anyone else find PC's more reliable than macs?

anyone else find PC's more reliable than macs?

Absolutely - when they are running as linux servers and I never touch them :p

17 years developing software and doing support for windows systems, my entire company has now moved to macs other than the servers. The guys I employ are full on geeks and every single one of them has not only moved to macs at work but also replaced their home machines with macs.
 
Absolutely - when they are running as linux servers and I never touch them :p

17 years developing software and doing support for windows systems, my entire company has now moved to macs other than the servers. The guys I employ are full on geeks and every single one of them has not only moved to macs at work but also replaced their home machines with macs.

no wonder there is some buggy windows software out there...

:naughty:
 
I have been discussing macs with colleagues and friends recently. I find it a very interesting topic. Some things I have noticed about people's general perception of a mac:

1: Macs are more reliable/stable and crash less often.

Personally based on my experience I completely disagree.

2: Mac hardware is higher quality and this is why they are priced higher.

The underlying components are the same parts used in laptops/PCs but since branded as Apple are more expensive. They are not higher quality.

3: Mac OS is more intuitive.

I can but only completely disagree.

4: Macs are better for "media", specifically audio/video/graphical work.

This is the most interesting point for me, I will come back to this below.

5: Macs are built to last hence the higher price.

See point 2 above. With regard to design and toughness, I generally hear of more problems with Macs breaking. In fact of the people I know with Macs, they are always moaning about how they are having to "get this done/replaced" at significant cost. I recall a particular incident where a friend of mine had to buy a new Power adapter for some silly amount. However, power adapters for laptops can be a rip off for the basic function they do as well so...

6: Macs allow you to do more things at once.

Again see point 2 with regard to hardware. Not really a fair statement. It depends what Mac you buy, what you do. The Mac OS seems to be perceived as more stable, but I can't really agree with this at all. In fact, quite the opposite.

7: Macs are very "secure" and do not suffer from viri and spyware.

The first mac I ever used was when a friend gave me one to "fix" because it had a "virus". This actually turned out to be a spyware issue in the end but still, they are not untouchable as some people make out. They are also susceptible to user error with security threats the same as a PC.



I said I would come back to this point:

4: Macs are better for "media", specifically audio/video/graphical work.

This is the NUMBER 1 reason I hear of people recommending macs. Apple must be doing something right as Macs generally are recognized as more of an industry standard piece of hardware for editorial roles, magazines, articles, video editing, photography work, audio software work.
However, everytime I ask someone for more detail as to why they are better, I get the same mumbles: "they just are", "the software is better" "the graphics are better" "they are easier to use".
Well, based on my experience they are much less intuitive than a PC and rely heavily on "knowing" how to use one with regard to learning keyboard shortcuts and navigational aspects. I have not seen anyone go into detail about why they are better.

I would be the first to attempt to explore Macs again if I felt it worth wile in any way, but based on my experiences of using them and reading the same poorly constructed and detailed reasoning as to where the benefits are, I would have to REALLY REALLY want to learn it, as for me I see Macs as a big waste of money and time and a general headache, for when a PC would do the same job more efficiently on so many levels whilst being much cheaper outright.
 
The macs are better at media is a bit of a relic from the 'old days' when Macs had better colour profiling and image management. That and their almost universal adoption of firewire which is obviously a widely used media format.

That said, Windows can easily match this today.
 
ive often said that if we ripped out all the macs in design for equal spec PC's, hid the tower/notebook and hid the windows shell so it booted straight into illustrator and they wouldnt be none the wiser. but it wont happen because all the designers would leave..
 
Apple's advantage is it's limited range of hardware it has to run on. And it can be tested much more easily. Plus it came with built-in networking from the early days.

Also the pace of change was not so quick with macs. The processors just got quicker, but often used the same ram.

Of course the world has moved on and there is much less difference between them now. The two things that pc's have against them is the virus threat and the multitude of hardware configurations. It's very tempting for manufacturers to build down to a price, rather than up to a standard. Macs are never the cheap option, so they don't have to cut as many corners.

I'm typing this using an Intel chip on my mac, so many things have changed. However, I am still satisfied with my choice of platform - particularly as it satisfies my slightly rebellious urge to be different.

There seems only one way to sort this out - ask Harry Hill!

Graham
 
Not compared to PCs at the time though, I guess everything moves on and becomes more stable

really? i find the old powerpc is blown out of the water by the newer intel boxes.

any evidence to support that theory?
 
I've worked with macs a few times for image editing and general work and I found them to be less reliable and less easy to use than Windows machines. Crashes, lockups and I didn't find the interface very intuitive. I've had very few problems with my PCs XP, Vista or 7. I have a friend that swears by macs so I guess there's probably not much in it these days. But PCs are better!! (for me)
 
I use both, with PC's I find it's more of a software issue (although my motherboard is picky about RAM and what speed to run it at :bang: )

With the Macbook I've had it 3 yrs and only once it went horribly wrong where the RAM died and the HDD ran out of space, after I had replaced the RAM and upgraded the HDD, it's been fine (knocks on wood)

I've even upgraded to Snow Leopoard 10.6.1

:D


Kind Regards

Rob 80386
 
At my school (also my place of work as an ICT support techie) we have about 700 PC's, 20 or so windows servers, 1 X Serve and 60 Macs.

Once we had the macs in place we had a few teething problems at the start and from then on we have the occasional problem with students profiles not syncing etc... The macs have been in place for about 2 years now and we have about 1 problem a month from them.

The PC network on the other hand. It has been in for 2 years as well and after being told it was the best solution for our school, we are still trying to deal with all the issues! We have about 20 PC related issues each day for all manner of problems. Thats not including dealing with teachers laptops of which we have to deal with viruses and spyware and all the other delight full rubbish that they get filled with which slows them down.

We have now got to the point where teachers are now requesting Mac's instead of the PC's we provide them with because departments with Mac's in don't have any issues.
 
I'm very surprised by this thread. In my experience (only 32 years which included 12 as an IT professional), Macs are massively more reliable than PCs, both from a hardware and a software perspective.
 
:wacky:
 
same really, i've used stable machines from both parties just when macs fail they seem to fail catastrophically and they weren't overly keen on agreeing with networking last time i used them.

i'd have to say for me xp has been more reliable and windows 7, vista is probably somewhere below :)
 
We have been purely mac for the last 2 years after suffering years of unstable window based pc's. Most of my work just now involves film so I use final cut pro. I have never had an issue with any mac apart from my imac now fails to wake up from sleep, it is ok if we let it shut itself down though :thinking:.

For what we do and the software that is industry standard we use mac, will always use mac and will recommend mac. As far as I am concerned windows are for looking through. :naughty:

Arron
 
no fair, i want a dual xeon box :razz:

I have a proliant dual xeon box that I run freeNAS on. Very reliable but so is the Quad Xeon Mac pro next to it and the Dual Pentium 4 running Windows 7 next to that. I run all the major OSes and find that there is not a lot in it IF you have decent drivers and setup. Often I see crappy add-ons with rushed and buggy drivers causing problems for the whole Windows PC. Then we have anti virus programs slowing down Windows machines and the biggest killer of all are those machines where the user has installed 2 or 3 anti virus programs !! I also find problems where people will click on anything they are told to so they end up with IE with it's toolbar taking up half the screen and all manner of really "useful" software slowing things down and causing problems.

Most casual email and internet users pick a cheap computer that they are told to pick when they go into PC World or that is on special offer at Tesco etc. These are often poorly setup and with masses of FREE software that is just crap. It is these people that complain about viruses (this is what is blamed for EVERY fault) and the same people that install multiple security programs.

The reality is that most experienced and mildly experienced Windows and Mac users have few problems. This debate over which is best is pathetic to say the least. Once a week someone posts some thread about Macs being better or Windows being better.

  • They both do a job
  • They both do it well
  • One suits one group of people
  • One suits another group of people
  • Some like both
  • Most decent software is available for BOTH (eg Excel and Powerpoint came out for Apple 1st and then the PC and lots of packages have gone the other way.
  • Macs are more reliable than the average PC (this is because the average PC includes all those £249 special deal things from the super market)
  • Macs are AS reliable as a similarly priced decent branded PC eg DELL, Sony
  • Both are intuitive to a point (My tip a day for the Mac would not be needed if it was 100% intuitive)
  • The one you don't use always appears more complicated.
  • Macs are more expensive
  • You can build your own PC to your spec
  • You can fix your own PC more cheaply because you can just grab any old network, sound or video card.
  • Mac drivers tend to be better because it is easier to write them for a machine with less options.

etc etc etc etc.
 
I moved to a Mac Pro this year and find it is by far the most reliable machine I have ever had.

I still have my previous PC (Dell XPS) sitting next to the Mac on my desk but only so that when I'm feeling depressed, I can boot it up and remind myself just how much better life is now with the Mac!
 
tbh cowasaki i'm disgusted that you class powerpoint as decent software :p
 
tbh cowasaki i'm disgusted that you class powerpoint as decent software :p

It does the job so even computer numpties can create a presentation. Maybe decent was a bit of an exaggeration.

I am just getting a bit miffed at all this mac v pc, canon v nikon etc crap. Let's just concentrate on what we are producing with them and stop behaving like a bunch of :dummy:
 
Well said!!!

They are both tools to do a job, if what you have works for you stick with it, if not change. Simples.
 
It does the job so even computer numpties can create a presentation. Maybe decent was a bit of an exaggeration.

I am just getting a bit miffed at all this mac v pc, canon v nikon etc crap. Let's just concentrate on what we are producing with them and stop behaving like a bunch of :dummy:


I think you are my fav person on this site
let's take great pics
then ruin them on whatever platform you see fit
enjoy life
buy me a pint

simple
 
I like discussing all of the heated contrasting manufacturers for hardware products though, out of pure interest on discussing the pros/cons. I find it particularly interesting with macs since there is such a lack of reasoning from the people that recommend them.
 
Been a PC user since.....well since there were PCs, and just last month bought a MacBook Pro.

I don't really see what all the fuss is about. It does everything my PC does. Lightroom is pretty snappy compared to my PC laptop, but then this is a 64-bit machine with far superior hardware so I'd expect it to perform better :)

The OS is just a tool and as long as it runs a web browser, Lightroom and MS Office it's fine. OSX certainly isn't markedly easier or simpler to use than Windows. I mean seriously, what the hell is with the program installation procedure?

The multi-touch pad is a thing of genius though. Shame the aesthetics still prohibit some common sense things like two mouse buttons but hey ho, you can't have everything.
 
Macs are PCs. My Mac Pro is the same as a Dell Precision inside the case (layouts different, but the hardware is the same). My Mac is also a PC as it is a Personal Computer.

I use a Dell XPS at work running Vista x64 and absolutely love the thing, VERY fast, looks good, decent build quality and hardware plus Vista is one of my fav OS's (along with OS X).

I own a lot of Apple stuff, but I'm not an evangelist.

As far as reliability, my 30" Apple Cinema display had a dodgy power supply within 2 months of use and getting it replaced was a major pain compared to Dell's customer support...
 
I was a PC for 16 years ish. I did see a couple of Mac's in PC world and never paid any attention, thought they were rubbish, fear of the unknown I guess.
I had a conversation with a Mac guy who told me about a school that changed from PC to Mac, their IT staff dropped from 4 full time to 2 part time for the same number of machines. Still I wasn't listening.

Then my Dad bought a MacBook, I asked him what did you buy that for? Then I used it a couple of times and borrowed it when he went to America for a couple of weeks.\

I decided to get an iMac, and the difference is night and day. I used to spend my evenings trying to fix problems on the PC and now I don't need to do that, I gave my PC away. We're up to the iMac and a MacBook here now, neither needs maintenance from me ever, it's bliss.

My Dad has his MacBook, an Air and a MacMini which continue to work, plus a pile of broken PC's.

This is my experience. For me Macs are better in every way I can think of, I don't play games though, if I was a gamer then I guess I may think differently.
 
These debates drive me nuts.

It's very simple, people who own a mac and think the Windows is better aren't using it properly. People who own a PC and think Windows is better either have not used a mac or the only people they know with macs aren't using them properly. :thinking:

Mac OS X makes Windows look like a fisherprice toy!
 
The multi-touch pad is a thing of genius though. Shame the aesthetics still prohibit some common sense things like two mouse buttons but hey ho, you can't have everything.

You can set the track pad up to take a two finger tap to be a right click (y)
 
I haven't read all of this thread so apologies in advance. But I have had 2 pcs and both were crap. Crashing nearly every time I used them, slow etc. Got meself a mac and touch wood, haven't had a single problem. Would never go back to PCs.
 
Oh, it's a bit off topic but to all mac users here, I can HIGHLY recommend the new Magic Mouse, the new multitouch surface is awesome for browsing and so far I've found it pretty darn good for CS3 too! (y)
 
I have been discussing macs with colleagues and friends recently. I find it a very interesting topic. Some things I have noticed about people's general perception of a mac:

1: Macs are more reliable/stable and crash less often.

Personally based on my experience I completely disagree.

2: Mac hardware is higher quality and this is why they are priced higher.

The underlying components are the same parts used in laptops/PCs but since branded as Apple are more expensive. They are not higher quality.

3: Mac OS is more intuitive.

I can but only completely disagree.

4: Macs are better for "media", specifically audio/video/graphical work.

This is the most interesting point for me, I will come back to this below.

5: Macs are built to last hence the higher price.

See point 2 above. With regard to design and toughness, I generally hear of more problems with Macs breaking. In fact of the people I know with Macs, they are always moaning about how they are having to "get this done/replaced" at significant cost. I recall a particular incident where a friend of mine had to buy a new Power adapter for some silly amount. However, power adapters for laptops can be a rip off for the basic function they do as well so...

6: Macs allow you to do more things at once.

Again see point 2 with regard to hardware. Not really a fair statement. It depends what Mac you buy, what you do. The Mac OS seems to be perceived as more stable, but I can't really agree with this at all. In fact, quite the opposite.

7: Macs are very "secure" and do not suffer from viri and spyware.

The first mac I ever used was when a friend gave me one to "fix" because it had a "virus". This actually turned out to be a spyware issue in the end but still, they are not untouchable as some people make out. They are also susceptible to user error with security threats the same as a PC.



I said I would come back to this point:

4: Macs are better for "media", specifically audio/video/graphical work.

This is the NUMBER 1 reason I hear of people recommending macs. Apple must be doing something right as Macs generally are recognized as more of an industry standard piece of hardware for editorial roles, magazines, articles, video editing, photography work, audio software work.
However, everytime I ask someone for more detail as to why they are better, I get the same mumbles: "they just are", "the software is better" "the graphics are better" "they are easier to use".
Well, based on my experience they are much less intuitive than a PC and rely heavily on "knowing" how to use one with regard to learning keyboard shortcuts and navigational aspects. I have not seen anyone go into detail about why they are better.

I would be the first to attempt to explore Macs again if I felt it worth wile in any way, but based on my experiences of using them and reading the same poorly constructed and detailed reasoning as to where the benefits are, I would have to REALLY REALLY want to learn it, as for me I see Macs as a big waste of money and time and a general headache, for when a PC would do the same job more efficiently on so many levels whilst being much cheaper outright.

I'm afraid it just sounds as though you have a bone to pick with mac. If you don't like them don't buy them. Choice is a wonderful consumer power ;)
 
I have a proliant dual xeon box that I run freeNAS on. Very reliable but so is the Quad Xeon Mac pro next to it and the Dual Pentium 4 running Windows 7 next to that. I run all the major OSes and find that there is not a lot in it IF you have decent drivers and setup. Often I see crappy add-ons with rushed and buggy drivers causing problems for the whole Windows PC. Then we have anti virus programs slowing down Windows machines and the biggest killer of all are those machines where the user has installed 2 or 3 anti virus programs !! I also find problems where people will click on anything they are told to so they end up with IE with it's toolbar taking up half the screen and all manner of really "useful" software slowing things down and causing problems.

Most casual email and internet users pick a cheap computer that they are told to pick when they go into PC World or that is on special offer at Tesco etc. These are often poorly setup and with masses of FREE software that is just crap. It is these people that complain about viruses (this is what is blamed for EVERY fault) and the same people that install multiple security programs.

The reality is that most experienced and mildly experienced Windows and Mac users have few problems. This debate over which is best is pathetic to say the least. Once a week someone posts some thread about Macs being better or Windows being better.

  • They both do a job
  • They both do it well
  • One suits one group of people
  • One suits another group of people
  • Some like both
  • Most decent software is available for BOTH (eg Excel and Powerpoint came out for Apple 1st and then the PC and lots of packages have gone the other way.
  • Macs are more reliable than the average PC (this is because the average PC includes all those £249 special deal things from the super market)
  • Macs are AS reliable as a similarly priced decent branded PC eg DELL, Sony
  • Both are intuitive to a point (My tip a day for the Mac would not be needed if it was 100% intuitive)
  • The one you don't use always appears more complicated.
  • Macs are more expensive
  • You can build your own PC to your spec
  • You can fix your own PC more cheaply because you can just grab any old network, sound or video card.
  • Mac drivers tend to be better because it is easier to write them for a machine with less options.

etc etc etc etc.

This post should be required reading for anyone wanting to express an opinion on this subject :clap:

Time to move on and take some photos :)
 
This has been an interesting read.....

My home built PC is currently goosed and in the loft while I decorate the office. Rather than repair and but a nice shiny new LCD I havebeen leaning towards an imac 24 but am now rethinking this.

In many ways the thing with a mac is a lifestyle statement, a bit like B&O AV gear, form and funtion combined into an aesthetically and functionally pleasing unit, something that PC's still lack in so many ways.

Technically, I've never used a mac in anger but PC-wise, using my own built PC, although a little dated, has never been a drama, it drives me insane the amount of rubbish pre-installed on standard consumer units.

Stick to the PC I guess....... maybe try Linux......

Russ
 
This has been an interesting read.....

In many ways the thing with a mac is a lifestyle statement, a bit like B&O AV gear, form and funtion combined into an aesthetically and functionally pleasing unit, something that PC's still lack in so many ways.

Russ

Buy a PC and spend the money you save on a few black turtle neck sweaters and maybe a beret or two and just act pretentious. It will be like owning a Mac but cheaper :)

/Troll mode off
 
The only point I want to make is that Mac is industry standard for a reason.

What reason would that be though? This is the most major point I was talking about above. There seems to be a distinct lack of information as to what this "reason" is. I am in no way stating that it does not exist or putting Macs down. I would just like to hear why they have become more of an industry standard for this kind of thing i.e. Photo/Video/Audio editing. I genuinely am interested, on the basis that if I can see a good reason to try using one again, I will do so. :)
 
What reason would that be though? This is the most major point I was talking about above. There seems to be a distinct lack of information as to what this "reason" is. I am in no way stating that it does not exist or putting Macs down. I would just like to hear why they have become more of an industry standard for this kind of thing i.e. Photo/Video/Audio editing. I genuinely am interested, on the basis that if I can see a good reason to try using one again, I will do so. :)

I think that the answer lies in the fact that organisations want to buy computers that just 'work' with multimedia. Buying PC's would need them to understand the specs of the computers they were buying or take the word of the retailer. There is also the temptation to cut the spec of PC's to save a few quid, so the installation could be holed before it started. And as I mentioned earlier, networking was always a part of a mac out of the box no matter how low the model.

In isolation, or with a good understanding of the technology, there is no clear winner.

Most of these things are historical. And it's much easier to stick with what you know than change. Buying a PC now for me would not give me any advantage so I won't change. If Apple went under, it would be bad, but I'd survive the trauma these days.

Graham
 
Buying PC's would need them to understand the specs of the computers they were buying or take the word of the retailer. There is also the temptation to cut the spec of PC's to save a few quid, so the installation could be holed before it started.

but then most IT depts spec out equipment now anyway so that kind of negates that issue these days.

I think that the answer lies in the fact that organisations want to buy computers that just 'work' with multimedia.

more than likely yes, however you then run into a minefield of other areas where they dont just "work". for example, we have several apps that the mac users have to remote desktop to a terminal server to run on windows, pain in the arse file locking issues between the 2 platforms, exchange integration is poor albeit functional, iffy authentication with our unix based web filter.. to name a few. all for basically a box that runs illustrator. which a PC could do to an equal standard.

PERSONALLY i think the perception that macs are better for design/media is outdated.

thats not to say that i dislike macs by the way.
 
Back
Top