1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  1. RedRobin

    RedRobin

    Messages:
    3,445
    Name:
    Robin
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
    ....I came across this review video when researching about the M5.

    You'll have to put up with some very nondescript background piano music and the reviewer's voice sounding like an android's but you may find some of the content helpful :


    View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vF-sYxVBeF8
     
    jerry12953 and Mike.P like this.
  2. RedRobin

    RedRobin

    Messages:
    3,445
    Name:
    Robin
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
    As I said I would in my post #3039, here are 2 photos to compare taken on the same dull grey day - Both on the same Canon 100-400mm L II + 1.4x III but one mounted on my M5 and the other on my 7D2. I had forgotten that they were shot at different times of the same grey day and the light did improve slightly for the 7D2 shot. So I would say that the comparison only serves to illustrate that shooting with the M5 on an EF lens is capable of delivering as good an image as with the 7D2.

    [​IMG]

    ^ M5, Auto ISO 6400

    [​IMG]

    ^ 7D2, Auto ISO 1600

    Both images were shot RAW and have had noise reduction applied only to the background and not on the bird and branch. They are different juvenile Starlings. Click the images for Exif data etc on Flickr.
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2017
    Swissy likes this.
  3. Steve B

    Steve B

    Messages:
    729
    Name:
    Steve Bennett
    Edit My Images:
    No
    I think "Chimping" is the word you are looking for ;)

    I'm enjoying your thoughts on the M5, it certainly wasn't on my radar previously as I prefer the rangefinder style of EOS-M for most uses, but am seriously thinking that when it comes to replacing my DSLR (which doesn't get much use these days) The M5 could be a very serious contender.
     
    RedRobin likes this.
  4. magicolor1

    magicolor1

    Messages:
    935
    Name:
    Simon
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
    +1. Maybe the M6 would suit you better? I have an M3 at the moment but find the AF too slow with adapted EF lenses, but I like the option to use the evf when needed and leave it off when not.
     
    Last edited: May 22, 2017
    Steve B likes this.
  5. Steve B

    Steve B

    Messages:
    729
    Name:
    Steve Bennett
    Edit My Images:
    No
    You may well be right there Simon, it is something I have been thinking about. I very rarely use a viewfinder, so having it as an option to fit or not makes a lot of sense. Plenty of time to think about it, I dont have the funds to be an early adopter anyway, so no rush to decide. Will be interesting to see real world reviews of the M6 aswell, but it doesnt seem to have created the same buzz as the M5 has yet. By the time I make up my mind there will be several new models I'm sure ;)
     
  6. tourerjim

    tourerjim

    Messages:
    164
    Name:
    Jim
    Edit My Images:
    No
    I'm ready to buy the M6 but not rushing in like I did with the M & M3 so im going to wait for reviews of the camera & ef lens focus speed when mounted on M6
     
  7. magicolor1

    magicolor1

    Messages:
    935
    Name:
    Simon
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
    I'm surprised by the lack of attention shown by reviewers to the M6 after a lot of attention for the M5. I suppose if they're technically almost identical apart from the lack of built-in EVF there may not be much to say. Still - dpreview have looked at it and seem to (mostly) like it. As I have the original EVF on my M3, the M6 makes more sense for me.
     
  8. Swissy

    Swissy

    Messages:
    1,585
    Name:
    Giovanni
    Edit My Images:
    No
    Do eGlobal Central UK have a good reputation?

    They have the M5 with kit lens for £625, i'm seriously considering pulling the trigger :)
     
  9. Chaz Photos

    Chaz Photos Jack Elam

    Messages:
    6,430
    Name:
    Chaz
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
    I have got the 18-55mm lens and it's a great lens all metal, unlike the smaller kit lens, from SLRhut I got it for £89 best UK price, is about £237 on Amazon

    Got body from Hdew 635
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2017
  10. JRJ

    JRJ

    Messages:
    501
    Name:
    Jas
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
    Got my M5 from them arrived in about 4 days
     
    Swissy likes this.
  11. Swissy

    Swissy

    Messages:
    1,585
    Name:
    Giovanni
    Edit My Images:
    No
    Good to know thanks
     
  12. tourerjim

    tourerjim

    Messages:
    164
    Name:
    Jim
    Edit My Images:
    No
    Found these videos which may help...



     
  13. RedRobin

    RedRobin

    Messages:
    3,445
    Name:
    Robin
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
    Having now used my M5 (mounted with Canon EF 100mm F/2.8L IS Macro) alongside my 7D Mark II mounted with Canon EF 100-400mm L II for several long 5-6 hour sessions shooting wildlife and especially Dragonflies, my current thoughts about it are as follows :

    Because I am randomly swopping between body combos to shoot, when I upload into my RAW editor I have to look at the EXIF to check which camera I used for each image - The IQ is the same for each. The same startout post-processing recipes apply to both as well.

    I mostly shoot Manual-mode and I expected to experience some awkwardness and even irritation when quickly and randomly shooting with one body and then the other, but I have experienced no difficulties at all. I would not want the M5 to be any smaller (it's the same size as the 100D which my daughter uses) and although it would deliver the same results if mounted to an EF super-telephoto lens, it wouldn't handle well physically, so it would then need to be on the lens's tripod.

    I mostly shoot looking through the viewfinder and that matches my 7D2 technique too so that it feels simply like a miniature D-SLR. I find the tilt screen invaluable for very low shots and don't often need to use the touch screen. I don't want to become so used to a touch screen that I miss it on my 7D2. I don't get on with camera bodies which don't have a built-in viewfinder. I would like the M5 viewfinder to be bigger.

    I definitely would have no interest in buying a M6 and would rather have bought a 80D than a M6 as my second body.

    The exposure compensation dial is extremely conveniently placed. I just need to customise the M5 for fast ISO setting changes (overriding Auto ISO occasionally).

    Sometimes the shutter sounds as if there is a delay capturing the image but there is no delay or lag.

    I doubt very much indeed if I will ever buy any EF-M lenses.

    Since getting into the habit of switching the M5 off between uses (unlike my 7D2 which I leave switched on) the battery use seems much improved.

    I like the weight and it wouldn't feel so reliable if it was lighter.

    Overall I am so far very happy indeed with it as a valuable component in my Canon EOS D-SLR system. It is doing everything which I hoped it would. For my purposes it is good value for money.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2017
    jerry12953 and mipevo6 like this.
  14. Hugh Jarse

    Hugh Jarse

    Messages:
    4,124
    Name:
    Steve
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
    Hi

    Apart from the EF 70-200 f/4 IS, EF 40 f/2.8 pancake, 50 f/1.4, EF 80 f/1.8 and 100 macro f/2.8, I use the EF-S 10-18, EF-S 24 f/2.8 pancake, EF-S 60 f/2.8.

    On the M lens front I have the 15-45, 22 pancake 28mm and 55-200.

    I am seriiusly tempted by the Canon summer cashback of £40 on the M 11-22, which today, via Amazon, is £243 after cashback for a brand new UK warranty model. Until now it has beem upwards of £310.

    My indulgence lens which goes on my M5 as a standard prime is the Sigma DC 30mm f/1.4 ART. It's near natural eye view and low light capability makes it a favourite. The new EF-S 35mm f/2.8 macro may be of interest but the 30mm Sigma is cheaper and less gimmicky.

    I have an M10 as a second body but have ordered an M6. As in earlier posts I do not know if I will use it or just worsip it. I have ordered the Silver version.

    I am moving more to using prime lenses but I also like using the 5D mk2 so not sure. The prime route requires me to think and plan my shots more. I still use my Pentax M series and now 645n film cameras and lenses and really enjoy getting out with them. i have a few zoom lenses but am trying more with fixed focal lrnses. I will shortly be attending Writer's week in Listowel in Ireland and basically I wil have the M10 and the brilliant EF-M 22mm f/2 pancake with me, nothing else so 'upfront and personal'.

    The M5 (and adaptor when needed) is still surprising me every time I use it. i use the EOS750D 95% of the timr with the STM lens for video. The mainstay lend for it being the EF-S 18-135 STM which is not comfortable for me on the M5.

    If it seems like a lot of kit well... I have had photograohy as my main hobby since 1962 at the aga of 7!

    Steve
     
  15. Steve B

    Steve B

    Messages:
    729
    Name:
    Steve Bennett
    Edit My Images:
    No
    Curious Steve, why the M10 rather than the M5 ?
    I would have thought the M5 would have been the preferred choice of the two, or is it the smaller size of the M10 that makes it more useful?
    Cant argue with the 22mm though, I need a second M body so I dont need to ever remove the 22mm, it may aswell be fixed to my Original M :)
     
    Hugh Jarse likes this.
  16. michael23

    michael23

    Messages:
    12,938
    Name:
    michael
    Edit My Images:
    No
    Looks like an m10 replacement is coming if the rumours are to be believed.
     
  17. woof woof

    woof woof

    Messages:
    15,229
    Name:
    Alan
    Edit My Images:
    No
    No offence meant but whenever I read comments like this I shake my head in disbelief.
     
  18. RedRobin

    RedRobin

    Messages:
    3,445
    Name:
    Robin
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
    ....No offence taken :)

    When I say "reliable" I mean that a bit of weight feels that it is well built and is less likely to let me down and that it's not flimsy and helps the camera to feel more tactile in handling when shooting. Tactile quality in using any machine is very important - At least, it is to me.

    Even if camera bodies were built from the highest grade strength carbonfibre, such lightweight would not handle so well.

    Would you prefer to fire a metal gun or a plastic gun? - For me, the answer is a no-brainer.
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2017
  19. tourerjim

    tourerjim

    Messages:
    164
    Name:
    Jim
    Edit My Images:
    No
    Aww' why the disbelieve...?
     
  20. tourerjim

    tourerjim

    Messages:
    164
    Name:
    Jim
    Edit My Images:
    No
    Interesting point but would Canon make a lighter camera if the body was going to be weaker, could it just be lighter components inside maybe.
     
  21. Hugh Jarse

    Hugh Jarse

    Messages:
    4,124
    Name:
    Steve
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
    Hi

    The town gets really busy and the last time I went (2015) I used my now downstreamed (to my niece) M body with the 22mm and 90EX speedlight. It worked really well and was unobtrusive. I am attending various workshops and readings as a participant not a togger.

    I have my M5 and 5D2 in my wagon if, like 2015, I was asked to do some portraits snd a group shot of some of the published autors for the organisers and writers. Who knows, they may hit the big time.

    The M and now the M10 was the perfect discrete camera for the 4 days I was there. This time I can only attend for 2 days, as I have a very important medical appointment in London that will see me drive to Cork and fly to London. The festival will be over before I get back. For aspiring writers I recommend going along abd there are some great photo spots around Kerry (The Dingle Peninsula is but 1).

    http://writersweek.ie
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2017
  22. Steve B

    Steve B

    Messages:
    729
    Name:
    Steve Bennett
    Edit My Images:
    No
    Thanks for clarifying, that does make sense to me, can see the advantage of being unobtrusive and it should be ideal in that situation.
     
  23. RedRobin

    RedRobin

    Messages:
    3,445
    Name:
    Robin
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
    ....I think it's reasonable to assume that Canon want to make sure that their camera products are durable and if that means using materials which happen to be heavier (magnesium body carcasses being a good example) then so be it. It would be extremely damaging to their reputation if their camera products were reported not to be durable.

    I perhaps wasn't clear enough in my earlier post by not adding to my 'tactile' comment that weight balance is important. That's why an EOS M5 isn't very comfortable to handle on a 100-400mm L although it will match the image quality of the 7D Mark II.

    I continue to love my EOS M5 (always mounted on my EF 100mm Macro) - Weight and balance are perfect.

    I particularly like the Manual Focus Peaking Settings feature and would like that feature on my 7D2 but perhaps it's only possible on a mirrorless EVF body.
     
    tourerjim likes this.
  24. RedRobin

    RedRobin

    Messages:
    3,445
    Name:
    Robin
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
    ....'Chimping'! That's the term, thanks! With macro I find that I need to do quite a lot of chimping to check focus after a shot and consequently to make adjustments accordingly.

    Regarding battery life, yesterday I shot 236 RAW images with a freshly charged battery before the red light came on. I changed battery rather than risking it dying midst shot. Much chimping was done and also a few onboard flash shots.

    I have now taken just over 600 images on my M5, all except about 10 mounted on a Canon EF 100mm F/2.8L IS Macro + Kenko 1.4x, and can unreservedly say that its image quality absolutely matches my 7D Mark II - It may even be fractionally better in more scientific tests as the M5 has a later version 24Mb sensor and Digic-7 processor.

    In my opinion, the EOS M5 is most definitely a very serious contender for a D-SLR replacement except if you use bigger telephoto L lenses because the physical balance is then uncomfortable - No problem on a tripod though!

    Apologies for another Dragonfly photo as an IQ example but it's what I do. Taken on a very overcast day shortly before the rain started. Canon's all-singing-dancing 100mm macro lens is renowned though! : [click pic to see more info on Flickr]

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2017
  25. jerry12953

    jerry12953

    Messages:
    7,697
    Name:
    Jeremy Moore
    Edit My Images:
    No
    The quality looks great!
     
    RedRobin likes this.
  26. Steve B

    Steve B

    Messages:
    729
    Name:
    Steve Bennett
    Edit My Images:
    No
    Good to read such positive things about it Robin, gives confidence to the rest of us that haven't taken the plunge yet :)

    On the question of balance, I had a very quick play with an M5 mounted on a Sigma 150-600mm and TC over the weekend and was blown away at how good it felt to handle. It was certainly a lot better balanced than my lightweight 600D with an EF 100-400mm and TC attached.
    Luckily it wasn't enough to make me take up bird photography, I would have to extend my mortgage for that ;)
    Your dragonfly shots are starting to get to me though, the results with the 100mm are superb, keep them coming.
     
  27. RedRobin

    RedRobin

    Messages:
    3,445
    Name:
    Robin
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
    ....Thanks for all the encouragement, Steve :)

    I think that those photographers feeling confident as a result of reading my findings shared here, must not forget that with all camera gear the bottom line is always choosing the right horse-for-the-course for their own individual type of photography. The M5 suits my photography extremely well but not necessarily everyone else's.

    The other aspect (probably already realised by you guys) is that all my images are shot RAW and then post-processed in Capture One. But the fact remains that the image quality has to be captured on the sensor by the camera in the first place. There is no doubt about the M5's ability to capture high quality images, the rest is up to me to shoot some keepers.

    This afternoon I paired up my M5 with my iPhone 6s via Bluetooth and took a couple of remote test shots of my daughter's teddy bear in her bedroom. I was in the living room with my iPhone shooting remotely. Now I know it works, my next step will be to set up my M5 on a tripod in my garden aimed at a bird perch. I anticipate that accurate focussing via the iPhone might be a problem as my M5 is customised for Back Button Focus. Manual-mode settings including ISO were very easy to change via the iPhone.
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2017
  28. jerry12953

    jerry12953

    Messages:
    7,697
    Name:
    Jeremy Moore
    Edit My Images:
    No
    Have you / would you attach the M5 to your birding photography lens, Robin?

    Although I would mainly use the m5 as an alternative to my DSLR kit for general photography (landscapes etc) I could envisage using it on my long lens for extra reach whilst photograph wildlife (if it's up to it.....).
     
  29. RedRobin

    RedRobin

    Messages:
    3,445
    Name:
    Robin
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
    ....The short answer is no I usually wouldn't and not unless tripod mounted (via the lens collar).

    My usual 'birding' lens is a Canon 100-400mm L II occasionally with a Canon 1.4x mounted. I have also borrowed a Canon 500mm F/4L II (with and without my 1.4x) and will be buying my own in the next few months. The 500mm will also be a 'birding' lens and in practice doubtless more so.

    The reasons are simple. I wear a BlackRapid chest strap on which I hang my birding lens (with 7D Mark II body with battery grip mounted) when not shooting. But most of the time I walk around with it unattached, left switched on in readiness, and handheld using the body and battery grip. The combo is tough enough and weatherproof enough to lay on the ground or a stone wall etc. The M5 body on my birding lens doesn't give me the same confidence nor the handheld grip.

    Another reason I prefer the 7D2 over the M5 for birding (rather than insects) is battery life. The grip on my 7D2 gives me 2 batteries in the chamber and a spare in my pocket. The M5 only delivers about 230 RAW images per battery and only loads 1 battery in the chamber - The M5 is very noticeably thirstier on battery juice.

    However, if staking out a bird/animal and using a tripod I might then attach the M5 body but only if in circumstances where I thought the M5 would have an advantage over the 7D2 such as for distant remote control or tilt screen. < I haven't done this yet.

    Regarding image quality, the M5 is most definitely up to it whatever EF lens is mounted, but for me personally it's just the physical handling which is asking too much of it when on a bigger lens. I have used the M5 on my 100-400mm + 1.4x just to try it out and didn't like the handling.

    In the context of wildlife photography I think that the M5 is better suited to living in a bag with a shorter EF lens mounted when not actually shooting with. I don't think it would fare well in hardened professional use when exposed outdoors in all weathers and conditions searching for wildlife. I'm not a professional but my usage is no different and photographing wildlife challenges both camera gear and photographer.

    I hope this helps.

    This (posted earlier) is the only photo I have of a bird taken in my garden with the M5 + Canon 100-400mm + 1.4x combo. I don't know why Flickr isn't showing my EXIF data but it was shot @560mm (max), Manual-mode, 1/500s, F/8, Auto ISO 6400, RAW and post-processed with noise reduction applied to the background only : [click image to view on Flickr]

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2017
    jerry12953 likes this.
  30. Wissel

    Wissel

    Messages:
    1,112
    Name:
    David
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
  31. michael23

    michael23

    Messages:
    12,938
    Name:
    michael
    Edit My Images:
    No
    A couple of video questions,
    Top iso in video, is it 12800
    Also i assume you can select a black and white profile for video. Also how is the focus peaking on the m5
     
  32. RedRobin

    RedRobin

    Messages:
    3,445
    Name:
    Robin
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
    ....I have no idea about video as I never use video on any camera so don't know if focus peaking is even an option when shooting video - Probably not as it's a Manual Focus option only, not in AF stills.

    I use the Manual Focus Peaking option all the time when shooting on my macro lens and it's excellent. You can change the colours and strength to suit what you are focussing on. But even a red option on a red insect works.

    It will change the display of what's in focus live as you change the aperture (I mostly shoot Manual-mode). So you can slightly move yourself to and fro to change focus area without further adjustments to the manual focus ring if you want.

    I have just looked in my user manual and can't find any reference to ISO limits for video or even the option to change ISO value in video. For stills it's a gobsmacking and pretty turgid ISO 25600 !!
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2017
    michael23 likes this.
  33. jerry12953

    jerry12953

    Messages:
    7,697
    Name:
    Jeremy Moore
    Edit My Images:
    No
    Thanks very much for the very full response, Robin. I do understand where you're coming from with this.
     
    RedRobin likes this.
  34. Mike.P

    Mike.P

    Messages:
    3,563
    Edit My Images:
    No
    Just struck a deal with Wissel for his M5 kit. I had the original M but sold it due to lack of an EVF but this looks just the job for me. Like Robin I intend to use it for macro more than anything else but it will have the MP-E65mm and twinflash attached.more than the 100mm L macro.

    Just need to source a 11-22mm now.
     
    Wissel likes this.
  35. RedRobin

    RedRobin

    Messages:
    3,445
    Name:
    Robin
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
    ....I doubt very much indeed whether you will be disappointed. Just get a couple of extra batteries! The IQ is surprising and equal to any crop-frame D-SLR.

    Have you got much experience using the MP-E65? It has a reputation for being very difficult to use.
     
  36. Mike.P

    Mike.P

    Messages:
    3,563
    Edit My Images:
    No
    Couple of shots taken with it, first is on the original M and the second on my 7D. the MPE takes a while to get used to and when using it at the extreme magnification you get a lot more misses than hits but it's very satisfying when you get it right.

    I'm hoping the variable screen and focus peeking make it a lot easier though ;)

    [​IMG]Bee looking for pollen by Mike.Pursey, on Flickr

    [​IMG]Fly Guy : Explored thanks by Mike.Pursey, on Flickr
     
  37. Hugh Jarse

    Hugh Jarse

    Messages:
    4,124
    Name:
    Steve
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
    The 11-22 is in Canon's summer cash back offer of £40 cash back. The lowest price for U.K. Sourced is Amazon at £283 delivered, a final price of £243 after cashback

    I have not seen a price that for UK sourced stock since it was released.
     
  38. Mike.P

    Mike.P

    Messages:
    3,563
    Edit My Images:
    No
    Currys have it for the same price plus I can use quidco. Also Morrisons are giving 5000 more points (£5) if you buy a £50 Currys gift card.
     
    Hugh Jarse likes this.
  39. Mike.P

    Mike.P

    Messages:
    3,563
    Edit My Images:
    No
    A VERY quick play with the M5. As I only have the 15-45mm atm (11-22mm and 55-200mm ordered) I attached the adapter and 70-300mm L and took a few shots around the house.
    ISO on it blows away the 7D MKI and it looks to be a vey capable camera although the EVF will take some getting used to (have disabled the rear screen completely for the time being).

    I wouldn't like to go much larger than the 70-300mm L on it as it's very unbalaned even then, using my 150-600mm Sigma Sport may be a bit of a nightmare never mind the 300mm IS f2.8 I recently sold :)Also. I know it sort of defeats the object but if Canon (or a third party) brought out a battery grip then I would snap one up in a heartbeat.

    Anyway, just a quick picture of my normal test subject when I get a new camera ... I would normally be very wary of shooting ISO 1600 on the 7D but no problems here and a lot more room no manouvre yet I think.

    [​IMG]Finlay by Mike.Pursey, on Flickr
     
  40. RedRobin

    RedRobin

    Messages:
    3,445
    Name:
    Robin
    Edit My Images:
    Yes
    ....Pretty impressive isn't it!

    Funnily enough I thought exactly the same about whether a M5 battery grip would ever be available and consequently how it would improve handling when even an EF 100mm is mounted. For me, as I am carrying it on a 100mm EF lens as a second camera to my 7D2 (with battery grip), it would make it awkward to carry in the very practical Lenspro bag which it already fits exactly. But also, surely a M5 battery grip would greatly reduce the extent of movement of the tilt screen.

    P.S. - Nice doggie!
     

Share This Page