What video camera is best to record an 85" QLED t/v screen?

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Patrick1953

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Antony John Burton-Pye
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Hello,

I hope I'm on the correct forum. I'm 70 yrs old so please make any answers simple enough for an old fart like me to understand.
I have a Samsung 85" Qled t/v that is 18 months old and still under the 5-year warranty. For my 70th birthday and as a special treat I thought I'd push the boat out when I had to replace my old 40" t/v. I spent most of my savings on this t/v which has been fantastic for someone my age who is partly disabled. I can't get out to see the world but this t/v has brought the world to me.
However, it has now developed a number of faults the worst of which is that it has stopped upscaling. For an 85" screen you need good upscaling to watch HD, SD or old 625 stuff.
Samsung have done 2 remote diagnostics on this machine and said it was working within expected parameters even though I was watching a poor HD image on my screen as they were working on it. I pointed out that they were looking through an 18" or 20" monitor their end and that they probably couldn't see what I could see on my 85" t/v. They also sent a young engineer who took a load of reading with his gadget and then left. He said that there was no point in showing him any upscaled images as he didn't know much about them.
So I need to take Samsung to court and get them to repair or replace this set. I need to show the court these faulty so-called upscaled videos. Luckily with this set I can swap from full screen to a number of smaller sizes where the problem goes away. It only becomes unwatchable when I go to full screen.
Can someone recommend a video camera that can take a range of quality recordings that I can take to court and show how faulty it really is? I can't afford too much now that I've spent a fortune on this telly but at the same time, I can't let Samsung get away with trying to rip me off.
Sorry this is so long.
Thank you,
Patrick.
 
Hi there.

I can't answer your question directly, but I would exhaust all avenues before parting with any cash going down the court route.

Try, "resolver". I've used their website and had success on every occasion.

Resolver

Best of luck.
 
To show how bad it is I would imagine you would need to shoot 4K video of the screen, which would also then need to be watched on a suitable screen as well.
 
Get in touch with the CEO - yup go straight to the top on this one. A simple replacement will save him loads of bad press. See it as an adventure in doing the right thing - go get him !
 
Don't video it. Take the screen itself into court as evidence.

Otherwise you leave the door open to the defence to claim that it is the recording that is at fault - at which point, case dismissed.
 
As Elliiott says: your contract is with the retailer.

However, as I understand things, you would need to show either that the TV fails to meet the needs you stated before purchasing or that it fails to provide the performance that would reasonably be expected when making a purchase of this kind. Be aware that upscaling is very unlikely to provide a sharpened image from a standard definition (SD) or a 625 line analogue signal. If you could prove that such a claim was made by the seller, you might have a case.
 
AndrewFlannigan said:
As Elliiott says: your contract is with the retailer.

However, as I understand things, you would need to show either that the TV fails to meet the needs you stated before purchasing or that it fails to provide the performance that would reasonably be expected when making a purchase of this kind. Be aware that upscaling is very unlikely to provide a sharpened image from a standard definition (SD) or a 625 line analogue signal. If you could prove that such a claim was made by the seller, you might have a case.
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The OP stated the tv has STOPPED upscaling meaning there is now an issue with the product that wasn't there when purchased.

He should go back to the retailer (unless the extended warranty is direct with Samsung).
 
Fixer said:
Get in touch with the CEO - yup go straight to the top on this one. A simple replacement will save him loads of bad press. See it as an adventure in doing the right thing - go get him !
Click to expand...
I sent a formal letter of complaint to the CEO but from what I can tell it was handled by the call center. The email I got back just repeated all the lies they had been telling me about how much my faulty t/v wasn't faulty.
 
Not that it helps but I wonder if this is something that happened due to an update? We have a Samsung which reguarly gets updates from planet Samsung and I often wonder what is being updated and why.

Other than that as Elliott said above, contact the shop.
 
DemiLion said:
Don't video it. Take the screen itself into court as evidence.

Otherwise you leave the door open to the defence to claim that it is the recording that is at fault - at which point, case dismissed.
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The screen is 85" and weighs a ton. It has a solid steel core running through it to stop it from flexing when moved. So, no I wont be taking the screen to court. However you touched on a point that I think explains their reluctance to repair the t/v. The engineer that called to the flat said that he hoped they could fix the t/v with software as he didn't want to move the t/v. On a phone call to their call center a few weeks later the rep was reading notes aloud from his screen when he accidentally
said " too many stairs and no lift". I hadn't mentioned any of that to him. I live on the top floor of a three story building with no lift. So the engineer must have told his boss that it was too difficult to get the t/v out of the building, even though we got it up those same stairs in the first place. Two hours after the engineer left, Martin Dawes who do the repairs rang me to say the t/v was working within specifications and they couldn't help me. So now we go to court.
 
ecoleman said:
Are you in the UK and if so why are you dealing with Samsung?

In the UK It is the retailers responsibility to deal with any warranty issues and is the retailer who you should be taking to court.
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I purchased it directly from Samsung. At the time no one else was selling the 85" and I thought buying directly from such a "good " manufacturer would be ok. Boy was I wrong.
 
AndrewFlannigan said:
You may wish to read this page, before going any further...

www.which.co.uk

Faulty product? How to get a refund, repair or replacement - Which?

If an item you've bought develops a fault, your refund rights depend on when you bought it and who is responsible.
www.which.co.uk www.which.co.uk
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I'm taking Samsung to the small claims court which is very informal and doesn't cost much. You don't need a solicitor at this stage so I'll represent myself. I've suggested going to a third party or through the Alternative Dispute Resolution process, but Samsung just repeated the same trash that the t/v wasn't faulty, so I'' let the court decide.
 
Patrick1953 said:
I purchased it directly from Samsung.
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Ah!

You failed to make that clear in your earlier post. In such a situation, you can indeed initiate a case using the small claims procedure.
 
AndrewFlannigan said:
As Elliiott says: your contract is with the retailer.

However, as I understand things, you would need to show either that the TV fails to meet the needs you stated before purchasing or that it fails to provide the performance that would reasonably be expected when making a purchase of this kind. Be aware that upscaling is very unlikely to provide a sharpened image from a standard definition (SD) or a 625 line analogue signal. If you could prove that such a claim was made by the seller, you might have a case.
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You're correct in that the upscaling of SD and 625 doesn't give a sharp picture, but I have been very impressed with the upscaling from the Samsung. Watching stuff like Only Fools and Horses or One Foot In The Grave or Dinner Ladies and others has been a great experience with this set for the past 18 months. Yes, you can tell it's old tech and there is a "soft" look to the image but it is perfectly watchable and enjoyable. Until about 3 months ago, now it's fuzzy with scan lines all over the place, artifacts everywhere. It's just not fun anymore to watch.
 
woof woof said:
Not that it helps but I wonder if this is something that happened due to an update? We have a Samsung which reguarly gets updates from planet Samsung and I often wonder what is being updated and why.

Other than that as Elliott said above, contact the shop.
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I've checked for updates, the last one was long before this all started. Now I have a number of faults, not just the picture but the sound has a problem and within the past week the t/v has started changing channels all on its own. The faults seem to be cascading.
 
Patrick1953 said:
I've checked for updates, the last one was long before this all started. Now I have a number of faults, not just the picture but the sound has a problem and within the past week the t/v has started changing channels all on its own. The faults seem to be cascading.
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Put together another email to Samsung customer services detailing all the faults present.

Then if they do nothing and it does go to court you can prove full disclosure of the faults.

Best of luck with it.
 
This link may help, also consider contacting Citizens Advice.

www.gov.uk

Make a court claim for money

How to take legal action if someone owes you money (small claims court), how much it costs, what happens next. Includes information from withdrawn guidance EX303, EX304, EX306, EX321, EX325 and EX350.
www.gov.uk www.gov.uk
 
Patrick1953 said:
You sound like you know a little bit about the process. Any advice to give?
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Absolutely not.

If you need legal advice, try your local Citizens Advice Bureau...

www.citizensadvice.org.uk

Citizens Advice

Online free advice from Citizens Advice to help you find a way forward, whatever the problem. Our research enables us to campaign on issues affecting people's lives.
www.citizensadvice.org.uk www.citizensadvice.org.uk
 
Did you pay with a credit card. If so I’d be contacting your card issuer before proceeding with court.

Also before starting a claim make sure you send a letter detailing all the faults and giving them x amount of days to rectify the issue or you will be making a claim. It’s called a letter before action. If you start a claim without having done that it can be thrown out.

Instead of recording the issue which may not come across on a video, It may also be worth getting a 3rd party repairer out to look at the TV and ask them to write a report. It may cost a little bit but you will be able to claim that back in court.
 
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artyman said:
To show how bad it is I would imagine you would need to shoot 4K video of the screen, which would also then need to be watched on a suitable screen as well.
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If I were to record these faults would a laptop be able to show the differences between an upscaled picture and non-upscaled one? If the laptop screen was say 12" and I took a short recording of the original 625 image on a 25" t/v screen which would look nearly normal and watchable. Then took that same recording and showed it on an 85" screen with no upscaling, surely the differences between both would show up, maybe not in perfect contrast but enough for a court to see that there was a problem.
 
In your case I'd contact a local TV repair company.

It may be worth it to pay them for their time so they can provide evidence of a fault.

That may be enough to get Samsung to honour their warranty.
 
ecoleman said:
Did you pay with a credit card. If so I’d be contacting your card issuer before proceeding with court.

Also before starting a claim make sure you send a letter detailing all the faults and giving them x amount of days to rectify the issue or you will be making a claim. It’s called a letter before action. If you start a claim without having done that it can be thrown out.
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No I paid with a debit card. Yes I sent a formal letter informing them I would be taking action under the Consumer Rights Act 2015 and gave a long list of faults. They replied with an email repeating all the garbage about how my t/v wasn't faulty. I sent an email offering to go to a third party for arbitration or the ADR process. They replied with the same email as before. So they leave me no choice but to go to court.
 
Patrick1953 said:
No I paid with a debit card. Yes I sent a formal letter informing them I would be taking action under the Consumer Rights Act 2015 and gave a long list of faults. They replied with an email repeating all the garbage about how my t/v wasn't faulty. I sent an email offering to go to a third party for arbitration or the ADR process. They replied with the same email as before. So they leave me no choice but to go to court.
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See above, it may make it easier for you.
 
GreenNinja67 said:
In your case I'd contact a local TV repair company.

It may be worth it to pay them for their time so they can provide evidence of a fault.

That may be enough to get Samsung to honour their warranty.
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Way ahead of you. I firstly rang Currys but they don't send engineers to make reports. I rang another service center but they said the same. So I called two independent service engineers. The first one was so out of his depth when confronted by this 85" monster that he went straight into babbling about algorithms and frequencies and how bad Virgin were and how bad Utube was. I replied that I had been watching all this stuff for the past 18 months and it had been perfectly ok. I showed him a poor quality image from BBC's News 24 studios supposedly in HD and he thought it was fantastic. So I quickly paid him off and sent him on his way.
The second engineer was more informative. He was also gob-smacked at the size of the thing but agreed that the upscaling was poor or just not working. However he wasn't willing to sign anything that might come back to "haunt" him later. He also pointed out that t/v engineers might know a lot of tech stuff but very few will have seen an 85" t/v in action, let alone know the differences between the upscaled and non upscaled t/v pictures. Believe me, I've telephoned and emailed and messaged so many engineers and organisations and none have replied. It looks like it's down to me and a good camera to show a court that I have problems.
 
AndrewFlannigan said:
Absolutely not.

If you need legal advice, try your local Citizens Advice Bureau...

www.citizensadvice.org.uk

Citizens Advice

Online free advice from Citizens Advice to help you find a way forward, whatever the problem. Our research enables us to campaign on issues affecting people's lives.
www.citizensadvice.org.uk www.citizensadvice.org.uk
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Thank you, but that's already where I've been getting my advice from.
 
Patrick1953 said:
Way ahead of you. I firstly rang Currys but they don't send engineers to make reports. I rang another service center but they said the same. So I called two independent service engineers. The first one was so out of his depth when confronted by this 85" monster that he went straight into babbling about algorithms and frequencies and how bad Virgin were and how bad Utube was. I replied that I had been watching all this stuff for the past 18 months and it had been perfectly ok. I showed him a poor quality image from BBC's News 24 studios supposedly in HD and he thought it was fantastic. So I quickly paid him off and sent him on his way.
The second engineer was more informative. He was also gob-smacked at the size of the thing but agreed that the upscaling was poor or just not working. However he wasn't willing to sign anything that might come back to "haunt" him later. He also pointed out that t/v engineers might know a lot of tech stuff but very few will have seen an 85" t/v in action, let alone know the differences between the upscaled and non upscaled t/v pictures. Believe me, I've telephoned and emailed and messaged so many engineers and organisations and none have replied. It looks like it's down to me and a good camera to show a court that I have problems.
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Obviously nobody on this forum knows what your image should look like, what it did look like or what it looks like now, but my concern would be that if you can't find a TV engineer (and I use that term loosely because engineers build bridges) to confirm a fault, how are you going to convince a judge who probably has even less knowledge of TV's of this size.

I have a 50" TV and old TV programs don't look particularly great on that. Watchable but not great. I'd hate to think what it would look like on an 85" TV
 
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I used the 4k UHD Blu-ray 2016 film 'Passengers' with Jennifer Lawrence and Chris Pratt as my picture quality reference for my 4K monitors. The bar scenes are amazing. My Blu-ray player is a higher end one so other players might not be as good. Just my $0.02.
 
ecoleman said:
Obviously nobody on this forum knows what your image should look like, what it did look like or what it looks like now, but my concern would be that if you can't find a TV engineer (and I use that term loosely because engineers build bridges) to confirm a fault, how are you going to convince a judge who probably has even less knowledge of TV's of this size.

I have a 50" TV and old TV programs don't look particularly great on that. Watchable but not great. I'd hate to think what it would look like on an 85" TV
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Honestly, with this t/v most of the old stuff looks good when it's upscaled properly. When I watch say One Foot In The Grave on a 25" screen it looks just like I remember back in the 1980s and is ok to watch. When I switch to full screen it looks almost the same with the odd artifact or line but it doesn't interfere with the enjoyment. The 85" screen looks just like the 25" but much bigger. But now it all looks bad at 85". Lets put it this way, I wouldn't have spent the last 18 months enjoying the old stuff if it looked anything like it does today. I'm a fussy viewer. This Samsung does a great job at upscaling when it works and I can recommend it just for that feature alone. Aftersales service however, based on my experience, is disgusting.
 
GreenNinja67 said:
Put together another email to Samsung customer services detailing all the faults present.

Then if they do nothing and it does go to court you can prove full disclosure of the faults.

Best of luck with it.
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I've sent so many emails to Samsung detailing everything that when I started to print them out in preparation for going to court, my fairly new ink cartridge ran out of ink and I had to order a couple more. Thank you for showing an interest.
 
Just a thought.

How are you receiving your TV? Sky, Virgin, Free View / Sat or directly through the TV.

If a box of some sort, could the problem be there. Have you tried replacing any HDMI cables?
 
ecoleman said:
Just a thought.

How are you receiving your TV? Sky, Virgin, Free View / Sat or directly through the TV.

If a box of some sort, could the problem be there. Have you tried replacing any HDMI cables?
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I use the Virgin box a lot but I have the option of terrestrial t/v via an aerial, Samsungs own website, Utube via wi-fi. When this all started I assumed it was Virgins fault and got them to replace my wi-fi box and Virgin t/v box. They tested everything and couldn't find a fault. I'm on their 550mbs package and get a good signal from my wi-fi box. These faults happen regardless of the source.
 
Fixer said:
I used the 4k UHD Blu-ray 2016 film 'Passengers' with Jennifer Lawrence and Chris Pratt as my picture quality reference for my 4K monitors. The bar scenes are amazing. My Blu-ray player is a higher end one so other players might not be as good. Just my $0.02.
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I don't suppose you have had a reason to film or record anything from your 4k t/v screen by any chance? If so can you tell me what video camera you used as I need to buy one soon to start filming my problems?
 
Patrick1953 said:
I don't suppose you have had a reason to film or record anything from your 4k t/v screen by any chance? If so can you tell me what video camera you used as I need to buy one soon to start filming my problems?
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No I have not sorry. It's seems an awful predicament you find yourself in. It won't help matters but at the end of the day it is just a 'TV'. Have you tried disconnecting all the cables for every connection then re-inserting everything in case there is a dry joint or loose connection?
 
Fixer said:
No I have not sorry. It's seems an awful predicament you find yourself in. It won't help matters but at the end of the day it is just a 'TV'. Have you tried disconnecting all the cables for every connection then re-inserting everything in case there is a dry joint or loose connection?
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I know it's just a t/v but at my age and being a bit disabled (I need two sticks to get around) this t/v has become something of a lifeline for me. I have no family now and my friends are either too far away or too senile to be of any help. So I can't get out and see the world anymore but this t/v brought the world to me and it was fantastic. I've walked around Tokyo at night in the rain and snow. I've white-water rafted down the Colorado river. I've travelled all over China via car driver dashcams. I've travelled throughout Europe by train using cab dash cams. And all of it from my armchair and in glorious UHD with HDR. I'm not trying to brag but for me the t/v is very important, but I get your point. Don't have a heart attack over it.
When the Virgin engineer called we took all the cables out to fit the new equipment and very carefully put them back. I had a pair of expensive 8k cables and I made sure they were back in the right place.
 
Talk to the bank and ask for a charge back? Keep it short and sweet and say they can send someone around to have a look if they want?
 
Fixer said:
Talk to the bank and ask for a charge back? Keep it short and sweet and say they can send someone around to have a look if they want?
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The OP paid with a debit card. Chargeback is not an option.

The lesson is, never buy expensive items on a debit card.
 
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'Generally' appliances like this can be reset to factory condition, which can resolve problems which have developed with firmware and drivers etc.
It would likely want to updates again but getting latest onto clean base as it were might avoid any problems introduced by incremental updates.
Or maybe you did this already.

As for recording what it's doing, you would struggle to do better than a good phone.
Or rather getting good results with a more serious video camera and rendering in a way to clearly show the issues isn't something you could do without quite a bit of trial and error learning curve.
So it would be better to enlist outside help IMO even for 'good phone' like recent iphone or google pixel.
This could be best anyway as you could concentrate on describing the issue as you demonstrate them.
 
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