Yashica 124g - why the price variation?

VirtualAdept

VirtualAdept

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A friend of mine is selling her yashica 124g, and while we were looking to see what she should be selling it for, we've noticed there's a massive range of pricing, from as low as £40 up to nearly £300.
All the cameras we looked at were described as working without any major haze or fungus, in fair condition, so I'm struggling to see what other differences there could be, so I ask you, great and knowledgable folk of F&C, why the difference? Could it be different lenses, or are some models just worth more?
 
The 124G is a specific model and they are technically all the same, so far as I know. The prices are scary with several over £300 on the auction site, and some of them are from Japan with £50 postage plus duties to be paid over and above that! It's a nice enough camera and pretty light for carrying around compared to the Mamiyas with interchangeable lenses, but I'm not sure they are worth all of the money unless they've had a CLA in the past few years.
 
What prices were they selling for? Just because the seller is asking hundred's it does not mean that they are selling for hundreds. Also, 'fair condition' can mean different things.
 
It's not just the 124G that has serious variations in present purchase and sold prices.

I've sold and am continuing to sell gear atm and it is proving a nightmare trying to value anything tbh

As for why the market is as such, I have no idea!
 
As suggested, it's what they sell for not what they're priced at. ebay advanced search gives sold prices.

I have a theory that pricing can be roughly divided into 3.

1. Low - someone has no idea. It's just an old camera.

2. Mid - a genuine filmie moving a camera on.

3. High - chancer hoping some clueless hipster will fall for it.

Slightly tongue in cheek, but only slightly.
 
Film camera prices seem to be a bit all over the place at the moment from what I can see. Around the beginning of the year the 'private sales' (auction sites, ads, etc.) seemed to be achieving prices higher than seen at some retailers, the retailers then seemed to cotton on to this and upped their prices. Currently, private sales prices seem to vary considerably, with some fairly reasonably priced cameras to be had. In the meantime, stocks of popular and desirable film cameras seem to have dwindled at some retailers, perhaps indicating that demand is reasonably strong for film cameras?

I'd suggest having a look at the price of similar condition 'completed items' on eBay, see if that seems reasonable to your friend, and perhaps take it from there? If going for a private sale, remember that a good, honest description and several good quality photos (and a recent example of a photo taken with the advertised camera) usually helps a sale, as does good feedback (particularly for similar value items) for eBay sellers.

The other major factor that can affect the selling price for a camera on eBay seems to be where the seller has specified 'collection only'. Some sellers won't post items, and this often seems to significantly reduce the price a camera sells for.
 
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Mr Badger said:
The other major factor that can affect the selling price for a camera on eBay seems to be where the seller has specified 'collection only'. Some sellers won't post items, and this often seems to significantly reduce the price a camera sells for.
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It stops me bidding entirely. The cost for me to travel 100 miles or more each way to pick up a camera would have to come off my maximum bid and is likely to be impossible to actually do.
 
Excluding compacts it would be interesting to know how many decent working film cameras are left in the world. Just between my father and I, I've thrown away at least 10 cameras away as not worth repairing and my father got through quite a few good rangefinder cameras h'mm all gone somewhere and dropped his AE1 into the sea. :eek:
 
excalibur2 said:
Excluding compacts it would be interesting to know how many decent working film cameras are left in the world. Just between my father and I, I've thrown away at least 10 cameras away as not worth repairing and my father got through quite a few good rangefinder cameras h'mm all gone somewhere and dropped his AE1 into the sea. :eek:
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It would be interesting to know how many decent working film cameras are left in my house, let alone the world! I seem to have lost count. :whistle:
 
VirtualAdept said:
A friend of mine is selling her yashica 124g, and while we were looking to see what she should be selling it for, we've noticed there's a massive range of pricing, from as low as £40 up to nearly £300.
All the cameras we looked at were described as working without any major haze or fungus, in fair condition, so I'm struggling to see what other differences there could be, so I ask you, great and knowledgable folk of F&C, why the difference? Could it be different lenses, or are some models just worth more?
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The prices for these cameras are becoming really inflated due to demand from beginners and those new to medium format after years of people recommending them as great medium format starter cameras (when they were cheaper).

To my mind, these cameras—in terms of results, build quality, and collectibility—don’t warrant these higher prices, however, so savvier buyers will steer clear, as there are similar, if not better, cameras (e.g., older Rolleiflexes) available for less.

So, in essence, there are factors pushing prices both up and down from what I’m seeing.
 
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skysh4rk said:
To my mind, these cameras—in terms of results, build quality, and collectibility—don’t warrant these higher prices, however, so savvier buyers will steer clear, as there are similar, if not better cameras (e.g., older Rolleiflexes), available for less.
.
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As the owner of a 124G, I have to agree. IMHO it's a decent tool, but I would never consider one at the current prices. It's full plastic in crucial bits, and 350 pounds puts you in potential Rollei 3.5 chance find, if you're patient. I should add I also briefly tested a Rolleicord Vb (which I then had to return because it came fitted with a 16 frame adapter and the 12 frame adapter was missing). In my experience, there is no comparison between the Mat 124G and the Rolleicord: the Rollei felt made to last. The 124G doesn't.
 
skysh4rk said:
The prices for these cameras are becoming really inflated due to demand from beginners and those new to medium format after years of people recommending them as great medium format starter cameras (when they were cheaper).

To my mind, these cameras—in terms of results, build quality, and collectibility—don’t warrant these higher prices, however, so savvier buyers will steer clear, as there are similar, if not better cameras (e.g., older Rolleiflexes), available for less.

So, in essence, there are factors pushing prices both up and down from what I’m seeing.
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In complete agreement with this. They are great cameras - they were my entry into medium format - but people are paying more for clean Yashicas than Rolleicords or even some Rolleiflex models. Although prices have been creeping up continuously, I still think a nice Rolleicord IV or V makes a great purchase.
 
freecom2 said:
, I still think a nice Rolleicord IV or V makes a great purchase.
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I have a VA and prefer it over the 124G even though the viewfinder is not as bright.

Nonetheless I plan on parting with it as the 6x6 format and I just don't get on :(
 
Asha said:
I have a VA and prefer it over the 124G even though the viewfinder is not as bright.

Nonetheless I plan on parting with it as the 6x6 format and I just don't get on :(
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A good clean and a brighter screen make an excellent addition. I had a cut Mamiya RB67 put in my Rolleiflex with a significant improvement in the viewfinder brightness.

Composing and structuring a shot in 6x6 is slightly innate, I feel; I often prefer the square format to a rectangular 35mm frame. Luckily I'm sure you could get back whatever you paid for the Rollei.
 
6X6 is the best.. end of.

When I posited the idea of using an RB67 screen in my Rollei the F&C collective were less than supportive.

:)
 
skysh4rk said:
Yes, but that’s a brand new camera, so not a fair comparison.

Used Lubitels do not cost anywhere near £289.
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Sure, but still a silly price for a version of something that was cheaper than a Zenith. Unused 'new old stock' 166Bs go for about £70 delivered on ebay. While we shouldn't expects 80s prices for anything made today, the Lomography price has more to do with marketing hype than the manufacturing cost.
 
My stock response to Lomo remains the same.

The market will dictate whether the price is too high, and evidently they must sell their film/accessories/cameras at the price they advertise to keep turning over and existing year on year. So they charge what we feel is too much - they offer physical stores, good targeted advertising, and try and keep film/analogue photography mainstream and in healthy demand. If someone buys a new Lubitel 166 for £289, then goes and buys some Tri-X or Portra, that keeps film stock being sold, and available to all of us.

Not everyone loves buying hobby equipment from poorly described, poorly photographed eBay/Gumtree adverts with the possibility of damage/non-functioning (I do).
 
VirtualAdept said:
A friend of mine is selling her yashica 124g, and while we were looking to see what she should be selling it for, we've noticed there's a massive range of pricing, from as low as £40 up to nearly £300.
All the cameras we looked at were described as working without any major haze or fungus, in fair condition, so I'm struggling to see what other differences there could be, so I ask you, great and knowledgable folk of F&C, why the difference? Could it be different lenses, or are some models just worth more?
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I do not know the British market, but I bought 4 different Yashica Mat over the past 2 years via the evil-bay, searching mostly inside Germany and Europe in general, and what I can say is that I would not pay more than 150 Euros for a Mat, Mat 124 or Mat 124G in good working condition. That is the average value now, you can buy one for 80 or 200 Euros but 150 is the most common price to pay. You can search on Ebay by "sold items" and see what is the average price from the past few months.

Why some Mat's are offered at 400 and other at 100?, I think it is for the same reason you can see a normal USB cable offered at 50 cents or 50 Euros, some people do not know the real market price of the product and set the value of what they think it is, and other people think that are the most intelligent in the world and the rest of us are stupid enough to pay those crazy prices, but ignorance is the most common case, a lot of people selling what it was from their parents or grandparents without a clue.
 
Thanks for the input, its been a very interesting read.

I had a look at completed listings, but the prices there also vary wildly, so I guess its just what people are willing to pay for it.
 
VirtualAdept said:
Thanks for the input, its been a very interesting read.

I had a look at completed listings, but the prices there also vary wildly, so I guess its just what people are willing to pay for it.
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Completed listings include withdrawn and expired, you need sold listings to see what people actually parted with their cash to get. Still tends to vary wildly, but there's usually an indication that the bulk of BIN prices are way to high.

ariel7515 said:
Why some Mat's are offered at 400 and other at 100?, I think it is for the same reason you can see a normal USB cable offered at 50 cents or 50 Euros, some people do not know the real market price of the product and set the value of what they think it is, and other people think that are the most intelligent in the world and the rest of us are stupid enough to pay those crazy prices, but ignorance is the most common case, a lot of people selling what it was from their parents or grandparents without a clue.
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IMHO the most common reason for over-pricing is simply gouging. The same reason you'll see a particular new item at £5 and £50, or Hifi cables at £1,000. Some sellers reckon that there are a few suckers who think the highest priced item is the best, and are prepared to wait for them!

(BTW I had an interesting conversation with the (excellent) guy selling walking boots in Tiso in Edinburgh. He says he has a problem with folk coming into the store and asking for the most expensive boots. He says it's hard work to convince them that a cheaper pair might fit them a lot better! Good on that man, I thought, paying my £135... :) )
 
Peter B said:
Lomo also do the LC-A 120 @ £339 and I've seen some pretty fair results from it on Photorio. I don't think I'd want to spend that much without actually seeing it and handling it. https://shop.lomography.com/en/lomo-lc-a-120?country=gb
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As with any camera, it has its plusses and minuses, but it is certainly a handy travel camera for shooting medium format in my experience. It's almost an easier to use Hasselblad Superwide at ⅓ the cost.



 
trypdal said:
In my experience, there is no comparison between the Mat 124G and the Rolleicord: the Rollei felt made to last. The 124G doesn't.
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I have a Yashicamat 124G which, like all of them, was made some time between 1970 and 1986. So it's somewhere between 32 and 48 years old ,and works fine. Even 32 years of use meets my definition of "built to last". It has survived being dropped in a river (the film came out fine too) and rolling down a hillside. I agree though that £350 is a lot to pay - I paid £100 for mine in 2009.
 
skysh4rk said:
Used Lubitels do not cost anywhere near £289.
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I paid £17 for a used Lubitel 166B - unfortunately I've had to stop using it after three films because a part that holds the film roll in place fell out and got lost. Although the image quality was better than I expected, using the viewfinder was a nightmare - if you don't look down at precisely the right angle you may not see the image at all.

Buying a used Yashicamat is an infinitely better deal than buying a new Lubitel.
 
Kevin Allan said:
I have a Yashicamat 124G which, like all of them, was made some time between 1970 and 1986. So it's somewhere between 32 and 48 years old ,and works fine. Even 32 years of use meets my definition of "built to last". It has survived being dropped in a river (the film came out fine too) and rolling down a hillside. I agree though that £350 is a lot to pay - I paid £100 for mine in 2009.
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Totally agree with you Kevin - sure, the 124G is not as heavily built as some TLR's, but there are still plenty of them around in good working order - so they can't be that badly built!!

I paid £100 for mine in good working order about 1 year ago and felt that was a fair price at the time, I would say a good one is worth up to £200 maybe. There are suggestions that you can buy a good Rolleiflex for the same price as a 124G, but I'd be very surprised if that was true - maybe a very early one with a dim VF. Even a good late Rolleicord will probably cost you more than a good 124G.

I had a Mamiya C330f outfit alongside my 124G, the Mamiya was a lovely camera, but ultimately the 124G was easier to carry, and easier/quicker to focus (for me) - the built in lightmeter was an added convenience. The results from the 75/80mm lenses were close enough that I went with the body that I preferred using, or was more likely to take out with me - which was the 124G. That and the fact I also have an RB67 outfit! I absolutely loved the 180mm super on the C330 though!!
 
Kevin Allan said:
I paid £17 for a used Lubitel 166B - unfortunately I've had to stop using it after three films because a part that holds the film roll in place fell out and got lost. Although the image quality was better than I expected, using the viewfinder was a nightmare - if you don't look down at precisely the right angle you may not see the image at all.

Buying a used Yashicamat is an infinitely better deal than buying a new Lubitel.
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Thats exactly my experience with the Lubitel 166B too. I got some nice shots out of it, but composing and focussing was a bit of a pain in the a*se. Also, the light weight of the Lubitel meant it was harder to hold steady than my heavier Yashica Mat 124G.
 
I think spending £25 or less on a Lubitel II or 166b is probably a fun way to try medium format film and TLRs, but once you start getting over £30 for one I think it would be better to save that and put it towards a better camera. Don't forget, there's the Yashica D and the Yashica 635 in terms of price steps before you get to a Yashicamat or 124G. Less to go wrong with the winding system on those too, and hardly a plastic part in sight. When stopped down a bit, I bet most people couldn't tell the difference between photos taken with the Yashikor triplet type lens on the D and 635 and the Yashinon 4 element lens fitted to most of the Yashicamat series. I think the main improvement was down to internal baffles to minimise veiling lens flare on the later 'Mats', but keep your back to the sun with a D or 635 and you should be OK.
 
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Hallsy said:
Totally agree with you Kevin - sure, the 124G is not as heavily built as some TLR's, but there are still plenty of them around in good working order - so they can't be that badly built!!

I paid £100 for mine in good working order about 1 year ago and felt that was a fair price at the time, I would say a good one is worth up to £200 maybe. There are suggestions that you can buy a good Rolleiflex for the same price as a 124G, but I'd be very surprised if that was true - maybe a very early one with a dim VF. Even a good late Rolleicord will probably cost you more than a good 124G.
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Let me reiterate this: based on my experience, the Yashicamat 124G (notice the G) is not that well built. £200 pounds? No way. For that amount of money you can (at least in continental Europe, not sure in the UK) get a near mint Rolleicord Vb or, with a bit more patience, a Ricoh 225 or Minolta Autocord III. The latter three noticeably better made than the Yashicamat 124G IME.

Again only based on my expectations and personal experience. I bought my 124G in near mint condition from somebody who had kept it in storage for years. All seemingly perfect, apart from a hazy/mouldy taking lens. I sent it to the Yashicamat 124G CLA guru, Mark Hama (someone who used to build these back in the day). It worked perfectly for a bit, then it started acting up exactly where I expected it would, in the (mostly plastic) crank and winding mechanism. I really suspect these cameras weren't meant to fit in the same quality bracket of a Rolleicord or Autocord. Heck, my Nikon FMs and Olympus OM2ns still go like clockwork after a light seal replacement. The difference is, mostly, metal where it matters.

Will I keep using my 124G until I run it to the ground? Sure - fun camera - surprising sharpness from its Tessar clone.

Would I pay >£150 for one? No way. Many superior options at the price (again, at least in continental Europe)
 
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