation of crop sensors can match or even surpass older full frame ones.
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I'd say theres a good arguement that the push forward has been slowing down considerabley in recent years or at any rate moving beyond what many users will be happy with.

I doubt the M9 will retain its value very well long term but it already likely covers many users needs, a well built body, M mount, a good rangefinder, FF sensor with enough detail for decent sized printing.
 
Laudrup said:
The Leica sensor and glass is better. The Leica will always win. It's better and fairer to compare the NEX against the competition it actually faces like the Micro 4/3 market etc.
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Unless, of course, you want to keep your images. Seems like the M9 has a fairly serious issue with losing files from the sd cards and locking solid. If I were in James' shoes the last thing I'd want is to find myself miles from anywhere with a dead camera and no photos.....
 
It's a shame this has developed into a a comparison with the M9. I merely remarked that it would appeal to the same users as those who use an M9. None of us can escape the current rate of progress, which renders digital cameras to the second division at an alarming rate which was never the case with film.

You can't stop progress, I'm sure the M10 which can't be far away will raise the bar yet again.
 
Flash In The Pan said:
Unless, of course, you want to keep your images. Seems like the M9 has a fairly serious issue with losing files from the sd cards and locking solid. If I were in James' shoes the last thing I'd want is to find myself miles from anywhere with a dead camera and no photos.....
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That's like telling me don't buy a Canon as I heard someone got an Err 99 message. I've used a £10 SD card and never had a problem. It's a not an issue for the vast majority.
 
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Laudrup said:
That's like telling me don't buy a Canon as I heard someone got an Err 99 message. I've used a £10 SD card and never had a problem. It's a not an issue for the vast majority.
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I'm surprised at Leica having to issue a statement and a fix then.
 
Nex7 looks like a very good option. finally something with interchangeable lenses and proper VF ( although it might be EVF don't remember ) other than Leica.

BUT - I think the sony lenses ar very bad. I don't know what are they thinking. and if they make a good one - the new zeiss 24mm or whatever , it's huge ! compare it to the zuiko 12mm little super gem .
 
Laudrup said:
The M9 is not known for being a high ISO camera. Up to about ISO 1000 is fine, push it higher and you won't be as pleased. It seems dpreview used a 75 Summarit, not the best lens to use.



http://en.leica-camera.com/photography/m_system/m9/
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Nope still not seeing it.
I see "The digital components and shutter assembly of the M9 and the M9-P are similarly constructed with a lifetime of endurance in mind. Free updates ensure that the cameras' firmware always embraces the latest developments. In short: an M camera is not only an investment for life, but also a lifelong companion." which just market talk for "These cameras are for doctors and lawyers to put on their shelf and fire about 100 times a year so we knew we could make the shutter from papier mache and it'd last fine." and "When we discover how badly we have programmed it we will put new firmware on our website for you to download" which is what pretty much every manufacturer of electronic goods worth their salt will do.
 
fixedimage said:
Nope still not seeing it.
I see "The digital components and shutter assembly of the M9 and the M9-P are similarly constructed with a lifetime of endurance in mind. Free updates ensure that the cameras' firmware always embraces the latest developments. In short: an M camera is not only an investment for life, but also a lifelong companion." which just market talk for "These cameras are for doctors and lawyers to put on their shelf and fire about 100 times a year so we knew we could make the shutter from papier mache and it'd last fine." and "When we discover how badly we have programmed it we will put new firmware on our website for you to download" which is what pretty much every manufacturer of electronic goods worth their salt will do.
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Leica has stockpiles of parts from broken cameras going back to the 1920s. Given that the amount of M9s sold is not astronomical and the parts have been selected to last, with some no doubt stockpiled, and when M10/M11s come out and there is an upgrade programme I'm sure my and others M9s will find their way back to Solms.

Leica have been doing this since before you were born, so I'll bow to their wisdom if it is all the same.
 
Laudrup said:
Leica has stockpiles of parts from broken cameras going back to the 1920s. Given that the amount of M9s sold is not astronomical and the parts have been selected to last, with some no doubt stockpiled, and when M10/M11s come out and there is an upgrade programme I'm sure my and others M9s will find their way back to Solms.

Leica have been doing this since before you were born, so I'll bow to their wisdom if it is all the same.
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I'm sure they do, not so sure they'll be stockpiling digital parts though but I'd love to be proven wrong.
 
I've been researching the available adaptors for my Contax Zeiss lenses and out of the options out there it seems the Metabones and the Kipon versions are the best engineered ones and the ones compatible with more of the Contax G lenses.

I've opted for the Metabones which gets good reviews and there's a UK supplier offering a couple of days delivery time.
 
Bugger! It looks like the release date of the NEX-7 is likely to be delayed due to major floods in Thailand and it's affect on the Sony plant which has halted production for the time being.

On a positive note Steve Huff has a production version Nex-7 which he's been posting some test shots with, and is currently writing a full review which should be published after this weekend.

http://www.stevehuffphoto.com/tag/nex-7/
 
jamesoliverstone said:
:(
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LOL I know! I've got the Metabones converter for my Contax G Zeiss lenses (brilliant bit of kit btw- really well engineered) a couple of memory stick cards- and just been and picked up a card reader to come back read this. :crying:
 
James, my Brother has the very same issue with you and has gone with a Panasonic GF3 et al. Still kept the Nikon stuff for the time being but as he says, and I quote

"GF3 and 2 lenses and flash goes in waistpack. Nikon macro 775gm - GF3 225gm!"

Food for thought! :)
 
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