Buying from HDEW & Panamoz

I don't blame HDEW or Panamoz for not joining in this debate they would be opening them selves up to all sorts of "he said she said " arguments and that would not be in there interest at all .

If your happy to buy from them fine if not look else ware it really is that simple .

Rob.
 
Mitzyboy said:
Again, I'm only commenting on my experience with HDEW, I know nothing about how other operaters operate and I have seen some sorry stories.

So ... you are telling me that you think that a stock of cameras can be bought into the UK by HDEW and deposited in a Uk depot without any import taxes being paid on them, and therefore the end buyer is responsible for making a customs entrty. Is that right? You're saying that commercial companies can bring freight into the UK without declaring it and therefore not paying taxes on them. I'm not talking about the people who send you a camera as a gift from Hong Kong to avoid tax, I'm talking about a UK registered company with UK offices. I just want to clarify that's what you think about the way that HDEW operates.
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Sending anything as a "gift" doesn't avoid tax, unless the item costs between £18 - £36 anyway. Or whatever the starting point for charging is anyway, I can't remember if it's £9 or £18.
 
GyRob said:
I don't blame HDEW or Panamoz for not joining in this debate they would be opening them selves up to all sorts of "he said she said " arguments and that would not be in there interest at all .

If your happy to buy from them fine if not look else ware it really is that simple .

Rob.
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Nothing to hide - nothing to fear!
 
KitsuneAndy said:
Sending anything as a "gift" doesn't avoid tax, unless the item costs between £18 - £36 anyway. Or whatever the starting point for charging is anyway, I can't remember if it's £9 or £18.
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In my limited experience of this 'practice' - it was a declaration which was not altogether factual or true. The declared value of 'the gift' being within the allowed range but was not the actual value of the $600+ item. (Wasn't me nor photographic)
 
Mitzyboy said:
I wouldnt dare argue with George Osbourne :)

I've not commented on any of the ebay sellers. I would never have bought a camera off ebay as it's fairly obvious in some instances whats going on. I DID buy a camera long ago from the States which arrived described as a gift with a low value, so thats about the same kind of thing I guess.

As i keep saying, I am only commenting on HDEW as thats my only experience of late, and I'm not even sure as to how Amazon operate. Although that article seems at the moment to pick out Amazon & ebay, as regards the comments about storing goods in the UK, I would be interested to see how that is achieved because normal import procedures preclude that, other than through a bonded warehouse. A bonded warehouse allows goods to be imported tax free to a registered premises and then tax paid only when the goods are removed. However it can be a costly process and wouldnt seem to fit in with the pricing.
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Here's your answer, easiest job in the world with the biggest container ships arriving here daily. This is the China Shipping Line's CSCL Globe arriving at Felixstowe (quite a sight it is too).

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipe...be_arriving_at_Felixstowe,_United_Kingdom.jpg

There is zero possibility that the customs documentation for that lot is 100% accurate, and no one will ever know. HMRC also has a difficult job: under resourced and tasked with not only upholding the rules and regs, but with an underlying remit to encourage trade and the free passage of goods.
 
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gramps said:
When questioning HDEW's T&C's statement about the customer being the importer, (quoted from their website above), this was the reply I got:-
TBH that makes no sense to me whatsoever, maybe @Mitzyboy with his Customs & Excise experience can interpret it for me?
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Well other than he is giving an assurance that there are no extra charges to pay and it comments that you are purchaser, it doesnt mean very much else does it. Did you read the reply I got from them on the guarantee that I posted as well.
It's difficult for me. I dont have a blinkered view as some might think, but I am working on the belief that the item from HDEW was tax paid. I have seen no evidence yet to show that they are working beyond the law, as suggested. I have not seen any evidence on line in reviews or comments that anyone using them has had to pay duty or vat after the event. Look on Trustpilot, dpreview and the rest, no complaints or concerns..... in fact the opposite.

I'd add that my paperwork just showed me as a buyer / delivery point, no mention of being an importer. Delivery for UK addresses was 1-3 days iirc, but if it was to a non UK address it would add 3 days giving the impression again that the shipment point was from the UK
 
HoppyUK said:
Here's your answer, easiest job in the world with the biggest container ships arriving here daily. This is the China Shipping Line's CSCL Globe arriving at Felixstowe (quite a sight it is too).

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipe...be_arriving_at_Felixstowe,_United_Kingdom.jpg

There is zero possibility that the customs documentation for that lot is 100% accurate, and no one will ever know. HMRC also has a difficult job: under resourced and tasked with not only upholding the rules and regs, but with an underlying remit to encourage trade and the free passage of goods.
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All that cargo is manifested in the Far East. All the manifests are electronically submitted to the authorities. In the case of LCL cargo (groupage) it is checked into containers. The manifested cargo has to be entered for HMRC on arrivale UK. Manifest v documentation, it's all electronic. If you take the vierw that foreign shippers are stuffing containers full of contraband, then fair enough ... but there are procedures that are followed. Agreed, they are fallable, but yet again we're talking guesswork :)
 
Mitzyboy said:
I'd add that my paperwork just showed me as a buyer / delivery point, no mention of being an importer. Delivery for UK addresses was 1-3 days iirc, but if it was to a non UK address it would add 3 days giving the impression again that the shipment point was from the UK
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I have no evidence of unlawful activity and I am not suggesting anywhere that is the case.
My issue is specifically with the T&C's statement regarding the buyer being the importer ... having raised the issue with them myself, I would have thought that the easiest thing for them to do would be to remove the statement ... after all, if the buyer isn't the importer why have it in your T&C's that they are?
 
gramps said:
I have no evidence of unlawful activity and I am not suggesting anywhere that is the case.
My issue is specifically with the T&C's statement regarding the buyer being the importer ... having raised the issue with them myself, I would have thought that the easiest thing for them to do would be to remove the statement ... after all, if the buyer isn't the importer why have it in your T&C's that they are?
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Because when you are setting up your terms and conditions you set them up taking into consideration absolutely every possible scenario, imagining the worst possible things that could happen with the most obnoxious troublesome customer. Often done with the help of a costly commercial solicitor. So when you often read "the small print" in any T&C's there are all kinds of things covered that wouldnt necessarily apply to you .... but because of legaliities and todays "cover my arse" mentality, it all goes in :). I guess they arent going to spend money with solicitors to remove something that, judging by their popularity, they dont really need to.
 
You really believe their T&C's were formulated by a solicitor?
 
gramps said:
You really believe their T&C's were formulated by a solicitor?
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Did I say that? No. When I set our company up though we certainly had a solicitor involved because making a mistake at set up can be costly later ;)

I said "often done with" I think ... and in any case I wouldnt change terms and conditions when not necessary
 
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As GyRob basically said above.

If you are happy to buy from either company then do. If you are not happy to buy from either company then don't.

SIMPLES!!!!
 
bucz said:
I didn't read the whole thread so sorry if this question was asked previously but can you put equipment bought from these companies into your business expenses?
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in theory yes - but if you didnt pay the correct duty/tax you might want to think about the wisdom of sending receipts showing that to HMRC if they were to chose to audit your business (also if your business is VAT registered grey import may not be cheaper anyway)
 
big soft moose said:
in theory yes - but if you didnt pay the correct duty/tax you might want to think about the wisdom of sending receipts showing that to HMRC if they were to chose to audit your business (also if your business is VAT registered grey import may not be cheaper anyway)
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So they only pay duty/tax when you are receiving a note from HMRC? What if I pay those fees and send them the receipt? Has anyone did that before?
 
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Say again ?

In essence some grey importers pay correct Vat , some misdeclare the value or mis describe the goods , some just send pacels and hope they don't get caught - only the recipient knows for sure what Vat etc was paid on their import (for which they are liable as the importer unless the grey dealer has a uk base).

If you receive a parcel on which the correct vat hasnt been paid you can choose to declare this and pay the difference yourself ... be aware that this might make the camera more expensive than the white price ... particularly as grey prices have been going up lately due to exchange rates.
 
big soft moose said:
Say again ?

In essence some grey importers pay correct Vat , some misdeclare the value or mis describe the goods , some just send pacels and hope they don't get caught - only the recipient knows for sure what Vat etc was paid on their import (for which they are liable as the importer unless the grey dealer has a uk base).

If you receive a parcel on which the correct vat hasnt been paid you can choose to declare this and pay the difference yourself ... be aware that this might make the camera more expensive than the white price ... particularly as grey prices have been going up lately due to exchange rates.
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Those companies claim that they will pay duty/tax. This is a quote from panamoz:

"Import and Customs Charges
The prices on Panamoz.com are all inclusive. All import and customs charges will be covered by us fully, and will be billed to our shipping account directly. You will not be billed. These charges include import taxes and duties, such as VAT, and all associated charges, such as administration fees."

... and from one stop digital:

"The prices you pay Onestop-Digital do not include VAT and import duty. Your government may charge you import tax and duty. If you are asked to pay such charges, please pay these charges and we will reimburse you in full. Please refer to our terms and conditions for more details on our VAT Free Guarantee."

I was asking what if after receiving goods I pay those charges without being asked by government to do so and send the receipt to one of these companies. Will they cover them or not? Has anyone did this before?
 
I've asked Panamoz and SLR hut that question in the past- neither of them has responded.
 
D750 ordered from HDEW on Monday with forecast 3-5 day despatch time, but apparently sent yesterday, so should be here today. Excited.

I went through a range of pre-purchase questions with them after reading posts here and elsewhere about what I might call the various 'shades of grey' in different supplier's trading methodologies, so thank you all for the various contributions.

Now I must make sure I'm not a 'one post wonder' with all that entails. :)
 
I have bought plenty - the price you pay is not the price they decare on the shipping information... but there is nothing I can do about that!
 
JJ! said:
I have bought plenty - the price you pay is not the price they decare on the shipping information... but there is nothing I can do about that!
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other than declare the true value to HMRC which you are legally obliged to do (as you are the importer not them) ... they 'say' that they will refund all customs charges so this shouldnt be a problem ... (although see discussion above on whether that applies to voluntary declaration)
 
big soft moose said:
other than declare the true value to HMRC which you are legally obliged to do (as you are the importer not them) ... they 'say' that they will refund all customs charges so this shouldnt be a problem ... (although see discussion above on whether that applies to voluntary declaration)
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That's like doing 35mph and stopping at the nearest police station to say sorry I was speeding and I have it on my dashcam if you need it. Or are you going to lie and say you don't speed?
 
n0chex said:
That's like doing 35mph and stopping at the nearest police station to say sorry I was speeding and I have it on my dashcam if you need it. Or are you going to lie and say you don't speed?
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Not like that at all..... non-declaration is fraud. Like it or not, it reduces the content of the 'coffers' of HMRC which has the likelihood of raising Taxes levied against all of us.
 
Come on Barry .......how many people buy camera's in the UK from abroad compared to people speeding which is still a criminal offence as you know . You are more likely to get a slap on the wrist and made to pay the taxes for importing 1 camera but the speeding fine would be a lot more £100 fine and 3 points on your licence so speeding is a more serious offence and we all know we do it.
 
n0chex said:
That's like doing 35mph and stopping at the nearest police station to say sorry I was speeding and I have it on my dashcam if you need it. Or are you going to lie and say you don't speed?
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No it's nothing like that at all.

Firstly, you are not legally obliged to report your own driving transgressions. The speeding may be a crime but the failure to report is not.

Secondly, the under-declaration of value by the seller is not your offence. Your offence is failure to correct the value. So at the point you discover the 'error', you have committed no crime - by changing the value you are not admitting to a crime but correcting an administrative error.
 
I don't know why you're all arguing about grey imports anyway. In a couple of years we might have a free trade deal with much of Asia. :D
 
OldCarlos said:
I don't know why you're all arguing about grey imports anyway. In a couple of years we might have a free trade deal with much of Asia. :D
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Canon will set their pricing according to each market - and Britain will still be a high price area. The reason things cost more in the UK than in the USA (for instance) has nothing to do with the EU and everything to do with what the market will bear. Retail prices will not go down even if taxes and duties do.
 
john.margetts said:
The reason things cost more in the UK than in the USA
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This is often said, but isn't always the case because local taxes aren't always shown, but
apart from anything else .................... I was 'avin a laaaarf. ;)
 
with the current state of Sterling, soon enough there will be a price increase on UK stock and more immediately on GBP priced goods form HDEW and the like.
 
You can see how it is effecting the grey market from a screen capture of E-global


 
Llamaman said:
No it's nothing like that at all.

Firstly, you are not legally obliged to report your own driving transgressions. The speeding may be a crime but the failure to report is not.

Secondly, the under-declaration of value by the seller is not your offence. Your offence is failure to correct the value. So at the point you discover the 'error', you have committed no crime - by changing the value you are not admitting to a crime but correcting an administrative error.
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That

and if you trust that the importers are telling the truth when they say they'll refund all customs charges then you have nothing to lose by declaring the actual value - if you don't trust that they are telling the truth then you probably shouldnt use them anyway
 
Hi all. I just wanted to share my experience , buying from HDEW. I bought a Canon 80D , with the 18-135 usm kit lens ... I paid for it on a Thursday and on Monday it was with me.
The box was body only , obviously it was opened in order to put the lens in. No manual. No extra costs
 
jerry12953 said:
I've been looking at the price of a particular lens on HDew for a few months now. At first it was as low as £1219, now its £1439; that's just £10 cheaper than the best price on Camera price buster.

Is this typical? Is HMRC getting their act together?
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Brexit.
Exchange Rates.
 
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